Chapter 587 "I will not run!" Discussion
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Then suddenly revolutionaries
Appeared before my eyes
And sang to me this song of hope
And this is what they said
They said "Come sail away!", "Come sail away!" "Come sail away with me!" -
Very interesting little chapter.
So Kuma has been working with Dragon for at least 10 years, interesting. Once more, why does Kuma 'seem' to know that Luffy is Dragon's son but Ivan-san didn't know until Luffy told him in Impel Down?
Sabo may have set sail but something tells me he is going to be captured before he can get away from the Goa Kingdom. A very high ranking Marine could be on the ship carrying the Celestial Dragon and seeing Sabo's pirate flag could result in Sabo being attacked.
Once again, the King of City's face is hidden so it will be interesting to find out who he is. Right now, I can't even think of who this person might be. I suspect it is someone who we have met before.
We know that Ivan was in ID for a number of years. Its possible that Dragon told Kuma about Luffy after Ivan was captured, maybe after Luffy started gaining so much attention from the WG, as a means of having someone on the inside to spy and/or help if necessary.
Yeah its possible Sabo got caught or killed by teh Celestial Dragon or his Admiral, if he has one with him.
The King is becoming more of an interesting figure for sure! I wonder if he's become, in modern times, one of the 5 stars?
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So tell me a good explanation why a pirate Sabo isn't recognized by nobody and not even Ace or Luffy? Why is Luffy only speaking about ONE brother if he FOR NOW knows he is completely fine? Where was he?
And the S thing is now really obivious.
The strongest pro for him was being a revolutionary and being saved by Dragon. But this one has fallen apart right now.
Again, wait for the flashback to end, we don't know if this is the last time Ace and Sabo will meet up, maybe Ace believed Sabo died, maybe Sabo change his name as a pirate or maybe SABO IS INDEED DEAD, saying things like "He must be absolutely dead" is pointless when you know Oda can make a hundred of excuses for Luffy thinking he have only one brother and Sabo not comming to the War.
Learning the secret technique of the engrish, forgive me, grammar gods!!!
Moria's Current status:
Spoiler:
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Maybe Ace had Kings Haki when he was younger and had a strong ambition to be a pirate but he lost that when he joined WBs crew as he only wanted Whitebeard to be the Pirate King rather than himself
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Dragon's shirt = awesome. Growing transponder snails, kind of soft for such a stern-looking guy as him. However, cover is still great.
LOL. As someone else suggested in the spoiler thread, he may have set them free–after all they are slaves of a sort, as well.
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I knew Kuma would be with Dragon. Yay I finally called something right.
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And really the S thing is really obivious now isn't it?
I thought that the "S" was a mistake by the artist but as you stated, I am starting to think that it was done intentionally in memory of Sabo.
Also, if Ace dedicated part of his tatoo to Sabo, then to me, it is inferred that Ace thinks Sabo is dead or doesn't know Sabo left to become a pirate.
did i get that right?
ace has the Haōshoku haki?Ace was a bad ass when he was a kid… MOTHER FUCKING HAOSHOKU HAKI... too bad he grew up
I don't think it necessarily means Ace has 'King's Haki', it just means he has Haki ability.
If Ace had used the 'King's Haki', I have to believe that Bluejam would have been effected as well.
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I hope this mini-arc will end soon. I don't really care for luffys past, neither for characters like dadan, sabo or ace. I'd rather see whats going on in the real time and how the strawhats reunite/start sailing again etc.
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Again, wait for the flashback to end, we don't know if this is the last time Ace and Sabo will meet up, maybe Ace believed Sabo died, maybe Sabo change his name as a pirate or maybe SABO IS INDEED DEAD, saying things like "He must be absolutely dead" is pointless when you know Oda can make a hundred of excuses for Luffy thinking he have only one brother and Sabo not comming to the War.
Did I say that? But some people are talking that Sabo is alive is more likely than dead? which isn't true.
The biggest pro for him now even was crushed (being a revolutionary)
And something has still to happen that Luffy believes he is dead…
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Again, wait for the flashback to end, we don't know if this is the last time Ace and Sabo will meet up, maybe Ace believed Sabo died, maybe Sabo change his name as a pirate or maybe SABO IS INDEED DEAD, saying things like "He must be absolutely dead" is pointless when you know Oda can make a hundred of excuses for Luffy thinking he have only one brother and Sabo not comming to the War.
Seconding this, with all due respect, KiShiDo, I thought we'd all agreed in the spoiler thread to respectfully accept that there was a good possibilty of Sabo being dead or still alive.
Nevermind, saw your most recent post.
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Well, we all know Dadan and Ace are going to make it back, so I guess the only mystery left is what Sabo's fate will be. And the Celestial Dragon too, I suppose. We should finally see him/her next chapter.
I mentioned this in the spoiler thread, but one of the only reasons I can think of for Oda to have Ace still missing this chapter is to give reason for Luffy to go out searching for him, which could allow him to witness whatever happens to Sabo. Given the chapter ends days(?) after Luffy was last seen, he should now be able to head out in search for Ace now. The search should bring him to or near the coast / city / port, enough to see Sabo.
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It's irrelevant but I'm wondering if it was Kuma repelling the flames or Dragon's wind/mystery df? Also again I'm pretty sure that Sabo is going to die, now that I know he didn't go with Dragon there's just too many things pointing to him not living past this flashback.
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Looks interesting! I'm also for Sabo dying or something - that noble's slave pic someone showed a while ago still looks like Sabo's destiny! Hopefully not - but in that case he should have gone to Marineford to rescue Ace.
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It's irrelevant but I'm wondering if it was Kuma repelling the flames or Dragon's wind/mystery df? Also again I'm pretty sure that Sabo is going to die, now that I know he didn't go with Dragon there's just too many things pointing to him not living past this flashback.
You don't think the death wink would have been able to accomplish that tunnel effect?
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So, is no one going to say something about [Theory]Dragon using his air logia powers to make path on the flames[/Theory]
Edit:
@I:
You don't think the death wink would have been able to accomplish that tunnel effect?
Not with Dragon trademark wind on the path.
Learning the secret technique of the engrish, forgive me, grammar gods!!!
Moria's Current status:
Spoiler:
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It's irrelevant but I'm wondering if it was Kuma repelling the flames or Dragon's wind/mystery df? Also again I'm pretty sure that Sabo is going to die, now that I know he didn't go with Dragon there's just too many things pointing to him not living past this flashback.
Going out on a limb and suggesting it's Kuma. The rounded trench that the blast force left could have been easily done by his Paw-Paw abilities.
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So, is no one going to say something about [Theory]Dragon using his air logia powers to make path on the flames[/Theory]
It seems kinda obvious…
While Kuma or Iva could have done it, Dragon is the one who most likely did it..
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Even if he is alive… Next chapter or 2 something has to happen that Ace and Luffy believes that he is dead!
But if he is still a pirate sailing on the sea it would be plain dumb Ace (NW pirate) would now about that and would say it to Luffy... hell even the small fries have bounty posters and are in the papers all the time.
If he is alive it has to be a good reason why he hided all the time and didn't came to the war.
The only thing now left... Him being captured the next chapters.
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Nice chapter even if I was expecting the Tenryuubito's apearance as the cliffhanger ending by now .
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First thing I thought about when I saw that tunnel was "Crab-chan's" abilities to make openings and roads in ID, and almost expected to see a paved pathway, lol. Of course that's not it. It could be any number of things, though.
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@I:
We know that Ivan was in ID for a number of years. Its possible that Dragon told Kuma about Luffy after Ivan was captured, maybe after Luffy started gaining so much attention from the WG, as a means of having someone on the inside to spy and/or help if necessary.
I didn't think about that scenario and it is definitely plausible. When I first read the chapter, the first thing I thought was that Kuma may be in the know more then Ivan-san.
@I:
Yeah its possible Sabo got caught or killed by teh Celestial Dragon or his Admiral, if he has one with him.
Sabo is flashing that new flag awfully high. I think before he clears the Goa Kingdom, he is going to be sighted by the Marine Convoy and the Marines will try to eliminate him. For all the Marines know, he could be trying to attack the Celestial Dragon.
@I:
The King is becoming more of an interesting figure for sure! I wonder if he's become, in modern times, one of the 5 stars?
Yes, I am sure we have seen this guy in the story. I just don't have any good guesses as to who he might be.
Personally, I don't think you can become a member of the 5 Elder's Stars if you weren't born a Celestial Dragon. I think you can certainly become a Celestial Dragon through marriage and maybe your offspring could become one but I don't think you a person not born a Celestial Dragon can become a member of the 5 Elder Stars.
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I don't think it necessarily means Ace has 'King's Haki', it just means he has Haki ability.
If Ace had used the 'King's Haki', I have to believe that Bluejam would have been effected as well.
why woudl bluejam be affected? to me this seemed like uncontrolled and first time like Luffy has done a few times here or there.
remember how DUVAL was not affected. bluejam isn't fodder, he is a fearsome pirate as has been said a bunch in this flashback. he isn't no some huge name, but at least duval level.
and this is a 10 year old doing it as well, i feel much weaker than any luffy might have done before.
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Great chapter, so we know that Kuma was a former revolutionary, and does anybody think we've already met older Sabo under a different alias (I'm leaning towards the side of "No")?
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@I:
You don't think the death wink would have been able to accomplish that tunnel effect?
Oh I forgot about that, yeah that could work too.
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this chapter was AAWWWWWSOME. I knew that had to be IVa-chan and not luffy's mom like some people were saying. .Man Kuma a revolutionary , now who didn't see that coming. It finally confirms key mysteries in the plotline. Sabo might still be alive and become his own pirate or still join dragon. It didn't look like he left yet.
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@RPG:
this chapter was AAWWWWWSOME. I knew that had to be IVa-chan and not luffy's mom like some people were saying. .Man Kuma a revolutionary , now who didn't see that coming. It finally confirms key mysteries in the plotline. Sabo might still be alive and become his own pirate or still join dragon. It didn't look like he left yet.
Dragon didn't left…
We see him sailing away... Than a day or 2 left...
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Great chapter, so we know that Kuma was a former revolutionary, and does anybody think we've already met older Sabo under a different alias (I'm leaning towards the side of "No")?
well not sure who is all with me, but i just feel if Sabo is alive that it is very dissapointing he didn't show for war. he seemed so like Luffy and Ace and many strawhats in attitude towards friends, but yet doesn't show for this war to save Ace.
dissapointed in you Sabo if you are alive. If you are, you better have an amazingly good excuse for not making it.
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It's irrelevant but I'm wondering if it was Kuma repelling the flames or Dragon's wind/mystery df?
The SFX on the page with the old man are "hyururu…" and "baki baki..."; the former is used for swift movement, I believe, and the latter is used for loud impacts. Aohige will probably correct me though, so don't think much of this. I think I've seen 'hyururu' used for a helicopter before too.
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"AWWWWWSOME" ?
Don't get me wrong I liked it but it wasn't that good . Not even a single bubble in sight :ninja:
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Apparently he's fighting on your behalf.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v284/lord_darkstorm/freedom.jpg
Yeah, that tricky Kuma.
Always keeping things shrouded in mystery
So, is no one going to say something about [Theory]Dragon using his air logia powers to make path on the flames[/Theory]
It's another hint at his abilities but it's no confirmation.
About Ace using 'ambition'. It was to be expected, after Ace's statement about Luffy also possessing the ability. I'm not that surprised, but I must admit it's a bit unnerving considering we never saw Ace use the ability as an adult.
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Thanks for the chapter link! I guess that explosion that made a path could also be because of Kuma's abilities. Its still quite unclear though.
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maybe i'm too excited but it doesn't take much for me. learnig ace is rogers son was the only thing that got you guys hyped up
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It's a ghost . A ghost I tell you :ninja:
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Still a 50-50 if Sabo is dead or alive to me,
Him going to interrupt the Celestial Dragons Ceremonies is a sign of something ill to come and the fact that Luffy has never gone to look for him still is bothering me…and the fact we didn't see him at Ace's execution..
So the only way I can see Sabo still alive right now is as a slave..
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Given the chapter ends days(?) after Luffy was last seen,
Just to clarify, the chapter ends two days after the fire:
Last chapter, Stelly told Sabo the Tenryuubito would come "3 days from now" and that "tomorrow will be the big trash fire night".
So, we are already "tomorrow" (one day since Stelly said it) when last chapter ended. In this chapter "tomorrow" ends.
The scene in which Luffy's with the bandits wanting to search for Dadan and Ace is the day after the fire. We also see the guards searching the Gray Terminal and Sabo thinking about his options.
The last page of this chapter is the day the Tenryuubito are coming, so it's the third day, two days since the fire.
About Ace using 'ambition'. It was to be expected, after Ace's statement about Luffy also possessing the ability. I'm not that surprised, but I must admit it's a bit unnerving considering we never saw Ace use the ability as an adult.
But it's not like we saw his adventures. We know so little of his adult self. He never got a big fight or anything like that on-screen.
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World nobles are about to land, and Sabo is in the way of the ceremony? Oh my, so this is how Sabos story will end. We all know what happens when one gets in the way of a world noble.
I really liked this chapter. Really, really liked. claps
Yeah, next chapter: Sabo's ship is about to exploooode…
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Nice epsidoes i liked seeing Ace kicking some ass, also Dragon is awzum.
Sabo didnt go with him im sad ;(, the sea king is going to eat him next chapter.
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I liked how Oda confirmed "Ace never runs."
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My main problem with Sabo dying is that from a reader POV using Sabo's death to encourage the late Ace it's kinda odd when you already know Ace is equally going to be dead on the present, maybe if the Sabo "thing" was a bit more related to Luffy…But forget about Sabo people, the really important question here is, are we going to see Stelly again?!
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But it's not like we saw his adventures. We know so little of his adult self. He never got a big fight or anything like that on-screen.
I heard there was a big discussion about this in the spoiler thread. Perhaps someone cough brennen cough could give a quick summary with his magic powers.
Either way, with ambition being showcased as such a pivotal ability. Such that on using it (Luffy at Marineford), the marines immediately deem him too dangerous to continue living. I expect that any character possessing this ability will be showcased to the reader (audience) in critical story time. And there were plenty of opportunities to squeeze this into the story IMO.
Overall, it doesn't really bother me. I just found it a little surprising given Oda's attention to detail.
WARNING (Explicit Dialog)!!
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I heard there was a big discussion about this in the spoiler thread. Perhaps someone cough brennen cough could give a quick summary with his magic powers.
Either way, with ambition being showcased as such a pivotal ability. Such that on using it (Luffy at Marineford), the marines immediately deem him too dangerous to continue living. I expect that any character possessing this ability will be showcased to the reader (audience) in critical story time. And there were plenty of opportunities to squeeze this into the story IMO.
Overall, it doesn't really bother me. I just found it a little surprising given Oda's attention to detail.
Who's to know that Ace, much like Luffy, still doesn't know how to harness this ability. The only users revealed to us thus far with Haki powers in general were all veterans who have been pirating for much longer than Ace..
And again, even if he could use his Haki powers, much like a lot of other stuff about Ace, Oda doesn't really seem to care about it. Oda concentrates on Ace's personality and impact on Luffy much more in the story than his ability's, pirating career, and now his Haki. Apparently Oda doesn't think its necessary for us to know these things…
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Not seeing the King's face again has me convinced he will have a big reveal.
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Sabo is going to die.
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It was a nice little chapter, nothing extremely great, but very good.
The nobles are as ugly as possible. That little girl there was… yuck. Oh well.I like how the prediction go on. First: Sabo will die, then all the other theories and in the end he'll die. I like how the story unfolds. Clearly the keypoint is freedom and I think Sabo's death, possibly in the next chapter, and Ace's comeback and his speech about "we will be free, more than anyone else" will enable Luffy to become free from his own "burdens", which is now the pain over Ace's death. Remembering how Sabo died and Ace and uffy dealt with it when they were young will remind Luffy of how he can overcome this sad feeling. And the he and wee can go on to Shabondy Archipelago. Maybe in two weeks.
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I heard there was a big discussion about this in the spoiler thread. Perhaps someone cough brennen cough could give a quick summary with his magic powers.
Either way, with ambition being showcased as such a pivotal ability. Such that on using it (Luffy at Marineford), the marines immediately deem him too dangerous to continue living. I expect that any character possessing this ability will be showcased to the reader (audience) in critical story time. And there were plenty of opportunities to squeeze this into the story IMO.
Overall, it doesn't really bother me. I just found it a little surprising given Oda's attention to detail.
I have a feeling that "making people faint" is the weakest Ambition use. We know Shanks and Rayleigh use it, but we also know other guys, like Ace and Whitebeard, could use it but didn't. Guys like the Supernova's crewmembers or Bluejam could resist it.
We also know that though guys, like Akainu or even Luffy may be hurt by Ambition, but just can resist it just like a strong guy can take several punches and sword cuts and still be standing and fighting.
So, I think Ambition is a powerful ability, but not the ultimate technique. We can just assume that Ace and Whitebeard were using it in their fights, but since they were fighting guys that are really strong, we readers couldn't tell the difference most of the time.
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Seeing Kuma there made this whole side story worth it…
