I think his fruit is the dragon fruit, and regarding why he didn't drown himself yet, I think this fruit has a side effect that prevent him from dying at all Even if water was a weakness to everyone. If all the things that were mentioned didn't manage to kill him, Why would water be special? Probably it would just evaporate or some shit like that if he tried to drown himself.
Theory : Kaido has a Dragon Devil Fruit
-
-
Ok, guys. I am adding updates.
-
-
Ok, guys, I have added the updates.
For those who havenât read the theory yet, please read it and enjoy it. For those who have already read the theory and do not wish to re-read it(although I suggest reading it either way),here are the updates:
After Kinemon, Momo, Kanjuro and the other samurai evaded the capture of Kaidoâs goons and left for Zo, they met with disaster, and Momonosuke, Kinemon and kanjuro drifted ashore Dressrosa.
Once there, Doflamingo and his underlings âresumedâ the pursuing, and Momonosuke, as a result, hid himself aboard the ship, which was headed to Punk Hazard. When Momonosuke was narrating what had happened to him, he spoke of Doflamingo with great âunfamiliarityâ. This suggests that his acquaintance with Doflamingo was fairly recent.
When Kanjuro was covering for Kinemon to escape, he shouted,â pursue Momonosuke!! That is all that matters!!â. This suggests that Momonosuke is a vital part both in their escape from Kaido and in their journey to Zo.
When Momonosuke arrived at Punk Hazard and was asked about his name by one of the âsickâ children, he denied having a name. This suggest that Momonosuke believes that his name might attract âunknownâ enemies 'again'.
When Momo was about to be grabbed by the man who is suggested to have a flying ability(Kaido), he was asked about his name.
When Doflamingo was pursuing the three samurai at Dressrosa, he was focused only on Momonosuke. The only man with the strongest ties to Doflamingo is Kaido. He is also the only one who is suggested to have extracted the name from Momonosuke prior to any of these events. And he is also the one who is suggested to have ordered the âcaptureâ of the âsamuraiâ, and the only samurai that was suggested to have the highest importance amongst the four samurai, who were evading Kaido's capture, was Momonosuke.
This explains both Doflamingoâs desire to catch Momonosuke and Momonosuke's evasion of exposing his identity recklessly.
â- Update From New Post Merge ---
Coolest day ever!
Thank you, Nitwit. You guys are like another family to me:happy:
-
Ok, guys. Here is another thing that I have noticed today:
When Brook, Zoro, Sanji and Kinemon were running away from the deathly gas, Shinokuni, they perceived a dragon running ahead of them. While Sanji and Zoro were debating about the existence of dragons, Kinemon reacted to the word âdragonâ for the first time.
**â**just wondering how the direct ties to Doflamingo fit in (i.e. Doflamingo wanting Momonosuke)âŠâ
I hadnât addressed this issue fairly when I first answered this question, but now I have done so better than previously, on the post above. Hope you enjoy it:)
@maxpower69:Not saying that a Dragon Devil Fruit wouldn't be special. But i don't think introducing a Dragon Devil Fruit via Momo would make sense if an Emperor also had one. There would be zero shock value at that point. I feel whatever fruit he has will be very unique. Since Momo already has a Dragon Zoan i feel Kaido will have something different.
The artificial creation of dragons at Punk Hazard by Vegapunk wasnât introduced to us via Momonosuke only; it was done through three dragons: the gigantic dragon that Luffy, Zoro, Usopp, and Robin met at the burning half of Punk Hazard; the small dragon, which was the evolved model of the big dragon; and the artificial Dragon Devil Fruit, which was consumed by Momonosuke. We donât know which of them might hold any resemblance to Kaidoâs Dragon Devil Fruit, if any. Besides, Vegapunkâs artificial Dragon Devil Fruit was deemed a âfailureâ, and we donât know the reasons behind that yet.
If Vegapunk was trying to create a perfect âcopyâ of Kaidoâs Dragon Devil Fruit, it is possible for one of the reasons behind the verdict that it is a âfailureâ to be the âdissimilarityâ between Kaido and Momoâs devil fruits.
@Fleet_Admiral_Akainu:âDragon?NahâŠa cool DF,indeed,but not cool enough for an Yonkou.
Whatever it is,it definitely must be one of the craziest DF ever seen in terms of power(just like Whitebeard's,for example).Oda certainly keeps the best ones for the coolest characters...and personally,I don't see Kaidou being an exception.âA Dragon Devil Fruit could be âthe strongest zoanâ devil fruit.
When Lucci first revealed his ability through his transformation into a big cat, Chopper said that âcarnivorousâ zoan are a lot more violent. In other words, carnivorous zoan are suited for combat more than herbivorous or omnivorous zoan devil fruits.
The small dragon that we met at Punk Hazard was a carnivorous zoan because it was feeding on âmeatâ. It has also tried to feed on âpeopleâ. This could suggest that Kaido belongs to the same order as this dragon. In other words, his devil fruit could be a carnivorous mythical zoan.
Furthermore, Lucci himself said that zoan are the âstrongestâ kind in âclose combatâ. He also said that their powers increase the more they train. When he was describing his abilities, Lucci said that zoan's special quality is to 'strengthen' themselves 'physically'. This could amount to the explanation behind Kaido's inhuman strength that protects him from violent death.
The small dragon that we have seen at Punk Hazard was incredibly fast insofar as he was able to dodge bullets fired at him.
His jaws were incredibly strong so far as they were able to crumble steel as if it were a cookie.
And he could also attack through the exhalation of fire just as mythical dragons could.
When Luffy and Zoro were battling against the big dragon, the hardness of the dragonâs 'skin' easily withstood Luffyâs âjet Bulletâ, inasmuch as it shocked Luffy himself.
When Zoro was blocking an attack of the big dragon, he was applying a tremendous force insomuch as he was sweating and expressing his surprise at the enormous âtoughnessâ and âstrengthâ of that dragon.
Now, imagine Kaido( who must be already very strong) with a devil fruit that could have these abilities and more.
@King:âI mean, it's a Mythical Zoan, even rarer than Logia, and the only other people we've seen with those so far is an Emperor commander and the former Fleet Admiral.â
When G5 were fighting for survival against the small dragon at Punk Hazard, they referred to dragons as âmythicalâ beasts.
This authenticates the notion that a Dragon Devil Fruit will be classed as âmythical zoanâ.
âThe "Hundred beast' epithet seems a very strong hint of Kaidou's DF awesomeness.
AnywayâŠthats just my two cents.ââBefore he was introduced, I thought Kaido was going to have eaten dozens of different SMILES and was just a crazy homunculus combination beast. After his intro, I started thinking about a Luck-Luck fruit, but now that you mention it, a Mythical Dragon Zoan could have luck being one of it's side effects, its hard to say.â
@S.C.:
On a whim, I was looking more into Kaido, and I recall either Aohige or CCC saying that Kaido's epithet is a term for Lions, like how "King of Beasts" is as well. And then I remembered a certain creature from Greek myth, the Nemean Lion, a creature that could not be killed via normal means and with claws sharper then any sword.
The only drawback to this theory is that it's a oddly specific creature to have a Zoan fruit on, but it seems like it could be plausible.
Regarding Kaidoâs epithet of âKaido of the Beastsâ or Kaido of the Hundred Beastsâ, let me tell you guys what I think.
Luffyâs epithet is âStraw Hat Luffyâ, but does that epithet hint to his devil fruit? No. Itâs completely unrelated to his devil fruit.
Buggyâs epithet is âBuggy the Clownâ, but does that mean he consumed the âClown Devil Fruitâ? No. It doesnât whatsoever hint to his ability.
Edward Newgateâs epithet is âWhitebeardâ, but that is completely unrelated to his âEarthquake Devil Fruitâ.
Shanksâ epithet is âRed Haired Shanksâ, but does that have anything to do with his abilities? No. You get where I am going with this. We could say the same thing about Kaido. His epithet should be unrelated to his ability.
-
This thread is great, you've done some good work here Australopithecus. The thread should have a big fat label saying "This is what foreshadowing looks like"
It also shows just how much good translation matters. -
Even though the hundred beast thing is true, I still want the chimera zoan, the poor Cerberus zombie wasn't enough.
Maybe someone else with Blackbeard's condition who ate a bunch of zoans (lion and goat are unclaimed, and it could have any snake), or a vegapunk experiment gone wrong, or an item of multiple separate parts, like a complex machine, where each part was given a different zoan, or a smile experiment, or just the chimera fruit.
-
I think all mythical zoans will be based on divine mythical creatures from asian myths, we've already seen a fair share of western monsters and beasts from impel down and punk hazard arc, it would be too confusing to mix them into mythical zoans as well.
-
If Kaido was really serious about trying to kill himself I would think he would have tried eating multiple DFs by now. If that's happened then he probably has multiple DF abilities. It might even be where his moniker came from.
-
Ok, guys. This is both a small theory about the âcauseâ of Momonosukeâs transformation into a dragon and something else that I forgot to share.
After Momonosuke entered the âSecret Roomâ and consumed Vegapunkâs artificial Dragon Devil Fruit, Caesarâs underlings discovered that the gate of that room was left open. Upon hearing their approach, Momonosuke tried to evade capture, but started âuncontrollablyâ transforming into a dragon.
When he was narrating his misfortune to Luffy, Momonosuke showed utter lack of âcontrolâ over his dragon transformation through his lack of knowledge concerning the reversion to his human form.
When the Straw Hats were leaving Punk Hazard and heading to Dressrosa, Momonosuke was in his human form. At that very moment, Luffy began a conversation that will revolve around âDoflamingo and Kaidoâ.
As soon as Kaidoâs name surfaced at the middle of that conversation, Momonosuke transformed into a dragon unconsciously due to the âfearâ he harbours about Kaido.
In the day after that, the Straw Hats were reading Doflamingoâs resignation as a warlord on the newspaper, and Momonosuke was shown in his human form.
But as soon as Law contacted Doflamingo, and his(Doflamingoâs) voice became audible through the loudspeaker, the atmosphere became turbulent with âfearâ and Momonosuke transformed into a dragon again.
After Sanji and company successfully escaped Doflamingo, Momonosuke was shown transformed into a dragon. When he was asked by Sanji about why he was transformed into a dragon, Momonosuke answered that he cannot stop the âshakingâ. In other words, the âstimulusâ or âcauseâ of his âunintentionalâ transformation into a dragon is âfearâ. Momonosuke further referred to the cause of his fear at that moment as a âflying manâ. And Kaido is a âflying manâ. (I'm talking here about the 'subtle' foreshadowig regarding Kaido).
The âflying manâ was stressed in both the English version of CCC and the Japanese version.
Momonosukeâs uncontrollable transformation that happens due to 'fear' is one of the reasons behind Vegapunkâs verdict that his artificial Dragon Devil Fruit is a âfailureâ.
Now Iâm done with the theory. Letâs move on to what I forgot to share.
When the Straw Hats docked at Dressrosa, Momonosuke was in his dragon form, and Luffy tried to fly him, to which Momo responded that he can neither fly nor enter âthis islandâ(Dressrosa) by his fatherâs orders.
This further suggests that Momonosuke is the targeted one among the four samurai.
Thank you for reading.
@Daz:
This thread is great, you've done some good work here Australopithecus. The thread should have a big fat label saying "This is what foreshadowing looks like"
Thank you very much for your encouraging words, Daz:happy:
@Daz:
It also shows just how much good translation matters.
Yes, indeed.
Even though the hundred beast thing is true, I still want the chimera zoan, the poor Cerberus zombie wasn't enough.
Since Joker could get his hands on a variety of devil fruits due to his influence and connections in the underworld and since Kaido was his biggest partner and Kaidoâs favourite choice of devil fruits was implied to be âzoanâ, it might have been possible for him to have gotten for one of his commanders the Chimera Devil Fruit.
-
What if a dragon ate the Kaido Kaido no mi???:ninja:
-
^ Works for me
Earlier i said I didn't think Kaido is a dragon but what I really meant is I didn't want him to be a dragon, now I'm cool with it. I mean who better fits the description at this point.
-
I think all mythical zoans will be based on divine mythical creatures from asian myths, we've already seen a fair share of western monsters and beasts from impel down and punk hazard arc, it would be too confusing to mix them into mythical zoans as well.
Pretty sure the Phoenix is a Greek myth (although Marco's Zoan appearance is based more on the Chinese fenghuang, but those do not have regenerative abilities).
-
Thought I was so clever because I didn't see any "Oni" theories in the other thread - turns out I'm months late!
Having skimmed through the thread I'm stuck between two contradicting problems:
- If Kaidou has a DF, why doesn't he drown himself (other people drown him)?
- From a narrative angle, Kaidou should have a Zoan DF. He lords over Zoans, and then Shanks would be the only non-DF Yonkou, and depending on how you look at BB, and whether Big Mom is paramecia or logia, the four Yonkou would represent the four classes of DF
I believe Kaidou ultimately is not human. I think the fact that he is called the strongest "creature" and not strongest "man" implies he is not man, but regardless it is convenient from what we have seen from him that he is not originally human.
With the references to both onis and dragons, he's either an Oni with the Dragon fruit or a Dragon with the Oni fruit.
The benefit of this theory is that it could solve both problems, as if we say one of dragon or oni cannot drown (for some reason), then sea water would not kill him (he'd just be unconscious if anything).
In addition, my hunch is that Whitebeard gave him his fruit (and possibly immortality), and he was defeated by both Roger and Whitebeard pre-fruit.
I think I'll pitch my tent in the "Kaidou is an Oni with Dragon DF" camp because his Jolly Roger has a reference to his horns (and most Jolly Rogers don't use references to DF powers, but characteristics of the underlying user).
Side note: I'm a little annoyed that "hito hito no mi" is classed as Mythical, because it breaks the Mythical/Ancient Zoans being named after famous explorers (Drake and Marco). In a way I'd be happy if Kaidou was a dragon, and then we can say Hito Hito No Mi is a special Mythical and therefore is the exception to the rule
-
By the end of the series I wonder what will be the strongest Mythical Zoan fruit, a dragon does seem pretty high on the list. But Is it the strongest though? Who knows, oh which reminds me why aren't there more mythical df users in the story.
-
By the end of the series I wonder what will be the strongest Mythical Zoan fruit, a dragon does seem pretty high on the list. But Is it the strongest though? Who knows, oh which reminds me why aren't there more mythical df users in the story.
Mythical Zoans are rarer then Logias.
-
Thought I was so clever because I didn't see any "Oni" theories in the other thread - turns out I'm months late!
Having skimmed through the thread I'm stuck between two contradicting problems:
- If Kaidou has a DF, why doesn't he drown himself (other people drown him)?
- From a narrative angle, Kaidou should have a Zoan DF. He lords over Zoans, and then Shanks would be the only non-DF Yonkou, and depending on how you look at BB, and whether Big Mom is paramecia or logia, the four Yonkou would represent the four classes of DF
I believe Kaidou ultimately is not human. I think the fact that he is called the strongest "creature" and not strongest "man" implies he is not man, but regardless it is convenient from what we have seen from him that he is not originally human.
With the references to both onis and dragons, he's either an Oni with the Dragon fruit or a Dragon with the Oni fruit.
The benefit of this theory is that it could solve both problems, as if we say one of dragon or oni cannot drown (for some reason), then sea water would not kill him (he'd just be unconscious if anything).
I agree, Kaido being an oni with a dragon devil fruit seems to be the most likely.
If he is human, however, then I'd say that the reason he doesn't just bother to drown himself is because that's kind of the "obvious" way out and he wants to see if there's any other way for him to die outside of that.
-
What if a dragon ate the Kaido Kaido no mi???:ninja:
You know⊠I personally kind of (halfway jokingly) theorized that maybe Kaido ate some kind of... Demon Demon no mi, or Devil Devil no mi, or maybe Satan Satan no mi or something like that (the Satan Satan no mi would probably be the most badass Devil Fruit that we'll almost certainly never get, right up there with the God God no mi that I'm sure Enel wishes he ate... although we did get what was effectively a Buddha Buddha no mi with Sengoku so I guess I can't even entirely rule out those joke DF's :ninja:) But, the idea that Kaido ate a Dragon DF feels more and more plausible with each of the theories these people posted. I agree wholeheartedly with Daz (one of many posters who are far better then me) that Oda has given us so many, admittedly pretty subtle, examples of foreshadowing to Kaido's DF being a Dragon Zoan that he might as well put "Hey! I'm foreshadowing here! Pay attention!" Although, I will say that I'm glad that Oda's symbolism is always subtle (which is effectively what all this) unlike... certain other hack mangakas I could name... but I won't because I think most people can figure out who they are already...
I will say though that... the idea that Kaido is impervious to harm because of how strong a Dragon's skin is (we saw some of that with the artificial Dragons we saw on Punk Hazard) does make a lot of sense but... this does still call into question what Dragon's DF is... because many people theorized that there would be an Eastern and Western Model for the Dragon Zoan and that... well Dragon would have the Eastern Model because he can evidently control the weather, because back in Loguetown that seemed to be what Oda implied his ability to be. I'm pretty sure that Eastern Dragons were said to be able to control the weather... but now Oda is making it seem more and more that Kaido has an Eastern Dragon Zoan. So does this mean that Monkey D. Dragon has the Western Dragon Zoan? Or does he just have some kind of Weather control Paramecia, or some kind of Wind Zoan, which are some of the other theories.
Because, quite frankly, I don't think that Western style Dragon's can control the weather, or at least I never remember that from any of the fables that I read as someone who actually grew up in the West. Because, I could maybe see Kaido being a Western style Dragon as well but... all the symbolism around him seems much more Eastern? Maybe, I'm just splitting hairs here, and I do agree that all the theories that Kaido has a Dragon DF makes a lot of sense but... it does call into question what Monkey D. Dragon's DF is then. I mean, that's a discussion for another time but still, it seems like maybe Dragon isn't a Zoan after all.
I will say though that I still wouldn't rule out the possibility that Kaido's DF may actually be a Hydra or a Chimera, something Dragon like without actually being a Dragon. Especially since the Hydra's never die, it only regrows heads, which would fit with Kaido's whole immortality gimmick. Really the only thing going against the "Kaido has a Dragon DF" theory is that we kept thinking that Dragon the Revolutionary leader had one of those (given that it's his name...) that's really the only monkey wrench in all of these theories, and it's not hard to fathom that in spite of his name, Dragon actually just has some kind of Storm Paramecia. Either way, much respect to the people who made these theories, because I just feel like now I'm seeing full well that there's too much evidence to think that Kaido isn't a Dragon Zoan.
Mad props to you Australopithecus, I wish I had your keen eye for foreshadowing.
--- Update From New Post Merge ---
I agree, Kaido being an oni with a dragon devil fruit seems to be the most likely.
If he is human, however, then I'd say that the reason he doesn't just bother to drown himself is because that's kind of the "obvious" way out and he wants to see if there's any other way for him to die outside of that.
Or maybe⊠when he tries to drown himself, he just doesn't suffocate... He just keeps on breathing. :ninja:
-
I'd say the reason is, he can't commit suicide. All means of killing him failed and the appratus to do so broke. Who is to say, when trying to drown himself, he wouldn't get swept up by a current? Or concrete around his feet braking? Or getting rescued by whoever?
This is a man whose fate prevents him from dying, so to speak. The same 'fate' would save him when drowning.
My 2 cents.
-
I'd say the reason is, he can't commit suicide. All means of killing him failed and the appratus to do so broke. Who is to say, when trying to drown himself, he wouldn't get swept up by a current? Or concrete around his feet braking? Or getting rescued by whoever?
This is a man whose fate prevents him from dying, so to speak. The same 'fate' would save him when drowning.
My 2 cents.
And indeed I have a major speculation that Kaido's desire to die, which is apparently so great that he wants to start a war with whomever (presumably either the other Yonko or the Marines or perhaps both) simply so that he can create an Earth shattering conflict that will cause him to die. I very strongly believe that this is the next major plot point where the story is heading. And considering that Oda has said something about how we're about 60% to 70% done with the story now⊠it seems as though Kaido moving forward with his plans seems like as good a way as any to jump start the narrative.
I must say though, the idea that Kaido is willing to start a war that will shake the world just so he can have a chance of dying is... pretty damn profound when you think about it. I mean, if he thinks this is the only possible way he can die, since all his other attempts failed, then I can weirdly respect that in a way. I mean I guess if you find life pointless but find yourself unable to die then... who's to say what someone would do in that situation? Very interested to see where the story is going to go now with Kaido as the main villain for at least another arc.
-
@Kareem:
And indeed I have a major speculation that Kaido's desire to die, which is apparently so great that he wants to start a war with whomever (presumably either the other Yonko or the Marines or perhaps both) simply so that he can create an Earth shattering conflict that will cause him to die. I very strongly believe that this is the next major plot point where the story is heading. And considering that Oda has said something about how we're about 60% to 70% done with the story now⊠it seems as though Kaido moving forward with his plans seems like as good a way as any to jump start the narrative.
I must say though, the idea that Kaido is willing to start a war that will shake the world just so he can have a chance of dying is... pretty damn profound when you think about it. I mean, if he thinks this is the only possible way he can die, since all his other attempts failed, then I can weirdly respect that in a way. I mean I guess if you find life pointless but find yourself unable to die then... who's to say what someone would do in that situation? Very interested to see where the story is going to go now with Kaido as the main villain for at least another arc.
From a thematic standpoint, Kaido wanting to die will allow Oda to explore how "Luffy doesn't kill" if he wants to.
Also it's hard to see the "start a war to die" as profound while simultaenously reading another Shounen manga series
! Fairy Tail
-
If Kaido had really eaten a DF, wouldn't he just jump in the water to drown himself?
-
If Kaido had really eaten a DF, wouldn't he just jump in the water to drown himself?
It isn't quite necessary that drowning would kill him. he is called the strongest creature and as such he might be able to breathe underwater.
So even if he drowns due to having a DF, he won't die.He could just stay under water until dies of hunger, but then, he can do the same without a DF too, so the assumption at this point is that he doesn't want a lame death like that and is instead looking for something grand like a world war or jumping from a sky island, etc.
-
When Kizaru had made an encounter with Marcoâs ability, he said that he has never seen a bird like that. In other words, kizaru has never seen a phoenix before.
This could suggest that âmythical creaturesâ are truly âmythicalâ in the One Piece world. And since dragons are considered âmythicalâ and Kinemon harbours a 'personal vendetta' against them, it follows that it is an ability user against whom Kinemon holds a personal vendetta, not a ârealâ dragon.
Thought I was so clever because I didn't see any "Oni" theories in the other thread - turns out I'm months late!
Having skimmed through the thread I'm stuck between two contradicting problems:
- If Kaidou has a DF, why doesn't he drown himself (other people drown him)?
If Kaido had really eaten a DF, wouldn't he just jump in the water to drown himself?
It isn't quite necessary that drowning would kill him. he is called the strongest creature and as such he might be able to breathe underwater.
So even if he drowns due to having a DF, he won't die.He could just stay under water until dies of hunger, but then, he can do the same without a DF too, so the assumption at this point is that he doesn't want a lame death like that and is instead looking for something grand like a world war or jumping from a sky island, etc.
@Kareem:
Or maybe⊠when he tries to drown himself, he just doesn't suffocate... He just keeps on breathing. :ninja:
I'd say the reason is, he can't commit suicide. All means of killing him failed and the appratus to do so broke. Who is to say, when trying to drown himself, he wouldn't get swept up by a current? Or concrete around his feet braking? Or getting rescued by whoever?
This is a man whose fate prevents him from dying, so to speak. The same 'fate' would save him when drowning.
My 2 cents.
Okay, guys. Regarding the notion that if Kaido has a devil fruit and he seeks death, then he should be able to drown himself since âability usersâ cannot swim, first and foremost, Kaidoâs suicidal methods were not those of someone who desperately seeks death âat any priceâ. When he tried to kill himself, he flew to a sky island and threw himself from there, whereas, if he has an ability, he should just go to the shore of the island upon which Drake and the rest of his crew were, and throw himself into water. Or he could just fly horizontally for a long distance(long enough to make it possible for nobody to be able to save him from drowning) and then dive into the sea. But none of these happened. Kaido is âpickyâ when it comes to his suicidal methods. He doesnât get satisfied by anything and everything that will grant him his desire of dying. He showed interest in almost âunprecedentedâ methods of suicide.
Besides, whether or not he has a devil fruit, he can always kill himself through the consumption of more than one devil fruit, but he didnât. This further supports the notion that he is picky about his suicidal methods.
I believe Kaidou ultimately is not human. I think the fact that he is called the strongest "creature" and not strongest "man" implies he is not man, but regardless it is convenient from what we have seen from him that he is not originally human.
When you use the superlative degree(most/ -est) to compare Kaido with other âmenâ by saying he is the strongest âmanâ, you imply that he is the strongest among the creatures known as âmanâ only. However, since Kaido is the strongest among creatures that live in the air(the people of sky islands and possibly even flying creatures, I believe), in the sea(from fishmen to possibly even sea kings), or on land(anything that lives above the earthâs surface, including human beings), it follows that he will be referred to as âcreatureâ. The term creature here is used to make the comparison âgenericâ. You cannot use the phrase âthe strongest manâ to make a comparison among other creatures aside âmankindâ.
With the references to both onis and dragons, he's either an Oni with the Dragon fruit or a Dragon with the Oni fruit.
The benefit of this theory is that it could solve both problems, as if we say one of dragon or oni cannot drown (for some reason), then sea water would not kill him (he'd just be unconscious if anything).
In addition, my hunch is that Whitebeard gave him his fruit (and possibly immortality), and he was defeated by both Roger and Whitebeard pre-fruit.
I think I'll pitch my tent in the "Kaidou is an Oni with Dragon DF" camp because his Jolly Roger has a reference to his horns (and most Jolly Rogers don't use references to DF powers, but characteristics of the underlying user).
Nice catch! I agree with this. However, I don't think Kaido will ever be referred to as 'oni' or devil/demon in the literal sense of the word. If he happened to be referred to as such, it would be in the moral sense of the word. This is my opinion.
Side note: I'm a little annoyed that "hito hito no mi" is classed as Mythical, because it breaks the Mythical/Ancient Zoans being named after famous explorers (Drake and Marco). In a way I'd be happy if Kaidou was a dragon, and then we can say Hito Hito No Mi is a special Mythical and therefore is the exception to the rule
The 'Human Devil Fruit', which was consumed by Chopper, is not 'mythical'. The word mythical means that it relates to 'myths'. Is a 'human' a mythical creature? No. What you are talking about is the 'Hito Hito no Mi, Model: Daibutsu'(Sengoku's Ability). There is a difference.:happy:
By the end of the series I wonder what will be the strongest Mythical Zoan fruit, a dragon does seem pretty high on the list. But Is it the strongest though?
It could be. I am not certain. So far we have two confirmed mythical devil fruits(Marco and Sengoku's devil fruits) and one theoretical(Kaido's). It is definitely stronger than Marco's ability from both the defense and offense aspects. The question is is it stronger than Sengoku's ability? I may address this issue in the future.
Who knows, oh which reminds me why aren't there more mythical df users in the story.
Just like Amigo said, it is because they are said to be ârarer than logiaâ. In other words, the scarcity of these devil fruits makes our encounter with their users rarer than our encounters with logia users.
@Kareem:
I will say though that⊠the idea that Kaido is impervious to harm because of how strong a Dragon's skin is (we saw some of that with the artificial Dragons we saw on Punk Hazard) does make a lot of sense but... this does still call into question what Dragon's DF is... because many people theorized that there would be an Eastern and Western Model for the Dragon Zoan and that... well Dragon would have the Eastern Model because he can evidently control the weather, because back in Loguetown that seemed to be what Oda implied his ability to be. I'm pretty sure that Eastern Dragons were said to be able to control the weather... but now Oda is making it seem more and more that Kaido has an Eastern Dragon Zoan. So does this mean that Monkey D. Dragon has the Western Dragon Zoan? Or does he just have some kind of Weather control Paramecia, or some kind of Wind Zoan, which are some of the other theories.
Because, quite frankly, I don't think that Western style Dragon's can control the weather, or at least I never remember that from any of the fables that I read as someone who actually grew up in the West. Because, I could maybe see Kaido being a Western style Dragon as well but... all the symbolism around him seems much more Eastern? Maybe, I'm just splitting hairs here, and I do agree that all the theories that Kaido has a Dragon DF makes a lot of sense but... it does call into question what Monkey D. Dragon's DF is then. I mean, that's a discussion for another time but still, it seems like maybe Dragon isn't a Zoan after all.
Regarding Monkey D. Dragon, it's truly worth reading this post:
Dragon either is the wind logia or the weather man with the same powers as Storm. If he was called Monkey D Steve no one would think that he's the dragon zoan.
As for the answer to which Dragon Devil Fruit Kaido possesses, I do not know sincerely. His abnormally long mustache looks like the whiskers of an eastern dragon, but I am not sure.
@Kareem:
Mad props to you Australopithecus, I wish I had your keen eye for foreshadowing.
Thank you kindly, Kareem. I appreciate that.:happy:
By the way, I found this picture of an eastern dragon that looks pretty menacing. I liked it and I wanted to share this pleasure with you guys.
-
I don't think taking Kizaru's words at face value is such a good idea.
-
I don't think taking Kizaru's words at face value is such a good idea.
You know, when I wrote 'this' and 'suggest', I think wrote suggest without an 's', and when I was checking if I messed something in my post, I found suggest without an 's', so I added the 's' and made it 'suggests'. Now I remember that the mistake wasn't the 's' but the 'could' between 'this' and 'sugget' that I didn't type.
-
By the way, I found this picture of an eastern dragon that looks pretty menacing. I liked it and I wanted to share this pleasure with you guys.
[qimg]http://i.imgur.com/qm1fjXl.jpg[/qimg]That Dragon's garbage, if Kaido has a Dragon DF he's gonna look like this
-
That Dragon's garbage, if Kaido has a Dragon DF he's gonna look like this
Ryuu Ryuu no Mi, Model: Polunga
Last time I checked, Oda-sensei favoured Shenlong over Polunga
-
Ryuu Ryuu no Mi, Model: Polunga
Last time I checked, Oda-sensei favoured Shenlong over Polunga
[qimg]http://dragonballarena.gamesurf.it/immagini/info/tributes/01-eiichiro_oda.jpg[/qimg]
But we already have Momo looking like Shenglong.
Zou also kinda looks like Namek.And his muscles are too massive to not to end up looking like Polunga.
-
Ryuu Ryuu no Mi, Model: Polunga
Last time I checked, Oda-sensei favoured Shenlong over Polunga
[qimg]http://dragonballarena.gamesurf.it/immagini/info/tributes/01-eiichiro_oda.jpg[/qimg]
That's pretty damn cool. I like how Oda paid tributes to Naruto as well.
-
I always imagine Kaido's dragon form like this:
[hide]
[/hide]
Luffy and Law would fight him on his back. -
I know what Kaidou has. He's the toughest creature on the planet. So I did some brainstorming on which animal was the toughest. And you know what it is?
! >! http://imgs.inkfrog.com/pix/american_design_ltd/Wile_E_Coyote_fork_image.jpg
Just a quick demonstration of an average coyote's durability, which i consider a level 7 (god level)
! Which other animal has feats like them?
! Can tank:
! -Pianos to head
-Leaves imprints in ground from falling off cliffs
-Frequently handles TNT explosions
! >!This post is funny. It never gets old.
I like those cartoons, by the way. They will never get old.
But we already have Momo looking like Shenglong.
Zou also kinda looks like Namek.And his muscles are too massive to not to end up looking like Polunga.
You can be sure that when Kaido transforms to a hybrid dragon form, he will look like Polunga regardless of what type of Dragon Devil Fruit he has consumed, assuming there is a type.
What I donât get is, what name will Kaidoâs Dragon Devil Fruit have if he ate either of the two types of dragons that we know, assuming there is a type? Ryuu Ryuu no MI, Model Western/Eastern Dragon? It sounds weird because the âWestâ and âEastâ in One Piece arenât the âWestâ and âEastâ in our world.
That's pretty damn cool. I like how Oda paid tributes to Naruto as well.
Same here
â- Update From New Post Merge ---
I always imagine Kaido's dragon form like this:
[hide]https://voreinmedia.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/leventhan-cornelius1.jpg[/hide]
Luffy and Law would fight him on his back.That way he'll be too immense to fight.
-
If Kaido had really eaten a DF, wouldn't he just jump in the water to drown himself?
If Kaido actually died then suicide wouldn't be his 'hobby', would it?
He performs actions that most people would consider suicidal and outlasts them. He doesn't want a wuss death which he clearly vocalized in how he respects Whitebeard's approach.
So how dumb would it be if he, as a DF user (assuming he is) just jumped in the sea? He doesn't want a simple death, he wants to be remembered for it
Can you picture the headline?
"Strongest Creature and Devil Fruit User Dives Into Ocean of Own Will and Drowns"
-
Besides, whether or not he has a devil fruit, he can always kill himself through the consumption of more than one devil fruit, but he didnât. This further supports the notion that he is picky about his suicidal methods.
Or he has tried, but he's another exception to the rule like Blackbeard and now has a bunch of abilities.
That might be one of the main uses of the smiles he was getting: eating them to attept killing himself.
-
Also, if Kaido really wanted to die, couldn't he just eat two devils fruits?
-
Kaido just wants to be legen⊠wait for it.... dare(y)...muhahahah
-
If Kaido actually died then suicide wouldn't be his 'hobby', would it?
He performs actions that most people would consider suicidal and outlasts them. He doesn't want a wuss death which he clearly vocalized in how he respects Whitebeard's approach.
So how dumb would it be if he, as a DF user (assuming he is) just jumped in the sea? He doesn't want a simple death, he wants to be remembered for it
Can you picture the headline?
"Strongest Creature and Devil Fruit User Dives Into Ocean of Own Will and Drowns"
Not sure thats much worse than "Strongest Creature and Devil Fruit User Jumps Off Sky Island of Own Will and Dies". The only cool part is that he survives it, and if he really wanted to survive why does he curse the fact that he's still alive?
I also question why of all the attempts to kill him, why he didn't die? If he was a DF user Kairouseki chains would disarm him yet he survives every attempt - he's clearly close to invincible without his DF powers enabled. Presumably nobody tries to drown him either which seems short-sighted.
His admiration of Whitebeard is more to connect the ideas of death and suicide with war (which isn't necessarily the case in OP - almost everyone important survives Paramount) with his own declaration of war.
A question I have is does Kaido know about Joker's defeat before he jumps? In the official (Stephen) translation, it could go either way - he says "Hurry up Joker!! Prepare for the Final Battle! Let this dreary world be destroyed! Let's start the greatest war this planet has ever seen!"
When I first read it, I thought it was him declaring war on Joker. But if you recall, Joker has been supplying Kaido with his SMILE to build his troops, so the statement can work if Joker was on his side (as in "hurry up and finish building my troops"). This would fit in to the fact that when we see Kaido's men learn about Joker, they don't know the location of Kaido (presumably he's already started heading up to the Sky Island).
Either way it's interesting that he used the jump as a last-ditch attempt to avoid starting the war (as evidenced by the line "I guess⊠there's no choice but to go through with it").
He's genuinely chasing suicide, not suicide attempts. IE he really just wants to die - if he cared about nobility, or hated the world, then he would start the war to destroy it (because nothing is more noble than dying on the battlefield). However the fact that he's willing to die from jumping off a Sky Island says to me he's bored of the "dreary" world and wants to be done with it any means necessary (which is why I think he would try drowning himself).
I haven't read 800 (I wait til the official release) so if this is cleared up please excuse me.
-
If kaidou has some dragon DF, hope it's not one of those giant 7 heads dragon freaks.
I want luffy to have a mano a mano, brawler vs brawler fight, not cut each of the 7 heads in order to defeat the giant nasty thing.
-
We're going to be seeing Dragons in Wano Country, since it was already foreshadowed when Ryuma was introduced, not to mention Kin'emon's hatred for them. I'd rather have Kaido having a pet Dragon, than him being one himself.
-
Not sure thats much worse than "Strongest Creature and Devil Fruit User Jumps Off Sky Island of Own Will and Dies".
Wrong. That would be an awesome death and the key is in how he falls with his arms crossed making it all the more badass. He certainly is looking to die, but not in a lame way.
You're thinking logically, not Oda-gically. Oda likes big, noisy, aggressive, manly, sexy things. His characters that pursue such ends obviously seek the same. We've got a Meseeks here who is looking to die in the most awesome way possible. Dunno how many times I can say it, he's not going to leave behind a legacy that ends with him drowning of own volition knowing his weakness as a DF user.
But fighting off Marines?
Being executed for crimes?
Jumping off a freaking sky island with your arms crossed!?All crazy stories for a grizzled criminal looking for a manly way to die because the outcome is uncertain. Drowning himself of his own volition due to a weakness is without question, a certain end. It's the uncertainty in the act that is the lynchpin.
If you can't see the direction his story is heading or pick up on all the clues I don't know what else to say. It's even possible to extrapolate precisely how he will meet his end at this point and believe me, he's going to get exactly what he's looking for.
(You 2chers out there that like to misconstrue my every word, this is entirely conjecture, albeit conjecture that I strongly believe in)
-
Or he has tried, but he's another exception to the rule like Blackbeard and now has a bunch of abilities.
That might be one of the main uses of the smiles he was getting: eating them to attept killing himself.
Regarding that, it was confirmed that Blackbeard was the only one in the records of history who has consumed two devil fruits (top, left-most speech bubble).
-
So Kin'emon's reaction to Kanjuro's Dragon seems to confirms this
-
Yeah unless its a bad translation we get yet another Wano doesn't like dragons reference.
-
As I said before, Momo transforms into a dragon when he is scared.
When Sanji and company successfully escaped from Doflamingo, Sanji was talking about Kaido, and Momo was seen transformed into a dragon.
In the Japanese version, the word "YONKO" [ćç] was stressed.
After that, Sanji followed Momonosuke and asked him about what was wrong, to which Momo responded that he cannot stop shaking, and he referred to the cause of his fear at that moment as a âflying manâ. And Kaido is a âflying manâ.
The âflying manâ ("éŁă¶ç·"), as I said before, was stressed in both the English version of CCC and the Japanese version.
We have two stresses in succession: "YONKO" and "flying man". I don't think that was a coincidence.
It is possible that Oda-sensei was talking about one thing, while using the stress to refer to something else(Kaido).
In this week's chapter, Kanjuru drew a dragon, and Kinemon reacted to that negatively. Responding to this, Kanjuro told him that as they say "an eye for an eye". In my view this means, just as Maju said, that "a dragon is the source of their problems, and a dragon will help them in overcoming them".
Kanjuro was not surprised at Kinemon's negative reaction to the dragon. He even appeared to be pacifying him.
Keep in mind that the reason that Kinemon was annoyed was not due to the dragon's resemblance to Momonosuke's Dragon Devil Fruit(as some have suggested). That is not possible because Kanjuro has never seen Momonosuke after he has consumed his artificial Dragon Devil Fruit.
There is a good possibility that the Dragon Devil Fruit that Kaido has is an Eastern dragon because both Kaido's mustache and Kanjuro's drawing appear to hint to this.
We must also keep in mind that Kanjuru's drawing is 'bad'. Kaido won't look like that
-
As I said before, Momo transforms into a dragon when he is scared.
When Sanji and company successfully escaped from Doflamingo, Sanji was talking about Kaido, and Momo was seen transformed into a dragon.
http://i.imgur.com/wNakNZe.pngIn the Japanese version, the word "YONKO" [ćç] was stressed.
http://i.imgur.com/qr5A0uW.jpgAfter that, Sanji followed Momonosuke and asked him about what was wrong, to which Momo responded that he cannot stop shaking, and he referred to the cause of his fear at that moment as a âflying manâ. And Kaido is a âflying manâ.
http://i.imgur.com/ud3nJZg.pngThe âflying manâ ("éŁă¶ç·"), as I said before, was stressed in both the English version of CCC and the Japanese version.
http://i.imgur.com/FpUMAa9.jpgWe have two stresses in succession: "YONKO" and "flying man". I don't think that was a coincidence.
It is possible that Oda-sensei was talking about one thing, while using the stress to refer to something else(Kaido).
In this week's chapter, Kanjuru drew a dragon, and Kinemon reacted to that negatively. Responding to this, Kanjuro told him that as they say "an eye for an eye". In my view this means, just as Maju said, that "a dragon is the source of their problems, and a dragon will help them in overcoming them". http://i.imgur.com/mh7Kx4H.png
Kanjuro was not surprised at Kinemon's negative reaction to the dragon. He even appeared to be pacifying him.
Keep in mind that the reason that Kinemon was annoyed was not due to the dragon's resemblance to Momonosuke's Dragon Devil Fruit(as some have suggested). That is not possible because Kanjuro has never seen Momonosuke after he has consumed his artificial Dragon Devil Fruit.
There is a good possibility that the Dragon Devil Fruit that Kaido has is an Eastern dragon because both Kaido's mustache and Kanjuro's drawing appear to hint to this.
We must also keep in mind that Kanjuru's drawing is 'bad'. Kaido won't look like that
kanjuro has seen momo's devil fruit.
-
The flying man that Momonosuke was talking about was Doflamingo.
It's makes it clear when you post the whole page, explaining it as a whole, not just the upper panel of the page.
Remember this was after Sanji's group got away from the "flying man" Doflamingo.
They all witnessed the aerial fight between Sanji and DD. Now regarding Momonosuke's statement about the "clouds", that was in Punk Hazard. He turned into a dragon and created artificial clouds, then started climbing(Flying in Luffy's eyes).
That why Luffy mentioned him flying before. His fear was all about Doflamingo. His flashback at Punk Hazard was an image of DD not Kaido. This page shows him trembling on the bottom panel, also when he remembered DD at Punk Hazard. -
@LordEnel:
kanjuro has seen momo's devil fruit.
Well, let's see now.
Kanjuro was captured at Dressrosa slightly after Momo went to Punk Hazard, wherein the artificial Dragon Devil Fruit was. Days after Kanjuro's capture, Momo ate the fruit because of his extreme hunger, met the Straw Hats, watched them defeat Caesar, and started heading back to Dressrosa with them so as to rescue Kanjuro from Doflamingo's clutches. When they arrived at Dressrosa, Luffy tried to fly Momo, but Momo refused to enter Dressrosa on his father's orders(701).
After that, Momo was on the Sunny playing Shogun with Nami, Brook and Chopper. Stuff happened, and Luffy told Sanji and Company to head to Zo ahead of them(chapter 730). At that time, Kinemon had still not found Kanjuro. Stuff happened again and kept happening until it reached chapter 746. At this chapter, Doflamingo initiated the Bird Cage, and put a bounty on everyone opposing him, and this includes Kinemon. People tried to catch Kinemon, and he jumped into a hole that leads to the "Scrap Yard". Therein Kinemon found Kanjuro(754). It was then that Kanjuro was shown to us for the first time. Meanwhile, Momonosuke was on the Sunny heading to Zo.
The battle with Doflamingo continued and everyone was engaged in it(Kinemon, Kanjuro, and Zoro, trying to stop the Bird Cage from shredding everyone on Dressrosa). 10 minutes after(Gear 4), Luffy defeated Doflamingo and saved everyone from the horror of the Birdcage(790 & 791).
The day after Luffy defeated Doflamingo, Momo and company have arrived at Zo. While they were at Zo, Kinemon and Kanjuro were at Dressrosa making preparations to escape together with Luffy from the marines.
After Kanjuro Luffy and co have successfully escaped from Fujitora, they partied and boarded Bartolomew's ship and started heading for Zo until they have reached it in this chapter.So how did Kanjuro see Momo's devil fruit then?
The flying man that Momonosuke was talking about was Doflamingo.
It's makes it clear when you post the whole page, explaining it as a whole, not just the upper panel of the page.http://s22.postimg.org/ba248hdq9/05_1.png
Remember this was after Sanji's group got away from the "flying man" Doflamingo.
They all witnessed the aerial fight between Sanji and DD.Oh, but I know. I have already said it in my previous post:
"It is possible that Oda-sensei was talking about one thing, while using the stress to refer to something else(Kaido)."
In other words, it is possible he was using Momo to talk about Doflamingo using those words "flying man", while he is using the stress in that pattern('yonko' followed by 'flying man') to refer to Kaido. That was what I said.
Furthermore, I used the article "a" when I referred to Kaido: "and Kaido is 'a' flying man". I did not use the article "the" to create the sentence "and Kaido is 'the' flying man." I was clear on this.
Now regarding Momonosuke's statement about the "clouds", that was in Punk Hazard. He turned into a dragon and created artificial clouds, then started climbing(Flying in Luffy's eyes).
That why Luffy mentioned him flying before.I have already said that in the theory:
"Shortly after the Straw Hatsâ arrival in Dressrosa, Luffy had tried to fly Momonosuke because of the flying ability that Momonosuke had displayed and used unconsciously to save both Luffy and himself from remaining in the pit wherein Luffy first stumbled upon him, but Momonosuke dreadfully and loudly rejected the idea of flying âagainâ through the 'skies' despite having no memory of the time when he had flown out of the pit together with Luffy, wherein there was no 'sky'."His fear was all about Doflamingo. His flashback at Punk Hazard was an image of DD not Kaido. This page shows him trembling on the bottom panel, also when he remembered DD at Punk Hazard.
When he was recalling Doflamingo, it was not at Punk Hazard. It was at Dressrosa. Even Kanjuro was with them at that instant.
Why do you think he trembles from Doflamingo? Because he is scary? That's half true. But he is mostly afraid about what will happen after Doflamingo catches him and delivers him to Kaido. He harbours fear about Kaido prior to meeting Doflamingo.
When Momo, Nami, Chooper, and Brook were on board the Suny while the rest of the group was on Dressrosa, Chopper told Brook that Momo has a scar on his heart. Whenever they leave him alone, he gets a serious look on his face, as though he is thinking about something.
Few chapters before this, it was revealed to us that Momo has aviophobia.
And I have shown in my theory how Kaido was the one who sowed this terror in his heart.
It couldn't have been Doflamingo because Doflamingo has never caught Momo before, let alone take him to the sky. It was this process of chasing Momonosuke that caused Momo to stow away in the ship that was headed for Punk Hazard.
At Punk Hazard, nobody was able to know the identity of Momonosuke. For this reason, Doflamingo was unable to know his whereabouts.
When Momonosuke was evading capture at Punk Hazard (and this capture had a different "purpose": giantification), Caesar's underlings were finding their chase weird because Momonosuke's name was not in the ship's registry.
I have already shown in the theory everything. Anything I say further in this discussion will be merely a paraphrase of things that were already mentioned in the theory.
-
Kin'emon could easy told Kanjuro about the situation and the new powers of Momonosuke and he mocks in 2 ways
-
When he was recalling Doflamingo, it was not at Punk Hazard. It was at Dressrosa. Even Kanjuro was with them at that instant.
Actually he recalled Doflamingo at Punk Hazard. That's when he started flying, out of fear.
Why do you think he trembles from Doflamingo? Because he is scary? That's half true. But he is mostly afraid about what will happen after Doflamingo catches him and delivers him to Kaido. He harbours fear about Kaido prior to meeting Doflamingo.
At Punk Hazard Momonosuke wasn't even aware that Doflamingo was working with Kaido. It was when they heard Law's plan at the ship.
When Momo, Nami, Chooper, and Brook were on board the Suny while the rest of the group was on Dressrosa, Chopper told Brook that Momo has a scar on his heart. Whenever they leave him alone, he gets a serious look on his face, as though he is thinking about something.
http://i.imgur.com/6GJYgoQ.pngA little kid witnessing DD's cruelty, then chased away, ending up on a ship filled with experimental kids, then witnessing a mad scientist, then he ended up on a dark place all alone. You won't have a scar in your heart with this experience?
Few chapters before this, it was revealed to us that Momo has aviophobia.
http://i.imgur.com/Bo0CZcI.png[And I have shown in my theory how Kaido was the one who sowed this terror in his heart.[/QUOTE]
That could've been the part with Luffy. When he flew with Luffy, they were heading up, that could be interpreted as "taking him to the sky", since he's still on denial that he flew himself.It couldn't have been Doflamingo because Doflamingo has never caught Momo before, let alone take him to the sky. It was this process of chasing Momonosuke that caused Momo to stow away in the ship that was headed for Punk Hazard.
Both times that Momonosuke was looking scared he had a flashback and a vision of Doflamingo.
The part where Momo was caught and taken to the sky, is still an assumption, based on his fear of flying.
But his shakes all points out to DD, as shown a couple of times, before and after kaido was revealed to be associated with DD. -
@The:
Kin'emon could easy told Kanjuro about the situation and the new powers of Momonosuke and he mocks in 2 ways
Good point. But then again, even if he told him about it, he shouldn't be annoyed at the sight of a dragon because it resembles his son's Dragon Devil Fruit. It appears unreasonable no matter how you look at it, unless he dislikes dragons for another reason (the theory lists the reasons), and Kanjuro is aware of that because he was shown pacifying him. It was like he expected that negative response from Kinemon.
Then there is the "eye for eye", which is used to return the like for the like, especially about harmful things that have been done to the person who is doing the returning.
Kanjuro couldn't have been talking about Momonosuke at that instant. It would be unreasonable to use the "law of retaliation" (eye for eye) to allude to Momonosuke.Actually he recalled Doflamingo at Punk Hazard. That's when he started flying, out of fear.
Well, you provided one image in which Momo was recalling Doflamingo at Dressrosa, and you were discussing another event from Punk Hazard. That's why there was confusion on this matter.
He wasn't actually "recalling" Doflamingo; he was "hallucinating" Doflamingo. There is this difference that contributes to the confusion.At Punk Hazard Momonosuke wasn't even aware that Doflamingo was working with Kaido. It was when they heard Law's plan at the ship.
I wasn't talking about the Punk Hazard incident. I was talking about the Dressrosa incident, and in the Dressrosa incident he was absolutely certain that Doflamingo was working with Kaido.
A little kid witnessing DD's cruelty, then chased away, ending up on a ship filled with experimental kids, then witnessing a mad scientist, then he ended up on a dark place all alone. You won't have a scar in your heart with this experience?
It's true that Doffy's cruelty had a little impact on him. As I said before, "that is half true"; however, the kids, Caesar, and the hole couldn't have been what caused him that. When Momo Stowed away on the boat that was heading to Punk Hazard, he did not know that the children were "experiments" of Caesar.
Even after witnessing their giant size, that did not emotionally affect him. It was shown in the chapter of "My Name Is Momonosuke". It was until he overheard Caesar that he became aware of the fact that those children were being used as experiments.Regarding the pit(hole), he hid in it with his own volition, and his presence in that hole did not appear to have any emotionally negative impact on him. The chapter named "My Name Is Momonosuke" says it all.
That could've been the part with Luffy. When he flew with Luffy, they were heading up, that could be interpreted as "taking him to the sky", since he's still on denial that he flew himself.
You are suggesting that it was Luffy who asked Momonosuke his name and grabbed him, and they flew together. That is impossible because when Momo was about to fly, Luffy was telling him to get a hold of himself; he wasn't asking his name. The image you posted says it all. To avoid any further confusions regarding this issue, look at the image before it. Luffy was asking if he was dying with "hunger", and he was telling him to get a hold of himself.
Momo was flying unconsciously from that pit. His swirly eyes say a lot on this matter.
Moreover, Luffy was told Momo's name many pages before Momo unconscisouly flew out from the pit. Like I said, it's evidently impossible for that to be Luffy.
When Momo was saying that he doesn't remember flying in that pit, he was telling the truth.
Both times that Momonosuke was looking scared he had a flashback and a vision of Doflamingo.
I have explained the Punk Hazard issue. It was a hallucination. He was not recalling Doflamingo. As for the second time that he was talking about Doflamingo, he was fully aware of Doflamingo's connection to Kaido, so it is natural to fear Doflamingo then, since it must have become clear to him that Doflamingo desires to deliver him to Kaido.
The part where Momo was caught and taken to the sky, is still an assumption, based on his fear of flying.
That is not an assumption. Saying that it is an assumption is an understatement. Logically, it is called a strong inductive argument. It is supported by many other things in the theory, not just his fear of flying.
But his shakes all points out to DD, as shown a couple of times, before and after kaido was revealed to be associated with DD.
Not at all.
As I have said in another one of my theories, Momonosuke transforms into a dragon when he is scared.When the Straw Hats were talking about Doflamingo, he was not transformed into a dragon.
However, as soon as Kaido's name surfaced in the conversation along with his connection to Doflamingo, he transformed into a dragon.
Ever since then, he has been transforming into a dragon when Doflamingo is present.
