watch it, enjoy it, hype.
Bruce Timm new Justice League: of gods and monsters
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watch it, enjoy it, hype.
Something about the batman universe always breeds nightmare fuel.
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watch it, enjoy it, hype.
…......
Remember when superheroes were fun?
Well, at least we still have Marvel.
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…......
Remember when superheroes were fun?
Well, at least we still have Marvel.
So you've finally seen the light on Ultimate Spider-Man, Agents Of Smash, & Avengers Assemble eh
I've often wondered about that myself; seems like being supported by people who only want you there so the world can end in fire (with you going to Hell in the process) would be somewhat off-putting
3DS Friend Code 0044-2806-5284
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So you've finally seen the light on Ultimate Spider-Man, Agents Of Smash, & Avengers Assemble eh
Well, I was referring more to the MCU. Hell, I haven't even seen Spectacular Spiderman yet.
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watch it, enjoy it, hype.
1. Harley has blonde hair. She can have highlights or streaks, but the base should always be blonde.
2. Uhhhh . . . . . . . . . . . -
I'm kind of torn on this.
On one hand, I am sick of the edginess. It really sucks having nieces and nephews who like superheroes, but they don't have much for the DCU world to watch since most of it isn't made for kids much lately (Brave and the Bold was wonderful). We've ended up just sticking to Marvel because of this.
On the other, I kind of like the horror motif. Harley being the 'kidnap people to make playthings out of their corpses' killer is stupid, but the series concept could be entertaining if they do it right.
I don't have high hopes for this, I admit.
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So, I'm the only one hyped?
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I am sufficiently un-hyped, in fact. Looks dreary.
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it's… not bad .. but if Bruce Timm weren't attached, i wouldn't have any expectations for this to get any better
"In an alternative history Zod is Superman's father, Batman is a vampiric Man-Bat, and Wonder Woman is the child of Ares, God of War. When these dark heroes form an alliance, the question everyone asks is will they save the world, or rule it?"the trailer is a bit more interesting. this superman looks cool
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I don`t think I like that. Nope, no thx.
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Oooh, females in skimpy outfits. Edgy.
Or to be a little more exact, ludicrous. :getlost:–- Update From New Post Merge ---
I don`t think I like that. Nope, no thx.
We know dude.
[hide]
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I'm kind of torn on this.
On one hand, I am sick of the edginess. It really sucks having nieces and nephews who like superheroes, but they don't have much for the DCU world to watch since most of it isn't made for kids much lately (Brave and the Bold was wonderful). We've ended up just sticking to Marvel because of this.
They ever watched other DC animated series everyone's seen and never shuts up about?
the trailer is a bit more interesting. this superman looks cool
Well he does look like Tony Stark.
@Nobodyman:Well, I was referring more to the MCU. Hell, I haven't even seen Spectacular Spiderman yet.
To paraphrase Stephen A. Smith "Dayum".
I've often wondered about that myself; seems like being supported by people who only want you there so the world can end in fire (with you going to Hell in the process) would be somewhat off-putting
3DS Friend Code 0044-2806-5284
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To expand on what I said before:
Remember when superheroes were fun?
Remember when they were in shows that parents could watch with their kids?
Remember when they inspired hope and optimism?
Remember when Harley was a spunky villainess and not a depraved, chainsaw-wielding, panty-exposing lunatic who put body parts in a fridge for no discernible reason?
And now everything's dark and brutal. Because, for some reason, superheroes had to be dark and brutal.
And, yeah, I get it. The fans don't want to be "talked down to". They don't want to be "treated like kids." But we have The Dark Knight Returns. We have Watchmen. We have Burton's Batman. We have Nolan's Batman. We have Man of Steel. We have a comic universe full of killers, wife-beaters, drunks, people dying horribly, and people angsting over their inability to save people (and these are meant to be our heroes). And now we have Harley Quinn committing acts so gruesome it would make Hannibal Lecter blush.
What more do you want?
And I'm not against dark elements in story-telling. In fact, that's part of what made the DCAU so great. But they were always done with a bit of class and restraint. One of, if not the best, moments in Superman TAS comes at the end of Darkseid's invasion of Earth. With Superman incapacitated, Dan Turpin, an ordinary man with no superheroes, rallies the people of Metropolis together and they succeed in holding off Darkseid's forces and inspiring Superman to break free. Darkseid's invasion is stopped, but, in one final act of spite, he murders Dan Turpin. The world has lost a hero. After his funeral, Superman looks over his grave and says, "In the end, the world didn't need a Superman…just a brave one." The episode is dedicated to Jack Kirby.
I've read the gist of what this Gods and Monster thing is and, apparently, what we take away from it is that, in some alternate universe, the heroes we know and love are a bunch of crazy people who kill their enemies with no due process. Gee. How uplifting.
This isn't creative. This isn't original. This isn't clever. It requires no talent and there's no wisdom in it. It's just a sick twisted fantasy that a teenager would think up, which is mainly what this is marketed to.
I know it's kind of random to be saying all this now since, yes, superheroes have been uber dark for quite some time. And yes, I know this isn't meant for a large audience, and will most-likely be bought only by the hardcore DC fans who will watch it and then, probably, just as soon forget about it in a few weeks. But...maybe it's because it's Bruce Timm doing this. Heck, maybe this isn't even the first time he's done something like this, but I turned on that video hoping I'd see more superhero-y goodness from the master and, sure, the animation is top notch as usual, but.......yeah. And what's really sad is that this is apparently what Timm's generation has turned into. A bunch of shut-ins who want to see the stuffed decaying corpse of a little boy. This is what we took away from those old cartoons?
Well, I hope they enjoy it.
And the lamb lies down on Broadway
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Trying to hard to be edgy.
But I might give it a shot and see how it goes.
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What more do you want?
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Remember when they were in shows that parents could watch with their kids?
Yep and the occasional animated movie where the writers had more leeway than the networks would offer them letting them do things like having the Villians kill or torture people like in the comics.
Judging from the reactions of the last few animated movies nope.
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Apparently its not even Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman… its three different characters in similar roles. A kryptonian, (son of Zod) an vampire, and a new god.
I'm all for elseworlds titles but, eh... I just really don't like the dark, dark stuff in my superheroes. (there's a time and a place for it, sure.)
Can we please go back to the middle ground between this and Teen Titans GO?
They ever watched other DC animated series everyone's seen and never shuts up about?
Those shows are 15-23! years old and don't get rerun on tv anymore. Unless you explicitly own the dvds and are showing them those, no, todays kids don't get those great toons and versions of the characters.
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You knoooow. I'm genuinely really annoyed at most of the comments in here and I won't even touch this subject with quotes if I have too. A bit sensitive much? I know alot of peeps don't really like the dark approach DC tends to go for, and I agree most of them have been pretty damned terrible or "try hard" as of late. But I feel this project actually actually has some merits. Especially after I've read over some of Bruce Timm's interviews with this alternative universe, and his reasoning behind the design choices and themes. It's like back when he introduced Batman with The Animated Series. He simply saw the typical approach to superheroes or Batman for the matter, and then decided to do something completely different with it even if it had a chance of being canned or looked down/downrated on by a consensus of kids in a closed viewing.
So yeah. I have alot of respect for the design behind this one, and heck… from the trailer, it doesn't look much different than the usual Justice League animated series. The character centric ones on the other hand... From what I read, those were intentionally pushing it and doesn't really reflect the actual thing.
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Theres a difference between overly "sensitive"
and
"don't like what they've done for tone on basically everything for the last several years" combined with a side of "they canceled the stuff that was doing it extremely right."
If it wasn't Bruce Tim it wouldn't be getting even a benefit of doubt. It just looks dark for the sake of being dark… coming from a man who has been doing this for 25 years now and is just tired of what he'd been doing.
Its absolutely fine for DC to do dark material. There's always been dark stuff throughout the years, even among the bright stuff. (Just look at teen Titan's darker bits.)
It just kind of sucks that that's basically all they do now.
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From what I read, those were intentionally pushing it and doesn't really reflect the actual thing.
Well maybe if these shorts aren't actually representative of the actual upcoming material… and are just being darker and edgier PURELY for the sake of being darker and edgier and shock value...
they shouldn't be the first things being shown to us?
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Apparently its not even Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman… its three different characters in similar roles. A kryptonian, (son of Zod) an vampire, and a new god.
I'm all for elseworlds titles but, eh... I just really don't like the dark, dark stuff in my superheroes. (there's a time and a place for it, sure.)
Can we please go back to the middle ground between this and Teen Titans GO?
Those shows are 15-23! years old and don't get rerun on tv anymore. Unless you explicitly own the dvds and are showing them those, no, todays kids don't get those great toons and versions of the characters.
if you consider netflix as sort of the new -go to- for kids, all the classics are there so it's likely they're still getting plenty of exposure. I wouldn't have seen 90% of DC shows if it wasn't for netflix
I think the Joker Returns is a great level of adultyness for Bruce Timm. Like maybe it could be pushed more but it really didn't need to.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
If it wasn't Bruce Tim it wouldn't be getting even a benefit of doubt. It just looks dark for the sake of being dark… coming from a man who has been doing this for 25 years now and is just tired of what he'd been doing.
honestly I think that clip was 10% Bruce Timm and 90% executives breathing down his neck to make things 'cool'
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You knoooow. I'm genuinely really annoyed at most of the comments in here and I won't even touch this subject with quotes if I have too. A bit sensitive much? I know alot of peeps don't really like the dark approach DC tends to go for, and I agree most of them have been pretty damned terrible or "try hard" as of late. But I feel this project actually actually has some merits. Especially after I've read over some of Bruce Timm's interviews with this alternative universe, and his reasoning behind the design choices and themes. It's like back when he introduced Batman with The Animated Series. He simply saw the typical approach to superheroes or Batman for the matter, and then decided to do something completely different with it even if it had a chance of being canned or looked down/downrated on by a consensus of kids in a closed viewing.
So yeah. I have alot of respect for the design behind this one, and heck… from the trailer, it doesn't look much different than the usual Justice League animated series. The character centric ones on the other hand... From what I read, those were intentionally pushing it and doesn't really reflect the actual thing.
i agree to an extent! It's hard to judge based on a 5 minute clip, and there's tons of shows I wouldn't like based on 5 minutes of viewing. What I saw didn't particularly make me jump up and down in my seat but I think it has plenty of potential to actually be good
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Every new Harley Quinn outfit is worse than the last.
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A more psycho Harley Quinn isn't necessarily a bad concept to play with. It's just the hair is making me twitch.
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A more psycho Harley Quinn isn't necessarily a bad concept to play with. It's just the hair is making me twitch.
Not the big eyes, creepy grin, or mole?
I've often wondered about that myself; seems like being supported by people who only want you there so the world can end in fire (with you going to Hell in the process) would be somewhat off-putting
3DS Friend Code 0044-2806-5284
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Eh. I'll give anything from Timm/Dini/DCAU a shot. There hasn't been a direct-to-dvd movie yet that I hated, and this barely seems "darker" than Joker and his smile gas, Baby Doll in BtAS, Ace in JLU, the twist in RotJ, etc. Not that that would be a problem.
shrugsI will admit that that trailer seemed bizarrely edited, though. It seems pretty clear that the Harley scene is like 5 minutes and serves to introduce Vamp Bats (ending with shocking reveal), but it got 1/3 of the trailer time…
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ugh I loathe these character designs
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Not the big eyes, creepy grin, or mole?
Not really, no.
The grin makes it look like she's inherited more of the Joker's look.
I'm not digging Batman's design though either.
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Return of the Joker was about the appropiate level of full bore darkness. Even before the edits.
It didn't have severed limbs being preserved in a fridge.
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@CCC:
There hasn't been a direct-to-dvd movie yet that I hated, and this barely seems "darker" than Joker and his smile gas, Baby Doll in BtAS, Ace in JLU, the twist in RotJ, etc.
We seem to have very different ideas about what constitutes "dark".
-The worst I ever saw of Joker's smile gas was in the Dark Knight Returns movie (which I haven't seen or read in its entirety, but based on what I have seen I doubt I'd really like it)
-Baby Doll and Ace? Yeah, sure, they were dark in that they were tragic characters and kind of creepy by design, but there was nothing horrendously disturbing or exploitative about them.
-For me, the flashback showing what the Joker did to Tim Drake and maybe Bonk's death were the darkest parts of the film, and those…really weren't so bad. Tim Drake still lived and seemed to have a happy life (in between Joker possessions)And the lamb lies down on Broadway
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Why is dark and edgy such a bad thing, anyways? Does it not convey something true to human nature that deserves an outlet for expression, too?
3DS FC: 0662-3589-2887
NNID: Gibbs-free
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Theres a difference between overly "sensitive"
and
"don't like what they've done for tone on basically everything for the last several years" combined with a side of "they canceled the stuff that was doing it extremely right."
If it wasn't Bruce Tim it wouldn't be getting even a benefit of doubt. It just looks dark for the sake of being dark… coming from a man who has been doing this for 25 years now and is just tired of what he'd been doing.
Its absolutely fine for DC to do dark material. There's always been dark stuff throughout the years, even among the bright stuff. (Just look at teen Titan's darker bits.)
It just kind of sucks that that's basically all they do now.
Assuming you never saw this before? [hide]
[/hide]–- Update From New Post Merge ---
A kids film, mind you?
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Why is dark and edgy such a bad thing, anyways? Does it not convey something true to human nature that deserves an outlet for expression, too?
Absolutely. No denial of that. But…
1. Conveying dark and edgy isn't inherently good or bad. What matters is what you're trying saying and how you go about it.
2. Is a story about larger-than-life spandex-wearing superhumans who fight crime really the best outlet? Or, at least, does it need to be at the point where it's almost the status quo?
3. There's dark and edgy, and there's being exploitatively creepysigh I'm about to repeat the whole HxH debacle, aren't I?
And the lamb lies down on Broadway
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Absolutely. No denial of that. But…
1. Conveying dark and edgy isn't inherently good or bad. What matters is what you're trying saying and how you go about it.
2. Is a story about larger-than-life spandex-wearing superhumans who fight crime really the best outlet? Or, at least, does it need to be at the point where it's almost the status quo?
3. There's dark and edgy, and there's being exploitatively creepysigh I'm about to repeat the whole HxH debacle, aren't I?
1. Why should a message matter? Art is about expression, messages are a subset of that. Something dark and edgy without a message is still valid expression that definitely conveys something common in human experience that's worth sharing.
2. Yes. Yes it is. There are plenty of factors that make superhero stories fertile soil for the dark and edgy. Superhero stories are power fantasies, and you know what they say about power and corruption. Beyond that, there's also the large scale reaction to the very altruistic and idealist roots of the genre, especially their growth through the Silver Age, which limited heroes to two-dimensional paradigms. Though that may be way in the past by now, because it's so integral to comic culture, especially in DC comics, the idea of subverting it is artistically attractive.
3. I still don't see why that doesn't deserve expression. Is it because they're offputting? Because that makes them that much more interesting to engage in, especially in the air of futile cynicism that's defined a lot of internet-era culture.Yeah, this is a similar can of worms to the whole HXH thing, but no less worth engaging in my mind.
3DS FC: 0662-3589-2887
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Why is dark and edgy such a bad thing, anyways? Does it not convey something true to human nature that deserves an outlet for expression, too?
Pssh I see your game. You just want more screencaps/inspiration for your melodic hardcore black deathmetal album cover.
Hey you! Let's party!
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1. Why should a message matter? Art is about expression, messages are a subset of that. Something dark and edgy without a message is still valid expression that definitely conveys something common in human experience that's worth sharing.
the viewer is the one who decides if it's worth sharing. Dark and Edgy with no message is about as entertaining as Light and Sappy with no message.. you get that same feeling of being pandered to
anyways there's something kinda crap about presenting 'dark and edgy' in particular for entertainment
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Pssh I see your game. You just want more screencaps/inspiration for your melodic hardcore black deathmetal album cover.
I swear it's just a coincidence that our new LP is called Fridges Full of Human Meat.
the viewer is the one who decides if it's worth sharing. Dark and Edgy with no message is about as entertaining as Light and Sappy with no message.. you get that same feeling of being pandered to
anyways there's something kinda crap about presenting 'dark and edgy' in particular for entertainment
On one hand, I get that comparison to light and sappy, but on the other, that doesn't mean they aren't evocative of something. I think it's easier to see in poetry? A lot of the most famous and popular poetry is light and sappy without wanting to say anything in particular besides trying to evoke some happy feeling, and it works for some (actual quality is a separate dimension from viability). Same goes for angsty poetry.
If we're just talking about the network trying to appeal to the popular interest, I still think there's something to be said both about how dark/edgy can be the popular interest and the appeal that it must hold to be that popular.
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We seem to have very different ideas about what constitutes "dark".
Guess we do, because I didn't see anything much worse about this Harley clip. Par for the course for these movies, which- while they aren't always DARK- tend to be more PG-13 than anything they ever showed on TV (not to support anything Frank Miller, but cartoony heads in fridges has nothing on Return of the Dark Knight Part 2). "Disturbing" is obviously subjective. Maybe it's games like Resident Evil that make me roll my eyes at the suggestion that this is anything but tame. If anything, it's a little…trite.
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We know dude.
[hide]http://www.theriddlefactory.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/3.jpg[/hide]Gah, I walked right into that one, didn`t I?
To expand on what I said before:
! Remember when superheroes were fun?
! Remember when they were in shows that parents could watch with their kids?
! Remember when they inspired hope and optimism?
! Remember when Harley was a spunky villainess and not a depraved, chainsaw-wielding, panty-exposing lunatic who put body parts in a fridge for no discernible reason?
! And now everything's dark and brutal. Because, for some reason, superheroes had to be dark and brutal.
! And, yeah, I get it. The fans don't want to be "talked down to". They don't want to be "treated like kids." But we have The Dark Knight Returns. We have Watchmen. We have Burton's Batman. We have Nolan's Batman. We have Man of Steel. We have a comic universe full of killers, wife-beaters, drunks, people dying horribly, and people angsting over their inability to save people (and these are meant to be our heroes). And now we have Harley Quinn committing acts so gruesome it would make Hannibal Lecter blush.
! What more do you want?
! And I'm not against dark elements in story-telling. In fact, that's part of what made the DCAU so great. But they were always done with a bit of class and restraint. One of, if not the best, moments in Superman TAS comes at the end of Darkseid's invasion of Earth. With Superman incapacitated, Dan Turpin, an ordinary man with no superheroes, rallies the people of Metropolis together and they succeed in holding off Darkseid's forces and inspiring Superman to break free. Darkseid's invasion is stopped, but, in one final act of spite, he murders Dan Turpin. The world has lost a hero. After his funeral, Superman looks over his grave and says, "In the end, the world didn't need a Superman…just a brave one." The episode is dedicated to Jack Kirby.
! I've read the gist of what this Gods and Monster thing is and, apparently, what we take away from it is that, in some alternate universe, the heroes we know and love are a bunch of crazy people who kill their enemies with no due process. Gee. How uplifting.
! This isn't creative. This isn't original. This isn't clever. It requires no talent and there's no wisdom in it. It's just a sick twisted fantasy that a teenager would think up, which is mainly what this is marketed to.
! I know it's kind of random to be saying all this now since, yes, superheroes have been uber dark for quite some time. And yes, I know this isn't meant for a large audience, and will most-likely be bought only by the hardcore DC fans who will watch it and then, probably, just as soon forget about it in a few weeks. But...maybe it's because it's Bruce Timm doing this. Heck, maybe this isn't even the first time he's done something like this, but I turned on that video hoping I'd see more superhero-y goodness from the master and, sure, the animation is top notch as usual, but.......yeah. And what's really sad is that this is apparently what Timm's generation has turned into. A bunch of shut-ins who want to see the stuffed decaying corpse of a little boy. This is what we took away from those old cartoons?
! Well, I hope they enjoy it.Pretty much this. I don
t mind darkness in comic books, Im alright with, for example, the Dark Knight having a rather dark atmosphere. But I dont remember the Joker keeping peoples heads in his fridge or stuffing the bodys of children in that movie. There is a difference between being a little dark or moody and going all Saw on the viewer. This is just way over the top for my taste. I dont want to see Harley Quinn of all people being portrayed as a deranged monster and I dont get any enjoyment from watching Batman brutally murder his enemies. That said, thats just me. As long as this is just an Elsewhere story with a different take on the characters, I can atleast with it. It`s not like that in the comics…right?--- Update From New Post Merge ---
Not the big eyes, creepy grin, or mole?
I actually kinda like Harley
s look here:ninja: Its appropriate for this version. I hated her outfit though, is that supposed to be sexy or something? Thats just, imho, again trying to be unnecessarily edgy. "Oh look, she is half naked, you can see her underpants, isnt that great?"
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1. Why should a message matter? Art is about expression, messages are a subset of that. Something dark and edgy without a message is still valid expression that definitely conveys something common in human experience that's worth sharing.
People can depict art however they want. I don't think anyone's denying that. They can depict The Joker taking babies from a maternity ward and throwing them into a meat grinder if they think that it, somehow, reflects the human experience. They can depict a turtle on its back next to a jar of mayonnaise if they think that it, somehow, reflects the human experience. It doesn't mean that everyone is going to like it or even find value in it. And that's the problem here is a number of us, based on what we've seen so far, DON'T like this and find little, if any, value in it.
When it comes down it, I suppose any form of art deserves to be expressed, as long as it doesn't infringe on the rights of others (e.g. a snuff film). Heck, even if it's just one guy in a million who sees an artistic vision that those other 999,999 would deem "offensive" or "worthless", no one can deny him his right to express it. And, apparently, a good number of people do like this new interpretation of the DC characters (more than 13,500 at least, according to Youtube). And that's fine. By all means, let their voices be heard. But there's also people who don't like it. I'm sure there are quite a few of us here who are disappointed that Bruce Timm, a man who made up a good part of our childhoods, has decided to go in a direction that we're not fond of, and we'd like to let that voice be heard, even if it's just on a little forum dedicated to a rubber pirate comic.
tl;dr The right of artistic expression should be preserved. However, you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink
And the lamb lies down on Broadway
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Well, I didn't plan this through, felt kind of bad for this being offputting for so many people.
I just found interesting a batman villian made to fear, not just pitty, or be entretained with.
That episode of The brave and the bold that deals with "what tone should batman be", and all the interpretations are valid goes both ways, lighthearthed and grimdark. Specialy if Vampire Batman is not Bruce.
Also, Bruce Timm has done enough amazing things to get a try run for this level of gore. Is like if oda went full berserk.
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People can depict art however they want. I don't think anyone's denying that. They can depict The Joker taking babies from a maternity ward and throwing them into a meat grinder if they think that it, somehow, reflects the human experience. They can depict a turtle on its back next to a jar of mayonnaise if they think that it, somehow, reflects the human experience. It doesn't mean that everyone is going to like it or even find value in it. And that's the problem here is a number of us, based on what we've seen so far, DON'T like this and find little, if any, value in it.
When it comes down it, I suppose any form of art deserves to be expressed, as long as it doesn't infringe on the rights of others (e.g. a snuff film). Heck, even if it's just one guy in a million who sees an artistic vision that those other 999,999 would deem "offensive" or "worthless", no one can deny him his right to express it. And, apparently, a good number of people do like this new interpretation of the DC characters (more than 13,500 at least, according to Youtube). And that's fine. By all means, let their voices be heard. But there's also people who don't like it. I'm sure there are quite a few of us here who are disappointed that Bruce Timm, a man who made up a good part of our childhoods, has decided to go in a direction that we're not fond of, and we'd like to let that voice be heard, even if it's just on a little forum dedicated to a rubber pirate comic.
tl;dr The right of artistic expression should be preserved. However, you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink
Well, you and some other folks were calling out the appropriateness of the expression in the genre, which I have beef with. If you're at the point of accepting and understanding the artistic value of something you don't like without having to like it, then I'm with you 100%, but if you're going to treat your personal tastes as general truths then you're headed into beef town, my friend.
3DS FC: 0662-3589-2887
NNID: Gibbs-free
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Well, you and some other folks were calling out the appropriateness of the expression in the genre,
I don' think anyone is saying the genre can't or shouldn't do it.
I think mostly we're tired of the fact it seems to be what they do all the time now as the standard on almost all their properties, from comics to movies to television to animation to games, and that's what feels wrong.
(And no, I don't need to read a batman comic, in the MAIN LINE, where we see Alfred's hand getting chopped off bloodily on camera and the joker surgically removes his face.)
When there's options its one thing. When its the only thing being made and its crowding out the other stuff to the point it doesn't exist? Bleh. And DC has reeeeally been ignoring the "all ages" crowd that they hit so well for so long.
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I don' think anyone is saying the genre can't or shouldn't do it.
I think mostly we're tired of the fact it seems to be what they do all the time now as the standard on almost all their properties, from comics to movies to television to animation to games, and that's what feels wrong.
(And no, I don't need to read a batman comic, in the MAIN LINE, where we see Alfred's hand getting chopped off bloodily on camera and the joker surgically removes his face.)
When there's options its one thing. When its the only thing being made and its crowding out the other stuff to the point it doesn't exist? Bleh. And DC has reeeeally been ignoring the "all ages" crowd that they hit so well for so long.
No, that specifically came up a few times, between Nobody and Riddler. Your problem seemed to be more about it being overdone and its execution, which are more valid complaints.
I also don't like the demographic arguments that have come up a few times. They reeks of ageism that is at the center of the whole 'talking down' thing you mentioned before, which makes dark/edgy so popular in the first place. I mean, I'm all for a paradigm shift in a stagnant genre, but it shouldn't be just another way to look down on the young.
3DS FC: 0662-3589-2887
NNID: Gibbs-free
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Well, you and some other folks were calling out the appropriateness of the expression in the genre, which I have beef with. If you're at the point of accepting and understanding the artistic value of something you don't like without having to like it, then I'm with you 100%, but if you're going to treat your personal tastes as general truths then you're headed into beef town, my friend.
I'll come right out and admit that not everything I said in my soapbox post was 100% fair (mainly I just wanted to get it off my chest). I understand different people have different tastes and tolerances and see in value in things that others may not.
Me? I don't know if I see artistic value in Psycho Killer Leatherface Harley, but I understand that others might. I'm very particular when it comes to the gruesome disturbing stuff. A lot of times, to me, it comes off as excessive and sadistic and…it just makes me feel bad. But a lot of people are apparently more tolerant to it and I kind of wish I could feel the same.
And, as I said before, I guess just seeing Bruce Timm involved in this is what set it off for me. If this was being done by some other random DC animator, I probably wouldn't even care.
Anyway, here's the next segment
Still a better Superman than Man of Steel
And yeah, I think I liked this one a lot better
And the lamb lies down on Broadway
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Superman looks better with a coat instead of a cape. But why does the fact that he is Zod's son he somehow have a beard?
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See, that was fine. It was darker in tone (but not really beyond anything Justice League did) but wasn't gruesome for the sake of nastiness.
Maybe it was just a mistake to start with the Batman clip.
Superman looks better with a coat instead of a cape. But why does the fact that he is Zod's son he somehow have a beard?
He wasn't raised by the Kents in Kansas.
Different nature, and different nurture. Gonna come out different.
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Ehhhhh…I'm just not really feeling the designs. Terrence Stamp Superman is kinda interesting I guess.
I do approve of President Amanda Waller however. And...DOCTOR SIVANA???? DC remembers Captain Marvel has villains that aren't Black Adam????? This may be worth it after all.
 
