Hey guys remember how Kubo made that huge point about killing God basically by subduing Aizen? Well it turns out that we've got a guy who he threw the biblical name of God at! Clearly this isn't a sign that he'll make the battle even _more_ dragged out than Aizen, right?
Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time
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Bleach was never good. The beginning was engaging and that's it. Soul Society arc already showed many of Kubo's flaws, how he likes to introduce lots of characters at the same time (each with their own meaningless flashback) while dragging the old ones with no real purpose, that he liked cheap plot twists and that he handled power levels terribly.
Naruto on the other hand started great and was enjoyable. In retrospect, it was extremely rushed, but at the time it felt right.
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@Purple:
Reminds me that Bleach spent a full 23 chapters or almost half a year on that deicide nonsense. Makes me wonder how long it'll take to beat J-wach
On the other hand, looking at Naruto now…
Lest we forget, the whole Deicide stuff was mostly Aizen dicking around with Ichigo's friends and then Gin's betrayal. The actual final battle between him and Ichigo, ironically, was rushed as hell.
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Does that mean that he, like the rest of the world, was completely tired of that shit by the end and just wanted it to be over?
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Lest we forget, the whole Deicide stuff was mostly Aizen dicking around with Ichigo's friends and then Gin's betrayal. The actual final battle between him and Ichigo, ironically, was rushed as hell.
Thank fucking God for that too.
Though Kubo could at least have Ichigo be the one to beat Aizen and not…. Aizen.
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Bleach was never good. The beginning was engaging and that's it. Soul Society arc already showed many of Kubo's flaws, how he likes to introduce lots of characters at the same time (each with their own meaningless flashback) while dragging the old ones with no real purpose, that he liked cheap plot twists and that he handled power levels terribly.
Naruto on the other hand started great and was enjoyable. In retrospect, it was extremely rushed, but at the time it felt right.
Sorry but Naruto showed many of Kishimoto flaws early as well! I noticed a lot of them from the first view, thing is thatI never thought that he would dismiss stuff that he made earlier(how would I know) and that the flaws would be more persistently and big, to the point of turning all of it stupid.
Examples:
The main point of the story was Naruto infancy and how it was cruel, but it was always superficially showed and badly handled. How can a baby and later a kid survive without guardians? If that point of "Naruto don't have parents he was all alone" wan'ts reinforced so much than it would be OK for his story to be superficial. Hell, Harry Potter talks a lot less about that stuff and it explained the history of Harry Potter infancy, even the manga Kingdom, where that is practically not mentioned anymore.All the drama of the first chapter was due to Naruto Sexy no Jutsu the Hokage. If the title was Bbobobo-bo bo-bobo and the drama was only played for laughs I would understand but real drama based on that?
Zabuza was a Jounin Ninja specialized in Silence Killing and completing his mission with minimum effort. Zabuza passes all of his arc badmouthing Kakashi and fighting him when the mission was killing the old Bridge Guy.
Chuunin Exam have multiple villages to improve their relationship! Put the kids from different villages killing each other!
Chuunin is the middle ground of a ninja and the main power in the village. Makes an Exam really hard, that even when you have a dozen of candidates(with other villages included) you have to make another competition to make less of them into it.
Next Hokage first appearance was showing her being beat by a guy like Kabuto and saved by a guy like Naruto. The Summoning Jutsu was like a mean to say, no, she isn't weak, when it was totally showed that she is.
Decision to send troops to a fugitive, worse, sending kids Genin and one new Chuunin to the mission, and knowing they would fight against Elite Ninja from the worse criminal of the village. The explanation for it was specially bad too. The only adults chuunin that we have are defending the village. Why not substitute some of them for the kids. Is way better to have kids mixed with adults, defending the village than sending kids to their death.
And there are more and more and more.
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Lest we forget, the whole Deicide stuff was mostly Aizen dicking around with Ichigo's friends and then Gin's betrayal. The actual final battle between him and Ichigo, ironically, was rushed as hell.
Well, there was that stuff about Aizen revealing that Ichigo was a shinigami and a human -> Urahara showing up. Basically it was the entire time he was morphing into a beautiful butterflaizen.
But yeah the actual final confrontation part of that was really rushed. "Whaaaat? Ichigo has even more broken powers than I do?"
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@Purple:
Well, there was that stuff about Aizen revealing that Ichigo was a shinigami and a human -> Urahara showing up. Basically it was the entire time he was morphing into a beautiful butterflaizen.
But yeah the actual final confrontation part of that was really rushed. "Whaaaat? Ichigo has even more broken powers than I do?"
The final battle against Aizen, from Ichigo going to a dimension with distorted time and gaining a new power with the help of his father, was the exact same thing that happened to Psyren! The thing with Psyren is that it was cancelled so it rushed a lot, but Bleach …
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The final battle against Aizen, from Ichigo going to a dimension with distorted time and gaining a new power with the help of his father, was the exact same thing that happened to Psyren! The thing with Psyren is that it was cancelled so it rushed a lot, but Bleach …
Yeah, it took me a while to get over how Psyren was handled.
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Bleach pissed me off. After Ichigo beat Aizen and started living his new normal life he never once went and asked his father about him being a captain class shinigami. He had months to ask. And when it mattered he trusted some creeper stranger over his family. In the beginning Ichigo was supposed to be very intelligent. But he's done nothing to prove that other than scoring well on a test the one time he went to school.
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Bleach pissed me off. After Ichigo beat Aizen and started living his new normal life he never once went and asked his father about him being a captain class shinigami. He had months to ask. And when it mattered he trusted some creeper stranger over his family. In the beginning Ichigo was supposed to be very intelligent. But he's done nothing to prove that other than scoring well on a test the one time he went to school.
Hell I'm just surprised he managed to make it to high school along with Orihime and Chad, that is unless Kon is actually taking his studies seriously.
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Talking about Kon, has he done anything after randomly appearing for a few chapters? Poor guy, he should take Chad and move to another manga, I didn't even remember he existed until you mentioned him.
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I see. So I better stay away from it. I guess the only reason to start it would have been that it belongs into the "so bad it's good"-category.
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Sorry but Naruto showed many of Kishimoto flaws early as well! I noticed a lot of them from the first view, thing is thatI never thought that he would dismiss stuff that he made earlier(how would I know) and that the flaws would be more persistently and big, to the point of turning all of it stupid.
Yeah, I know Naruto's flaws were also showing pretty early. But I said it was enjoyable, because at least things were happening and there was a good measure of action and an interesting world that we hoped to learn about. Although probably I have a bias since I started watching Naruto when I was younger, and Bleach like 2 years ago (I thought I might give it a try because I had too much free time) so I was able to see the crappyness right from the start.
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@Bartholemew:
I see. So I better stay away from it. I guess the only reason to start it would have been that it belongs into the "so bad it's good"-category.
From what? Bleach or Naruto? Both of them are really good at the beginning, even counting the problems they have from the beginning. The problems are easily forgotten and accepted, but as time passes, they become bigger and bigger and than suddenly some really stupid stuff appears. I will say that they have at least 4 years of good material(around 200 chapters) than suddenly something starts to go really badly, but depending on how you can endure the material, you can go 2 or 4 more years(100 or 200 more chapters) thinking it is still good, and than suddenly they go to far to be repaired. I would say is a good experience at first so I would recommend, but than later it becomes really bad, and that I wouldn't recommend.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
Yeah, I know Naruto's flaws were also showing pretty early. But I said it was enjoyable, because at least things were happening and there was a good measure of action and an interesting world that we hoped to learn about. Although probably I have a bias since I started watching Naruto when I was younger, and Bleach like 2 years ago (I thought I might give it a try because I had too much free time) so I was able to see the crappyness right from the start.
No you're right the world of Naruto was always more interesting than that of Bleach, so in the beginning you have really hopes of knowing more about it. I can't say if that is a good thing or bad thing about Naruto. In Naruto you have a lot of hope and suddenly it all crumbles, in Bleach you never had such an incredible world so is not that much of a shock
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Yeah, I know Naruto's flaws were also showing pretty early. But I said it was enjoyable, because at least things were happening and there was a good measure of action and an interesting world that we hoped to learn about. Although probably I have a bias since I started watching Naruto when I was younger, and Bleach like 2 years ago (I thought I might give it a try because I had too much free time) so I was able to see the crappyness right from the start.
Yeah, I also think Naruto was enjoyable at the beginning. The flaws were already present, but at least for me nothing to overthink too much.
I don't think too much over it because from a good author I'm expecting that he/she will deal with it later so that it makes sense at the end. Sometimes there's something which doesn't make perfect sense to me in both Naruto and One Piece. However, unlike Kishi, Oda just knows how to handle everything in the long run. Therefore, at some point later the questions I have will be answered sufficiently. Therefore, if I reread the past chapters everything actually makes more sense.
In Naruto this is not the case. Instead it's the exact opposite.
From what? Bleach or Naruto? Both of them are really good at the beginning, even counting the problems they have from the beginning. The problems are easily forgotten and accepted, but as time passes, they become bigger and bigger and than suddenly some really stupid stuff appears. I will say that they have at least 4 years of good material(around 200 chapters) than suddenly something starts to go really badly, but depending on how you can endure the material, you can go 2 or 4 more years(100 or 200 more chapters) thinking it is still good, and than suddenly they go to far to be repaired. I would say is a good experience at first so I would recommend, but than later it becomes really bad, and that I wouldn't recommend.
I meant Bleach - going into "so bad that's good"-territory towards the end. Yeah, I thought that it might be quite enjoyable at the beginning. I read Naruto until the end of the Pain Invasion arc until I started having major problems with the overall quality. The difference between Naruto (+Fairy Tail) and Bleach would be that I started reading them with other expectations. Whereas I started reading Naruto and Fairy Tail with positive expectations, I just cannot do this with Bleach anymore.
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I'd say that before the beginning of the war, you can marathon Naruto and the flaws are forgivable because there are some decent fights and interesting powers (even if they make less sense as the story progresses). And there's always the world to explore. It's not until the war that you notice the world is void of anything, there are just nameless ninjas out there that spam jutsus of their village element.
Bleach it's a mess where Ichigo goes from normal human being to better than the whole gottei 13 minus the old man and Aizen in like a month (2 weeks killing hollows, 2 weeks training with Urahara or something like that). After Ichigo met Grand Fisher, I thought that maybe looking him would be the start of the main plot. After finishing SS I suspected that maybe Bleach actually sucked at being consistent or having a plot, so I googled and effectively Grand Fisher was offscreened and had no importance whatsoever. I don't understand how it became so popular.
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I don't understand how it became so popular.
Swords, Kubo's shallow grasp of "cool", "action", and things that kids find to be cool but people like us would consider to be of secondary importance.
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Swords, Kubo's shallow grasp of "cool", "action", and things that kids find to be cool but people like us would consider to be of secondary importance.
Don't forget the Bs.
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I caught up on Naruto, but not Bleach. I was gonna post some general thoughts but forget that.
I am disappointed that nobody has ever mentioned this gem I just now discovered. this is actual, official art for an official music album.
what the fuck why is Shikamaru like that? he's NEVER like that. when has he ever been that energetic. you got Naruto being Naruto, and Sakura being Sakura. But then you've got Sasuke awkwardly being like 'am I doing this right' and poor Kakashi's like 'why the fuck am I here' and all these characters sing songs. how could anyone neglect to mention something so beautiful. we need an AU where instead of fighting, ninjas form rock bands instead. -
Don't forget the Bs.
Damn, forgot about that but I was thinking along the lines of earlier Bleach, where the kids would probably be hooked and the BS was at a minimum compared to now.
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I'd say that before the beginning of the war, you can marathon Naruto and the flaws are forgivable because there are some decent fights and interesting powers (even if they make less sense as the story progresses). And there's always the world to explore. It's not until the war that you notice the world is void of anything, there are just nameless ninjas out there that spam jutsus of their village element.
Bleach it's a mess where Ichigo goes from normal human being to better than the whole gottei 13 minus the old man and Aizen in like a month (2 weeks killing hollows, 2 weeks training with Urahara or something like that). After Ichigo met Grand Fisher, I thought that maybe looking him would be the start of the main plot. After finishing SS I suspected that maybe Bleach actually sucked at being consistent or having a plot, so I googled and effectively Grand Fisher was offscreened and had no importance whatsoever. I don't understand how it became so popular.
Are you saying that after two years and a half with special training with Jiraya, and not being in any significant way better didn't happen in Naruto? And that after being some days in the frog realm he didn't suddenly surpassed everybody?
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I caught up on Naruto, but not Bleach. I was gonna post some general thoughts but forget that.
I am disappointed that nobody has ever mentioned this gem I just now discovered. this is actual, official art for an official music album.
http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110421164540/naruto/images/4/4b/NARUTO_ALL_STARS.jpg
what the fuck why is Shikamaru like that? he's NEVER like that. when has he ever been that energetic. you got Naruto being Naruto, and Sakura being Sakura. But then you've got Sasuke awkwardly being like 'am I doing this right' and poor Kakashi's like 'why the fuck am I here' and all these characters sing songs. how could anyone neglect to mention something so beautiful. we need an AU where instead of fighting, ninjas form rock bands instead. -
Are you saying that after two years and a half with special training with Jiraya, and not being in any significant way better didn't happen in Naruto? And that after being some days in the frog realm he didn't suddenly surpassed everybody?
Hey, some of the Akatsuki fights are entertaining (in the anime at least) if you don't take the plot seriously, that's all I say. I said once before that Naruto is enjoyable until the fight of Pein's 6 paths with Naruto, exactly because that's the point where Naruto became a messiah archetype.
On the other hand, Bleach fights are boring in the manga and anime, and Ichigo went god mode since the second arc.
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The worst thing about Naruto is how it treats its secondary characters and its women. I think at one point Naruto told Tsunade (THE HOKAGE) to go make a cup of tea or something while he fought the big baddie.
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Bleach it's a mess where Ichigo goes from normal human being to better than the whole gottei 13 minus the old man and Aizen in like a month (2 weeks killing hollows, 2 weeks training with Urahara or something like that). After Ichigo met Grand Fisher, I thought that maybe looking him would be the start of the main plot. After finishing SS I suspected that maybe Bleach actually sucked at being consistent or having a plot, so I googled and effectively Grand Fisher was offscreened and had no importance whatsoever. I don't understand how it became so popular.
Not like Naruto is or was anymore consistent with it's plot than Bleach . Bleach at least had soul society arc which is still one of the best arc in shonen i have seen so far and that is the arc where Bleach had established it's future potential as one of the best . Bleach concept was more original and unique since Kubo took the idea from Yu yu hakusho and made it into something really interesting but Kubo didn't know what to do with it and thus the concept fall on it's back. Bleach is what you get when you place a great potential in the hands of the shitty writer.
Naruto on the other hand wasn't anything special since the beginning nor it showed any great future potential . It was above average or good at best but that's all it was There isn't an arc in Naruto where Kishi truly established something for the series in terms of it's potential. The world -building for the most part was fairly typical both in terms of it's look and the fighting abilities it had .
And saying that as long as you don't look at the flaws then the series will be enjoyable is really flawed of itself . This could really apply to Bleach or any other shitty series .
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Not like Naruto is or was anymore consistent with it's plot than Bleach . Bleach at least had soul society arc which is still one of the best arc in shonen i have seen so far and that is the arc where Bleach had established it's future potential as one of the best . Bleach concept was more original and unique since Kubo took the idea from Yu yu hakusho and made it into something really interesting but Kubo didn't know what to do with it and thus the concept fall on it's back. Bleach is what you get when you place a great potential in the hands of the shitty writer.
Gonna have to stop you there, buddy. Even in SS, there were a lot of things that were pretty wonky, but were forgivable with the promise of more. But especially considering those grievances, it definitely wouldn't stack up as one of the best anythings.
Naruto on the other hand wasn't anything special since the beginning nor it showed any great future potential . It was above average or good at best but that's all it was There isn't an arc in Naruto where Kishi truly established something for the series in terms of it's potential. The world -building for the most part was fairly typical both in terms of it's look and the fighting abilities it had .
And saying that as long as you don't look at the flaws then the series will be enjoyable is really flawed of itself . This could really apply to Bleach or any other shitty series .
Depends on how far back you consider it the "beginning." If we're talking anything past, let's say, midway through the sasuke retrieval arc where everything begins its descent into madness, sure. But before then? It kept to its themes and actually for the most part showed a lot of potential and enjoyability. Outcast loser making a name for himself with hard work and determination without any assistance from his heritage/lineage/prophecies? While perhaps any single arc didn't have as many cool things or I guess exciting things like Bleach's soul society arc, the arcs in the beginning were consistent, and they actually demonstrated a purpose, meaning, and a message behind them before it descends into an overly idealistic and masochistic orange wearing kid trying to show his sadistic and abusive best friend that there's more meaning to life than being all grumpy and hanging out with weirdos.
With Naruto, I feel much more inclined to say that the series in the beginning had an actual message, and the narrative, while perhaps not outstanding, definitely is clear as to its intent. With Bleach, I can honestly say I remember the beginning stuff being "cool" but I do have a hard time recalling what exactly the point a lot of the narrative served other than stringing together a bunch of fights, and the resolution was particularly horrendous in trying to make Byakuya look sympathetic. Still, the arc itself was more or less a fun ride, and I can see why people would say "as long as you ignore some flaws about it then it's pretty fun," because SS is definitely an arc where I'd use that phrase.
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I didn't say you can enjoy Naruto if you ignore the bad stuff. I said you can enjoy it if you ignore the plot alltogether because most of the fights used to be* fun to follow. By comparison, I can't stand how turn based Bleach fights are. They are not fun. To illustrate my point, look at this video (skip to 5:20 for the fight).
I like that video. I don't care about the cheesy dialogue or the excuse of plot that's given at the beginning to set up the fight. I like the fight. That's what I was trying to say, Naruto can be fun in a mindless kind of way. But Bleach bores and angers me.
*Up to Naruto vs Pein.
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Too bad that Kishi really isn't up to the task of choreographing anything like that these days.
I honestly can't remember the last time I legitimately enjoyed a Naruto fight, though. Maybe when Naruto was showing off his newly gained senjutsu skills for the first chapter or two? Perhaps Shikamaru vs the undead dude?
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@Purple:
Too bad that Kishi really isn't up to the task of choreographing anything like that these days.
I honestly can't remember the last time I legitimately enjoyed a Naruto fight, though. Maybe when Naruto was showing off his newly gained senjutsu skills for the first chapter or two? Perhaps Shikamaru vs the undead dude?
As far as anime is concerned, the best fight for me will always be Lee vs Kimimaro. I'd put a link if I was at home.
I notice it in a lot of mangas. The fights at the start are well coreographed with a lot of movements drawn. Then, after a while, when more powerful abilities are learned, it comes down to force blasts, gigantic power slashes or fireballs. Beside Naruto, I think Fairy Tail is the best example. Natsu's fights were awesome at first, but then Mashima got a little lazy.
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Hey, some of the Akatsuki fights are entertaining (in the anime at least) if you don't take the plot seriously, that's all I say. I said once before that Naruto is enjoyable until the fight of Pein's 6 paths with Naruto, exactly because that's the point where Naruto became a messiah archetype.
On the other hand, Bleach fights are boring in the manga and anime, and Ichigo went god mode since the second arc.
I'm seeing you're some battle hungry guy, well I'm not, I enjoy the fights don't get me wrong, but a fight without proper context isn't really that great. Look at Hungry Joker, a fighting fest with really well drawn battles, but the series is only that, fights, it has nothing else in it and because of that it was cancelled. A lot of battle hungry guys till today don't understand how nor why the cancellation happened(Specially in the Youtube manga and anime community).
About taking things seriously I take everything always serious, even comedy. Note that when I'm talking "taking something serious", I'm talking of thought and importance that I give to them, normally I give everything the same importance, normally when I don't value things the same is when I'm joking with stuff, but that rarely happens to things that I read and anime that I watch. If is bad is bad, I don't know why it should be sugarcoated. As I said Naruto flaws were only something superficial, and normally hidden by other stuff(so you wouldn't noticed them much), but the majority of the plot was pretty good, the same is true for Bleach. I don't think Bleach had more potential than Naruto, but the beginning story and the world of "ghosts" of it was really good and well explained(Later it was totally destroyed and substituted by nonsense, but only later).
The power leveling isn't something that bad, Naruto had that staff even earlier than Bleach really, and even though I hate power-levels and exponential rate of leveling-up(to be more precise, I don't like them. I don't really hate them) I don't see that much of a problem with them. Are you questioning what I refer by Naruto having it earlier than Bleach? In the Zabuza arc! Sasuke in a matter of days passed from being Zabuza clones bitch to destroying dozens of them in a blink of an eye and even being faster than Zabuza, if we believe what he said, because Zabuza said that Haku was faster than him, and Sasuke showed that he was faster than him, so … That was in chapter 22! Note that the clones were 1/10 of Zabuza(by what he says) so Sasuke was so much slower than 1/10 of Zabuza, let say half as fast for estimation sake(given that he was cumber-stomped without any difficulty the first time against Zabuza) and some days later he gets more than 20 times faster(20 times faster means being the same speed than Zabuza, he got faster than Haku that was faster than Zabuza), and with days of training controlling chakra tree climbing.
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I caught up on Naruto, but not Bleach. I was gonna post some general thoughts but forget that.
I am disappointed that nobody has ever mentioned this gem I just now discovered. this is actual, official art for an official music album.
what the fuck why is Shikamaru like that? he's NEVER like that. when has he ever been that energetic. you got Naruto being Naruto, and Sakura being Sakura. But then you've got Sasuke awkwardly being like 'am I doing this right' and poor Kakashi's like 'why the fuck am I here' and all these characters sing songs. how could anyone neglect to mention something so beautiful. we need an AU where instead of fighting, ninjas form rock bands instead.Pfft….what is with this lol? I love how Kakashi looks like he doesn't give a fuck.
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Bleach concept was more original and unique since Kubo took the idea from Yu yu hakusho
Wait what lol? I'm guessing you probably meant something else, but when you praise it for being original, and then say a part of it (even if it's very small), it just seems odd.
Trivial though. -
Wait what lol? I'm guessing you probably meant something else, but when you praise it for being original, and then say a part of it (even if it's very small), it just seems odd.
Trivial though.Could also just be sarcasm.^^
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Wait what lol? I'm guessing you probably meant something else, but when you praise it for being original, and then say a part of it (even if it's very small), it just seems odd.
Trivial though.Kubo took the basic idea from Yu Yu Hakusho and expanded on that idea thus making it his own original and unique concept . I simply haven't read a manga that uses this soul reaper concept this way.
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Could also just be sarcasm.^^
No sarcasm , i really did mean it .
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I agree that SS was a great arc. And you know why? Rukia's capture and self-doubt = emotional investment
That plus mysterious new threats
Kubo probably should have curtailed the Gotei 13 to like the Gotei 4 though
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@Purple:
Gonna have to stop you there, buddy. Even in SS, there were a lot of things that were pretty wonky, but were forgivable with the promise of more. But especially considering those grievances, it definitely wouldn't stack up as one of the best anythings.
Depends on how far back you consider it the "beginning." If we're talking anything past, let's say, midway through the sasuke retrieval arc where everything begins its descent into madness, sure. But before then? It kept to its themes and actually for the most part showed a lot of potential and enjoyability. Outcast loser making a name for himself with hard work and determination without any assistance from his heritage/lineage/prophecies? While perhaps any single arc didn't have as many cool things or I guess exciting things like Bleach's soul society arc, the arcs in the beginning were consistent, and they actually demonstrated a purpose, meaning, and a message behind them before it descends into an overly idealistic and masochistic orange wearing kid trying to show his sadistic and abusive best friend that there's more meaning to life than being all grumpy and hanging out with weirdos.
With Naruto, I feel much more inclined to say that the series in the beginning had an actual message, and the narrative, while perhaps not outstanding, definitely is clear as to its intent. With Bleach, I can honestly say I remember the beginning stuff being "cool" but I do have a hard time recalling what exactly the point a lot of the narrative served other than stringing together a bunch of fights, and the resolution was particularly horrendous in trying to make Byakuya look sympathetic. Still, the arc itself was more or less a fun ride, and I can see why people would say "as long as you ignore some flaws about it then it's pretty fun," because SS is definitely an arc where I'd use that phrase.
Actually i completely agree . Soul Society arc did have your typical "Kubo" stuff and it had it's fair share of flaws but it is the only arc where Kubo actually decided to add some depth to the main cast which caused genuine emotional investment .It also did a good job at exploring some of Soul Society and how zanpakuto and it's master's relationship work . The build up from the beginning to that arc was done fairly well and there was sense of danger without having to constantly rely on big explosions and the fights were actually pretty good ( except for Ichigo vs Byakuya since that is the time where Bleach broken power level started to emerge ) . Hell even Aizen appeared to be interesting at that time .
Naruto has a plot however it doesn't do any good when the author decides to later trash everything from it thus making the early arc's of Naruto pointless since they are gonna mean nothing for the future arc's . Naruto and his speech to Neji about how Naruto will become Hokage and that's not his destiny only to have it revealed that he is in fact the son of a hokage and is really destined to become a hokage . This is a great example of showing Kishi pretty much trashing his own logic and how majority of beginning Naruto stuff is pointless . I agree that Naruto had message but that doesn't really matter since the author goes and does exactly opposite of what the message was .
Bleach doesn't have a plot and individual arc's has it's own goals however this is one of the biggest strength of Soul society arc since it is able to stand on it's own and no matter how bad the future arc's maybe , it still wouldn't affect Soul Society arc since they are two different arc's with different goal and they are not tie in together with anything .
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I agree that SS was a great arc. And you know why? Rukia's capture and self-doubt = emotional investment
That plus mysterious new threats
Kubo probably should have curtailed the Gotei 13 to like the Gotei 4 though
For the life of me I can't recall why Rukia had such self-doubt during the SS arc, and I actually needed to look up why she was going to be executed (turns out it was the shinigami power transfer to Ichigo), but I guess even then now I have some trouble connecting the dots as to why she basically wanted to get off'd. Something about Kaien I'm sure, but eh.
But yeah it was a time when Kubo was actively trying to figure out how to induce plot mystery instead of resorting to things like "when did you assume that I didn't use Kyoka Suigetsu?" or "Your dad's actually a shinigami" or "I love you, Ichigo."
Actually i completely agree . Soul Society arc did have your typical "Kubo" stuff and it had it's fair share of flaws but it is the only arc where Kubo actually decided to add some depth to the main cast which caused genuine emotional investment .It also did a good job at exploring some of Soul Society and how zanpakuto and it's master's relationship work . The build up from the beginning to that arc was done fairly well and there was sense of danger without having to constantly rely on big explosions and the fights were actually pretty good ( except for Ichigo vs Byakuya since that is the time where Bleach broken power level started to emerge ) . Hell even Aizen appeared to be interesting at that time .
Naruto has a plot however it doesn't do any good when the author decides to later trash everything from it thus making the early arc's of Naruto pointless since they are gonna mean nothing for the future arc's . Naruto and his speech to Neji about how Naruto will become Hokage and that's not his destiny only to have it revealed that he is in fact the son of a hokage and is really destined to become a hokage . This is a great example of showing Kishi pretty much trashing his own logic and how majority of beginning Naruto stuff is pointless . I agree that Naruto had message but that doesn't really matter since the author goes and does exactly opposite of what the message was .
Bleach doesn't have a plot and individual arc's has it's own goals however this is one of the biggest strength of Soul society arc since it is able to stand on it's own and no matter how bad the future arc's maybe , it still wouldn't affect Soul Society arc since they are two different arc's with different goal and they are not tie in together with anything .
Well yeah, now Naruto's message is completely wasted, but I think that just looking at the arcs from a standalone view, they were pretty excellent on their own. That's where the potential was built and that's why the arcs later on are such a disappointment, else we get just regular disappointment like, say, Fairy TAil.
SS did build up a bit of potential though. Kubo being only experienced with Zombie Powder otherwise beforehand could chalk up a lot of those mistakes in SS as rookie mistakes, just like how East Blue isn't too engaging as a whole compared to later arcs for Oda. A nice set of mysteries, some characters get a few goals, and the big problem was that Kubo basically placed a cap on the main characters' skills by giving them a "final release," the bankai, and not knowing what to do to deal with a power creep because he doesn't know how to do ability fights like HxH or JoJo. It's a very flawed arc but besides the powers you at least had the premise that there was more left to the world to deal with and explore with different characters, and basically all other arcs following fail to live up to the hype.
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@Cyan:
@MetaMario:Pfft….what is with this lol? I love how Kakashi looks like he doesn't give a fuck.
I like how Shikamaru is there for no reason. he's never part of team 7. never struck me as particularly popular either. plus, THIS is what Shikamaru's seiyuu sounds like:
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I like how Shikamaru is there for no reason. he's never part of team 7. never struck me as particularly popular either. plus, THIS is what Shikamaru's seiyuu sounds like:
He's also Bartolomeo, isn't he?
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He's also Bartolomeo, isn't he?
I am very limited in my knowledge of Japanese voice actors, but the wikipedia page checks out. He's also Tensa Zangetsu from Bleach. this is rather amusing.
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I agree that SS was a great arc. And you know why? Rukia's capture and self-doubt = emotional investment
That plus mysterious new threats
Kubo probably should have curtailed the Gotei 13 to like the Gotei 4 though
Maybe scratch the assassination division.
Cause that don't look too good no matter what way you cut it.
Also
"Dying to exterminate great evil. Know that this is the spirit of the Gotei 13."
That is only part of that motto. The other half is
"Unless I can't be arsed to."
Edit:
So….SS has it's own magazine.
Huh.
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@Purple:
For the life of me I can't recall why Rukia had such self-doubt during the SS arc, and I actually needed to look up why she was going to be executed (turns out it was the shinigami power transfer to Ichigo), but I guess even then now I have some trouble connecting the dots as to why she basically wanted to get off'd. Something about Kaien I'm sure, but eh.
But yeah it was a time when Kubo was actively trying to figure out how to induce plot mystery instead of resorting to things like "when did you assume that I didn't use Kyoka Suigetsu?" or "Your dad's actually a shinigami" or "I love you, Ichigo."
Or my favourite:
"So, you thought Espada were from 1-10…"
@Purple:
Well yeah, now Naruto's message is completely wasted, but I think that just looking at the arcs from a standalone view, they were pretty excellent on their own. That's where the potential was built and that's why the arcs later on are such a disappointment, else we get just regular disappointment like, say, Fairy TAil.
SS did build up a bit of potential though. Kubo being only experienced with Zombie Powder otherwise beforehand could chalk up a lot of those mistakes in SS as rookie mistakes, just like how East Blue isn't too engaging as a whole compared to later arcs for Oda. A nice set of mysteries, some characters get a few goals, and the big problem was that Kubo basically placed a cap on the main characters' skills by giving them a "final release," the bankai, and not knowing what to do to deal with a power creep because he doesn't know how to do ability fights like HxH or JoJo. It's a very flawed arc but besides the powers you at least had the premise that there was more left to the world to deal with and explore with different characters, and basically all other arcs following fail to live up to the hype.
Kubo doesn't seem to know what to do with his fights unless he dumbs characters down to create openings. There are couple dozens of examples, everyone knows what I'm talking about.
There aren't enough even fights. Ichigo vs Grimmjaw was good, Kenpachi vs Nnoitra too. The exchange between Urahara, Ishin, Yoruichi and Aizen was also good, but Aizen was derping around too much.
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It's Togashi day, does that mean we say we're going to do something but then spend 3+ years not doing it and play video games instead while idiots defend us blindly?
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What does Togashi Day have to do with Naruto and Bleach?
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This post is deleted!
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So it's that time of the year already? Happy Togashi Day everyone
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I stumbled on to this on Youtube. My room already looks like that and the part with the fridge was funny.
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Happy Togashi Day, everyone. :>
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What does Togashi Day have to do with Naruto and Bleach?
Aren't their authors competing to be the number one fan? (HxH and YYH 2.0 gone wrong)
Happy Togashi Day! By the way glad his wife is also getting a remake.