Chapter 574 "The Death of Portgas D. Ace" Discussion

Fortysix2

Although I am not at all a fan of Ace from the beginning (I just like his DF, its fucking awesome) I felt bad for him when I read the latest chapter because his life was nothing but a tragedy. So I got kind of nostalgic and started going through chapters from Shaboady Archipelago and I have a slight feeling that Portgas D.Ace could be alive. But I am not really sure about this, next chapter will definitely clarify if Ace is dead for sure or not. But some facts kind of hinted to the fact that Ace might not have died afterall.

Deductions:

1. Why was Kuma in Shaboady during that Tenrobityu incident when there were no orders from Govt.?

Ans: For the first time, it was publicly announced that Ace is going to be executed. Disco-Doflamingo, again on the same day converse over phone and Doflamingo tells him that he has been called to a Shichibukai assembly related to Ace's execution.

So it is highly probable that even kuma came to know about it the same day.

So Kuma realises that if Luffy comes to know about this, he will definitely go to Marineford and will get killed for sure. So he goes to Shaboady to send the mugiwara crew to far off islands.

2. What did he tell Rayleigh?

Ans: That Ace is going to be executed in 10 days and that "Ace-Luffy" are brothers. So I need to send him very far to keep him safe. Rayleigh reacts saying, "Should I believe that nonsense?" because it was posted in papers the same day and it is highly likely that he does not know of it.

3. Why should Rayleigh come and save Ace?

Ans: If Rayleigh knew that Ace was Roger's son from before, Kuma's conversation let him know that he was going to be executed. So he would come to save Ace by default and he had like "7 idle days" after coating the ship to go to marineford.

And if he didn't know, doesn't really matter because Ace's execution has become a famous issue in Shaboady. So he would have heard it from some-one or watched it live himself. Its just that he would have less time for preparation now, but he would put his life on to saving Ace.

So I have a strong feeling that Rayleigh is going to turn-up in Marineford with coated-sunny and save Ace the next chapter. Now don't ask me from where he is going to get expert doctors and stuff but anything is possible in OP world. Ace might become a cyborg…Who knows??

Remember one thing. In one of the chapters, Garp says that it is too tough for Marines to take on "Two-Legends" at the same time. So I guess Rayleigh's entrance is going to turn tables of this war. It is also apt because "Legends" of previous era should lay a path for the "New Era."

Also, Rayleigh is going to play very minor role in the future and his major role has to be this saga because the new-era is starting. And if Rayleigh did not turn up because he did not know that Ace is Roger's son, he will eventually come to know of that fact sometime soon. What kind of a fucked up legend is he who could not save his Sencho's son.

If both WB and Ace die, Ace's death basically overshadows WB's death and it would seem as if ace laid path to new era. He bloody belongs to this era. Then how the hell can he lay path for a new era??

AGOG

We beat the spoiler record…

So, anyone down for this record? 2,453

That's in terms of CHAPTER DISCUSSION posts…

korosion

@Aohige_AP:

I'm getting sick and tired of this whole "Oda said no one dies in his manga" and Ace returning from dead crap.

If you're gonna site something like an interview, make sure you know exactly what was said!
I'm so tired of this crap, I'm gonna go and translate the damn interview from Playboy Oda interview myself.
I'm sure Greg or someone has done it before, but quick search didn't find it, so I'll do mine.

Stay tuned.

I've read somewhere that Oda has just sait that in that era (the Roger's one), beating or killing is the same, only victory matters.

I think I posted this earlier here or on the spoiler thread : since Ace proclaimed a new era something like 5 minutes before dying, the rule may have changed. It's not so insignificant to ignore this possibility since Oda is always weighing his words when revealing some important information concerning the whole manga, espacially in SBS and interviews.

mstarsup5

@irishpud:

Ah havent read this chapter yet (waiting for trans) but I wish they had given it a bit of a different title cause it has kinda ruined it for me

You have Aohige's translation some pages back, cnet's on MH, and Steven D. Teach's on first page

The_dragon

…. O.o

Ok, let settle things, ACE is definitely dead... no matter what everyone is thinking, it's just because the story needs a moment like that to make a big jump forward.

What else:

Luffy hidden power/Gear3/defeat an Admiral ... !!!
WB reage/Destroy the whole island .. possible!!!

I think next chapter will be ... like the others, great ^^

alfredjohn617

Can't wait for the next chapter. have some friends saying he'll be back since he promised he will not die. but i think that's the tragedy of it.

Sick_Fool

@Aohige_AP:

I: It's one of the defining characteristcs of One Piece that the protagonists don't die, and they don't kill their opponents either. In other words, people don't come back to life. How come you don't use the character revival plots like other manga?

O: Well, it's unnatural for people to come back to life, don't you think? (laughs) I don't like that type of stereotypical fantasy. That's why I want to have reasons for whatever happens in the manga, but if I have to resort to bringing someone back to life, it's better not to kill them in the first place. That's why my characters don't die, even when they're on the verge of death.

And with that the teeny weeny shred of doubt I have is finally gone. Thanks Aohige.

Aohige_AP

@korosion:

I've read somewhere that Oda has just sait that in that era (the Roger's one), beating or killing is the same, only victory matters.

I think I posted this earlier here or on the spoiler thread : since Ace proclaimed a new era something like 5 minutes before dying, the rule may have changed. It's not so insignificant to ignore this possibility since Oda is always weighing his words when revealing some important information concerning the whole manga, espacially in SBS and interviews.

Dude, you see, that's exactly what I'm annoyed about. :ermm:

"I think I read somewhere…" "someone on **** said...."

If you want to site a reference, you should research the reference, read the article, and quote it.
Because understanding only half of what was said, is worse than not knowing it in the first place.

@Fire-Fist:

was thinking of collection all your chapter translations and make one thread. It would be good for reference. Can i do that?

I don't mind, but I'd think a collection of link would suffice.

mstarsup5

@Fortysix2:

Although I am not at all a fan of Ace from the beginning (I just like his DF, its fucking awesome) I felt bad for him when I read the latest chapter because his life was nothing but a tragedy. So I got kind of nostalgic and started going through chapters from Shaboady Archipelago and I have a slight feeling that Portgas D.Ace could be alive. But I am not really sure about this, next chapter will definitely clarify if Ace is dead for sure or not. But some facts kind of hinted to the fact that Ace might not have died afterall.

Deductions:

1. Why was Kuma in Shaboady during that Tenrobityu incident when there were no orders from Govt.?

Ans: For the first time, it was publicly announced that Ace is going to be executed. Disco-Doflamingo, again on the same day converse over phone and Doflamingo tells him that he has been called to a Shichibukai assembly related to Ace's execution.

So it is highly probable that even kuma came to know about it the same day.

So Kuma realises that if Luffy comes to know about this, he will definitely go to Marineford and will get killed for sure. So he goes to Shaboady to send the mugiwara crew to far off islands.

2. What did he tell Rayleigh?

Ans: That Ace is going to be executed in 10 days and that "Ace-Luffy" are brothers. So I need to send him very far to keep him safe. Rayleigh reacts saying, "Should I believe that nonsense?" because it was posted in papers the same day and it is highly likely that he does not know of it.

3. Why should Rayleigh come and save Ace?

Ans: If Rayleigh knew that Ace was Roger's son from before, Kuma's conversation let him know that he was going to be executed. So he would come to save Ace by default and he had like "7 idle days" after coating the ship to go to marineford.

And if he didn't know, doesn't really matter because Ace's execution has become a famous issue in Shaboady. So he would have heard it from some-one or watched it live himself. Its just that he would have less time for preparation now, but he would put his life on to saving Ace.

So I have a strong feeling that Rayleigh is going to turn-up in Marineford with coated-sunny and save Ace the next chapter. Now don't ask me from where he is going to get expert doctors and stuff but anything is possible in OP world. Ace might become a cyborg…Who knows??

Remember one thing. In one of the chapters, Garp says that it is too tough for Marines to take on "Two-Legends" at the same time. So I guess Rayleigh's entrance is going to turn tables of this war. It is also apt because "Legends" of previous era should lay a path for the "New Era."

Also, Rayleigh is going to play very minor role in the future and his major role has to be this saga because the new-era is starting. And if Rayleigh did not turn up because he did not know that Ace is Roger's son, he will eventually come to know of that fact sometime soon. What kind of a fucked up legend is he who could not save his Sencho's son.

There might be mistakes in this but I guess you understood the basic point behind my rant.

Not very likely, but I like this idea… Also, that would definitely bring an end to Roger/Whitebeard era. And I'd be much happier with Ace alive, and Luffy won't be so destroyed :(((

Fire-Fist

@Aohige_AP:

I don't mind, but I'd think a collection of link would suffice.

okay! i am making it

newone

@Aohige_AP:

I'm getting sick and tired of this whole "Oda said no one dies in his manga" and Ace returning from dead crap.

If you're gonna site something like an interview, make sure you know exactly what was said!
I'm so tired of this crap, I'm gonna go and translate the damn interview from Playboy Oda interview myself.
I'm sure Greg or someone has done it before, but quick search didn't find it, so I'll do mine.

Stay tuned.

Thanks a lot aohige, we all in need of this detail that must be well translate
We're still tuned

maxterdexter

People rather have Pirate/Zombie/Robot Ace than Dead Ace…

People thinking "oh this manga NOW will get dark", that after the woman who was shot in the head because she admited that she had daugthers, the man who blew himself up to not make his son think that he killed him because he ate the poison that he made for him, the little girl who survived her entire island being razed to the ground, and the man who spent 50 years of his life alone in a ship as an undead.

People thinking that Akainu is more of a bastard for taunting and punching the guts out of a pirate than blowing up ships full of civilians.

People thinking that Ace will survive when he himself admited that he "was burned inside", that means that logia rules didn't aply, and that he didn't lose just "most internal organs", but also part of his spine.

People thinking that Oda will revive Ace as the man himself has stated that he won't revive anybody, except Brook, because as we all know, he was already dead (yohohoho)

Fandoms can be so stupid.

And the face, even if it was stupid, it is how Luffy would react. And no, he won't go superpiratehakijin and fuck everyone, he at most will be able to trully punch Akainu once, if he isn't out cold already.

irishpud

@mstarsup5:

You have Aohige's translation some pages back, cnet's on MH, and Steven D. Teach's on first page

Thanks for the help - still dislike the title tho!

LightningAce

@KiShiDo:

I'll wait for the next chapter vefore saying the death is 1oo %

I can't believe a magma punch can kill a NW-tier fighter like Ace in an instant. Jinbei didn't die after the punch and WB as well.

We have seen things in OP who should be 100 % death and the people still live their lifes… So dunno.

The attack went right through him. No one could survive that attack if it pierced through their body. Not even WB

Sick_Fool

@newone:

Thanks a lot aohige, we all in need of this detail that must be well translate
We're still tuned

Well, aren't we a little late? Aohige already posted the translated interview on the previous page.

goty

@maxterdexter:

People rather have Pirate/Zombie/Robot Ace than Dead Ace…

Yeah, that's really really sad. How about scarecrow Ace? Or maybe his head will come back to life in a jar, Luffy can take the head as his new crewmate.

Cyanotic

@maxterdexter:

People rather have Pirate/Zombie/Robot Ace than Dead Ace…

People thinking "oh this manga NOW will get dark", that after the woman who was shot in the head because she admited that she had daugthers, the man who blew himself up to not make his son think that he killed him because he ate the poison that he made for him, the little girl who survived her entire island being razed to the ground, and the man who spent 50 years of his life alone in a ship as an undead.

People thinking that Akainu is more of a bastard for taunting and punching the guts out of a pirate than blowing up ships full of civilians.

People thinking that Ace will survive when he himself admited that he "was burned inside", that means that logia rules didn't aply, and that he didn't lose just "most internal organs", but also part of his spine.

People thinking that Oda will revive Ace as the man himself has stated that he won't revive anybody, except Brook, because as we all know, he was already dead (yohohoho)

Fandoms can be so stupid.

And the face, even if it was stupid, it is how Luffy would react. And no, he won't go superpiratehakijin and fuck everyone, he at most will be able to trully punch Akainu once, if he isn't out cold already.

This is a good post.

And you're right about the spine thing, he should've died instantly, but I'll let it go.

Kishido

@LightningAce:

The attack went right through him. No one could survive that attack if it pierced through their body. Not even WB

Kalifa… :ninja:

Monkey.D.Joeru

@Sick_Fool:

Or worse, Luffy dies because he broke the devil fruit rule.

Zany tangent theory: Luffy's rubberness will prevent him from exploding and luffy will begin hording devil fruits becoming ridiculously powerful One Piece Version of Sylar.:ninja:

Yonkou3

Ace has gone to the yTKzZiNUYJU

korosion

@Aohige_AP:

Dude, that's exactly what I'm annoyed about.

"I think I read somewhere…" "someone on **** said...."

If you want to site a reference, you should research the reference, read the article, and quote it.
Because understanding only half of what was said, is worse than not knowing it in the first place.

I know, I'm trying to find out where it has been said, I'm curently re-reading all the SBS in order to…

LightningAce

@KiShiDo:

Kalifa… :ninja:

explain??? 16 char

tigerlilly

@mstarsup5:

…........... :((((

fIqKWLkm2-g

[hide]yKqIuN8CN4o
:([/hide]

@Aohige_AP:

Not only that, he makes it clear that he doesn't want to kill his characters off precisely because he doesn't think characters should come back to life.

Yes, this is exactly what I'm hoping for. If Oda really has the guts to keep Ace, one of the most popular side characters, dead, this would increase my respect for the series even more. I didn't want Ace to die in the first place, but now that he has actually died, in such a heartwrenching, touching manner that is, don't ruin it by bringing him back to life…

A little easter egg; anybody else realised how Ace's last two expressions resemble the two smilies he wore on his hat? Now I finally understand what they are supposed to symbolise: his struggle for happiness in life.

Fortysix2

@mstarsup5:

Not very likely, but I like this idea… Also, that would definitely bring an end to Roger/Whitebeard era. And I'd be much happier with Ace alive, and Luffy won't be so destroyed :(((

As I said, I am not a fan of Ace but these facts seem to clearly point out the fact that Ace cannot die. I am game for anything. Lets see what happens

blue-san

@Monkey.D.Joeru:

;____; And I wasn't very sympathetic with ace before seeing the scans, Damn you oda ;___________;

What scans there arent any

LightningAce

@Yonkou#3:

Ace has gone to the yTKzZiNUYJU

Did you make that avatar? Because that is just fking awesome

Yonkou3

@LightningAce:

explain??? 16 char

I belive he is refering to this
rbO2MWZ46js

Since lightning bolt through the back should have had the same effect as lava through the back….

Kishido

@LightningAce:

explain??? 16 char

http://media.onemanga.com/mangas/00000002/000128662/10-11.jpg

Sorry for having my doubts after seeing so many people surviving things which aren't to survive…

I really want that Ace is dead... but after all this I have my doubts... and like I said if next chapters he is staying than this is a good thing!

maxterdexter

@Monkey.D.Joeru:

Zany tangent theory: Luffy's rubberness will prevent him from exploding and luffy will begin hording devil fruits becoming ridiculously powerful One Piece Version of Sylar.:ninja:

I liked beter that Blackbeard was the one who could do this because the darkness fruit made the others fruits stop working except one of his choise. That would make him a more powerfull foe.

TsunamiJace

@blue-san:

I on the other hand cant hate a character who is portrayed evil, if he backs it up with actions not just words, characters like Buggy and Spandam on the other hand are annyoing to me

You are dead on. I do not like Akainu but he said something and did it. For that he earns some points. Man this chapter… One piece will never be the same.

Monkey.D.Joeru

@blue-san:

What scans there arent any

I meant the cam raw, sorry to get your hopes up. I was fairly unsympathetic with ace in the spoiler thread but after these pics it's pretty brutally heartwrenching.

Crimz

I hate Akainu! I wish WB, Garp or Marco kills him!

LightningAce

@KiShiDo:

http://media.onemanga.com/mangas/00000002/000128662/10-11.jpg

Sorry for having my doubts after seeing so many people surviving things which aren't to survive…

I really want that Ace is dead... but after all this I have my doubts... and like I said if next chapters he is staying than this is a good thing!

Its a strong attack…but not enuff to kill someone. Maybe it had a stronge effect on her because she was soap bubbles....which is water...

Ace_san_is_awesome

@tigerlilly:

[hide]yKqIuN8CN4o
:([/hide]

Yes, this is exactly what I'm hoping for. If Oda really has the guts to keep Ace, one of the most popular side characters, dead, this would increase my respect for the series even more. I didn't want Ace to die in the first place, but now that he has actually died, in such a heartwrenching, touching manner that is, don't ruin it by bringing him back to life…

A little easter egg; anybody else realised how Ace's last two expressions resemble the two smilies he wore on his hat? Now I finally understand what they are supposed to symbolise: his struggle for happiness in life.

The story-lover in me is saying what you are, that it's a bit of a weak devise to revive lovable characters after they've died just to make it all sugary and sweet. However, the Ace fangirl inside of me is also desperatly hoping that he will not stay dead. God I am so conflicted, though I think the fangirl is winning lol.
As for the hat, I can't believe I didn't notice that! That is so Oda-sensei to throw in symbolism like that! I still love Oda-sensei and One Piece, despite my favorite character being the first (possibly the only…maybe) character to die in the current timeline.

GetsugaZoro

@Yonkou#3:

I belive he is refering to this
rbO2MWZ46js

Since lightning bolt through the back should have had the same effect as lava through the back….

It just gave her a shock she wasnt pierced you can see the same thing on the pacifista battle, her internal organs were shocked not pierced, she even appeared alive without any hole in the belly.

mr.french

Am I one of the few that actually likes this development? I think Oda did a great job with killing Ace.

I'm thinking next chapter, Luffy's emotions will be so strong, that the heavens will crack, as it did between Whitebeard and Shanks.

This chapter means the arc is almost over. Ace is dead, Whitebeard's have lost the war, especially now that Whitebeard himself will die to protect the others. Now it's time for them to leave. There's no reason for them to stay. Not even Luffy. He'd probably want revenge at this point, but his body won't be able to move.

Anticipating a new time-skip in the near future.

Kishido

@LightningAce:

Its a strong attack…but not enuff to kill someone. Maybe it had a stronge effect on her because she was soap bubbles....which is water...

Well if you look closely you can see smoke coming out of her mouth… She is burned from the inside as well...

But like I said... Sorry for havin my doubt after people have people survived bombs, lightning bolts and so on.

Yonkou3

@LightningAce:

Did you make that avatar? Because that is just fking awesome

No, someone on page 11 of the chapter 571 spoiler thread did.

Cyanotic

@GetsugaZoro:

It just gave her a shock she wasnt pierced you can see the same thing on the pacifista battle, her internal orgasm were shocked not pierced, she even appeared alive without any hole in the belly.

Hehe…sorry, couldn't resist.

Robby

"WHEN do you think a man dies?
When his heart is pierced by a bullet from a pistol?
No.
When he succumbs to an incurable disease?
No.
When he drinks soup made with a poisonous mushroom? NO!!!

He dies …when others have forgotten him!! Even though I will soon be gone, my dream will come true. The ailing hearts of the people will be cured!

As long as something is there... to be "passed on"...
A monster will be here soon. He is my son. Do not harm him. {Don't worry, Chopper. Your mushroom... won't kill me.} I'll be damned!! IT WAS ONE HELL OF A LIFE!!!"

GetsugaZoro

@Cyanotic:

Hehe…sorry, couldn't resist.

HAHA wtf been watching too much porn i meant organs ofc

Yonkou3

That was a football sized lightning bolt. It's pure bullshit if you survive it through the spine and out the front of your body. In fact as a rule surviving anything the size of a book or larger piercing your torso is bs. It was bs when it happened to luffy, it was bs vs. kalifa and it would be s if it happened to ace now.

newone

@Sick_Fool:

Well, aren't we a little late? Aohige already posted the translated interview on the previous page.

Yeah i've just read it
this time i think that i'll be convinced
although this'll make the events so sad and bad
but as i said before maybe oda is kidnapped and forced to do it this way
Maybe it's a naruto fool who loves seeing deaths who's the autor

Crossword

A bolt of lighting is intangible. A magma fist is not.

Yonkou3

@robbybedfart:

"WHEN do you think a man dies?
When his heart is pierced by a bullet from a pistol?
No.
When he succumbs to an incurable disease?
No.
When he drinks soup made with a poisonous mushroom? NO!!!

He dies …when others have forgotten him!! Even though I will soon be gone, my dream will come true. The ailing hearts of the people will be cured!

As long as something is there… to be "passed on"...
A monster will be here soon. He is my son. Do not harm him. {Don't worry, Chopper. Your mushroom… won't kill me.} I'll be damned!! IT WAS ONE HELL OF A LIFE!!!"

Oda wasn't lying when he said no one dies in One piece. This is his explanation.

GetsugaZoro

@Yonkou#3:

That was a football sized lightning bolt. It's pure bullshit if you survive it through the spine and out the front of your body. In fact as a rule surviving anything the size of a book or larger piercing your torso is bs. It was bs when it happened to luffy, it was bs vs. kalifa and it would be s if it happened to ace now.

SHe wasnt pierced its was just a shock it didnt destroy anything inside her it only made her unable to battle, atlest as Oda portrayed it ofcourse in other mangas Kalifa would be dead and many others.

LightningAce

@KiShiDo:

Well if you look closely you can see smoke coming out of her mouth… She is burned from the inside as well...

But like I said... Sorry for havin my doubt after people have people survived bombs, lightning bolts and so on.

Internal damage was minor…because it wasn't that strong an attack.

Yonkou#3

No, someone on page 11 of the chapter 571 spoiler thread did.

Oh. But still..brilliant stuff.

Yonkou3

@Crossword:

A bolt of lighting is intangible. A magma fist is not.

Really? That thing that blows shit up and breaks things is intangible?

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.comingbackalive.com/images/cba/people/puzzles2.gif&imgrefurl=http://www.comingbackalive.com/lightning.html&usg=__A_KV_l_L7FhL8kwvf8oeAaYTJs0=&h=244&w=200&sz=39&hl=en&start=1&um=1&itbs=1&tbnid=rpT71Tf0wHajwM:&tbnh=110&tbnw=90&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dlightning%2Bstrike%2Bvictims%26hl%3Den%26um%3D1

Kishido

Ok sorry… he is dead and will stay dead.

Sorry that I have my doubts after reading OP since the beginning and seeing fodder and other surviving stuff which are as cruel as that.

dark knight

top 3 deaths in anime 3.jirahyas death he was a good character a one piece worthy character 2. gokus and vegetas death when vegeta sacraficed himself that was emotional 1. with odas first time trying he has made the saddest death ever in a manga it almost feels real ace deathmade me relise how amazing he is i shedded tears i thought i would never shed i dont no wether to love or hate oda.
vista is proving to be one of the best commanders in whitebeards crew seriously he has actually really been epic marco was ok in this chapter.