Well, that sucks. The only way I can see them resolving this is to create a new series or for the editors to decide they need to do something with PCP to make it more anime-adaptable (but the latter probably won't happen as they addressed in this chapter). I guess we've still got a ways to go. I'm sure Bakuman will probably get to chapter 120 at least.
Bakuman
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He could team up with Homewreaker making a perfect rival triangle
FUCK NOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!! (goddamn fucking homewrecker has to team up with Nakai)
But yeah, I like that it's a perfectly logical reason for why they won't get an anime (despite all the offers for one). We all know the terrifying power of Angry Soccer Moms
.HOWEVER, I think that if PCP gets popular enough, they'll get an anime. If something gets sickeningly popular, the higher-ups will want to milk every penny/yen they can out of it. It would have to be a Post-Midnight show though, but I don't think they care about that.
There is the possibility of Mashiro and/or Takagi doing new series too, however. So right now there are several ways this could develop. So I'm happy to keep reading. Well played, Ohba, well played.
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Good chapter. Bad cliffhanger.
I have never seen Mashiro work on his own before, so I'm not sure how well he can write or how creative he is. I can't see any possible collaborations either unless he gets he teams up with someone that can write a powerful jump…. like Crowe, Just throwing the idea out there.
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Nice chapter overall, with all the fuss about PCP not being suited for anime I thought that maybe there comes a point were PCP beats Crow and +Natural, making Eiji use his option to "kill" a manga, PCP in this case and forcing Ashirogi to make a new one, better suited for anime.
But, well I think this would be a bit off-character from Eiji, I mean he would prefer to beat them and keep the rivalry, not killing a manga he enjoys.. So I don't really know if Eiji is gonna ever use that.. :S -
Nizuma would never destroy a manga that he thinks is good.
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Soooooooooooooo this manga's not ending anytime soon, huh?
WOOOOOOOOOOO
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I don't think that they'll (chief editor, to be precise) give Nizuma the option to kill one series for real.
Ah, I love Bakuman, such a positive manga -
mashiro should team up with aoki, purely because the height of the manga for me were the stories involving around her.
Also, it's a children's comic from Japan.
Why are you comparing it to cultural engravings and burritos.
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I would welcome more Aoki stories myself. But isn't her series doing well? I mean, it's not PCP or Crow level-popular, but it's consistent, isn't it?
Maybe though if she were doing only the writing, she and Mashiro could make something awesome.
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Mashiro is going to do his own manga. Only then can he surpass Eiji.
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So, what, Shueisha is in charge of getting sponsors for anime adaptations of their manga? Otherwise, I don't see how it makes sense.
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You guys can read my translation of chapter 102 here if you want:
http://mangahelpers.com/t/kewl0210/releases/24969Honestly, nothing much happens. Sort of going into another subplot.
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If I were the kid I would of took the chance to go to Paris. He's getting it for free, studying at one of the most art renowned places in the world. Honestly 4 years in Paris could of easily made his art skyrocket, Jump would of been there when he got back. He may of already been good, and that he's getting forced into studying fine arts, that doesn't mean he can't take what he learns from Paris and use it towards the comics he wants to draw.
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Suppose it's more of an independence thing, since he's being actively told by his parents what to do with his life.
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I find it kind of funny how in bakuman world, all the "team fukuda" people's mangas are totally owning the shit out of One Piece, Naruto, Bleach, Toriko, Gintama, etc.
Its like… they referenced some of them, so they exist in that world, but... maybe they're all doing really badly? or maybe they are all taking a togashi-esque hiatus!!
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Nah, if you notice the rankings there are always top 3 and top 10 spots for manga in the real world.
Like: 1- empty; 2 -empty; 3- Crow; 4- empty; 5-PCP; 6- +Natural, etc, etc.
And Crow is supposed to be the most recent fighting shounen miracle, up there with OP, Naruto and Bleach. -
i'm just gonna point out that Kaya is one of the more insightful characters in this series. Sure she can be airheaded, but she hit on the head probably what we were ALL thinking at the end when she voiced her concern about Shujin and Mashiro's partnership. Shujin is quite an oblivious fellow.
i feel for the pretty boy's situation. But i'd go to Paris, distance myself from my controlling family, become independent by seeing the world. Come back and destroy shueshia with my upgraded style. But that would go against this series "love for manga and dreams" theme. But studying art in paris would be a great opportunity.
I don't like the pretty boy.
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Here is the trailer of the anime version: No it's not P.C.P. XD
fgjhDN4-aSs
The voices are pretty good. Can wait for the anime starts begins.
For our nice German neighbours XD
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Oh, Miyoshi, you rock as usual. For all you're a glorified housewife, you are like the pillar in this circle of friends. And the only one who notices things not manga-related.
looks at trailer Man, the animation really isn't living up the drawings. But I suppose that's expected. I really like Takagi's voice, but Mashiro's? Eehhhhhhh.
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Here is the trailer of the anime version: No it's not P.C.P. XD
HwuWlGrr84k&
The voices are pretty good. Can wait for the anime starts begins.
Alright, the anime of Bakuman is almost here. :D
Personally, I'm liking those voices, especially the one for Takagi.
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mashiro sounds like Paku Romi
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That's cause Paku Romi is considered the current premier seiyuu for "young boy" roles, so everyone imitates her.
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Looks like I'll be watching two series this fall with Atsushi Abe as the lead.
For the chapter, to be honest, I would have taken the opportunity to study art in Paris, but this being the kind of manga it is, that would be tantamount to admitting defeat.
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Here is the trailer of the anime version: No it's not P.C.P. XD
HwuWlGrr84k&
The voices are pretty good. Can wait for the anime starts begins.
beat me to it.
azuki doesn't sound like the most annoying person ever, which seems like weird casting if you ask me. mashiro and takagi sound okay. the theme song sounds amazing.
the chapteR:storylines like shiratori's are why i giggle every time someone calls bakuman a 'realistic' story. his mom is acting like some melodramatic debutant from a victorian romance novel or something. i'm a little surprised there wasn't a scene where she gasped while dropping her monocle shouting, 'MANGA?! oh, my word…this just won't do!'
i have friends and a girlfriend who turned down the same paris opportunity, so i don't think that part is so hard to buy, though.
Also, it's a children's comic from Japan.
Why are you comparing it to cultural engravings and burritos.
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@Ao:
the chapteR:storylines like shiratori's are why i giggle every time someone calls bakuman a 'realistic' story. his mom is acting like some melodramatic debutant from a victorian romance novel or something. i'm a little surprised there wasn't a scene where she gasped while dropping her monocle shouting, 'MANGA?! oh, my word…this just won't do!'
Actually, its an incredibly common realistic reaction, I went through the exact same thing with my father when I said I'd rather be working in comics than wasting more time on college courses that weren't doing anything for me. Even then I have to do a year and a half of college first and give it a chance. And every single artist I've ever worked with went through the same thing with their parents when they started, be they 18 or 30 when they made the decision. It's an artist's right of passage, be they painters or comic book artists or poets or sculptors or writers or actors.
I know a guy whose been doing it for 25 years, and still his mother AND his wife harp on him to do something else that would make more money.
If I hadn't landed right in my dream job, and had 20 years of drawing and writing nonstop before that, I no doubt would have continued with college.
Most parents would prefer for their children to go to college and get a respectable career, rather than a low paying anonymous industry that nobody knows about that's associated with stinky anti-social Otaku, that takes up all your free time and demands hundreds of work hours every single week and which has almost no romantic prospects. (Most parents want to be grandparents when their kids are 25-30)
Remember, while everyone here understands the romance and the joy of comics, how many people here activley do it for a living on the incredibly lousy paycheck it provides? It is NOT a good industry to get into. To work in comics, you have to REALLY love it, and thats a difficult passion to explain to anyone, ESPECIALLY parents who want a real future for you.
Doing art for fun is one thing, doing it as your only income career is another.
In the end though, once they see that you're happy doing it, and that you CAN make a living at it, they'll usually relent within a year or two. But NO good parent would let their kid enter that kind of career without trying other things first. I work in comics, and if I ever have kids, I'd discourage them like crazy from starting!
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What Robby said. Doing comics for a living is not some widely accepted career choice.
Though I can agree that Shiratori's mother looks like she stepped right out of a Charlotte Bronte novel.
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The animation in that preview looked kind of bad. Hopefully I'm wrong though.
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@RobbyBevard:
snip
One of the most disappointing things I ever learned in life was how brutal and unattractive the artistic industry is. Not just because I realized I would never have a career there, but also how unfair it is to the artists (Seriously, a lousy paycheck on top of all the work you put in? That's gratitude for ya). Now, I like art in most of it's forms, but as you said, actually working in art is entirely different monster. Sacrificing 70% of my time, dealing with editors that are always trying to change my creative visions, working and working for hours on end until my fingers bleed and my brain turns to scrambled egg and then get a bum paycheck on top of that. No. I don't like it that much. I don't like ANYTHING that much. And it's all the more reason for me to respect you Robby.
Oh, and I love how you said "hundreds of work hours every single week" when there are only 168 hours in a week.
Oh, uh, yeah. Good chapter too. Well, actually I'm not sure how I feel about this little subplot. Seems like it's slowing things down unnecessarily.
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One of my friends in Canada does penciling for comics, but most of his money comes from freelance anyways. He's not making a lot of money, but he sure isn't making crap money. It's a touch and go situation when it comes to cash. But it's always smart to have a second job until you're getting at least 2-3 gigs a week. If you have a permanent job that you know you can live off of, good job you're better off then most artists in the field.
My parents encourage me to do art, but they want me to do Graphic Design, which I'm just not into. I have plans for my art. I won't just stay in one spot the rest of my life. You just gotta push yourself and make your own opportunities. Which is why I'd like to know what the two will do after PCP and after they get married and what not. Are they going to retire after they're done with comics? Would they consider going into teaching?
Long post ahead.
! Well any art career can be a good decision, or a bad one. Comics could be the worst decision someone has ever made, even if they love it. Or it can lead them places. Comics can lead to a manager positions, or even presidents of companies, art directors, etc. All in which make a significant money difference than a good ol' penciler or colorist.
! The thing I like about Bakuman is how they portray the time it takes to get something done. The guy obviously knows how long it takes to get something done, he does it for a living afterall. I find it weird that they have any life outside of drawing at all, when like Robby said, it takes hours in the day we don't have to complete something.
! A good thing about colleges, is you get to participate in internships that can lead you into a possible career. By the end of college, if you're not good enough to break into the field, you're screwed and have to do more work to make sure you do make a living.
! The average freelance artist out of school will most likely make $24k a year, this isn't the absolute minimum, it's just what my friends made when they finished school. Bakuman to me makes it seem like they're incredibly rich for doing comics. While in reality, most people end up taking a second job like telemarketing or something to actually make sure they have the rent on time.
! Another thing about art, is like the mother of that chapter, but reversed. When people think art these days, they think cartoons and comics. Which is a turnoff, because not a lot of places focus on fine arts anymore. It takes a lot of guts, courage, and stupidity to go into a field where you're staring at your drawing desk or Cintiq monitor for 100+ hours a week with no sleep. -
@RobbyBevard:
Actually, its an incredibly common realistic reaction, I went through the exact same thing with my father when I said I'd rather be working in comics than wasting more time on college courses that weren't doing anything for me. Even then I have to do a year and a half of college first and give it a chance. And every single artist I've ever worked with went through the same thing with their parents when they started, be they 18 or 30 when they made the decision. It's an artist's right of passage, be they painters or comic book artists or poets or sculptors or writers or actors.
I know a guy whose been doing it for 25 years, and still his mother AND his wife harp on him to do something else that would make more money.
If I hadn't landed right in my dream job, and had 20 years of drawing and writing nonstop before that, I no doubt would have continued with college.
Most parents would prefer for their children to go to college and get a respectable career, rather than a low paying anonymous industry that nobody knows about that's associated with stinky anti-social Otaku, that takes up all your free time and demands hundreds of work hours every single week and which has almost no romantic prospects. (Most parents want to be grandparents when their kids are 25-30)
Remember, while everyone here understands the romance and the joy of comics, how many people here activley do it for a living on the incredibly lousy paycheck it provides? It is NOT a good industry to get into. To work in comics, you have to REALLY love it, and thats a difficult passion to explain to anyone, ESPECIALLY parents who want a real future for you.
Doing art for fun is one thing, doing it as your only income career is another.
In the end though, once they see that you're happy doing it, and that you CAN make a living at it, they'll usually relent within a year or two. But NO good parent would let their kid enter that kind of career without trying other things first. I work in comics, and if I ever have kids, I'd discourage them like crazy from starting!
i wasn't saying it wasn't a realistic situation, just that the way it's handled is so heavy-handed and melodramatic that it feels like life filtered through an after-school special rather than real human beings' reactions to things.
re: the art in that anime trailer, slice-of-life anime always tend to get notoriously bad animation in comparison to other genres. it might work. the art in bakuman is more about the character designs looking pretty rather than super-impressive artwork most of the time, anyway.
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The trailer works good. I'm still preparing to try to sub it, but even if it doesn't work out there'll definitely be groups trying to for such a popular series.
As for the art conversation, I didn't think it sounded that heavy handed. But his parents did seem to be from a rich family and seem pretty snooty. But that does sort of have a reality to it, where there are people like that. It's just not something you see too often.
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One thing I liked about this chapter was showing that, for all his parents are snooty rich people, Shiratori DOES have art in his background. His art-collector grandfather is shining through him.
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@DanialG:
One of my friends in Canada does penciling for comics, but most of his money comes from freelance anyways. He's not making a lot of money, but he sure isn't making crap money. It's a touch and go situation when it comes to cash. But it's always smart to have a second job until you're getting at least 2-3 gigs a week. If you have a permanent job that you know you can live off of, good job you're better off then most artists in the field.
My parents encourage me to do art, but they want me to do Graphic Design, which I'm just not into. I have plans for my art. I won't just stay in one spot the rest of my life. You just gotta push yourself and make your own opportunities. Which is why I'd like to know what the two will do after PCP and after they get married and what not. Are they going to retire after they're done with comics? Would they consider going into teaching?
Long post ahead.
! Well any art career can be a good decision, or a bad one. Comics could be the worst decision someone has ever made, even if they love it. Or it can lead them places. Comics can lead to a manager positions, or even presidents of companies, art directors, etc. All in which make a significant money difference than a good ol' penciler or colorist.
! The thing I like about Bakuman is how they portray the time it takes to get something done. The guy obviously knows how long it takes to get something done, he does it for a living afterall. I find it weird that they have any life outside of drawing at all, when like Robby said, it takes hours in the day we don't have to complete something.
! A good thing about colleges, is you get to participate in internships that can lead you into a possible career. By the end of college, if you're not good enough to break into the field, you're screwed and have to do more work to make sure you do make a living.
! The average freelance artist out of school will most likely make $24k a year, this isn't the absolute minimum, it's just what my friends made when they finished school. Bakuman to me makes it seem like they're incredibly rich for doing comics. While in reality, most people end up taking a second job like telemarketing or something to actually make sure they have the rent on time.
! Another thing about art, is like the mother of that chapter, but reversed. When people think art these days, they think cartoons and comics. Which is a turnoff, because not a lot of places focus on fine arts anymore. It takes a lot of guts, courage, and stupidity to go into a field where you're staring at your drawing desk or Cintiq monitor for 100+ hours a week with no sleep.I agree with your post except one thing.:p
I don't think Bakuman shows authors to be very rich. Saito and Shujin have a nice life because they don't spend much. That fat assistant had to return home because he had no money when he quitted.
The only rich ones are Neji who doesn't seems to spend much either and Otters 11 guy but that's because they're smash hits popular manga with anime, games, toys and craploads of merchandise. -
I agree with your post except one thing.:p
I don't think Bakuman shows authors to be very rich. Saito and Shujin have a nice life because they don't spend much. .Dude, they got an entire manga studio + supplies for free (sans rent). The only mangaka in this series I think was poor is probably eiji, and he's got two smash hit manga under his belt
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They don't get supplies for free. And they have to pay assistants too.
They probably have a very good bank account because we don't see them spending money on random stuff nor they seem the type to just go widly spending money.
When they get and anime and lots of merchandise like Eiji and Otters11 they really be rich. Right now they seem to have a very comfortable life. -
My point is, Bakuman makes it seem easier to achieve stuff and get money in this, than in real life. They said it was a bargain, but it was more of a cake walk for them. Besides the offscreen timelapse and name making, everything seems incredibly easy for them to be making that money. They've done 3 comics; Trap, Tanto, and PCP all within that short amount of time. And while 2 of them were canceled, they already achieved more than most people out there, with mediocre work. I understand this is a comic, and in no way relates to real life at all, but everything they done so far seems as if they've been spoon fed. The crap that's in Jump today makes it seem like anyone can get in. Good writer bad artist, Good Artist terrible writer.
Now the writer has time to do PCP and the new series? They plan on doing another series? Plus continue PCP? They've got more time than they can handle, to get something done. They're rich in my books when it comes to time and the environment they live in.
But like I said, I love how they convey time in the comic. Showing just how long it takes to get something done. I just think they have it better than most people out there, in comparison to money, time, and where they work.
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Don't forget they're also paying the salaries of all three of their assistants.
The assitants being the only reason they're able to do things on a regular schedule and have that much time. Without them, the artist wouldn't even be able to sleep and would be working 20 hour days again.
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@DanialG:
My point is, Bakuman makes it seem easier to achieve stuff and get money in this, than in real life. They said it was a bargain, but it was more of a cake walk for them. Besides the offscreen timelapse and name making, everything seems incredibly easy for them to be making that money. They've done 3 comics; Trap, Tanto, and PCP all within that short amount of time. And while 2 of them were canceled, they already achieved more than most people out there, with mediocre work. I understand this is a comic, and in no way relates to real life at all, but everything they done so far seems as if they've been spoon fed. The crap that's in Jump today makes it seem like anyone can get in. Good writer bad artist, Good Artist terrible writer.
Now the writer has time to do PCP and the new series? They plan on doing another series? Plus continue PCP? They've got more time than they can handle, to get something done. They're rich in my books when it comes to time and the environment they live in.
But like I said, I love how they convey time in the comic. Showing just how long it takes to get something done. I just think they have it better than most people out there, in comparison to money, time, and where they work.
C'mon, you kidding me? It's a shounen manga, of course it's easier that real life. In real life no teenager can smash through a wall, some middle aged man who trained all his life can but not a teen who's been training for two years.
And if you read the first chapters you understand they are geniouses. They talked about great examples of older authors who used to have more than one series running because they were amazing geniouses and say "Ok, that's our example/inspiration because we're geniouses too".Their work was never mediocre. Trap got cancelled because it stopped for months when Mashiro got sick, although it was gaining some fans it was still very recent and would never be able to pull a HunterXHunter.
Tanto was very poular with kid but they decided to quit because they wanted to compete with Eiji and use Shujin's skills better. And PCP is also becoming very popular. -
@DanialG:
I understand this is a comic, and in no way relates to real life at all
@DanialG:
and in no way relates to real life at all
@DanialG:
AT ALL
Even if they're written to look like geniuses, the stuff the writer pushes out in Bakuman is half-assed at best. I understand he's making it Jump material, but the basic ideas he throws out seem mediocre.
He was 14 and good at drawing, okay good for him. So are other people. Nakai gets made fun of cause he's in his 30's and hasn't gotten serialized, when it's more common for artists to just start getting good in the 30-40 area anyways.The point is, as a slice of life comic their life makes it seem like they're way more rich/lucky than people make it out to be. It's still entertaining as fuck tho.
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Oda was an assistant on Kenshin when he was 19 and did the original one shots for One Piece when he was 21.
Kishimoto and Kubo are about the same age and have been doing their series for 10+ years (so when they were in their early 20's) Ken Akamatsu did A.I. Love you when he was 25 and moved onto Love Hina when he was 30, and Negima which is his best work he started at 25, but he was going to art college and getting into Comiket when he was 20.
I personally started interning in comics at 17 during my senior year in high school, and have been in them since, even if I never quite developed the drawing talent to go full tilt as an artist, I still do well as a writer, colorist and editor.
Comics IS a young man's game. If you don't have the passion and enthusiasm to try and break in when you're 20, a life of dreams behind you, if you aren't interning right out of school, then you're not likely to ever have the motivation to break in. And you need the stamina of a 20 year old to deal with the all nighters.
Most artists hit their peak in the range of 30-40, yes, but thats after years of work and practice and development and meeting deadlines, not when you start. Not to say an unknown quality talent at 30 can't get in… but more likely, if they're 30 and starting then, they haven't been that interested in comics at all and were pursuing other fields first (Novels, movies, tv, advertising, making sandwiches, etc.) and comics are their second or fifth choice, for whatever reason.
When you have a dream field you want to work in, you generally have an inkling of it before you're out of high school. You don't discover you like to draw in college and then get good at it, you scribble and doodle on your notes and homework while the teacher talks since you were 6. (Well, actual training and serious study don't usually kick in later, but the enthusiasm and energy and desire has to be there from pretty early on.)
Aside from that, of course the stories in Bakuman are familiar and throwaway, the author isn't going to develop a full blown useable sellable concept for a series within a series, its easier to just base them off existing familiar properties. So of COURSE Tanto is just like Doremon, of course Trap and PCP are like Detective Conan and their own Death Note. But even with that, most of the stories in Bakuman DO seem more interesting than what's currently in Jump, and the artist is quite good at showcasing different visually interesting styles, while giving a peak at the behind the scenes.
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I saw that part of you previous post but it seemed you were contradicting yourself a bit.
And a story is not only the ideas, it's more how you put them on paper. You read the Otters 11 oneshot? The premiss of a human with the face/head of an otter is ridiculous but the way it's written creates a very funny manga. Like One Piece is the story of a boy trying to be the greatest pirate ever, it's how it's done that matters and we simply don't fully see that, just some little clips were and there.The manga is aimed at teens so the main characters are teens, so readers can easily relate. Obata and Obha have worked mostly if not exclusively with Jump so that's what they're talking about. In Jump it's normal to have a series out before reaching 30 years old, so Nakai could be an odd case in real life.
If this was published in other magazine I wouldn't find it that much of a realistic slice-of-life but since it's Jump it's fair game.
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it's a slice-of-life, but it's still a 'shonen reality' look at life.
everything is simpler than it would be in real life. -
Funny how other shonen have kids tearing open the heavens and defeating insurmountable odds, while Bakuman writers give the leads all the advantages in the world just so two kids could become comic artists in real life
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If it frustrates you it may help to lighten up.
I mean the big unknown factor is just how talented the kids are, right? We take it on the writer's authority that, yes, Saiko and Shujin are good enough to handle this stuff and handle it well. I think that yes, there are times when things are simplified or seem too easy for the sake of the plot progressing, but there have been just as many occasions if not more where they run into these huge roadblocks all the time. Look at how hard it is for them, despite how good they are, to become no.1 in the magazine. It still hasn't happened yet!
Take it in stride.
There's a great lighthearted vibe around here, because no matter how serious we might get, we're all together because of some magical pirate.
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If it frustrates you it may help to lighten up.
I mean the big unknown factor is just how talented the kids are, right? We take it on the writer's authority that, yes, Saiko and Shujin are good enough to handle this stuff and handle it well. I think that yes, there are times when things are simplified or seem too easy for the sake of the plot progressing, but there have been just as many occasions if not more where they run into these huge roadblocks all the time. Look at how hard it is for them, despite how good they are, to become no.1 in the magazine. It still hasn't happened yet!
Take it in stride.
i meant frustrating that kids can't become rich comic authors overnight in reality. successful comic authors can't become rich from the industry alone, except for a few exceptions.
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@Ao:
i meant frustrating that kids can't become rich comic authors overnight in reality. successful comic authors can't become rich from the industry alone, except for a few exceptions.
I'm not sure which market you're talking about.
If you really are "successful comic author" in Japan, wealth is pretty much guaranteed.You're just not guaranteed to become popular, period, due to extremely tough competition.
You don't start making the mega-bucks until you have a tankoubon out.
And if you can't get a tankoubon out, then you're not successful. You suck.Shujin and Saiko are making pretty pennies already, they're just not hitting the millionaire status just yet due to lack of long-running series or anime franchise taking off. Yet.
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I'm not sure which market you're talking about.
If you really are "successful comic author" in Japan, wealth is pretty much guaranteed.You're just not guaranteed to become popular, period, due to extremely tough competition.
You don't start making the mega-bucks until you have a tankoubon out.
And if you can't get a tankoubon out, then you're not successful. You suck.Shujin and Saiko are making pretty pennies already, they're just not hitting the millionaire status just yet due to lack of long-running series or anime franchise taking off. Yet.
i was talking about the western comics industry as the question was directed specifically at taboo.
