Why can't we use those amazing Pell pictures for either situation? I mean, they're so great that I want them to be scene, and if we give the "not dead" camp a new punishment, then no one will get to see their greatness!
The Monet Problem: An Arlong Park Wager
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I just realized that this wager is about a character who is missing a heart and might die, so I searched and found embarassing pictures of a dead character from another series who most of you should be familiar about.
For the people in the "dead" camp, which one of the following is the most embarassing? (I'm sure there's worse somewhere in the net, but for the sake of my sanity, I won't go any deeper than this.)
! http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/8096/heartgv.jpg
! http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/4600/heart2b.jpg
! http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/9713/heart4nb.jpg
! http://img607.imageshack.us/img607/3452/heart5a.jpg
! http://img805.imageshack.us/img805/4070/heart6.jpg
! http://img203.imageshack.us/img203/7637/heart7.jpg
! http://img824.imageshack.us/img824/6739/heart8.jpgAll of them can be used as Avatars.
I personally find the first one the worst because, even though it's not the ugliest, it's the one that's most obviously Ulquiorra and is something 95% of the people here would not be caught dead wearing. The other ones I might wear ironically one day, like the forums hipster I am, but the first one I would never be caught wearing without a heart/dead.
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i think the punishments isn't bad enough. i don't feel a satisfaction seeing the losers using them nor feel ashamed if i have to use them as my ava + sig.
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I personally find the first one the worst because, even though it's not the ugliest, it's the one that's most obviously Ulquiorra and is something 95% of the people here would not be caught dead wearing. The other ones I might wear ironically one day, like the forums hipster I am, but the first one I would never be caught wearing without a heart/dead.
I agree. It actually feels like a "serious" piece of fanart instead of an intentionally funny one, which makes it worse.
This one it is, then.
@Nex:
Why can't we use those amazing Pell pictures for either situation? I mean, they're so great that I want them to be scene, and if we give the "not dead" camp a new punishment, then no one will get to see their greatness!
Because Pell symbolizes this infamous trend Oda is known for. It wouldn't work as well if it was punishment for the "not dead" camp, who are mostly fine with the aforementioned trend.
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Is it really such a good idea to take a character from Bleach who will most likely show up again in Ichigo's final fight against Nazi Germany, along with Grimmjow?
I will wear anything thrown at me, but just saying :D
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Is it really such a good idea to take a character from Bleach who will most likely show up again in Ichigo's final fight against Nazi Germany, along with Grimmjow?
I will wear anything thrown at me, but just saying :D
Uliquiorra is dead, that is confirmed. He isn't coming back.
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Uliquiorra is dead, that is confirmed. He isn't coming back.
Which is why he is perfect for this. He's a winged, literally heartless character, like Monet (no offense to Monet's fans).
And because the "not dead" camp has more people in it, the punishment for that group needs to be more severe. We get Pell, they get a Bleach character.
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Well then, go go make a disgusting sig out of it! Can't use it as an avatar according to Robby (since it would cause confusion if half of the forum sports the same pic).
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Because Pell symbolizes this infamous trend Oda is known for. It wouldn't work as well if it was punishment for the "not dead" camp, who are mostly fine with the aforementioned trend.
there's a large difference between knowing Oda doesn't kill and recognizing recurring storytelling themes and patters… and being cool with it.
Its probably his largest storytelling weakness. But its how he operates since Skypeia. (around when he truly realized just how many kids were reading his work and how much influence he had, I think.)
Monet isn't dead for the simple reason of "Oda". Doesn't mean that's a good thing.
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@RobbyBevard:
there's a large difference between knowing Oda doesn't kill and recognizing recurring storytelling themes and patters… and being cool with it.
Its probably his largest storytelling weakness. But its how he operates since Skypeia. (around when he truly realized just how many kids were reading his work and how much influence he had, I think.)
Monet isn't dead for the simple reason of "Oda". Doesn't mean that's a good thing.
I know. That's why I said "mostly fine".
Though, I'm not exactly sure if the majority of that group is actually fine with the way Oda handles this sort of stuff. It's not the point of the thread, after all.
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@Nex:
Anyway, as punishment, I googled for "the most embarassing picture ever." This is what I found:
[hide][qimg]http://cdn2.elitedaily.com/elite/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/elite-daily-yearbook-91.jpg[/qimg][/hide]That pic is hawt.
I also vote dead… At this point I'd be a little disappointed if she wasn't... but not surprised.
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I just realized that this wager is about a character who is missing a heart and might die, so I searched and found embarassing pictures of a dead character from another series who most of you should be familiar about.
For the people in the "not dead" camp, which one of the following is the most embarassing? (I'm sure there's worse somewhere in the net, but for the sake of my sanity, I won't go any deeper than this.)
! http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/8096/heartgv.jpg
! http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/4600/heart2b.jpg
! http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/9713/heart4nb.jpg
! http://img607.imageshack.us/img607/3452/heart5a.jpg
! http://img805.imageshack.us/img805/4070/heart6.jpg
! http://img203.imageshack.us/img203/7637/heart7.jpg
! http://img824.imageshack.us/img824/6739/heart8.jpgAll of them can be used as Avatars.
Good, but I still like the Pell ones the best.
The last two you posted are particularly good. -
I want to bet. Please put me in the "not dead" list!
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For the people in the "not dead" camp, which one of the following is the most embarassing? (I'm sure there's worse somewhere in the net, but for the sake of my sanity, I won't go any deeper than this.)
! http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/8096/heartgv.jpg
! http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/4600/heart2b.jpg
! http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/9713/heart4nb.jpg
! http://img607.imageshack.us/img607/3452/heart5a.jpg
! http://img805.imageshack.us/img805/4070/heart6.jpg
! http://img203.imageshack.us/img203/7637/heart7.jpg
! http://img824.imageshack.us/img824/6739/heart8.jpgAll of them can be used as Avatars.
OH GOD WHY
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She's so dead .
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I will say that one good thing came out of this thread: that user that has a sig of the strawhats plus Jinbe and Monet's Jolly Rogers, Monet's doesn't look too bad :), still not gonna hold my breath. Sorry guys, if you wanna see Harpies in snow, go to Japan when the new yugioh harpie cards come out in february and have a ball.
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@Jet:
I will say that one good thing came out of this thread: that user that has a sig of the strawhats plus Jinbe and Monet's Jolly Rogers, Monet's doesn't look too bad :), still not gonna hold my breath. Sorry guys, if you wanna see Harpies in snow, go to Japan when the new yugioh harpie cards come out in february and have a ball.
Anyone call me? :ninja:
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Put me down in the not dead camp. of more importance here though… Does it ruin the point of the punishment if I start using that Ulquiorra(sp?) in underwear as an avatar now. That things just hilariously awesome.
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So, in the latest chapter we see that the spike Ceaser drove into the heart, is now well and truly outside of said heart cube but firmly implanted in the ground.
http://www.mangapanda.com/one-piece/695/7
Apparently he stabbed the heart once, then pulled the pick back out and stabbed the ground?
That seems… odd.
Or maaaybe he only delivered a glancing shot to the top, then the spike slid and hit the ground. Enough of a shock to make the cube squirt and knock Monet out... but basically missed and it was forced perspective and cutting the camera away making it look like he hit straight on.
Anyone feel like changing their "dead" vote now thats its pretty obvious he didn't actually impale the heart?
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@RobbyBevard:
Anyone feel like changing their "dead" vote now thats its pretty obvious he didn't actually impale the heart?
…..I'm gonna regret this, I know I will, but I was uneasy from the start of this whole thing.
Sign me up for a vote change.
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@RobbyBevard:
So, in the latest chapter we see that the spike Ceaser drove into the heart, is now well and truly outside of said heart cube but firmly implanted in the ground.
http://www.mangapanda.com/one-piece/695/7
Apparently he stabbed the heart once, then pulled the pick back out and stabbed the ground?
That seems… odd.
Or maaaybe he only delivered a glancing shot to the top, then the spike slid and hit the ground. Enough of a shock to make the cube squirt and knock Monet out... but basically missed and it was forced perspective and cutting the camera away making it look like he hit straight on.
Anyone feel like changing their "dead" vote now thats its pretty obvious he didn't actually impale the heart?
Maybe he stabbed or tried to stab the heart multiple times and passed out at a moment when the pick was out.
That doesn't change my opinion that she's alive.
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@RobbyBevard:
So, in the latest chapter we see that the spike Ceaser drove into the heart, is now well and truly outside of said heart cube but firmly implanted in the ground.
http://www.mangapanda.com/one-piece/695/7
Apparently he stabbed the heart once, then pulled the pick back out and stabbed the ground?
That seems… odd.
Or maaaybe he only delivered a glancing shot to the top, then the spike slid and hit the ground. Enough of a shock to make the cube squirt and knock Monet out... but basically missed and it was forced perspective and cutting the camera away making it look like he hit straight on.
Anyone feel like changing their "dead" vote now thats its pretty obvious he didn't actually impale the heart?
Could be, but as some people pointed out at the chapter thread, the spike seems to have penetrated a lot at chapter 694: http://mangarulereader.hostoi.com/MANGARULEREADER/?manga=One+Piece++Shonen+Jump&chapter=694+mangarule&page=12#page=12
There is also a lot of blood coming out of the cube, and Monet spiting blood too… -
Oda went to the trouble of showing the spike distinctly aside from the heart… when he could have left it out of frame, or still impaled. He made a visual representation that the spike is not currently in there, or that it may have never been in there at all.
That's just his subtle way of playing fair and setting up for the reveal that she's alive later, (and in the very next chapter!) though the actual on screen denouncement may take a while.
There is also a lot of blood coming out of the cube, and Monet spiting blood too…
It IS a cube of blood, of course there's blood coming out of it. Doesn't mean its coming from the heart itself.
And both Law and Smoker were taken out when their cubes were just squeezed. Monet, (who was already wounded) would have been affected by a grazing, it wouldn't take a full stab to knock her out at that point.
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The heart was still stabbed, and it's still covered in devil fruit kryptonite.
My vote stays right where it is. -
@RobbyBevard:
Oda went to the trouble of showing the spike distinctly aside from the heart… when he could have left it out of frame, or still impaled. He made a visual representation that the spike is not currently in there, or that it may have never been in there at all.
That's just his subtle way of playing fair and setting up for the reveal that she's alive later, (and in the very next chapter!) though the actual on screen denouncement may take a while.
It IS a cube of blood, of course there's blood coming out of it. Doesn't mean its coming from the heart itself.
And both Law and Smoker were taken out when their cubes were just squeezed. Monet, (who was already wounded) would have been affected by a grazing, it wouldn't take a full stab to knock her out at that point.
My point was that Caesar did in fact stab the cube, and then removed the spike from it, and apparently stabbed the ground with it latter, but I agree that whether it actually damaged the heart or not is up for discussion.
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Nope. I'm going down with the ship. Sticking with dead.
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@RobbyBevard:
Oda went to the trouble of showing the spike distinctly aside from the heart… when he could have left it out of frame, or still impaled. He made a visual representation that the spike is not currently in there, or that it may have never been in there at all.
That's just his subtle way of playing fair and setting up for the reveal that she's alive later, (and in the very next chapter!) though the actual on screen denouncement may take a while.
It IS a cube of blood, of course there's blood coming out of it. Doesn't mean its coming from the heart itself.
And both Law and Smoker were taken out when their cubes were just squeezed. Monet, (who was already wounded) would have been affected by a grazing, it wouldn't take a full stab to knock her out at that point.
Is it confirmed that the cubes are filled with blood?
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Is it confirmed that the cubes are filled with blood?
Well, Law took a square section out of people's chests, so… presumably SOMETHING keeping that squishy cube shape.
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@RobbyBevard:
Well, Law took a square section out of people's chests, so… presumably SOMETHING keeping that squishy cube shape.
Valid point…I dont know why, but I had assumed that it was something else for some reason. :ninja:
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Why arent we including Vergo in this poll?
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Oda clearly drew that stake plunging into Monet's heart and her coughing up blood and fainting immediately afterwards, I'm not going to question if CC actually stabbed her.
When we get into all this talk of perspective and sliding and CC possibly just having retarded aim things get very convoluted.I'm not sure why specifically Oda would have drawn the stake in that position this chapter.
One possibility I can think of is that Oda is playing off of real word injury rules here.
Leaving an object in a stab wound is recommended to increase chances of survival as pulling the object out of the wound would dramatically increase blood loss.
Hopefully a world famous scientist would think of that :blink: -
You guys are falling into the same trap with Pell, Igaram and Papaya.
Monet's going to make a full recovery in a few chapters.
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Heck.. I start got this feeling that I'm goin to lose my bet >.>
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You guys are falling into the same trap with Pell, Igaram and Papaya.
Monet's going to make a full recovery in a few chapters.
Two of whom were blown up and the third struck by lightning. All possible to survive.
The most common form of death in one piece is stabbing. -
Yeah that is weird, but I join this wager knowing Monet has a high chance of surviving based on the patterns. Bets are more fun that way.
BRING IT ON!
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@Gia:
Why arent we including Vergo in this poll?
Because he was "killed" in an explosion. Of screen. The easiest "death" to survive in One-Piece.
Won't it be funny if he's the one who actually dies?
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clown missed it, he cannot pull the icicle out….he cant even move....when you try to stab something while lying down, you'll know its hard to aim well.
--- Update From New Post Merge ---
Oda clearly drew that stake plunging into Monet's heart and her coughing up blood and fainting immediately afterwards, I'm not going to question if CC actually stabbed her.
When we get into all this talk of perspective and sliding and CC possibly just having retarded aim things get very convoluted.I'm not sure why specifically Oda would have drawn the stake in that position this chapter.
One possibility I can think of is that Oda is playing off of real word injury rules here.
Leaving an object in a stab wound is recommended to increase chances of survival as pulling the object out of the wound would dramatically increase blood loss.
Hopefully a world famous scientist would think of that :blink:i havent seen any panel where monet was coughing blood because of the supposed impalement….he got blood on her mouth since the chapter before that.
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clown missed it, he cannot pull the icicle out….he cant even move....when you try to stab something while lying down, you'll know its hard to aim well.
--- Update From New Post Merge ---
i havent seen any panel where monet was coughing blood because of the supposed impalement....he got blood on her mouth since the chapter before that.
Well.. what is that?
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@The:
[qimg]http://i.imgur.com/RXjIT.jpg[/qimg]
Well.. what is that?
She'd been coughing up blood since TASHIGI hit her back in chapter 687.
http://www.mangapanda.com/one-piece/687/19
Oda used juxtopisiton and context to make it seem like stabbing the heart killed her for drama's sake. (I'll note he used the EXACT SAME scene cutting trick to make it seem like Smoker was about to be hit.) But… Monet was already coughing blood from her earlier wound and we can see now in this chapter that while Ceaser hit the cube enough to splatter it some, he didn't hit the heart very well since the spike is in the ground to the side.
Oda used the angle of the shot and cut the scene away so the missing of the target wasn't clear or obvious... but it's pretty blatant now that Ceaser just missed and Monet fainted from her earlier wounds. And possibly her heart being jostled around a little (just like Law and Smoker) but not from being stabbed in it.
She wasn't stabbed in the heart any more than Pell was in the center of the explosion, or that one guy died from biting his tongue off. (And he was declared dead by doctors! On camera!) We as an audience get a dramatic moment and its read the way the author presents it, but we miss out on the couple of seconds that matter in making it not-fatal... until the eventual reveal.
We may not know that "officially" until her cover story, but Oda put his subtle "she's okay" signal in the very next chapter so its not a total copout in a year (much like Luffy declaring Bon wasn't dead, or the tongue pirate being up in the next chapter.)
She's fine.
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@RobbyBevard:
She'd been coughing up blood since TASHIGI hit her back in chapter 687.
http://www.mangapanda.com/one-piece/687/19
Oda used juxtopisiton and context to make it seem like stabbing the heart killed her for drama's sake. (I'll note he used the EXACT SAME scene cutting trick to make it seem like Smoker was about to be hit.) But… Monet was already coughing blood from her earlier wound and we can see now in this chapter that while Ceaser hit the cube enough to splatter it some, he didn't hit the heart very well since the spike is in the ground to the side.
She wasn't stabbed in the heart any more than Pell was by the explosion, or that one guy died from biting his tongue off. (And he was declared dead by doctors! On camera!) She's fine.
Well im a Monet fanboy so i don't care about that and im with not dead camp
Simple i post this cause he question that
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@RobbyBevard:
She'd been coughing up blood since TASHIGI hit her back in chapter 687.
http://www.mangapanda.com/one-piece/687/19
Oda used juxtopisiton and context to make it seem like stabbing the heart killed her for drama's sake. (I'll note he used the EXACT SAME scene cutting trick to make it seem like Smoker was about to be hit.) But… Monet was already coughing blood from her earlier wound and we can see now in this chapter that while Ceaser hit the cube enough to splatter it some, he didn't hit the heart very well since the spike is in the ground to the side.
Oda used the angle of the shot and cut the scene away so the missing of the target wasn't clear or obvious... but it's pretty blatant now that Ceaser just missed and Monet fainted from her earlier wounds. And possibly her heart being jostled around a little (just like Law and Smoker) but not from being stabbed in it.
She wasn't stabbed in the heart any more than Pell was in the center of the explosion, or that one guy died from biting his tongue off. (And he was declared dead by doctors! On camera!) We as an audience get a dramatic moment and its read the way the author presents it, but we miss out on the couple of seconds that matter in making it not-fatal... until the eventual reveal.
We may not know that "officially" until her cover story, but Oda put his subtle "she's okay" signal in the very next chapter so its not a total copout in a year (much like Luffy declaring Bon wasn't dead, or the tongue pirate being up in the next chapter.)
She's fine.
Seriously, you are really reaching here. We saw it penetrate her heart last chapter. If it was really just "juxtaposition" and she was caughing from a wound she already had, why would she look at her missing heart? And then why would she pass out at that exact moment? When she had been fine enough to make it there and talk to Joker?
She's not fine. Nothing in this chapter should give that idea. If anything the pike being removed should be cause for concern, as that will cause her to bleed out incredibly fast.
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It's clearly shown that Ceasar stabbed the cube. Trying to make out details like the spike glancing her heart is reaching. The amount of damage to the heart is irrelevant to the fact that the intention to kill, the actual stabbing and Monet's reaction all show that the heart was stabbed and the cube is bleeding because of it. Take note that the other instances we've seen of Heart Cubes were not covered in blood.
Look, if Monet is going to survive this, she will survive it. Oda doesn't need to hint at this in any shape, way or form. Brownbeard was shot directly in the face by the Yeti Cool brothers with intent to kill. They didn't 'glance his face' or 'use lighter bullets', they shot him point blank under orders to eliminate him. Brownbeard turned out fine with no explanation whatsoever.
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@Nex:
Seriously, you are really reaching here. We saw it penetrate her heart last chapter.
It's clearly shown that Ceasar stabbed the cube. Trying to make out details like the spike glancing her heart is reaching. The amount of damage to the heart is irrelevant to the fact that the intention to kill, the actual stabbing and Monet's reaction all show that the heart was stabbed and the cube is bleeding because of it. Take note that the other instances we've seen of Heart Cubes were not covered in blood.
No, we saw the top of the spike hit the top of the cube which caused a splurt of juice (blood) from the cube. Oda very specifically chose an angle that didn't much indicate or show a full on impalement.
If it was really just "juxtaposition" and she was caughing from a wound she already had, why would she look at her missing heart?
Because, as already shown with Smoker AND Law, even having your heart jostled or squeezed can cause pain and knock you out. Added to the wounds Monet ALREADY had from Tashigi, (which were making her cough blood) she passed out.
And then why would she pass out at that exact moment? When she had been fine enough to make it there and talk to Joker?
Coughing up blood and stumbling along isn't fine. And again, jostled heart.
She's not fine. Nothing in this chapter should give that idea. If anything the pike being removed should be cause for concern, as that will cause her to bleed out incredibly fast.
In the magical square box that Law made with his powers. We don't even know how that thing is getting or providing blood in the first place.
The spike either didn't hit, or it just grazed her, or whatever. If this was a DIFFERENT series, I'd say what we saw was a heart being stabbed.
But this is Oda. He does perspective visual tricks and intercuts to trick the audience ALL THE TIME. Its Oda's track record and the way he ALWAYS writes that makes me assume what's actually happening and WHAT ISN"T BEING SHOWN. He's using the comic medium to trick you.
He could have shown it from the side, or shown the spike go all the way through, or any number of other things. Instead, he used an angle that INDICATED a stabbing, he didn't actually show one.
Oda wants you to forget precedent. He wants you to believe for a little bit that he might violently kill someone. He doesn't want you to be an old veteran who has seen him do this trick dozens of times that doesn't believe. He wants you to believe in spite of the past, and that he gets so many people even still, means he does his job damn well.
It's like a magic trick. Magician keeps your eye on one thing and think what he wants you to think, while he has the actual trick up his sleeve.
What Oda did is the equivalent of this.
Look, if Monet is going to survive this, she will survive it. Oda doesn't need to hint at this in any shape, way or form. Brownbeard was shot directly in the face by the Yeti Cool brothers with intent to kill. They didn't 'glance his face' or 'use lighter bullets', they shot him point blank under orders to eliminate him. Brownbeard turned out fine with no explanation whatsoever.
And I'm totally fine with that, its as much explanation as is going to be actually given. But since 158 people are insisting "heart stabbed=dead" and she is NOT dead, then that means they need to believe "heart is not stabbed". So I'm giving them the explanation they need (and that Oda is allowing with the placement of spike this chapter) beyond simply just "Oda will let her tough it out."
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By the way, what ever happened to BlueJam? Was he ever 'confirmed' dead?
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no. it's assumed
and i kinda want to change my vote after this weeks chapter. oh well to late i guess
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The heart could have been hurt in any number of ways, including crushing it like Vergo did with Law's heart. It is clearly shown in the panel that it was stabbed. If Oda didn't want the heart to get stabbed, he wouldn't have drawn CC holding an icicle striking it down in a stabbing motion, and he wouldn't have shown the closeup of the heart cube with the spike in it. It's really that obvious.
Saying the heart was not stabbed is like explaining Pell's miraculous survival by saying the explosion never happened. You mention that Oda's track record involves using well placed angles and trickery to create assumed situations - yet the fact is that Oda shows the obvious and a character's survival is more often not explained.
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Saying the heart was not stabbed is like explaining Pell's miraculous survival by saying the explosion never happened.
No, the explanation there is that Pell wasn't in the center of the explosion and was knocked away from the blast, rather than taking the full force of it. Not that "the explosion never happened."
The explanation in this case is the cube of blood around the heart was stabbed, but not the heart itself.
http://www.mangapanda.com/one-piece/694/14We aren't shown how long the pick is. We don't see the end of it. We don't see it going through the box and thus the heart. We see the tip of the pick hitting the top of the box (and the heart is on the bottom).
Its like the ketchup packet trick I linked before.
You can do a violent stab and make a spray with a thin layer of red stuff, you don't actually have to get very deep.
Ceaser, in the previous panel, was on his back, shaking, and nearly unconscious .
http://www.mangapanda.com/one-piece/694/7 It the stabbing panel, he is on his side, reaching out, eyes closed, and using the arm that is on the ground. Not a lot of force that way, (only from the elbow) not a good angle, and hard to keep a good consistent power and aim behind… especially if the cube is blood, in which case it should also be slippery. He is NOT getting a good shot at it... but the drama of the moment hides all of that.I assume now from the placement of the spike this chapter, that he hit the top of the cube, then either slid the spike along the top, or the cube slipped away from him, and then the spike hit the ground and collapsed himself. That crucial half second the camera doesn't show that makes all the difference.
The idea that he, from that position and nearly collapsed, then pulled the spike out, and stabbed it into the ground (rather than dropping it) , is assuming just as much as him missing.... we just know that the spike ended up stabbed into the ground after. But given Oda's track record I have to side with the miss over a second stab.
You mention that Oda's track record involves using well placed angles and trickery to create assumed situations - yet the fact is that Oda shows the obvious and a character's survival is more often not explained.
Well yeah, you can't do the EXACT same trick every single time, the audience catches on then. You have to mix it up a little. You gotta make them believe, despite the track record. Sometimes that means showing a character coughing up blood and collapsing (Which… he does a lot. Killer snow bunnies, Robin in Alabasta, Zoro is every arc, Lucchi, pirate who bit his tongue off an was declared dead by doctors...) sometimes that means leaving them in an ominous situation and then pulling the camera away (Franky family, Bon Kurei, Mr. 3) sometimes it means showing a far off explosion (Igaram, Pell) sometimes just cutting to a scene and showing the aftermath (Zoro taking Luffy's pain then bleeding crazily, fights skipped off camera)... and sometimes just taking a shotgun to the face and not caring like Brownbeard.
Ocassionally he'll even have a guy blown up, shot and then peed on, but then he'll have them taken to the hospital to cover it. Or he'll have doctors declare a man legally dead! Oda has more than one trick.
Coughing up blood and collapsing is one of them, but it don't mean death any more than a far off explosion does.
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with the display of this panel, i doubt the spike is as short as ur second diagram.(not saying its the first) with the angle and display, the spike looks about as twice as big as the cube and is behind and to the right of the spike (at the least beside it). With that said the spike would also need extra length to pierce w/e it is piercing currently to be somewhat vertical and not fall over (not sure why a small icicle would pierce iron/steel anyway so this shot is weird to me).
also ur shaded heart looks like a tomato lol but thats not important, even if he didnt make it all the way through the heart, to pierce and artery is just as bad as the heart
either way, im HOPING she's dead but i know better by now. i dont gamble but if i was to i would say not dead b/c its a safer bet but honestly i would greatly appreciate losing that bet.
edit1: forgot to mention that oda isnt great when it comes to dept perception and actual sizing as he has on numerous occasions inflamed characters and such. 1 eg being the shichubukai in marine ford war. just something i wanted to put out there for these debates on sizes.
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http://i996.mangapanda.com/one-piece/695/one-piece-3844523.jpg
with the display of this panel, i doubt the spike is as short as ur second diagram.(not saying its the first) with the angle and display, the spike looks about as twice as big as the cube and is behind and to the right of the spike (at the least beside it). With that said the spike would also need extra length to pierce w/e it is piercing currently to be somewhat vertical and not fall over (not sure why a small icicle would pierce iron/steel anyway so this shot is weird to me).
also ur shaded heart looks like a tomato lol but thats not important, even if he didnt make it all the way through the heart, to pierce and artery is just as bad as the hearthttp://static.ddmcdn.com/gif/depression-cause-heart-attack-1.jpg
either way, im HOPING she's dead but i know better by now. i dont gamble but if i was to i would say not dead b/c its a safer bet but honestly i would greatly appreciate losing that bet.
You guys are applying too much logic to this, Oda didn't sit down with a diagram of a heart to make some loop hole where Caesar would miss an artery.
But that doesn't mean anything, Monet will be fine.
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@Foxy:
You guys are applying too much logic to this, Oda didn't sit down with a diagram of a heart to make some loop hole where Caesar would miss an artery.
But that doesn't mean anything, Monet will be fine.
This. Because if Oda is now using insane stuff like this to justify whether or not someone dies, it's time to stop reading One Piece. If she's somehow alive, the reason why will be much, much simpler.