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I cant see the giant war happening that leads to the dismantling of the WG and then he fights BB. There will be a BB raftel fight but it'll have to happen in a way at this giant war perhaps.
That's not what I said though. He'd fight Blackbeard during the war.
None of the above. Though C might be part of the truth.
D. It reveals the existence of a lost civilization that people should seek out more information about, and also how to reach Raftel. Stuff the Strawhats already know mostly because they have Robin in the crew.
Yeah I was thinking the information wouldnt be there in full on that island, the phrasing got me though
1. Gorosei, Marines, i don't know, it doesn't matter. 2. I don't know about 11 fighters that have as much build-up as the Kurohige pirates, but the World Government as an institution already does.
Blackbeard being the final antagonist is widely accepted but i don't buy it. Because for it to happen Luffy would have to beat him after becoming the Pirate King, while it'd be way more climactic for them to battle for the throne.
The way i picture it, The Blackbeard vs Luffy encounter will mark the end of the Pirates Era that Roger started. Blackbeard will be his last obstacle before achieving his dream, but the Manga will continue after that.Yeah, but technically, we don't actually know what you need to do to become Pirate King. It seems to be pretty widely accepted in the One Piece world that the Pirate King is the one who finds One Piece, but it's not like it's an official title or anything. We don't know if the rules really are "having One Piece makes you Pirate King", because we don't even know what One Piece is and whether it's possible for more than one person to "have" it (like if it's information rather than a material object). Roger didn't crown himself Pirate King, he was given that title by others (which made him happy, as Rayleigh told us). It's still undetermined whether or not Luffy getting to Raftel is enough to make him Pirate King, so his battle with Blackbeard doesn't have to take place there; it's possible that Luffy may make it to Raftel, find out whatever info Roger left behind there, and still fight Blackbeard somewhere else later as his last opponent while "dueling for the throne" (which, again, we don't really know yet how that works).
That's not what I said though. He'd fight Blackbeard during the war.
Im just xurious how they'd set it up, that's the most unpredictable way. I mean luffy needs to be drawn into this war in some capacity and right now thats inpossible to make a good guess,
When did assassin become only one thing?
I don't know. Certainly not in my post.
Maybe they train all assassin skills and students SPECIALIZE in a certain art of assassination.
Yeah, it's called Rokushiki.
Cipher Pol = Assassins
Assassin = Hitman = Ninja = Secret Agent = whatever other types
A ninja is a specific sort of assassin. If it wasn't you wouldn't be able to insanely obsess over it.
Wano retainers are older traditional, I think? Raizo is one type of older ninja representation. So why not have a "newer" version of ninja with a secret agent of the World Government?
Because Wano is One Piece Japan, and the World Government and CP9 are not. You're talking like all of human civilization starts at Ninja and then evolves into modern assassins. Which is insane. Ninja are a Japanese thing. Not even Korean or Chinese. Japanese.
Kaku = Kirinja = Ninja.
Please stop doing this. This is literally how like paranoid schizophrenics write. This is literally a running gag on the Angry Video Game Nerd.
Samurai, Ninjas, and other Japanese martial artists are in Wano.
Because Wano is OP Japan. Also samurai aren't a kind of martial artist, they're the basically the same thing as knights in Europe. A (theoretically) militarized nobility. There are martial arts disciplines that samurai might learn and practice, but that's separate. Some samurai were just fat corrupt nobles not too different from the Tenryubito.
CP0 will have something to do with Wano/Kaido arc.
Why? I read what you wrote and there isn't a single reason given for this conclusion.
The institution itself will be an end game antagonist, but not exclusively for the Straw Hats. They're being setup to be regulated to the "white hat" Marines (Coby, Kuzan, Smoker, etc) and the Revolutionaries instead.
That War is too far away to start thinking about precise information. I'm not Oda. The Revolutionary Army might not even exist at that point of the series, for all we know.
No he doesn't. Luffy won't be the Pirate King until he actually defeats Blackbeard, which doesn't necessarily need to be on Raftel.
Luffy doesn't have to defeat Blackbeard to become the Pirate King, he just has to find One Piece. It's a race and nothing else. And since it's obvious to me that the History that's written on Raftel is going to trigger Big Events, I sustain that the only way Kurohige is the last villain is if Luffy fights him after becoming the Pirate King.
Blackbeard is the epitome of chaos in this series, so there's no way he won't be involved in that final war, showing the clash between the ideals of both Teach and Luffy.
I don't think you understand what i'm saying at all. I aknowledge Kurohige as Luffy's nemesis.
Whether Blackbeard pulls a cheap one on the Straw Hats at Raftel or something else remains to be seen, but he will be the final guy taken down on Luffy's quest to be Pirate King.
Luffy doesn't have to defeat Blackbeard to become the Pirate King, he just has to find One Piece. It's a race and nothing else. And since it's obvious to me that the History that's written on Raftel is going to trigger Big Events (including a war against the government), I sustain that the only way Kurohige is the last villain is if Luffy fights him after becoming the Pirate King.
Would there be a difference in how it was written or read between speech quirk -ja and regular "ja" in ninja?
Is there a raw of the Zoro vs Kaku fight(Chapter 416)?
I tried to look but didn't find one yet. This would clear up my argument. Sorry if my ninja talk is disrupting your experience.
When did Shurikens = Assassin(not really), Assassin != Ninja(what?), and Shurikens != Ninja!?
So, Momo met Ace while Ace was on Wano learning how to make giant strawhat>?
Blackbeard being the final antagonist is widely accepted but i don't buy it. Because for it to happen Luffy would have to beat him after becoming the Pirate King, while it'd be way more climactic for them to battle for the throne.
You say this like the One Piece quest really is as simple as getting to Raftel and claiming the treasure (and no one really knows what it is).
After all that has happened and been revealed since the start of the series, do you really think this is still an accurate way to look at things?
Do you really think all Blackbeard is driven by is just getting a treasure? Even Luffy has been vaguer about his dream than just "get treasure". Recall his words about the Pirate King being the one who is most free.
The way i picture it, The Blackbeard vs Luffy encounter will mark the end of the Pirates Era that Roger started. Blackbeard will be his last obstacle before achieving his dream, but the Manga will continue after that.
So then what's the meaning behind the next fight? The final one?
The Revolutionary Army might not even exist at that point of the series, for all we know.
Why wouldn't they? I definitely see them being taken down a notch soon by Teach, but totally eliminated is probably out of the question. Some form of them will be there at the end to help reform the government. It's been the organization's mission statement for over ten years.
Luffy doesn't have to defeat Blackbeard to become the Pirate King, he just has to find One Piece. It's a race and nothing else. And since it's obvious to me that the History that's written on Raftel is going to trigger Big Events, I sustain that the only way Kurohige is the last villain is if Luffy fights him after becoming the Pirate King.
He does need to defeat Blackbeard to be at the Pirate King, because at that point, they'll be at odds on both of their ideals on what it means to be a Pirate, and the Pirate King as an extension.
Also, Blackbeard doesn't play fair. If you're so concerned about the treasure, he could easily come out of nowhere and hijack it after the Straw Hats find it.
I don't think you understand what i'm saying at all. I aknowledge Kurohige as Luffy's nemesis.
But you're saying he won't be the final antagonist? How can he be the nemesis of the main protagonist if he isn't final antagonist material to you?
That War is too far away to start thinking about precise information. I'm not Oda. The Revolutionary Army might not even exist at that point of the series, for all we know.
Oda has been setting up a Marine internal conflict since Volume ONE. This isn't some out there speculation, it's been visited again and again and again virtually every arc involving more than one named Marine. Oda couldn't possibly hammer this plot point into the reader harder honestly.
Luffy doesn't have to defeat Blackbeard to become the Pirate King, he just has to find One Piece. It's a race and nothing else.
I'm sorry…what were you just saying about not knowing all the details about a future event? I forgot what you said, can you maybe repeat it? Now at this time? Below these words?
I don't think you understand what i'm saying at all. I aknowledge Kurohige as Luffy's nemesis.
…and yet he wouldn't be a part of the finale of the series to you? Really?
--- Update From New Post Merge ---
Would there be a difference in how it was written or read between speech quirk -ja and regular "ja" in ninja?
Is there a raw of the Zoro vs Kaku fight(Chapter 416)?
Stop arguing with the people who actually know Japanese. You're wrong about this. Why are you even arguing about this anymore.
When did Shurikens = Assassin(not really), Assassin != Ninja(what?), and Shurikans != Ninja!?
Please seek medication.
When did Shurikens = Assassin(not really)
It's just one of his weapons. Porche had them too, and she isn't a ninja for having them.
Assassin != Ninja(what?),
Ninjas can be assassins, but not all assassins are ninjas. That is what people are saying here. There's nothing pointing towards Kaku being any more than just an assassin.
and Shurikans != Ninja!?
They can, but they also can just be used as a general weapon by anybody.
Yeah yeah, this is what everyone and their mother says if they're not really paying attention to Blackbeard.
Well, what am I missing?
Whitebeard didn't specify the World Government. He stated a conflict would erupt that would shake the world.
Yet he stated that the World Government (and the Marines) was afraid of it.
@Monkey:
That you can only conceive of this as involving JUST the government means you're not thinking as big as Oda has been setting up. And that you think the void century information involves the already accepted idea (that no one needs an ancient rock to tell them) that the government are a bunch of assholes shows you're definitely not paying attention.
I never talked about the information (or, if i did, it was an unconscious act) on Raftel, i just said it'd trigger Big Events, including a war against the government. And that makes perfect sense, because they're the ones that are so keen in keeping the Void Century void.
@Monkey:
I mean…did the whole ancient weapons plot...did you forget about that? There's more to the hidden information than just "GOVERNMENT BAD".
No, i didn't forget about something as basic as Ancient Weapons and their importance, just like you, i've been reading and re-reading the series for a while now.
Would there be a difference in how it was written or read between speech quirk -ja and regular "ja" in ninja?
Is there a raw of the Zoro vs Kaku fight(Chapter 416)?When did Shurikens = Assassin(not really), Assassin != Ninja(what?), and Shurikens != Ninja!?
There actually is a difference. Speech quirk "ja" is just written in hiragana, but ninja "ja" uses kanji.
A kanji that on it's own, just means "person". Like in "nouryokusha" (power user, referring to Devil Fruit eaters).
It's really not a pun on ninja.
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Oda has been setting up a Marine internal conflict since Volume ONE. This isn't some out there speculation, it's been visited again and again and again virtually every arc involving more than one named Marine. Oda couldn't possibly hammer this plot point into the reader harder honestly.
I aknowledge that, what does that have to do with anything. You're just replying whatever you want.
I'm sorry…what were you just saying about not knowing all the details about a future event? I forgot what you said, can you maybe repeat it? Now at this time? Below these words?
It's been said multiple times that whoever lands in Raftel and finds One Piece will become the Pirate King. Hell, even a few chapters ago Usopp was saying 'You'll be Pirate King!' while they were talking about the Red Poneglyphs!
…and yet he wouldn't be a part of the finale of the series to you? Really?
I stand for him not being Luffy's final opponent, yes.
Why wouldn't they? I definitely see them being taken down a notch soon by Teach, but totally eliminated is probably out of the question. Some form of them will be there at the end to help reform the government. It's been the organization's mission statement for over ten years.
I don't know. It was an example to express that We Can't Know.
He does need to defeat Blackbeard to be at the Pirate King, because at that point, they'll be at odds on both of their ideals on what it means to be a Pirate, and the Pirate King as an extension.
Also, Blackbeard doesn't play fair. If you're so concerned about the treasure, he could easily come out of nowhere and hijack it after the Straw Hats find it.
But you're saying he won't be the final antagonist? How can he be the nemesis of the main protagonist if he isn't final antagonist material to you?
Which is exactly why I am saying Kurohige will be Luffy's last rival in piracy, once Luffy becomes the Pirate King the history will take a new direction before finishing.
I aknowledge that, what does that have to do with anything. You're just replying whatever you want.
You stated that it's too early to get into the specifics… but is it really? We know what that war will encompass, which is the morals of both the Revolutionaries and the good Marines vs. the corruption. Then the morals of the "good" pirates (The Straw Hats) and the "bad" pirates (The Blackbeards). Those are the bare bones and what Oda has led us to believe for years.
It's been said multiple times that whoever lands in Raftel and finds One Piece will become the Pirate King. Hell, even a few chapters ago Usopp was saying 'You'll be Pirate King!' while they were talking about the Red Poneglyphs!
Do you think they just instantly are known to the world as the Pirate King or what? This is something that has to spread, and there likely won't be any time for that at that point.
That war will be the public spot where the world will witness that clash of ideals, and see the actual Pirate King emerge as victorious.
I stand for him not being Luffy's final opponent, yes.
Then who will that be? Who else is equal to the nemesis of the main protagonist? It's certainly not any of the Gorosei or Akainu.
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Which is exactly why I am saying Kurohige will be Luffy's last rival in piracy, once Luffy becomes the Pirate King the history will take a new direction before finishing.
That doesn't make any sense though.
We are not getting the big foreshadowed battle, and then going into the big war to face somebody else. That wouldn't work structurally or make any sense from what Oda has set up.
You stated that it's too early to get into the specifics… but is it really? We know what that war will encompass, which is the morals of both the revolutionaries and the good Marines, and then the morals of the "good" pirates (The Straw Hats) and the "bad" pirates (The Blackbeards). Those are the bare bones.
Do you think they just instantly are known to the world as the Pirate King or what? This is something that has to spread, and there likely won't be any time for that at that point.
That war will be the public spot where the world will witness that clash of ideals, and see the actual Pirate King emerge as victorious.
Then who will that be? Who else is equal to the nemesis of the main protagonist? It's certainly not any of the Gorosei or Akainu.
16 chars of buggy sama
Kirinja is simply Zoro making fun of Kaku for his accent. It is not a hint towards anything.
I thought Zoro said KirinGER and Kaku said Kirin-JA(hiragana) or KirinJA(kanji) the first time Kaku corrects Zoro.
There actually is a difference. Speech quirk "ja" is just written in hiragana, but ninja "ja" uses kanji.
A kanji that on it's own, just means "person". Like in "nouryokusha" (power user, referring to Devil Fruit eaters).
It's really not a pun on ninja.
Thanks. That helps me better understand. I'll just wonder if Kaku said hiragana "-ja" every time he said "ja"…in particular the very first time he said Kirin"ja"(Kirin-ja vs Kirinja) until I see the raw.
But this is great information regardless. Thanks again.
Greg… you... For god's sake. Now I have to wait for days.
I just hope it has nothing to do with Roger being somehow alive or Momo being some super human aging in a strange way and he actually is much older.
And now with Roger... The damn egg on the Oro Jackson is coming in my mind again
That doesn't make any sense though.
We are not getting the big foreshadowed battle, and then going into the big war to face somebody else. That wouldn't work structurally or make any sense from what Oda has set up.
OK, it doesn't make any sense, clearly there's many evident narrative intrincacies that i'm missing cos' i'm an idiot.
I still think - from my ignorance - i'm right.
I thought Zoro said KirinGER and Kaku said Kirin-JA(hiragana) or KirinJA(kanji) the first time Kaku corrects Zoro.
Thanks. That helps me better understand. I'll just update if Kaku said hiragana "-ja" every time he said "ja"…in particular the very first time he said Kirin"ja"(Kirin-ja vs Kirinja) until I see the raw.
But this is great information regardless. Thanks again.
For additional information, when Zoro says Kiringer, it's pronounced exactly the same as kirinja, but spelled in katakana since it's referencing "ranger". As their exchange continues, the katakana ja and hiragana ja gets mixed around a lot.
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Well, what am I missing?
So so much. Haven't you ever read the Final Villain threads?
Yet he stated that the World Government (and the Marines) was afraid of it.
Yes? And?
I never talked about the information (or, if i did, it was an unconscious act) on Raftel, i just said it'd trigger Big Events, including a war against the government. And that makes perfect sense, because they're the ones that are so keen in keeping the Void Century void.
Including a war against the government. As in, something being part of a larger thing or series of connected happenings.
No, i didn't forget about something as basic as Ancient Weapons and their importance, just like you, i've been reading and re-reading the series for a while now.
Ok so then where do they fit into this picture of yours. And in what way is "GOVERNMENT BAD" a revelation that our heroes need an old rock to tell them.
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I aknowledge that, what does that have to do with anything. You're just replying whatever you want.
You were treating his post like total speculation that we couldn't possible guess at just yet. This thing established in the first volume and endlessly brought up ever since.
It's been said multiple times that whoever lands in Raftel and finds One Piece will become the Pirate King.
It's also been said that the Pirate Kind is whoever is the most free. A pretty important character said that. It's also been described as the person who conquers the seas. In fact it would appear to be a fairly nebulous concept strongly tied to Raftel and the One Piece treasure. But clearly not a totally defined thing, and something that involves huge unknowns like namely "what the heck even is the One Piece".
I stand for him not being Luffy's final opponent, yes.
Ok. Who will?
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Perona is Zoro's final battle.
No…she is mine...:sad:
For additional information, when Zoro says Kiringer, it's pronounced exactly the same as kirinja, but spelled in katakana since it's referencing "ranger". As their exchange continues, the katakana ja and hiragana ja gets mixed around a lot.
Wow…let me break this down so it's clear for me.
I hope this shows what I mean.
Thanks once again.
Greg's thoughts on Momo are great. This'll definitely be a podcast to tune in for.
Greg… you... For god's sake. Now I have to wait for days.
I just hope it has nothing to do with Roger being somehow alive or Momo being some super human aging in a strange way and he actually is much older.
And now with Roger... The damn egg on the Oro Jackson is coming in my mind again
time machine egg :ninja:
I thought Zoro said KirinGER and Kaku said Kirin-JA(hiragana) or KirinJA(kanji) the first time Kaku corrects Zoro.
Yes, but the ja is part of his speech pattern and added to the word for giraffe (Kirin).
Zoro makes fun of him with Kiringer.
Zoro calls Kaku "Kiringer" ("Kirinjaa" in Japanese, punning on the Japanese word for giraffe - kirin - and the Super Sentai habit of ending names with "-ger"). Kaku, annoyed, responds "Kiringer nai! Kirin ja!" ("I'm not a Kiringer, I'm a giraffe!") before confusing himself trying to differentiate between "Kirinjaa" and "Kirin ja".
The main point here is that there is no blatant ninja reference here.
Do you think the voice of all things will be related to Zoro's breath of all things?
Still do not understand what Zoro actually has done at Arabasta with Mr. 1 to actually cut him. People theorized it being haki… But logically it would be CoO or something. He still wa sable to cut through Mr 1 with this breath
Wow…let me break this down so it's clear for me.
Zoro says KirinGER which sounds like KirinJA(katakana).
Kaku says to correct Zoro at first Kirin-JA(hiragana). I was curious if KirinJA(kanji) was used instead here.
Then mix up happens of ja meaning between hiragana(Kaku) and katakana(Zoro).I hope this shows what I mean.
Thanks once again.
What I've bolded is correct. Kanji was never used for kirinja in that exchange.
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What I've bolded is correct. Kanji was never used for kirinja in that exchange.
Alright. I'll let it go. Thank you for your patience and explanations.
Neko's comment was unrelated to the little side commentary Momo made on an already ongoing conversation.
And uh do you not interact with children ever? Are they generally strongly aware of every adult they've met before and very conscious of the passage of time? No not really.
Maybe, or maybe he also added to the exchange Usopp and Momo had.
Momo mentioned it extremely casually, like he was badly recalling memories and confusing things. Not to mention saying something without really thinking it through.
This is somehow a more outlandish idea then time traveling Gold Roger to you?
Why does it have to be either time travel or Ace? There are numerous posibilities. He saw a snail recording of Roger, he saw a play about Roger's adventures as a child, his growth was suspended or he was in some sort of cryostate for a couple of years for whatever reason. The Ope Ope was used on him causing him to stop growing or to growing a lot slower…
Hell, it might even have something to do with his devil fruit. Perhaps Vegapunk derived it from the samples of the dragon that was born on Roger's ship, in that egg we saw and Momo somehow confused it's memories with his own. Somehow? Maybe the ability to hear the voice has something to do with it. Maybe it's connected to the PH dragon whose name was supposed to be important.
Some kind of variation of the original Momotaro story, but with egg instead of peach.
Then there's a fact Vegapunk's devil fruit is supposedly a failure, but seems to be working fine. Maybe Momo's transformation is more complicated than that.
Seeing what Greg said, though, I doubt it's either of these things.
You realize Ace and Roger being blood related have some y'know, visual similarities? That an uninformed half interested kid wouldn't be an expert on? You're talking like Momo is a One Piece fan following the series and researching everything on wikipedia at the same time lol. As to being sad, it's pretty obvious Momo even in his confusion didn't feel some heavy connection to the person he met (why would he if it was a quick visit from Ace or whoever?).
Visual similarities between 17-20 hairless faced man and 40-50 year old mustached man a small child would pick up on? Stretching it thin there.
Roger seems to be a pretty big part of Momo's family history, so I imagine he'd know some stuff. Enough to not confuse things that bad.
I'm more inclined to believe it would have been someone else connected to Roger.
I can see it being Ace maybe if he overheard WB or Oden, for example, talking about Ace being Roger's son, meeting him afterwards and remembering wrong, but it still sounds contrived. As if the line was dropped only to create a plot line that doesn't go anywhere.
Maybe what Momo is saying about has to do with that artificial zoan he ate? The side effects of it. False memories or hallucinations? Maybe it has to do with how that devil fruit was made..
Calling it, Jack has a swordman zoan with him that will fight Zoro. Proper zoan, not smile user.
Maybe:
!
Ok. Who will?
I kinda feel the same way, though that doesn't mean I know for sure it will be true. Feels to me like Blackbeard will be Luffy's ultimate opponent towards his goal to become Pirate King, but as the story is laid out the WG, Celestials, Void Century, Revolutionaries, Ancient Weapons etc seem to be things that are meant for after that journey is completed. Becoming a Pirate King and ruling the seas going up against the marines and BB seems to be a tier below. Like Marines-Shanks(Yonkou)-BB-Pirate King and after that WG-CD's-Void Century- Ancient Weapons- Revolutionaries
Luffy having a final battle as Pirate King seems to be at least an option to me still.
wow i am late.
I think momo did meet with roger, his ghost ( jedi style ) :ninja: lol.
could it be that momo related to Joy Boy ( the voice of all thing )…...........
looking forward to what Greg have to say about this.
I wonder if Momo met Greg too.
Anyone saying Zoro vs Mihawk fight won't happen is a damn fool. This fight WILL happen. For the love of swordsmanship. Zoro doesn't need to hate Mihawk for that fight to happen. This fight will be about SWORDSMANSHIP! The love of swordsmanship. They dedicated their lives for that, they are both passionate about it and they will fight to know who is the best at it. This fight will be the most thrilling and exciting fight of their life. THEY WILL FIGHT WITH A BIG SMILE ALL OVER THEIR FACE, and both of them will go all out, this will be bloody for sure. MIHAWK IS NOT DYING AGAINST SHIRYU.
Also there was no egg on Roger's ship. And don't even show me that stupid toy.
As for Momo, it's just like Blackbeard's line about him living twice.
Anyone saying Zoro vs Mihawk fight won't happen is a damn fool. This fight WILL happen. For the love of swordsmanship. Zoro doesn't need to hate Mihawk for that fight to happen. This fight will be about SWORDSMANSHIP! The love of swordsmanship. They dedicated their lives for that, they are both passionate about it and they will fight to know who is the best at it. This fight will be the most thrilling and exciting fight of their life. THEY WILL FIGHT WITH A BIG SMILE ALL OVER THEIR FACE, and both of them will go all out, this will be bloody for sure. MIHAWK IS NOT DYING AGAINST SHIRYU.
Also there was no egg on Roger's ship. And don't even show me that stupid toy.
it already did happen twice 1. before going into the grand line and 2.during his 2 year training that is why he lost a eye lol.
@sanji''s_dad:
it already did happen twice 1. before going into the grand line and 2.during his 2 year training that is why he lost a eye lol.
LOLOLOL "look I'm a big idiot and I don't understand a single word of the post I quoted".
The line which, according to Oda, holds a hint to why Blackbeard can have 2 devil fruits.
I know that idiot.
Toy or not, you can see it clearly on several panels of chapter 0.
If you think that round spotted egg-resembling thing is something else, please…
Tell me again if you see a damn egg here:
http://www.fotos-hochladen.net/uploads/img1328bearbyp1c2wkt80.jpg
protip: you won't.
