So? It's the perfect way to make the point. If it weren't PH, it would have been something or someone else. What Law did was an inevitability. The old era ended and it's time for the new era to swing into action. He only did it in a cool way. Really your problem as far as I can see boils down to "Well the scene was important, but I don't like Law, did he have to be the one to do it?" Well, no, it could have been anyone. But Oda made Law's character specifically for this purpose (not just because he's cool).
If you’re just repeating myself, I guess I’ll do it too: this is not something that “just happened, and I guess any old character could have said it.” This whole thing is a master plan Law has set up. That Law is enacting. That Law is bragging to Doflamingo about. He isn’t just saying “Hey Doffy! Eras changing, dude!” He’s explaining specifically how Laws designs are playing out. Thats my issue; everything that little speech talks about is something Law has orchestrated. All of Punk Hazard is dancing to his tune, not the tune of “Huh, I guess the eras changed”
Arlong Park sucks. He only beat Arlong because Nami wanted him to ugh
"But that's okay because he cared about Nami!"
And he cares about Law. I realize that a broken down woman like Nami is much more likable than Law but same principle. Luffy helps who he wants. Really, this again boils down to "I don't like Luffy helping Law because I don't like Law". Fair enough but don't say he's being manipulated because he's not.
I repeat, again: its not comparable to a close companion asking Luffy to help with a completely despairing situation. In those cases, it is a bona fide plead for help from someone not capable of dealing with a situation themselves, and as a result, Luffy is left to solve the problem as HE sees fit. Here: its just “hey Luffy I got this intricate plan all figured out, and it was ready to go even without anyone showing up, but since you’re here, wanna help out? You just have to do A then B then C” shrug”okay”.
No, he couldn't. If Kubo thought him up, he would be terrible because I'd know there would be nothing more to this character than meets the eye. I'm interested in Law because of the subtle impressions he gives me of being a much deeper character. I'm legitimately interested in the character and what he's going to do. That's not something that any mangaka can do with such an archetype which is so easy to devolve into pretentious cool boy. That takes some good writing skills.
Then you liking of Law is based on a prejudice that other authors would not develop him but Oda will? Then you’re saying that if Law was transplanted into Bleach, exactly as he is, you would automatically hate him because your opinion of Kubo? And Once again, we come down to liking a character based on his hypothetical future self, instead of his present. “I like Law because he might get developed sometime, and will then be fleshed out!”
Personally I never found his design or personality bland. He had this cool hippy look and a chill stoner like personality juxtaposed with the fact that he;s apparently some stone-cold serial killer. That was different.
He’s Zoros face with Aces hair and designer brand regular clothing. He could have passed for a nameless background crewmember with his level of detail. And the chill stoner personality is long gone.
Baroque Works and CP9 were large organizations that hired whoever was strong regardless of appearance. Crocodile never even met the people he hired before his plan. Law's crew is smaller and more personal and the fact that he goes out of his way to take on a Polar Bear who he's comfortable enough with to let stay by his right shoulder and even rests on his sleeping body especially when he's supposed to be this malicious dude is interesting. Like how Kenpachi always has a small girl as his vice-captain is interesting. Didn't amount to much in the end, but it was interesting at the start.
Law rested his back on a sleeping Bepo. Is that all you got? Thats pretty much the extent of any scenes showing a “special connection” between the two. Is the fact that he treats him as any other person supposed to be special in the Opverse? When we have Luffy with Chopper and Brook? Whitebeards crew of misfits? Big Mam with a three eyed chick and Pekoms? Foxy had a fishman? BB with San Juan? Even in the “non-personal” organizations like Baroque and CP9 the point remains the same: Organizations in the Opverse are extremely liberal with whom they include. I can’t think of any crew or group in the series that would go “A POLAR BEAR!?! ABOMINATION! I CAST THEE OUT!”
Again, all I'm getting is "I don't like him because fuck Bleach" execution be damned. And really, I don't see him much different from the start except we're delving into his character in detail now. Law always gave the impression of someone who likes to plan things out from the start though.
Did I mention Bleach? I don’t believe I did. I believe I described the most readily appearant –indeed, pretty much only- character traits at this point. “Serious smirking badass Mastermind Law”. If that immediately makes you think of Bleach it kinda reinforces my point, no?
Well if we're going to be downright pedantic, his substance is he's mysterious but we don't know his actual substance but we've seen quite a bit of it it here and there and we liked what we saw. His character is subtle but it's there. We've seen more and more of him especially in this arc. Totally different from "He's so cool, he must be DEEP!".
Indeed. Its more “I don’t know jack about this guy. He must be DEEP! Thats mysterious! Mysterious is cool!”
You mean other than planning to create a shitstorm in the New World and majorly piss off some very big players?
Cocky? Yes. Insane? Not really no. Enel destroying a civilization because it was his duty as God was insane (and entertaining). This most certainly isn’t.
The plan itself is solid. Fixed goal, everything he does is working towards it. Cause and effect.
Plan is full of holes and he takes massive detours to the goal.
He's that good? It's a minor thing, by no means a deal-breaker especially given how vague the details about it are.
Its not a minor thing when its impossible. Tell me then: How did Law get non-seastone chains without anyone noticing? “He’d placed normal chains around the lab!” Yeah, but how did he know they specifically would be picked to cuff him?
Law could have implemented his plan whenever he wanted true but he decided to bide him time, wait for the right moment and in the mean time do his research on SAD and refine his plan.
This is baseless. No canon confirmation whatsoever. And are you saying Law targetted Punk hazard before even knowing what SAD was?
The fact that Luffy came was the opportune moment so he decided to implement his plan then and there. Had he tried doing it on his own, he'd have had to face Caeser and all his personnel by himself opposed to Luffy coming in and serving as a distraction to split his forces. Really, if Vergo hadn't shown up, he'd have walked off with SAD with absolutely no obstruction or risk towards himself. However because Vergo showed up, without Luffy and Smoker, he'd never have succeeded.
So you are saying that his plan pretty much was “reach Punk Hazard. Twiddle thumbs and hope for the best.” I find it very hard to believe that he sat down, thought up his plan, then sat down on his ass and said “Right! Now all I got to do is wait until someone willing to help me stumbles across this non-log targetted island!”
Because people are going to walk out in the freezing cold for no reason. The only reason those guys are there is probably because they followed him from inside the complex
Yeah, but since they’re right in front of the entrance they might, you know, get back in.
Like Kinemon could? Oh wait…
Kinemon whose head (and thus, vision) was locked up, and whose legs were thrown to the other side of the island?
But again, really these are all nitpicks. Are these the biggest flaws you can come up with? Nothing more substantial or fundamental or completely counter-productive to his goals? Like chasing some stupid highschoolers for no reason level?
You don’t see his move of “Hi I’m Law! Please don’t tell Doflamingo I’m here. Pretty please?” as a stupid one?
See above. He was biding his time
Baseless. And you said it yourself:
Really, if Vergo hadn't shown up, he'd have walked off with SAD with absolutely no obstruction or risk towards himself.
SO WHY DIDN’T HE DO IT AGES AGO, before Vergo showed up. He was on the island for a goddamn year.
Vergo arriving was as much BECAUSE Smoker and Luffy arrived than anything. Caeser called for reinforcements because how out of control the situation was getting.
But Vergo getting Laws heart to keep was specifically because Monet and Caesar had long since ratted him out. If Vergo arrived JUST as backup, and Laws secret had been kept, he’d have been surprised to see Law.
But really, I'm not even arguing that the plan was flawless. I'm arguing that it MAKES SENSE. That there's a fixed defined goal and that everything Law does is working towards it.
So wait, as long as those two criteria are met then its okay? I guess Aizen and Ginjo need to be forgiven for a lot then, despite all the plotholes, impossibilities and nonsense all they did was in order to either cultivate Ichigos power for their own selfish reasons, or become spirit king/get ill defined revenge.
So no, I don’t think his plan is that well put together and executed, and he is thus not getting any points for “having a master plan that isn’t bogus”. Not that I can see why that should make me like his character.
Yep Luffy can do nothing but stretch. Just stretch. Oh and accelerate his blood flow greatly increasing his speed and stamina. And blow himself up into gigantic proportions
Exactly! Both because he’s rubber. Its not something he “unlocked”, its not a mutation of his DF, its something he can do because he is rubber. It obeys the rules of him being just rubber. No new rules introduced.
. Buggy can't do anything but split himself. And fly so long as his feet follow. And turn himself into a car.
Do I really need to say “He can split himself and combine his parts within a fixed area” to make you happy? And again, its just one ability, with one ruleset. Buggy reordering himself into a car isn’t introducing anything new to his base ability an its ryles. Buggy splitting other things into pieces would, on the other hand.
Crocodile can't do anything but turn to sand. And suck the water out of you. And completely eradicate the ground under your feet.
BECAUSE HE IS SAND. His powers of erosion stems directly from it being a property of sand. If Croc started summoning Cacti it would be different, but every single thing he does is through the attributes of sand.
Law's base ability is that he can cut up and move around anything in his room. But of course he's going to find new ways to use his devil fruit, new applications just like Luffy did. It's the smart thing for Devil Fruit users to do. But it all ties into his base ability. Almost everything you listed falls under he can make things move in his room how he wishes souls included. It's Buggy in reverse. That's all it is. He can take people's hearts and they'll still live. Just like how he can take people's head and they still live. The only thing that hasn't been explained and that doesn't fit in with his ability is his countershock but I'm willing to wait for an explanation for that one.
In the beginning, Laws rules seemed to be that he can exchange objects of similar size within his room. And that was fine. But wait! Now he can exchange objects of different sizes! Wait, he doesn’t need to exchange things, and can thus effectively teleport himself! Forget swapping, he can make stuff levitate! He can scan the surroundings for objects he doesn’t know whether exists and obtain them! Sometimes he needs to cut stuff to swap, sometimes he doesn’t!
And forgive me for saying that he’s overpowered when Law can effectively just levitate his opponent into the air, teleport them wherever he wishes, materialize an object he didn’t know was in the area to impale his opponent, then swap his mind with a rat and electrocute him.
Laws power definition is “He can treat stuff in his Room as if its an operating room”. Thats absurdly broad and unspecific.
Law only landed his one hit. That wasn't the sort of fight where the combatants beat each other bloody. It was a "first one to hit wins" fight. Law would have just as easily lost had Smoker managed to pin him down with his jutte. It was a very close call at the end where Smoker only lost by one move. But the whole point of that fight was to show how both the characters were equally strong but Law only came out on top that one time mostly due to a sneak attack. If they fought again, Smoker wouldn't make the same mistake again.
No, the way the chapter presents it is "Fuck you Vergo, you underestimated me!" Had Vergo not just charged recklessly and took Law's attack thinking it wouldn't do anything to him but simply fought smart and cautiously against a tired out, beat up Law, he'd have probably won. Yes, he got a cool pose in the end, everyone gets those when they win a fight. But it really was more to accentuate how shocking it was that Law just beat him just like that (which was quickly tied in to the theme at the end) not how awesome he is.
Law calling them out on sitting on their asses is exactly the same as saying “I’ve become stronger than you these two years”. But fair enough, I’ll concede that Law isn’t made out to be über top tier yet. Doesn’t mean that Smoker was more deserving of winning at least the fight against Vergo though.
What? Did I say they were good designs or good characters? No. But since they’re bad thats at least one thing that differentiates them. At they don’t suck because they’re boring and uninspired.
I think the shit he does is cool and entertaining. His devil fruit alone has a lot of entertainment value.
Laws ability and moves are cool. Noted. What about actual character? Or is it like Rayleigh where such things are immaterial?
I'm sorry he doesn't have horns on his head and goofy expressions or something exaggerated like that but his hat and cool stoner look is pretty memorable to me.
Oh, my mistake. No memorable design like Doflamingo. Or Mihawk. Or Kizaru. Or Enel. Better? Like I said: Law’s just a regular looking dude in regular looking clothes.
Neither did Robin when we first met her. We only got hints of it like when we found out in Arabasta that she sank a bunch of warships when she was eight. Her character was mostly supported by the mystery and intrigue surrounding her. But we got that emotional heart in the end. Just like we'll get with Law when we come to his flashback. But until then, I'll enjoy that aforementioned mystery and intrigue surrounding his character until we get something juicier.
And you know what? Robin was far and away the most boring crewmember for years on end.
Again: You can’t tell me to like someone because their future self will be interesting.
That's your opinion. I think the balance between drama and story has been pretty good in this arc. Yes, Luffy and the crew didn't become invested till pretty late in the game but that wasn't due to the failing on Oda's part, that was the point. To uncover the true horror of the island, for Luffy and Co. to start off all happy and hyper and then they and we become shocked at just how dark and insidious this place really is.
…That was present pretty much from the get go? And at least after they rescued the kids the first time. I doubt I’ll shake your belief on this one, but the Criticism thread at least shows that I’m not the only one feeling this way.
What spotlight hogging? He's getting the amount of spotlight that the story needs. Again, Oda is not looking at popularity polls and overdosing us with Law because of that. He's doing it for a reason. Which is to build up his character for the impending Doflamingo arc. You can not like him sure but bitching about how he's getting too much screentime is silly. He's getting as much as he needs.
Nearly a third of the arc is too much.