Chapter 379 "Douriki" Discussion

Greg

As far a 'power levels' go….

That was all a show to help us see who fits along the strength line and basically point out that all 6Shiki are not created equal. This will help justify eventual battles and who takes down whom. Rather than create controversy, so long as Oda has done his planning (which he almost always has) this should indeed put a stop to useless "Well so and so should have been able to do that' considering we already have a pretty solid idea of where the crew members' strengths lie.

Everything Oda does has a purpose. Although OP has the occassional slip of logic, Oda spends a great deal of time making sure what he creates makes 'sense', at least as far as manga go. For instance, consider the layout of the island. The giant gaping hole in the ocean isn't just pretty scenery, that fully justifies why Rocketman didn't simply ram right into the side of the island foregoing the gate crap.

These numbers will help the story flow and I highly doubt this will spiral into DB so long as Oda doesn't overuse them.

Pandaman

@ooshi78:

this was such a filler chapter… i didn't really need to see their power levels or a three headed judge... i think oda's planning for something big on chapter 400 and filling to make it happen...

ooshi78

but it introduces so much for people to discuss
-Two new devil fruits
-power levels(are they completely accurate?)
-how strong jabura is in zoan form
-history behind the CP9
-how spandam got to head of CP9 dispite being so weak.

and Franky bit Spandam!!

plus not to mention a new move by Luffy(gomu gomu no volcano)
But yeah, something big happening in 400 would be cool.

Greg

For me this chapter was freaking fantastic. It adds a bunch of history to CP9 and that's what I've been waiting for. Since their introduction the team has seemed kind of weak. This was mostly due to Oda's plot twist which landed a flying kick to my groin. But finally we're seeing all of them talk about each other, their history, etc. and through that their personalities are all coming through.

And like Pandaman said, holy-freaking-Devil Fruits Batman! The possibilities boggle the mind. An amazing chapter for the MUCH needed development of our villains. VERY happy fan.

Zeefer

@GunMetal::

Not so sure about that, Zeefer. The storyline is getting darker. Going Merry is too "cute". They're going to get a new ship. Oda's been banging us with this over the head for over a year now. And they'll definitely get a new crew member in addition to the ship. Oda's built up that fact too much.

Yes they'll be getting a new ship (what Luffy says he wants Luffy ends up getting), but whose to say it won't be rebuilt from the wood used to build Going Merry (of course, after it's been powered up by devil fruits) along with new materials. In this way, the new ship wouldn't really be a new ship at all (though it may end up being in a different form), but would still in essence be the going Merry, since the same wood is being used. In this way, the crew won't end up abandoning a Nakama, and Going Merry doesn't end up remaining dead. As for the new crew member, many thought Vivi would end up being a crew member, but look what happened there. All I'm saying is the possibility remains, that neither Franky nor Paulie may end up becoming the carpenter, rather the ship itself may end up being it's own carpenter.

ronozoro

as long as the power level stuff stays with in this arc and to a minimum i dont have a problem with it. if every acr the crew has to find a way to improve their power level blah blah blah then i will get anoyed but i highly doubt oda plans to use this power level past this arc.
i enjoyed this chapter wasnt as much action as some of the ast chapters but it gave some depth and character to CP9. plus franky bit spandamXD. the color spread was awsome, i loved it. and thoes two devil fruits are very interesting i wonder whats going to happen to them

Greg

Not sure if anyone mentioned this but take a lil' closer look at Jyabura's shadow too. Note how Lucci's arcs up for his back but Jyabura's goes off the page as if it continues. Oda always drops hints in images like this…

Buccaneer

I think he may be a dog, or something, the way he quarrels with Lucci. Did Lucci call him that literally?

Spandam getting bit was cool, but it's been done, and after that, Franky got dropped by one of the bench warmers….ah well, I've been waiting to see Lucci, Spandam, and Franky in the same place.

These numbers will help the story flow and I highly doubt this will spiral into DB so long as Oda doesn't overuse them.

Hopefully. I mean, it could already start:

member #1: No way Kaku is stronger than SSJabura!
member #2:Okay, he's not, but SSJabura is only as strong as Lucci, so there's no way he could stand up to Oozaru Lucci!

And then add in the speculations of the crews' power levels….

Ranion

on the right head i could make a joke about the three headed monty python reference

on the left head i could say that it would be a waste of time

but in my mind i think i just want some tea.. maybe with biscuits, or not, bah i just wanna see more Franky biting action and Luffy ass kicking action

Solid

Awesome chapter!

I think that jabura has the wolf fruit, sure it would be strongest dog fruit, but so? That doesnyt matter, a wolf and a leopard is like equally in strength in our world so why not?

And about the 2 new devil fruits, I doubt that anyone in the strawhat team would eat them, neither anyone in CP9. I just want the strawhats to take the DFs with them and and maybe they will play Key-role later.

ABout the power level thing, I love it, this doesnt mean that Calipha would lose against Fukuro or something, she still has her Torn Whips, wich can trap the enemy… And I wonder how high level Lucci has in his Neko form...

And one more thing... The sexual harrasment thing.. Now, I would just love a Paulie vs. Calipha battle..

And I love the new 3headed character...

Pandaman

seeing how jabura and lucci seem to not be best of friends I'm starting to wonder if he got that scar down his eye from Lucci, just a thought :wacko:

Donquixote Doflamingo

I hope this is the first and last time that we see power levels in OP, the bounties are enough already.

Though aside from that this chapter was great, the CP9 are hilarious (never would've thought to say that…).

ooshi78

@Buccaneer:

I think he may be a dog, or something, the way he quarrels with Lucci. Did Lucci call him that literally?

yes he was called that literally. i try to translate so that if a japanese person was reverse translating it back to japanese, it would appear close to the original.

ooshi78

KatanaJon1.1

I hope this is the first and last time that we see power levels in OP, the bounties are enough already.

This got me thinking.
What if this is a new concept?

Example, the strength of the pirates is measured by their bounties, correct?

What is these power levels are used to measure the strength of the Govenment officals? Not just CP9, but the
"Good" guys?

To everyone who thinks the going merry can use a devil fruit…the ship wont float! devil fruit users sink in salt water. as for spandam having a power level...it started with 9- and then it cut off. i think it might actually be 9o because there is no way he has 900 as his level.

Mafioso11

well i'd like for it to be 9 so he could eat a DF to make him stronger. but i also wouldn't mind if it was 90 or higher so he wouldn't seem so pathetic .

speaking of DFs, i'd like one of them to be a fruit to make your arm strength increase (then maybe if usopp ate it, he could handle impact or even reject dials, if he has any, without hurting himself).

Greg

member #1: No way Kaku is stronger than SSJabura!
member #2:Okay, he's not, but SSJabura is only as strong as Lucci, so there's no way he could stand up to Oozaru Lucci!

But you're using examples of multiple form changes and things that don't even exist in OP. Don't doubt Oda. At this point it is very basic and straightforward. We'll see where it goes.

And about the 2 new devil fruits, I doubt that anyone in the strawhat team would eat them, neither anyone in CP9.

Oh I TOTALLY agree. I doubt any crew member would willingly eat one.

Malgwath

Kaku is stronger than Jyabura, but Jyabura has a devilfruit-power, which makes him stronger. I would believe heÂ´s got some kind of wolf-fruit or something like that.

I donÂ´t think that any strawhat will eat a devilfruit. But it seems to me like the CP9-members get their fruits given to them by the government. Maybe Kaku and Spandam will get one each? Spandam needs one to get stronger, and Kaku is the second strongest without DF-powers. Number one (Lucci), three (Jyabura) and four (Blueno) has eaten devilfruits, so it seems logical that Kaku will eat one too.

ooshi78

@mugiwara:

To everyone who thinks the going merry can use a devil fruit…the ship wont float! devil fruit users sink in salt water. as for spandam having a power level...it started with 9- and then it cut off. i think it might actually be 9o because there is no way he has 900 as his level.

he wasn't cut off… his power level is 9.

ooshi78

changsho

Having never read Dragon Ball Z, I don't really mind the power levels. Rather, I take it as small interesting details.

I think that this is the only time the power levels are going to show up. As shown in this chapter, only the likes of Fukurou are able to measure it. In other words, it is not a simple goggle device like in DBZ, where everyone has one.

I can see Fukurou or any other CP9 member getting a beating by Luffy or receiving one of his punches, and then said, "OMG! Power level 6000!!" or something like that, but that's about it.

There's no way the power level concept is going to last; I just can't see the likes of Shanks or Ace getting measured. Besides, it measures movement or physical strength only, no? You can't measure survival skills, devil fruit mastery, the level of respect gained, etc.

The CP9 have the similar basic abilities, and therefore Oda needs to show us that they are not similar to each other, and that they each are unique.

Buccaneer

Oh, I tend to refer to leopard form Lucci as "oozaru" Lucci. Yes, I am aware that "oozaru" is great ape.

But true enough, Oda just had like, 3 pages with that kind of concept. It'll only be really disappointing if they do it outside of the government.

Solid

It would be awesome if Lulu and Tilestone ate the Dfs.. XD Iceburgs bodyguards..

joekido the Second

@Buccaneer:

Oh, I tend to refer to leopard form Lucci as "oozaru" Lucci. Yes, I am aware that "oozaru" is great ape.

But true enough, Oda just had like, 3 pages with that kind of concept. It'll only be really disappointing if they do it outside of the government.

I agree. This story is about friendship not who is the strongest. That concert was pointless in DBZ; I mean who cares who the strongest, what does matter? Theofore Oda would not abondon the original material he sets back in 1997.

Malgwath

@Solid:

It would be awesome if Lulu and Tilestone ate the Dfs.. XD Iceburgs bodyguards..

Yeah, that would be awsome ^^

I think that that measurement is something you can only use if youÂ´re a rokoshiki-user. So weÂ´ll probably not see i later.

In OP you donÂ´t win a battle when being stronger, you win it by having a stronger will.

GUTB

The power ranking is a character-specific ability, and the whole thing was presented as this kind of CP9 game. It won't come back after this arc, and it was honestly needed to determine a strength ranking between them. Pirates have bounties and Marines have ranks. So you need to settle who is where. But it doesn't account for DF or other factors so it's not that useful.

Pandaman

It's obviously a skill Zipman?! has, no one else has used it before so it's probably a unique thing and the numbers just helps explain the difference in strength that zipman predicts.

Buccaneer

Hm, I'm starting to think Zoro will run into 3 head (Baskerville?).

GUTB

I still don't see how the CP9 would stand a chance against Crocodile. Or Ace.

Greg

I still don't see how the CP9 would stand a chance against Crocodile. Or Ace.

Then does it surprise you that someone who is rubber could accomplish such things? It's not the skill, it's how you use it. Take a look at Gomu Gomu Volcano, yet another amazing extension of his ability. We've seen very little of what Lucci and the others are actual capable of doing in combat besides taking out a few low-level fighters and throwing a couple punches here and there. I can't WAIT to see how each of them can use 6Shiki to their advantage, ESPECIALLY KAKU!

changsho

@omae:

Then does it surprise you that someone who is rubber could accomplish such things? It's not the skill, it's how you use it. Take a look at Gomu Gomu Volcano, yet another amazing extension of his ability. We've seen very little of what Lucci and the others are actual capable of doing in combat besides taking out a few low-level fighters and throwing a couple punches here and there. I can't WAIT to see how each of them can use 6Shiki to their advantage, ESPECIALLY KAKU!

Yes, and he better fight SogeKing.
burning eyes

But… I don't really get Gomu Gomu Kazan/Volcano. Is it a variation of Gomu Gomu Ono/Axe? Axe's area of damage focuses on the surface that Luffy's standing on, but Kazan?

Ivotas

Ok a quick explenation on the whole "power level" thing since it appears that people get annoyed by it without any real reason.

This isnÂ´t the first time Oda used an indicator to determine a strenght rank among the villains. In fact, this is the third time. The only difference to the other two times is that it is a new kind of indicator. To prove that letÂ´s elaborate the other two times.

In the Baroque Works arc, the strenght level of the villains was determined by the numbers that they received for their codenames. The lower the number the higher the rank was. This didnÂ´t mean that it had something to do with strenght alone (Mr. 3 and Mr. 4 are the best example).
This was a criminal organisation so such an order made sense.

In Skypiea we had the four priests. Their indicators were their ordeals with the 0%, 2%, 10% and 50% probability of survival. Another indicator to determine a rank among them and it made sense to use such an indicator because it was priests of god. A Mr 1,2,3 ranking wouldnÂ´t work that good in such a context.

Now to get to the current arc. Why does such a ranking make sense here? Because except for Spandam all the others are Rokushiki users, which means they are all trained in close combat.
Now if anybody of you is familiar with the boxing sport then youÂ´ll know that boxers often measure the speed of their punches to deternmine how strong it is. That really happens. However the strongest or fastest punch doesnÂ´t determine the better boxer. But it is an indicator on ranking the punching strenght of the boxers themselves. And in real life boxers would also freak out like Jabura if somebody has a stronger punch. They would say something like "yeah heÂ´s got the stronger punch but IÂ´m the better boxer and I can knock him out."

So since the CP9ers are all trained fighters this ranking system makes sense here, just like the ordeal survival probabilities made sense for priests and the agent names made sense for a criminal organisation.

This is definitely not the first time that Oda used a ranking system in One Piece so I donÂ´t get why everybody freaks out. IÂ´m sure that we wonÂ´t see it again in the next mega arc.

GUTB

Well for that matter I fail to see how they stand a chance against Luffy unless they display power levels FAR beyond what they already have.

Roman Zaenom

Ha ha… OP is so good you all tend to forget it is a SHONEN. And most shonens since Dragon Ball and Saint Seiya (like Naruto, Bleach, OP, HxH, Samurai Deeper Kyo...) are about people going up a level after gaining experience through fights or training, like a good old RPG. OP is no exception, though it's not as prominent as other shonens.

The bounties, the numbers in Baroque Works (it wasn't innocent, just like it wasn't innocent to say Mr.4 was stronger than 3), saying Krieg is the strongest in EB, that Gin is his strongest man, then saying Arlong is even stronger than Krieg and so on... It's nothing new. So, I see no problem with Oda introducing some hierarchy in CP9... It's some kind of fanservice and most fans of shonens like this, because they like to make comparison between characters. Hell, I like to compare chars from one anime to another too. It's part of the fun.

Besides, the only big surprise in this ranking is the numbers, not the places. We all knew that Lucci was number 1, that Jyabura would be in the top 3 and suspected Kaku to be stronger than Blueno.

Who else thinks Fukurou will be the first one to fight since he has probably no other fighting technique than Rokushiki? His DF would not be very useful in a fight, except for information like how much Dourikis does it take to break Tekkai... I doubt Oda would start with Karifa...

changsho

You are forgetting his completely pointless zipper-mouth. I bet that will come in handy…mouthy..whatever.

Pandaman

I bet when he tries to determine Luffy's power he'll start going no! no! no! 10-000 then explode

changsho

Mm, yah. Typical shonen situation where enemy goes WTF at main character's power.

GUTB

Although a Kenshin/HxH style tournoment battle would be fun once in a while, I really doubt Oda's going to start doing them now.

Solid

@Ivotas:

In Skypiea we had the four priests. Their indicators were their ordeals with the 0%, 2%, 10% and 50% probability of survival. Another indicator to determine a rank among them and it made sense to use such an indicator because it was priests of god. A Mr 1,2,3 ranking wouldnÂ´t work that good in such a context.

[QUOTE/]

Well, I dont think that Gedatsu was the weakest of the priests, he was the leader of them so.. Maybe he only had that high survival rate becasue he was stupid..

Zipper mouth didnt have df did he?

I bet 100$ that the 2 df will go one to usop and the other to Paulie ( rope guy) . This way they will both be strong enough to be with the strawhat.
I bet on Paulie cuz i m pretty sure he is the one to join, not Kati Fram, cuz

Franky's dream is to build a ship that would float over all seas => perfect as Rufy's ship
Franky teacher builded the ship of Gold D Roger, the pirate king => perfect Franky builds Rufy's ship, the future pirate king
Ossan has granted rufy he would let any of his shipwright to leave with him => what better than his favourite disciple
Paulie is in really good terms with all the strawhat after saving their life from the Aqua laguna.

The only problem i had accepting him was that he was too weak compared to others, but if he gets a chance to eat a Df that would be resolved.

So this is it for me.
Tks all for attention.
Bye

EDIT: Well actually to be sure i win my 100% i must say i m not so sure about Usop's having dinner . The problem is that spandam is too weak to fight against Franky, so one might go to him. And also lots of fans like Usop has it is now.
Hopefully nothing always certain in life.
cya

changsho

@schianto:

I bet 100$ that the 2 df will go one to usop and the other to Paulie ( rope guy) . This way they will both be strong enough to be with the strawhat.
I bet on Paulie cuz i m pretty sure he is the one to join, not Kati Fram, cuz

Franky's dream is to build a ship that would float over all seas => perfect as Rufy's ship

Franky teacher builded the ship of Gold D Roger, the pirate king => perfect Franky builds Rufy's ship, the future pirate king

Ossan has granted rufy he would let any of his shipwright to leave with him => what better than his favourite disciple

Paulie is in really good terms with all the strawhat after saving their life from the Aqua laguna.

The only problem i had accepting him was that he was too weak compared to others, but if he gets a chance to eat a Df that would be resolved.

So this is it for me.
Tks all for attention.
Bye

O_o Usopp, too weak to join?
… Gee, did he use DF when fighting Luffy? I think I need to read/watch that scene again. [/sarcasm]

This post is deleted!

the clicky pen

I can't even guess who's gonna eat the fruits… but I know damn well who isn't eating them, and that's Usopp.

changsho

Yeah, I like him as he is now. With all the gadgets and stuff :laugh: Plus, the handicap of not being able to swim is a bit muchXD

The only DF that I would consider for him to eat (sounds like a manager, no?) is a fruit that can help him fix stuff. Now that'd be neat.

Greg

I really REALLY like the idea of DF's going to devices. That would be so sweet. As far as strength for joining the crew, honestly, since when did actual physical strength decide whether someone would join or not. They don't join because they're strong, they join because they're unique, have dreams and nothing can stop them no matter how powerful they physically are or aren't.

Son Conan

Color Spread: Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaami…<3

-As far as the whole "power level" thing goes, well, I won't say, since Ivotas pretty much summed up how I feel about it.
-While I still hate CP9 with a passion, its now a "good" hate after this chapter. Their interactions with each other were hilarious.
-If they make a Franky doll, it better have a "Kung-Fu Bite" feature.
-Luffy STILL kicks so much butt its not even funny.
-I think that the Monty Python-esque judge's name is Baskerville, if it isn't already known.

Kakaliaha

I have never understood that a DF make a person any stronger, just gives them an ability. Luffy said that Ace could beat him anytime when they were younger even when Luffy had a DF and Ace didn't. Of course some fruits abilities would make the person more powerful, though in strength they would stay the same.

If Usopp did get a DF it wouldn't help him any unless if had something to do with marksmanship or inventing/fixing. any other type of DF would be useless to him. A DF isn't going to sudenly make him brave, he has to do that himself, and slowly has been doing that. He has beat mermen, high ranking BW agents, Skypia priests, and stood his ground against Luffy.

Usopp is the last person that needs a DF.

Son Conan

Kakaliaha: Actually, Zoan Devil Fruits allow you to increase your physical strength. Its only Paramecia and Logia that JUST give you a special ability.

I also agree with you about Usopp eating a Devil Fruit. He's been up against people and forces much more powerful than himself, and has managed to come out alive, if somewhat injured. He needs a Devil Fruit like I need a root canal.

changsho

@Kakaliaha:

I have never understood that a DF make a person any stronger, just gives them an ability. Luffy said that Ace could beat him anytime when they were younger even when Luffy had a DF and Ace didn't. Of course some fruits abilities would make the person more powerful, though in strength they would stay the same.

If Usopp did get a DF it wouldn't help him any unless if had something to do with marksmanship or inventing/fixing. any other type of DF would be useless to him. A DF isn't going to sudenly make him brave, he has to do that himself, and slowly has been doing that. He has beat mermen, high ranking BW agents, Skypia priests, and stood his ground against Luffy.

Usopp is the last person that needs a DF.

Word.

The only thing I dislike about this chapter is the… Judge. Sure it's a Monty Python thingy and all, but what for? Is he another "Jerry"?

Greg

Actually, Zoan Devil Fruits allow you to increase your physical strength.

A GREAT point! Thank you for bringing that up. That tiny detail did slip in there didn't it.

Polygon

What if Soge king's new weapon gets a DF?

Green Hair

Damn, I got a little bit carried away before… Since the list doesn't show their real strength levels, we can still assume that Kaku is somehow stronger than Jyabura in his Zoan form. Then again, I could be wrong... Hm, maybe Kaku will get to eat one of those Devil Fruits...