Untitled

Buccaneer

Well, I did make a thread. :P

I say all, yes all, of the DB filler was fun, while DBZ…..not so much.

And while I'm on it:

**I've seen practically the entire db anime….
And yhea, Iv'e read the entire db manga.

I love the manga, the anime is a waste of time.

This isn't the first time Romanmack, but I've always thought you watched stuff ENTIRELY for basic plot and character.

Your like those kids that take all the cheese off their pizzas before they eat it.

To Buccaneer: The Buddah statue was some filler thingie that guarded the treasure chest and like shot arrows or something at Bulma and kuririn.

The robot was in the Docking bay.

And theres a filler scene between the db hunt saga and 21rst budokai saga with Bulma and co. crashing their ship in a jungle and a whailing Kuririn runs by and freaks them out. It was both weird and pointless.

I love the 22nd too, but not with drawn out everything.**

I'll just take your word for it, since I seriously haven't seen the anime since it ran on CN. But I actually think the pointless stuff was fun. Reminds me of Slump, with all the random goofiness.

And to be honest, I prefer the DB anime to the manga.

Tony Tony Chopper

DB is far better than DBZ.

The manga was clever
And watching it as in an anime was even better. It was nice to see great work come to life.

Now DBZ, really went off topic. They made it about warriors with supernatural powers trying to save the world from villans. That's the general description where ever you go now for it.

And where exactly do the Dragon Balls come in? The show IS called Dragon Ball Z <_<

But, yes good topic Buc. I'll be dropping by alot now ^^

Buccaneer

DBZ pushed it. By then they were always like "har har, we can use the dragon balls" everytime something happened. Too much reliance.

Tony Tony Chopper

I agree

"The dragonballs can always help us! Now for the wild goose chase"

Like that whole stuff that happened on Namek. That was pretty much the only time they brought up the dragon balls…
And for Garlic Jr. I think too..

I see this topic as Mezease Tenkaiichi is in my head. It now plays in Winamp.

Say what you will, but I love Dragonball to death. When I say "Dragonball" I include Z because that's how Toriyama did it.

I can't say anything bad about it. Probably because it was THE series that got me into anime.

DB being the "Father" of One Piece doesn't hurt either!

Buccaneer

That was the name of the song. I love that song.

I agree Z got most of us into anime. I still like it, but now its flaws seem a bit gaping.

Usopp with a Pushpop

I like DragonBall more than DBZ because in DragonBall, nobody ever spent time "powering up" until the "Goku VS Young Piccolo" battle. They just went ahead and fought! In DBZ, they always spent about 10 mintues "powering up" and shouting like they are trying to crap thier pants.

Green Hair

Yeah, those power ups really went on my nerves. And I just can't understand why people keep saying that DB and DBZ go together naturally. DBZ wasn't even supposed to be made. Toriyama never really planed it. He did it just for the sake of money. And he didn't even participate in the making of DBGT. DBGT was Toriyama's bastard son, so to say. The beginning of DBZ was OK, the story looked promising, but after 200+ episodes and at least ten arcs, it was obvious that there is no plot whatsoever, and story and the characters were going nowhere. Toriyama just kept introducing new characters and villains, and he continuosly ignored the old ones. He just left out all those unique and diverse characters from DB: Yamcha, Oolong, Roshi, Tien, Lunch, Chiaotzu, Bulma… Instead, every new character in DBZ (Frieza, Vegeta, Trunks, Mr. Satan, Androids...) looked the same. They were all just a bunch of super-powered, egoistic megalomaniacs. The fights were repetitive, two guys would start exchanging powerful, flashy techniques and power-ups, and then one would finish the other with the most powerful copy of kamehameha. And that was just about it.

Master Gold Dragon

The original Dragonball was my favorite. The filler was DECENT…mostly but as Bucc up there said the DBZ filler is horrid. DBZ was great too, but the manga was a lot better, because all the filler just SLICED THE HELL OUT OF IT.

Buccaneer

Every episode, without fail, there'd be a "meanwhile." Goku would be fighting Freeza, and we'd suddenly see Chi Chi down on Earth crying about dinner getting cold or something.

Cap'n Carter

Garlic Jr. filler was one of the most hideously stupid things I've ever seen.

sanji-desu

I use to really like Dragon Ball Z, and it was partly the reason why I got into anime. But now when I look back to it I have to be a bit thankful because if I never saw it, then where would I be. Though Dragon Ball is far more fun to watch than DBZ (I actually don't like DBZ that much anymore). I guess I got tired of watching training scenes and screaming for half an hour…

Buccaneer

The Garlic Jr. filler should be considered a hate crime.

Really, I could stand the long power ups. The fights themselves were just bits and pieces of every other fight before it, like Green Hair described.

fight fast fight fast
corny talk about holding back
power up
fight fast, with one leading
more bluffs and power ups
Goku pulls something out of his ass

Solar Knight

I'm probably one of the few people here that liked the Garlic Jr. movie (filler… kinda meh).

I found DB to be better than DBZ for the simple fact it was very light-hearted. I'm not really into sci-fi, but I did originally get into the series through Z (I think it was when they first reached Namek). The thing that struck me as odd was when characters seemed to drop off the face of the earth for several episodes (were was Launch... or was it Lunch?).

Buccaneer

Eh? Return My Gohan/Dead Zone is the only anime film I've bothered to buy.

Zephos

I guess I just hate Toei or something.

neostar8710

well from what i heard..the anime started when the manga was only at chpater 50..and toriyama only released 14 page chapters (much like togashi does now)..so it must've been HELL for the animators. But like others said, it was dbz that got me into manga and everything. But i think one piece is slowly becoming like dbz where its always in danger of fillers and etc and who knows how long one piece will go on. But i think the best anime done battle was this one episdoe of goku vs cell (the one where the ring is destoryed and he does the kameha (sp) right at cell in his face)..i thought that episdoe was amazing. great filler battle. Abnd the fillers in dbz did suck.. but i enjoyed the afterlife tournament actually.. well the final fight newayz.

Buccaneer

The "afterlife" tournament….even that filler had filler, like when Paikon did that one attack like, 60 times.

BTW, OP is kicking ass right now. No filler in sight, and a lot of manga for source.

neostar8710

FOR NOW its goign very good..b/c that anime is smart..where it takes breaks every few episdoes..well yeah..i think it has done well after sky piea..b/c i heard the fillers are really entertaining..sigh..only if naruto could take breaks..>___<

Retro

Ditto on the DragonBall over DBZ, it just had more varitiy and adventure to it and some great jokes to boot. Though I'll admit DBZ was great in some areas such as the Sayian Saga, and the final moments of the Cell games where all of the Z warriors try to help Gohan. Other then that it was charge up, fight, charge up, fight, let the enemy get stronger, get beaten, train, gain more power, fight again till their almost on the brink of losing then win at the last second and move on. The fact that alot of the characters got pushed into the background or dissappered altogether also didn't sit well with me either.

And personally I liked the Garlic Jr. filler, it was the only time the Dragonballs weren't needed on the series as well as the first enemy they couldn't beat just by blasting him to pieces since he was immortal plus we see the lesser fighters finally get their due. Add to the fact its not a long arc and its pretty cool. The only thing I didn't agree on was the invention of Marron (the girlfriend, not Krillen's daughter). Annoying to no end.

sanji-desu

Well I guess the only reason animators start doing fillers is to stop catching up with the manga, so it must be hell at the studios or something XD. I'd think it'd be hard work since you either have to cancel an episode or the magazine has to cancel showing the chapter for a week or two.

Fillers are a problem but what can you do ^^

neostar8710

well they could just wait till the manga has at least 3 arcs done with or w/e and go at a steady pace like naruto does..which is not dragged out b/c it did follow the manag almsot 100% until the tea country arc…b/c i'm sure the mangakas know approximately how long their manga will be..and even if its wildly popular..i'm sure the fans in japan can wait for the manga to be done or w/e knowing that if aniamted too soon, there will be fillers..and i'm sure they dont like fillers that much

sanji-desu

True. It reminds me of how many fillers there will be for One Piece in the future (sort of off topic, but oh well ^^; ). Though if Naruto fillers are bad then how come they were on the charts?

neostar8710

i dont think naruto is bad..BUT ppl constantly whine and say how dragged out the anime is and etc..so i defend naruto saying it was exactly like the manga up till the tea arc..and i enjoy naruto fillers much more than one piece..i havent seen g8 or w/e yet…but i prefer naruto fillers b/c..like i was so use to watchign dragged out dbz with fillers..so i find naruto a relief as well as one piece

Solar Knight

Originally posted by Buccaneer@Jul 9 2005, 01:56 PM
Eh? Return My Gohan/Dead Zone is the only anime film I've bothered to buy.
[snapback]85987[/snapback]

Didn't by it. Saw it on CN when I was young (I have it taped somewhere…).

Akira

I couldn't find all of the DB subbed, So I just got the Dubbed uncut sagas. Pretty good, But I still prefer DB over Z because of some comedy and because I loved the fights and villains.. I remeber the first time I saw Piccolo Daimao I was totally obsessed for a while. Until I saw the Last tournament. That blew me away, Watching it and reading it.. The episode that I loved was with Murasaki in the Muscle tower, When he was hiding from Goku and when goku pours hot water down the reed-pipe. Dbz is just too intense, I really liked the whole Vegeta Saga, but I thought that the freeza saga was the worst saga in the series, even though it gave way to goku getting the Super saiyan powers, It was just too much fighting and everything..Bleh.

Slowymobile

i watched dragonball gt when i was lyk really young id say about 5ish (it as in chinese) and i loved it, haha. then i watched DBZ (english dubbed) when i was about 10ish and i found it good :lol: (Buu saga kicked ass!)
i dont see why everyone bags it out when most anime artists nowadays have Akira Toriyama as their idol <_<

Buccaneer

DBGT wasn't out when you were 5. :P

People bag on it because it seems as if the students have surpassed the teacher.

Zephos

Originally posted by Buccaneer@Jul 9 2005, 01:56 PM
**The "afterlife" tournament….even that filler had filler, like when Paikon did that one attack like, 60 times.

BTW, OP is kicking ass right now. No filler in sight, and a lot of manga for source.
[snapback]86030[/snapback]**

Don't hold your breath.

The anime is like in Volume 36 right?
And the mangas in Vol.39.
Not good.

2 volumes ahead in a single storyline.
Better call Maaco.

Buccaneer

When you look at it like that. However, episode 238 just aired, going up to chapter 337 at most. The manga is at 373. That's 36 whole chapters, at least 25 episodes. If they finished only up to 250 at a time, they'd just be getting to "Bingo," probably. Add in a few no-anime breaks and I'd say it's gonna be just fine.

joekido the Second

I really don't like much of DBZ even without fillers. There is too much figthing, No actual character development, no deep emotions, no general storyline. DBZ was nothing but buch of angery people with rare expression, screaming and showing off powers and matrial arts, villians with same personally and only though on killing, lame training and horrible loads of timeskip.

DB is good enough, Toriyama should had ended his series at the end of the Piccolo jr. arc. DBZ was all downhill for him.

I'll choose Oda as my role model because he actully wrote the story, he actully gave characters unique personally, he actully made the story historic, paotic, literery, emotional, general, and has a actual plot.

Well we all know that without Toriyama alot of manga would have not took flight. I still love Dragonball Z and still take lessons from his art to make my story. In other words I still consider Toriyama as kinda like a role model. Of course Oda is cool too and I consider him a role model as well, but you can't just knock Toriyama to the curve and say his story is'nt interesting just like that. That's kinda like abandoning him which is pretty sad.

neostar8710

i totally agree with you..and i did like Z..it was impressive even though he did want it to end that he managed to make a great story such as the cell saga (which had the most twists in my opinion) and the buu saga.

Green Hair

God, I hated the Cell saga. Ten super-strong men fights against Cell, but he wipes them off like dirt. In the end, Gohan beats him using only one arm. <_< And then Mr. Satan takes all the credit. Boy, was that lame.

Zephos

Joekiddo…...have you actually seen DBZ?

Caracal

DBZ introduced me to anime and manga. However I do prefer DB over DBZ. I like the fact DB has a more mystical sense to it. The fights are better because they don't need the ten hours of powering up. Goku vs Jackie Chun and Goku vs Piccolo Jr are two of my favourite fights.

For the record, Akira wanted to end the series at the Freiza saga, making fans wonder if Goku was dead or alive. It was fan pressure that made him make the Cell saga. Again he wanted to end it there, this time with Gohan as the hero. Fans wanted more so the Buu saga was made. Originally Akira wanted Gohan to save the day but fans wanted Goku to be the hero so that was changed.

As for lack of character development I personally disagree slightly. Gohan, Vegeta and possibly Piccolo change though out the series. Gohan starts off as a weak little boy who's scared of his shadow. Even after a year of training he still hasn't matured. Piccolo's death makes him grow up a bit more and his training with his father adds more to his character, though it also makes him a bit cocky. By the end of the Buu saga he is considered to be the strongest non-fused fighter. Vegeta starts the series as an utter bastard but as time goes on he slowly learns to accept other people and have children. Piccolo is the same, especally the way he looks after Gohan. for example in the Cell saga, he wants to save Gohan from Cell while Goku just wants to stand there. Yes, the character development may not be perfect but it is there if you look hard enough (in my opinion any way).

As for GT, some nice ideas on paper but when turned into an anime, it's a load of shit.

Zephos

Remember.
We wouldn't have One Piece without Dragonball guys.

Originally posted by Zephos@Jul 10 2005, 05:55 PM
Remember.
We wouldn't have One Piece without Dragonball guys.
[snapback]86698[/snapback]

Exactlly what I'm trying to tell em! The whole Dragonball legacy (EXCLUDING GT! :P )
is the start of all action shonen anime and manga. And since lots of Mangaka look at Toriyama as a role model, there's no denying that the WHOLE Dragonball story (AGAIN, excluding GT! :P ) is an epic one!

Caracal

_Originally posted by Zephos+Jul 10 2005, 05:55 PM–>QUOTE(Zephos @ Jul 10 2005, 05:55 PM)Remember.
We wouldn't have One Piece without Dragonball guys.

Exa…._

joekido the Second

Originally posted by Zephos@Jul 10 2005, 01:58 PM
Joekiddo…...have you actually seen DBZ?
[snapback]86586[/snapback]

Yes, I have seen some DBZ episode, I had research them on internet, I have two DBZ manga. Theofore I began to learn about fillers and the real story, I also read other DBZ manga and I know much about how DBZ went out.

You want to hear a little story? I went to the mall last year and bougth a DBZ manga, I was with my friend to see a movie. When my friends and I sat in the theater the wait for the start was long, one of my friend asked me if he could read my manga I bougth.

I passed to him and one minute later he tossed it back; I asked him what he thinks of it and he said it was boring.

Later I asked him to elobrate his opition, he told me that all he saw was to much figthing, anger, talking, screaming and no story. He told me that he wanted stories that have general basic, deep storyline, differant emotions, personal development, history, differant genre. At frist I was discourge by that, but after reading more DBZ manga I had to agree with that he's rigth. DBZ is boring.

Originally posted by joekido the Second+Jul 10 2005, 07:14 PM–>QUOTE(joekido the Second @ Jul 10 2005, 07:14 PM)

Zephos

Were One Piece fans Joekiddo.
If some twerp picked up Vol.2 and 3 and wrote One Piece off as "stupid fighting clown shit." I know you'd be mad at em.

neostar8710

well he does have a pt..BUT there is character development such as vegeta and piccolo. they def had the most development. as did gohan. and there wasnt REALLY that much fighting. i mean it decreased. b/c dragonball had more hand to hand fighting..but there def was a story..and i think akira did a hell of a job..b/c you have to remember..he didnt WANT to do dragonball afterthe frieza saga..ffor someone who didnt want to continue drawing manga did sure of a good job

joekido the Second

Oh, I see your point Neostar and Zephos, then why is everyone else say "OP is better then that shitty DBZ manga/anime"? I like One Piece, but do I have to like DBZ? Sure DBZ have good points, it would be nice if Toriyama put more effort in his series but he did not. Like I said I saw the manga and I all I see is figthing and anger and sweating guys so how is it?

neostar8710

well I dont care what you think, and i agree, OP is better than dbz and stuff, but you have to remmebr that dbz prob inspired oda to creat his materpiece today. and i thought toriyama did good enough work b/c he didnt want to draw after frieza and his drawings were well done i thought. but who cares what EVERYONE thinks anyways. everyone said BOBOBO is so funny and good, i read it and didnt like it at all..so w/e. you're entitled to your own opnion. i'm just stating mine and w/e

silver griffin girl

Even though I do agree that OP is better than DBZ, I have to give it some credit, after all, it was one of my first Animes. And even though I'm not nearly as interested in it as I was when I was younger, I still think it is pretty good, but not the best, and it brings back some good memories when I watch it. (Crowd: aww, or vomit, you choose)

OK, I just needed to voice my opinion. Don't hurt me for it.

Master Gold Dragon

Actually Toriyama wanted to end the series after Goku defeated Frieza. He wanted Goku to die on Namek after becomming the Legendary Super Saiyan.

But…it was so popular that he was forced to continue. He did create some good ideas brining back the Red Ribbon Army and super powerful androids but Buu was just too predictable...too boring. And GT ruined everything.

Ivotas

Back in the days, I was a huge DragonBall/DBZ fan. But even then I thought that DBZ better had ended after the Namek Saga. Though I enjoyed it a much this saga was already pushing it a bit for me with first having a super strong Piccolo (obviously stronger then Vegeta), then a short while later having a super strong Vegeta (whoÂ´s then obviously stronger then Piccolo) and in the end we have a super strong Goku whoÂ´s stronger then both of them together. It was just stretching the fighting. But none the less I loved this sage.

However DBZ went straight downhill from there on. What came next? Androids build by a human scientist who are a lot stronger then super saiyajinÂ´s, the dudes that defeated Frieza the strongest man in the universe? Very logic. And only a short while afterwards this androids arenÂ´t even the real threat but it is another human technology creation…Cell. And then itÂ´s the exact same thing as in the Namek saga. Cell is strong and in the meantime the heroes train hard to match the androids, then when they could be on one level with them Cell aborbs one and gets stronger now itÂ´s more working out for the heroes. Now a hero (Vegeta) is stronger then Cell so he has to become perfect to once again be superior. He becomes perfect Cell and yet again none of the heroes is powerful enough to match him so itÂ´s back to the drawing board...IÂ´m sorry...to the "gym" again. How annoying and totally uncreative. And donÂ´t get me even started on the entire Buu crap where itÂ´s the same thing only with FusionÂ´s this time. :rolleyes:

DragonBall on the other part was very enjoyable. It was about a little boy who went out to see the world. It was a beautiful story that was fun to watch/read and it should have ended when the boy became a man.

Other then that I prefered the manga much over the anime quite obviously because of the fact that the fighting scenes (especially in DBZ) where stretched to much. In One Piece no fight requires that much time. The fight with Crocodile is the perfect example. Luffy fights Crocodile in episode 110, the second fight is in ep 122 and the final fight takes place between episodes 124 and 126. And the best thing is that unlike DBZ these episodes have another plot running at the same time so you donÂ´t see just too long stretched fighting scene.

Caracal

Originally posted by joekido the Second@Jul 11 2005, 05:37 AM
Oh, I see your point Neostar and Zephos, then why is everyone else say "OP is better then that shitty DBZ manga/anime"? I like One Piece, but do I have to like DBZ? Sure DBZ have good points, it would be nice if Toriyama put more effort in his series but he did not. Like I said I saw the manga and I all I see is figthing and anger and sweating guys so how is it?
[snapback]86844[/snapback]

Have you ever read the original DragonBall? I personally felt that Akira did put alot of effort into the series.

As for the series ending when it should have, in all honesty I'm iffy on that. While I do agree it would have been a good ending, I do like Gohan the most, and the Cell saga did allow him to become the hero. With the Saiyan and Namek/Freiza saga, he never really had that. He was just some kid who apparently had a large amount of power that was, in my opinion, hardly touched. If it did end there, I felt it would have wasted that potential. But on the other hand I do agree that the Cell and Buu sagas didn't do the series much justice.