I agree that the first half felt slow and meandering. Second have makes up for it though.
Star Wars Universe - Resurrection F
-
-
! The issue isn't that it's just slow and meandering, it's who gives a shit. The characters just…sucked. I just had no emotional investment in them. Especially Jyn who was easily the worst of the bunch. Rey so easily blew her out the water in terms of charisma, charm, intimidation etc. Jyn sees her friends die in front of her and can do nothing but react with a blank stare on her face. The robot I liked. The Asians had potential but were completely underdeveloped. The pilot I was completely indifferent too. The other lead murdered a guy in coldblood for no reason so there's my investment in him gone. Plus his awful fake Antionio Banderas accent was so distracting.
! The first half is just this aimless thing of going one random location to the next. Jynn finds her former savior who proceeds to die in the next five minutes without ever really sharing any screentime with him to build their connection. Also for a hard core extremist dedicated to the cause, he sure gave up on life quick. She finds her dad who dies in her arms and again it is so hard to care due to the lack of screentime they shared together (not to mention Jones's terrible acting). I was really done with the movie at that point. It's a testament to that fantastic third act that got me so invested again. Just seeing the nameless try so hard to work together and save the galaxy got me far more invested and emotionally. It was great visual story-telling, amazing effects combined with a lot of quick scenes of normal people working together and sacrificing their lives, being parts of a whole to help win the war. And even then, it was undermined by every scene of the Rogue One dying one by one. Because I see them die and all I can think is...God I wish I cared about you , I really do because the balls of killing your cast and the delivery and the visuals are just so good, it just makes that first half so much more infuriating. So yes you can say the second half makes up for but at the same time the second half is letdown because of the first half. Man I'd have been satisfied paying full price if you cut out the rest and just gave me those 45 minutes in theater. -
@TLC:
! Plus his awful fake Antionio Banderas accent was so distracting.
I haven't seen the movie in English, but Diego Luna is Mexican and actually has an accent.
-
@TLC:
! The other lead murdered a guy in coldblood for no reason so there's my investment in him gone. Plus his awful fake Antionio Banderas accent was so distracting.
! I liked that he offed that guy. It showed another side to the rebellion and how far they would be willing to go. Also, what was wrong with his accent?! Sounded normal to me.
-
! I liked that he offed that guy. It showed another side to the rebellion and how far they would be willing to go. Also, what was wrong with his accent?! Sounded normal to me.
! The problem is the framing since we're clearly supposed to root for the rebellion no questions asked, the empire is evil, our guys are good. It was a very black and white movie so having one of our "good" guys casually murder a panicking man for no reason was distracting and made the character pretty irredeemable.
! Also I just found the accent too thick and distracting. Constantly interjecting h sounds with his w's. Hwat are you doing? Hwere are you going? It's the most fake authentic Mexican accent I've ever heard. -
Yeah shame on the guy for speaking with the accent of his native country.
-
I actually really liked all the characters. I think the problem is that it was made it to feel like a prequel to larger franchise (which is exactly what it is) But we don't get to continue on beyond it to really dig deeper into their development; it was like we were just introduced to them but they have a lot more potential. I could see a lot of tie-in material fleshing them out a lot more, like with Saw Gerrera coming to Rebels.
-
@TLC:
! The problem is the framing since we're clearly supposed to root for the rebellion no questions asked, the empire is evil, our guys are good. It was a very black and white movie so having one of our "good" guys casually murder a panicking man for no reason was distracting and made the character pretty irredeemable.
! My take was we were supposed to see the darker and less heroic side of the rebellion. Cassian's actions, their willingness to assassinate Galen Erso despite their new information, and then their loss of hope and the will to fight all showed a side of the rebellion I don't think we've seen before. Yes, they were still the good guys… but they had to do some questionable things in their struggle against the Empire. As for Cassian himself, he was a morally gray soldier/spy that had been surrounded by war most of his life. I'd say he redeemed himself in the end by volunteering for the suicide mission that ultimately led to the destruction of the first death star.
-
Rogue One was a solid Star Wars movie, a good start for the standalone experiment
-
@Purple:
Yeah shame on the guy for speaking with the accent of his native country.
And doubling down on it being fake even after being told it's not.
-
I'm with CosmicDebris, I really enjoyed all the characters.
! While the first half was a little weaker, the movie did manage to successfully make me invest into the characters. With some, like the pilot or the blind Asian guy and K2, I just really enjoyed them immediately. Must have been the actors' charisma or something, they just all had such a likable quality to them. Each death hit me pretty hard, especially when it slowly became apparent that not a single one of them would survive.
@TLC:
! > The problem is the framing since we're clearly supposed to root for the rebellion no questions asked, the empire is evil, our guys are good. It was a very black and white movie so having one of our "good" guys casually murder a panicking man for no reason was distracting and made the character pretty irredeemable.
! How are we clearly supposed to root for the rebellion no questions asked when there are multiple scenes, including one of the main characters murdering somebody in the beginning of the movie, that paint a darker picture of the rebels. The empire certainly is evil, but I disagree that it was a very black and white movie. There was a lot more grey in it than usual in a Star Wars movie. And it certainly didn't make the character irredeemable…what kind of atrocities do you think people commit for the greater good in a state of war like this in RL? The whole purpose of that scene was to build up his character as someone willing to do the dirty work, thus making the later scene of him struggling to kill Jyn's father and finally deciding to spare him a bigger turning point for the character. And then he does in fact redeem himself by sacrificing his own life for the greater good in the end. -
lol about the accent thing. I've lived among a large population of Mexicans my whole life, bra you ain't heard thick accents.
I'm glad that they opted to let him use his natural accent. The amount of diversity in this film compared to Star Wars movies of the past (sans fake aliens) is impressive. http://remezcla.com/features/film/diego-luna-rogue-one-star-wars-historic-role-latino-actor/
-
You mean…Donnie Yen, Forest Whitaker, and that former imperial pilot guy were not faking goofy accents just for fun?! And here I thought they were just being whimsically hilarious for hilarity sake with those accents.
-
If there's a planet of people with New Zealand accents (random Mandalorian planet), then there's a planet of people with Mexican accents.
-
! How are we clearly supposed to root for the rebellion no questions asked when there are multiple scenes, including one of the main characters murdering somebody in the beginning of the movie, that paint a darker picture of the rebels. The empire certainly is evil, but I disagree that it was a very black and white movie. There was a lot more grey in it than usual in a Star Wars movie. And it certainly didn't make the character irredeemable…what kind of atrocities do you think people commit for the greater good in a state of war like this in RL? The whole purpose of that scene was to build up his character as someone willing to do the dirty work, thus making the later scene of him struggling to kill Jyn's father and finally deciding to spare him a bigger turning point for the character. And then he does in fact redeem himself by sacrificing his own life for the greater good in the end.
! The problem is that this character arc isn't earned at all. Jyn and Carlissian have poor chemistry and barely interacted at all so his decision to spare her father was very unbelievable. His big turning point of standing behind her on her plan to get the Death Star plans is similarly unbelievable when the exact previous scene before this they were fighting over their methods and parted on awful terms with Jyn hating the extreme methods of the rebellion and Carlissian defending them. Yet….the exact next scene after this, Jyn is totally for the rebellion and and Carlissian is totally behind her crazy plan that puts the rebellion at risk? Did the editors drop an important scene somewhere where they actually talk and make peace? As such, the whole "the rebellion does whatever it needs to do for the galaxy no matter how dirty" never gels into a cohesive theme, it's just this half assed thing they put into the movie without ever committing to it. Like none of the other characters or the rebellion as a whole are ever put into a position in the final act where they have to sacrifice innocent civilians or do something dirty and deplorable for the sake of the whole, the most they did was sacrifice themselves which is framed as something noble (which it was) but not deplorable. So Carlissian's random act of murder remains that, a random act of murder. Like we couldn't have the guy about to shoot him like they did with Han Solo? You can keep the grungy do whatever is necessary aspect without making our main character look like a psychopath. So yes, I get the POINT of the random murder but it wasn't executed or connected well to the movie IMO so it just makes the character an iredeemable jackass who kills for no reason.
-
-
i prefer the Half in the Bag review. Think they get their points across better.
Actually, given RLM's feelings on the movie, I feel like Rogue One would have benefitted from tearing it apart scene by scene like the prequels were done, to allow people to better understand their issues. The Plinkett review feels premature.
–- Update From New Post Merge ---
And apologies if this has been posted before. Avoided the thread for spoiler reasons and haven't backtracked to see the overall opinion on the film.
Half in the Bag Rogue One
!
-
The Kylo Ren review is the best. (spoilers)
-
Carrie Fischer has unfortunately passed away.
-
Actually, given RLM's feelings on the movie, I feel like Rogue One would have benefitted from tearing it apart scene by scene like the prequels were done, to allow people to better understand their issues. The Plinkett review feels premature.
We're probably never getting that again. People hated the prequels and had years to stew on them, and for a long time they were the only Star Wars. (And the reviews had the point to make that the faws were far deeper than Jar Jar which everyone points to… they barely even mention him.) They were half the entire franchise. Now there's going to be a new one every year, good or bad, and that lessens the weight of there being a bad one now.
Similarly, its hard to tear into a movie if you don't really feel it. Their episode 7 review was half about the prequels still. And they still haven't gotten around to doing things like Dark Knight, and their Avatar review was completely half-hearted and before it even hit DVD. They got sudden fame and exposure with the Episode 1 review, and the popularity of that forced them to do 2 and 3... but they're probably not going to spends months and months on a project of that scale again anytime soon.
-
Fair enough. Shame given, unlike episode 7, I feel like they would have stuff to say about this film. Episode 7 RLM's biggest gripe was that it copied the story for a New Hope, but that's about it. Rogue One has them not really liking the characters and story too much, to the point where I think they could nitpick the movie and have enough material/issues with Rogue One to make a full hour long analysis of the film.
I agree it's not something they should force if their hearts aren't in it.
Apparently though the next Nostalgia Critic review is Rogue One with Chris Stuckmann as a guest and Chris while a Star Wars fan that liked the film, had a review more in line with RLM's take on it.
I personally liked it. I was really only bothered by Saw Gererra's final scene (even before RLM pointed out it's silliness). Thought the rest of the cast was likable enough, though I have not picks here/there about the characters/story.
-
well, once there's just a metric shitton of Star Wars films, people really will stop caring about the prequels, thankfully. Like, NO ONE ever harps on how bad some of the James Bond films are. There's 30 of the things spanning decades with a new one every couple years, so there's nothing to get in a fuss about.
SW being a once in a lifetime event, and the prequels being "all that will ever be made in the movies" is what elevated the prequels so high and tainted the brand so much. (In a way the Ewok movies never did.)
It'll eventually be the same here, hopefully.
-
well, once there's just a metric shitton of Star Wars films, people really will stop caring about the prequels, thankfully. Like, NO ONE ever harps on how bad some of the James Bond films are. There's 30 of the things spanning decades with a new one every couple years, so there's nothing to get in a fuss about.
Besides Spectre and Writing On The Wall you mean.
-
(In a way the Ewok movies never did.)
Battle for Endor is still one of the darkest things to come out of the franchise, which is pretty impressive after Revenge of the Sith and Rogue One came out.
-
Two things bugged me about the climax on planet Jedha:
! They had Jyn save the little girl from being crushed, only for her and her mom to be presumably vaporized along with the rest of the city. Yeah, real feel good moment right there. That said, how did Evazan and Ponda Baba, the guys Luke and Ben fight in the cantina and who make a cameo on Jedha, survive? Probably flew off before the blast, sure, but that's a pretty weak coincidence to me.
-
Two things bugged me about the climax on planet Jedha:
! They had Jyn save the little girl from being crushed, only for her and her mom to be presumably vaporized along with the rest of the city. Yeah, real feel good moment right there. That said, how did Evazan and Ponda Baba, the guys Luke and Ben fight in the cantina and who make a cameo on Jedha, survive? Probably flew off before the blast, sure, but that's a pretty weak coincidence to me.
! I have no problem with that. Jyn had no idea that was going to happen. Life is just shitty like that sometimes. An EMT might save someone's life after a heart attack only for them to die in a freak car accident the next day. But who knows, maybe they got on a ship and left the planet right after that, clearly some people did….
I'm gonna guess those two guys being there wasn't just a coincidence. -
! I have no problem with that. Jyn had no idea that was going to happen. Life is just shitty like that sometimes. An EMT might save someone's life after a heart attack only for them to die in a freak car accident the next day. But who knows, maybe they got on a ship and left the planet right after that, clearly some people did….
I'm gonna guess those two guys being there wasn't just a coincidence.! The problem is that it doesn't seem the writers were thinking that way. They didn't bother to call back to it and didn't seem to have Jyn fazed by it at all. If that was their intention, they could have shown some of the citizens like the girl and mother looking up just before the blast hits, or have Jyn quickly flash back to the girl when Chirrut and Baze are talking about the city being gone. The only way it makes an impact in that way is if the viewer happens to remember, Oh yeah, there were children in that city, weren't there? And that's what bugs me, how it's only the viewer that is impacted by that thought and seemingly not Jyn, who's supposed to be the character we care about but who just seems heartlessly unconcerned in this case.
! And by coincidence, I just meant that those two happened to take off in the few hours span span between when we saw them and the beam hit. I know that they probably did, but it's still way too convenient timing on their part. The R1 crew were far away enough to fly away in time, but anyone still in the city was gone in an instant, including the girl and mother who certainly didn't look like they were planning to fly.And there's another plot point that made me slap my head:
! Cassian is supposed to shoot Jyn's father but doesn't have the heart to, fair enough. But WHY does he never consider shooting Krennic the Empire general standing just two feet away? He had just as clear a shot and everything, he even had him in his viewfinder the whole time. I know they weren't his orders, but you'd think seeing a top-ranking Empire guy, he might be just a little tempted. Half the lives lost during this battle probably wouldn't have been had he just aimed a few inches to the right.
-
Saw it last night.
There are two easy signs that this wasn't a great Star Wars movie. One is that the "I've got a bad feeling about this line," while amusingly interrupted, came going into very clear danger with low survival odds like it often did in the prequels, as opposed to going into uncertainty where the threat isn't obvious yet. Interrupting the line helps, but the movie still lacks the self-awareness to answer it with a "No shit, Sherlock."
The other sign was immediately apparent in the first ten minutes when we saw about four different planets in quick succession. Bad Star Wars movies tend to use different planetary settings as a facsimile for world holding and often fall into the trap of One Objective per Planet. Eido, for instance, housed the designers of the Death Star but not the plans, for some reason. We see virtually nothing of the planet itself since the entire trip is spent on a ridge and landing platform. A smarter use of the planet would have been to combine it with Scarif on the other side and gift the team with an Imperial shuttle earlier. The incredibly weak writing after the title card would have benefited from combining all those disparate events onto one planet, possibly Jeddha. Desert Planet/Wretched Hive of Scum and Villainy #3 was probably the best offering of naturally-evolving adventure, even if it revolved around the poorly resolved Saw Gerrera plot. Excessive planethopping doesn't always correlate with poor quality, but it does break up the feel of an organic adventure.
As plenty of others have noticed, the movie also fails to establish just about anyone's character or offer consistent character arcs. The best way I can think to describe it is that it falls into the Suicide Squad trap of quickly stating each character's backstory once and occasionally giving them a personality trait. It cheapens what should otherwise be powerful moments when each of them die. (Side note, is it coincidence that only one dies to blasters while half are killed by grenades?) The biggest irritation, though, is one that Jyn's and Cassian's characters both make pretty significant backtracks with inspiring the rebels and not intentionally killing Galen. Cassian's change I can excuse since it was just poorly executed and makes sense with a bit of inference, but Jyn goes from goes from hating Cassian and, theoretically, by extension, the Rebellion to going all-in on their purpose and standing up for their message. It's not at all consistent and makes her corny speech even more grating.
On the plus side, the action was mostly excellent and included some awesome if impractical maneuvers. The acting was fine despite there not being much to go on, the sets were all pretty good, and I though the final scene or two were excellent. Other nitpicks I have include lapses in logic like the elastic number of extras they fit on that shuttle or the extraordinarily nonsensical lighting in space at points. Everything else has already been covered.
-
I saw it today. When I first heard that the title was going to be Rogue One I was expecting something more akin to Top Gun in space like the X-Wing books rather than an adaptation of the Dark Forces game in disguise.
! I actually enjoyed it a lot more than The Force Awakens largely on the basis that it did not turn the Original Trilogy into a shaggy dog story. It was certainly one of the darker stories to come out of the franchise aside from the New Jedi Order-era-and-beyond novels, but it was done in a more tasteful manner, and I appreciated the more grounded look and feel to the setting. The movie had its problems ranging from minor (the clown car shuttle, Donnie Yen's takedown of the TIE fighter was silly and being reminiscent of a notorious panel from the old X-Wing comics of a Wookiee destroying one by hitting it with a tree branch as it passes), to more major (bad pacing in the beginning, Saw - I was seriously surprised to see that he was played by Forest Whitaker considering how bad the performance was, and the fact that I could barely remember any of the main group's names outside of Jyn and Cassian - Chirrut is just "Donnie Yen" and I was surprised to learn that "The Big Guy with the Big Gun" was even given a name), but darn it, I actually had fun watching it throughout the whole thing, which is more than what I can say about the new trilogy's opening act.
! Also, while I get that it was kind of the point, Krennic was a rather lame antagonist, getting constantly shat on by his superiors the entire movie. -
We've got a mid-season trailer for Star Wars Rebels season 3:
! James Arnold Taylor or whoever is voicing old Obi-Wan nailed it.
-
I must admit that the trailer felt slightly underwhelming compared to previous ones…but I'm excited to see Thrawn in a bigger action role and also, yeah, the last scene.
-
I haven't read all the spoilers in your comments yet, but:
! I'm not alone in thinking that the tentacle monster mind-raping the pilot guy, to have him be crazy for a while, only to eventually have his insanity fade away was pretty fucking dumb right?
-
I haven't read all the spoilers in your comments yet, but:
! I'm not alone in thinking that the tentacle monster mind-raping the pilot guy, to have him be crazy for a while, only to eventually have his insanity fade away was pretty fucking dumb right?
I agree with you on that.
! This movie also had a bunch of different cuts and reworked scenes too didn't it? Maybe it was supposed to be more prominent.
-
Went and saw Rogue One today. It was pretty good though it looked like they CGd certain characters.
-
Went and saw Rogue One today. It was pretty good though it looked like they CGd certain characters.
They did. Both Tarkin and young Leia are CGI.
-
CGI Carrie Fisher is even more unsettling a week later.
-
! I'm not alone in thinking that the tentacle monster mind-raping the pilot guy, to have him be crazy for a while, only to eventually have his insanity fade away was pretty fucking dumb right?
! This movie also had a bunch of different cuts and reworked scenes too didn't it? Maybe it was supposed to be more prominent.
! The whole first segment with Bodhi was definitely added after rewrites; we know that much but not how far it extended. It's possible that his original first appearance onscreen was when he was already in the cell next to the cast and they wanted some reason for him to be slightly out of it.
-
I don't really know much about the Rebels show, but the use of the term "Darksaber" in that trailer got a Sensible Chuckle out of me.
On a related note, from the summaries I've read I don't have much interest in the new EU, but I might be tempted to check out Thrawn (seriously, why have most of the books been stuck with these boring one-word titles ever since the start of Legacy of the Force?!) later in the year to see what Zahn's able to do with the new setting since the Heir to the Empire trilogy was the backbone that so much of the franchise's world-building built off of even into the new Disney era, and to see if he can write a new backstory for Thrawn that doesn't completely rehash his old one. A shame that he'll never be able to write that story about Luke, Mara, and Ben that he wanted to now, though.
-
! The whole first segment with Bodhi was definitely added after rewrites; we know that much but not how far it extended. It's possible that his original first appearance onscreen was when he was already in the cell next to the cast and they wanted some reason for him to be slightly out of it.
! This makes me worried that there's a director's cut out there ala BvS where they have all of the important moments of character development and they just decided to keep even more Bodi story out…
-
! This makes me worried that there's a director's cut out there ala BvS where they have all of the important moments of character development and they just decided to keep even more Bodi story out…
They didn't cut material in that case but added it to explain who the guy was and how he got there.
-
I'm not really sure what to think of Rogue One.
! The action was good and some little references/vader tearing shit up at the end was pretty sweet.
! The characters were largely undeveloped though and I outright disliked the main female character (I forget her name).
! It was kinda hard to get worked up during the finale where everyone was dying when I had absolutely no investment in any of them. -
The movie could've been streamlined if they removed Saw Gerrera. Yeah, it's a tie into the cartoon, but we really didn't need his involvement in the plot and the extra stories that tie into his character, especially given where they end up taking his character's story. Any Star Wars fans of the show really happy about the tie in?
Also, say what you will about Felicity Jones and Jyn Erso, I feel like her reactions to certain things are on par with Luke and Leia's reactions to certain events in a New Hope.
-
Just rewatched Greivous introduction episode from the 2003 Clone Wars series. He was so much more awesome back then. Til someone went and turned him into the incompetent separatist General come episode 3 and the newer clone wars series. It's disappointing to say the least.
-
Just rewatched Greivous introduction episode from the 2003 Clone Wars series. He was so much more awesome back then. Til someone went and turned him into the incompetent separatist General come episode 3 and the newer clone wars series. It's disappointing to say the least.
The cartoon Clone Wars always bothered me because of how ridicolously overpowered everyone was. But Grievous was definetly incredibly awesome, I also hate what they did with him. I remember in 6th grade when I told all my buddies when we were to go see Episode III that Grievous was going to kick some serious ass and then my heart just sank. Fortunately, he got to shine in Battlefront II.
-
Just rewatched Greivous introduction episode from the 2003 Clone Wars series. He was so much more awesome back then. Til someone went and turned him into the incompetent separatist General come episode 3 and the newer clone wars series. It's disappointing to say the least.
Supposedly Lucas always intended for him to be the incompetent separatist general we saw in Episode III. It's just that the people behind the 2003 Clone Wars series saw his design and were like "Okay, this guy is clearly going to be a super huge threat!" and portrayed him accordingly.
-
The cartoon Clone Wars always bothered me because of how ridicolously overpowered everyone was. But Grievous was definetly incredibly awesome, I also hate what they did with him. I remember in 6th grade when I told all my buddies when we were to go see Episode III that Grievous was going to kick some serious ass and then my heart just sank. Fortunately, he got to shine in Battlefront II.
To be fair, Doku was also not the threatening guy we saw in Episode II as well.
-
The 2008 Clone Wars reached a middle-ground with Grievous. He's not the smartest person on Team Sith (though is capable of some strategic genius) and has a strong sense of self-preservation, but in personal combat he's an absolute monster.
-
Woody Harrelson confirmed for the Young Han Solo movie his role is not known yet.
-
@Cyan:
The 2008 Clone Wars reached a middle-ground with Grievous. He's not the smartest person on Team Sith (though is capable of some strategic genius) and has a strong sense of self-preservation, but in personal combat he's an absolute monster.
I guess when Sidious sends his people he's not sending his best….especially if we remember what happened to Maul in Phantom Menace, the Stormtroopers, and the incompetent hacks who got their shit pushed in Endor.