Newgate didn't hit anything with that stab, so no.
And again…the Armament Aspect doesn't "remove" anything, it just lets contact happen regardless of changes done to a Power User's body.
Newgate didn't hit anything with that stab, so no.
And again…the Armament Aspect doesn't "remove" anything, it just lets contact happen regardless of changes done to a Power User's body.
i dont really get it.
coa is supposed to make logians hittable.as in not allowing them to turn intangible at the area of contact of haki.
aokiji isnt didnt make a hole before wb pierced him, he does it while its piercing, hows that possible?
i dont really get it.
coa is supposed to make logians hittable.as in not allowing them to turn intangible at the area of contact of haki.
aokiji isnt didnt make a hole before wb pierced him, he does it while its piercing, hows that possible?
Aokiji DID make a hole right b4 WB pierced him. that's why he didn't get stabbed
Haki can be used to find people. I know that's how Chopper and Zoro were outed by Ohm in Skypia. It can be used like a radar.
! This ability combined with Enel's DF allowed him to enhance the area by which he could sense people, to the entire country.
! I never thought about Luffy's "instinct" maybe him using Haki to find Galdino out of all his clones.
i dont really get it.
coa is supposed to make logians hittable.as in not allowing them to turn intangible at the area of contact of haki.
aokiji isnt didnt make a hole before wb pierced him, he does it while its piercing, hows that possible?
It lets whoever is utilizing the Armament Aspect actually make contact with the logia as if they were hitting a normal body, but that doesn't stop the person who is hit from being a magmaman, lightman, iceman, whatever. It's why when Joz hits Kuzan he shatters just like always does or Sakazuki having magma drip down even after two slashes imbued with Ambition from Marco and Vista.
They don't stop being whatever their particular Devil Fruits entails. Same with become/control paramecias like Luffy or Buggy.
And yes, yes he did. It's the same reason strong characters can go from standing around one second to fighting positions or dodging from pointblank range the next. Kuzan is fast enough to pull something like that off.
It lets whoever is utilizing the Armament Aspect actually make contact with the logia as if they were hitting a normal body, but that doesn't stop the person who is hit from being a magmaman, lightman, iceman, whatever. It's why when Joz hits Kuzan he shatters just like always does or Sakazuki having magma drip down even after two slashes imbued with Ambition from Marco and Vista.
They don't stop being whatever their particular Devil Fruits entails. Same with become/control paramecias like Luffy or Buggy.
And yes, yes he did. It's the same reason strong characters can go from standing around one second to fighting positions or dodging from pointblank range the next. Kuzan is fast enough to pull something like that off.
ah kiez.
thanks for clearing that up.
It lets whoever is utilizing the Armament Aspect actually make contact with the logia as if they were hitting a normal body, but that doesn't stop the person who is hit from being a magmaman, lightman, iceman, whatever. It's why when Joz hits Kuzan he shatters just like always does or Sakazuki having magma drip down even after two slashes imbued with Ambition from Marco and Vista.
They don't stop being whatever their particular Devil Fruits entails. Same with become/control paramecias like Luffy or Buggy.
And yes, yes he did. It's the same reason strong characters can go from standing around one second to fighting positions or dodging from pointblank range the next. Kuzan is fast enough to pull something like that off.
Speaking off Vanessa, could you explain that Sakazuki bit for me cause I don't get it. I'd expect an ambition sword strike to the neck to be fatal to anyone even a logia. The segment of the body that's cut would be like a normal part of the body. Otherwise Kuzan would not have been in danger even if Whitebeard stabbed him with his bisento. Yet he just stood there with a gaping neck with no damage done as expected of a Logia. What's up?
!
@Thousand:
Speaking off Vanessa, could you explain that Sakazuki bit for me cause I don't get it. I'd expect an ambition sword strike to the neck to be fatal to anyone even a logia. The segment of the body that's cut would be like a normal part of the body. Otherwise Kuzan would not have been in danger even if Whitebeard stabbed him with his bisento. Yet he just stood there with a gaping neck with no damage done as expected of a Logia. What's up?
I don't know why, but I LOVE YOU !!!! <3
hm hm,lets get back to topic, So The way Akainu was able to escape from the Haki Strike would be like this for exemple :
Bugg can't be Cut, but if it was a Haki Sword it would be a different story, the only way for him to not be cut is to Separate the body part that is about to be Cut.
The reason The Admirals give us the impression that they were really hit is because they are good at ShapeShiffting their Alternate Body (Element of DF) and Can do it accuratelly probably thanks to their CoO.
I don't know why, but I LOVE YOU !!!! <3
hm hm,lets get back to topic, So The way Akainu was able to escape from the Haki Strike would be like this for exemple :
Bugg can't be Cut, but if it was a Haki Sword it would be a different story, the only way for him to not be cut is to Separate the body part that is about to be Cut.
The reason The Admirals give us the impression that they were really hit is because they are good at ShapeShiffting their Alternate Body (Element of DF) and Can do it accuratelly probably thanks to their CoO.
No, I don't buy it. That was clearly a surprise attack and Akainu even grunted in pain.
@Thousand:
Speaking off Vanessa, could you explain that Sakazuki bit for me cause I don't get it. I'd expect an ambition sword strike to the neck to be fatal to anyone even a logia. The segment of the body that's cut would be like a normal part of the body. Otherwise Kuzan would not have been in danger even if Whitebeard stabbed him with his bisento. Yet he just stood there with a gaping neck with no damage done as expected of a Logia. What's up?
Just because an attack is imbued with the Armament Aspect doesn't mean if the Power User is hit the fight is done or the hit is fatal. And with logias I wouldn't use what state their elemental body is in after an attack to gauge how much damage it actually did. I mean we saw Kuzan shatter into pieces yet all he had was a bloody lip; for Sakazuki those two slashes simply didn't hurt him much in spite of where they hit. I mean we've seen Luffy be gutted through(Crocodile, Lucci), Zoro take attacks that slice up the stone behind him(Daz Bones), Sanji stabbed through the heart(Absalom) and a lot of other stuff.
Once contact is made it's all dependent on the individual's toughness like anyone else, and it's not too out there to assume the Admirals are really really tough in spite of being logias.
It lets whoever is utilizing the Armament Aspect actually make contact with the logia as if they were hitting a normal body, but that doesn't stop the person who is hit from being a magmaman, lightman, iceman, whatever. It's why when Joz hits Kuzan he shatters just like always does or Sakazuki having magma drip down even after two slashes imbued with Ambition from Marco and Vista.
They don't stop being whatever their particular Devil Fruits entails. Same with become/control paramecias like Luffy or Buggy.
If that was the Case, then Ace should be alive now.
No i don't think so, the only one so far who can go back to his Normal Body Form after getting Epicly Pwned is Marco.
@Thousand:
No, I don't buy it. That was clearly a surprise attack and Akainu even grunted in pain.
I think the anime will make it clear if he was in Pain, Surprised or Annoyed.
If that was the Case, then Ace should be alive now.
No i don't think so, the only one so far who can go back to his Normal Body Form after getting Epicly Pwned is Marco.
Fireman's situation was similar to Crocodile with water and Ener with rubber.
Ace's Mera Fruit powers were forcibly canceled out by Sakazuki's magma(likely because it smothers the fire) so either way contact was going to happen.
When Kizaru was cut he did bleed a bit.
! Yet when Akainu was cut twice with Haki imbued attacks I don't think he bled at all. I think besides how tough the DF user may be it matters how proficient the Haki user is with CoA. Rayleigh did say people tend to gravitate more towards a certain type of Haki. Perhaps Vista and Marco aren't as well honed in CoA as Rayleigh.
it weird that now we know more about haki everybody referencing to skypiea . the arc most people say we could have done without.
Fireman's situation was similar to Crocodile with water and Ener with rubber.
Ace's Mera Fruit powers were forcibly canceled out by Sakazuki's magma(likely because it smothers the fire) so either way contact was going to happen.
I guess you are right, The Burned Fire of Ace was atually Representing His Organs, so He lost them forever.
But im Sure Akainu was either not touched with swords, or He Block Them with "Haki Imbued Neck". or else he would be Cut and bleed like Kizaru Did.
Actually Akainu did bleed once when he was hit by Haki, Remember after Ace's Death, WB raped Akainu.
P.S. : I love how You call Akainu by his Real name "Sakazuki"
In reference to Akainu's neck cut from Vista, I like to assume Akainu was using his armor defensivly to reduce the damage from Vista's strike.
@RPG:
it weird that now we know more about haki everybody referencing to skypiea . the arc most people say we could have done without.
It wouldn't have been as pointless if Wiper had joined.
I have a theory. It's a simple one. Vista and MArco had a weaker Haki than Akainu at the time due to Akainu basically being on a rampage and Marco/Vista witnessing the death of their brother.
Just because an attack is imbued with the Armament Aspect doesn't mean if the Power User is hit the fight is done or the hit is fatal. And with logias I wouldn't use what state their elemental body is in after an attack to gauge how much damage it actually did. I mean we saw Kuzan shatter into pieces yet all he had was a bloody lip; for Sakazuki those two slashes simply didn't hurt him much in spite of where they hit. I mean we've seen Luffy be gutted through(Crocodile, Lucci), Zoro take attacks that slice up the stone behind him(Daz Bones), Sanji stabbed through the heart(Absalom) and a lot of other stuff.
Once contact is made it's all dependent on the individual's toughness like anyone else, and it's not too out there to assume the Admirals are really really tough in spite of being logias.
Now THIS is an explanation I can stand behind. And explained so clearly too. I asked the right gal for the job:) Thanks a lot!
Just because an attack is imbued with the Armament Aspect doesn't mean if the Power User is hit the fight is done or the hit is fatal. And with logias I wouldn't use what state their elemental body is in after an attack to gauge how much damage it actually did. I mean we saw Kuzan shatter into pieces yet all he had was a bloody lip; for Sakazuki those two slashes simply didn't hurt him much in spite of where they hit. I mean we've seen Luffy be gutted through(Crocodile, Lucci), Zoro take attacks that slice up the stone behind him(Daz Bones), Sanji stabbed through the heart(Absalom) and a lot of other stuff.
Once contact is made it's all dependent on the individual's toughness like anyone else, and it's not too out there to assume the Admirals are really really tough in spite of being logias.
That makes no sense. Akainu's durability and/or endurance is obviously not what helped him against Marco's and Vista attack. You could clearly see a giant gash in his neck. It's obvious that Haki is not a guaranteed method of bypassing DFs and that it depends greatly on the users skill etc.
You lot… just epicly confused meh ._.
Perhaps it took longer for akainu to regenerate from the attack because their haki made him more solid.
Judging from his facial expression and comment, it seemed that the attack did "hurt" Akainu somewhat.
That makes no sense. Akainu's durability and/or endurance is obviously not what helped him against Marco's and Vista attack. You could clearly see a giant gash in his neck. It's obvious that Haki is not a guaranteed method of bypassing DFs and that it depends greatly on the users skill etc.
Yeah no, you guys try way too hard to tie Ambition into every little thing.
Try again please, and not badly like with Zkaiser in the other thread.
Yeah no, you guys try way too hard to tie Ambition into every little thing.
Try again please, and not badly like with Zkaiser in the other thread.
How else do you explain Akainu healing back from a giant gash in his neck? He's not Marco, he doesn't have healing powers. His real body was never hit in the first place, we can even see the magma dripping from the cut. It's very obvious that Akainu somehow used his own Haki to make it so that Marco and Vista couldn't properly bypass his intangibility. There is no other possible explanation. Same thing happened when Whitebeard attacked Kizaru and Aokiji.
Yeah no, you guys try way too hard to tie Ambition into every little thing.
Try again please, and not badly like with Zkaiser in the other thread.
So. With Haki a logia user can still turn into his element on impact… but the punchs hurts? And when being cut his magma like body helps him absorb more of the damage then usual ppl, rite :o ?
How else do you explain Akainu healing back from a giant gash in his neck? He's not Marco, he doesn't have healing powers. It's very obvious that Akainu somehow used his own Haki to make it so that Marco and Vista couldn't properly bypass his intangibility. There is no other possible explanation. Same thing happened when Whitebeard attacked Kizaru and Aokiji.
I agree with the point about Kizaru to a certain extent. He was just hit way to hard and with such a clear shot, for a wound to not have resulted from it. As for Aokiji, I still say he just moved out of the way.
Edit
you were refering to this page right?
http://read.mangashare.com/One-Piece/chapter-570/page012.html
I wish Oda would come out and explain that in an SBS.
I agree with the point about Kizaru to a certain extent. He was just hit way to hard and with such a clear shot, for a wound to not have resulted from it. As for Aokiji, I still say he just moved out of the way.
It is possible Aokiji just created a hole in himself before Whitebeard had a chance to, and dodged the attack that way. However considering that Akainu and Kizaru were both attacked, and their intangibility remained unbypassed in a similar manner I think it's more probably that Aokiji also used his Haki to make it to that Whitebeard couldn't bypass his intangibility.
Maybe that spot is more resistant to Haki because of his tattoo??
I'm fairly positive Akainu did the same AoKiji did and controlled the Magma in his body to converge, creating a void where he should have been striked
I agree with the point about Kizaru to a certain extent. He was just hit way to hard and with such a clear shot, for a wound to not have resulted from it. As for Aokiji, I still say he just moved out of the way.
It's simple. If a normal guy (like Zoro) got hit it would make him bleed, but he wouldn't los his head, but since Akainu is magma it appeared as the cut took his head off. It didn't. Haki just allows people to inflict dmg uppon logias while they still can go element mode.
Luffy punches Kizaru without haki > he turns to light.
He uses haki > Kizaru turns to light again but he takes dmg ?
@_@ im confused
I'm fairly positive Akainu did the same AoKiji did and controlled the Magma in his body to converge, creating a void where he should have been striked
Very unlikely, considering if that was the case it'd make a lot more sense to make a much bigger void as opposed to one just barely big enough.
It's simple. If a normal guy (like Zoro) got hit it would make him bleed, but he wouldn't los his head, but since Akainu is magma it appeared as the cut took his head off. It didn't. Haki just allows people to inflict dmg uppon logias while they still can go element mode.
Luffy punches Kizaru without haki > he turns to light.
He uses haki > Kizaru turns to light again but he takes dmg ?
@_@ im confused
That would be plausible, however, Kizaru was stopped by Rayleigh's kick, so we can shoot that theory down
That would be plausible, however, Kizaru was stopped by Rayleigh's kick, so we can shoot that theory down
We know that Rayleigh is the master of Haki. So at the most advanced lvl u can prolly grab logias 'n slam 'em around xD? And at lower lvls u can only inflict dmg but u can't stop their ability?
How else do you explain Akainu healing back from a giant gash in his neck? He's not Marco, he doesn't have healing powers. His real body was never hit in the first place, we can even see the magma dripping from the cut. It's very obvious that Akainu somehow used his own Haki to make it so that Marco and Vista couldn't properly bypass his intangibility. There is no other possible explanation. Same thing happened when Whitebeard attacked Kizaru and Aokiji.
Yeah I already covered all of this in the last page except Borsalino. Anyway, like I've said: we see characters get stabbed and sliced through all the time and soon after a scar or even blood isn't shown. Trying to make a big thing of a tough guy taking a hit and attributing it to something else simply to fit your little theory doesn't work, sorry.
With Borsalino, Newgate didn't seem to be utilizing Ambition against him any of the times he attacked with the bisento so that's covered. Unless you can somehow prove Newgate was using the Armament Aspect against lightman you've got nothing.
So. With Haki a logia user can still turn into his element on impact… but the punchs hurts? And when being cut his magma like body helps him absorb more of the damage then usual ppl, rite :o ?
Logia-type Power Users are in the elemental state by default. It's what we've been shown throughout the comic.
It's simple. If a normal guy (like Zoro) got hit it would make him bleed, but he wouldn't los his head, but since Akainu is magma it appeared as the cut took his head off. It didn't. Haki just allows people to inflict dmg uppon logias while they still can go element mode.
Luffy punches Kizaru without haki > he turns to light.
He uses haki > Kizaru turns to light again but he takes dmg ?
@_@ im confused
**No, that's not what's been shown at all.
Haki allows you to bypass DFs, but only on contact. This was shown when the Boa sisters fought Luffy. He ceased to be rubber (in a sense) only in the area there weapons were making contact with his body.
However, it's obviously not as simple as that. There seems to be a method people can use to prevent people from completely bypassing their own DFs. My personal theory is that if you want to bypass someone's DF, you have to have Haki on or above their level.** **Admirals are Haki masters, so even some very powerful Haki users (such as certain commanders) aren't able to bypass their intangibility.
Basically, you can only bypass a person's DF if your Haki is equal to or above theirs. With the case of Marco/Vista vs Akainu, it seems like their Haki wasn't strong enough at the time (since the strength of your will fluctuates depending on the situation) to completely bypass Akainu's intangibility but was strong enough to cause him some discomfort.**
Very unlikely, considering if that was the case it'd make a lot more sense to make a much bigger void as opposed to one just barely big enough.
His void was big enough to hold 2 swords in there, and its probably worse to void yourself too much than to void yourself enough to still have both your hands, eyes, hears and feet ready to attack
Just a theory
We know that Rayleigh is the master of Haki. So at the most advanced lvl u can prolly grab logias 'n slam 'em around xD? And at lower lvls u can only inflict dmg but u can't stop their ability?
Hum… Possibly? Who knows?
Still, shouldn't Vista and Marco be at enough level to do such a thing?
It's simple. If a normal guy (like Zoro) got hit it would make him bleed, but he wouldn't los his head, but since Akainu is magma it appeared as the cut took his head off. It didn't. Haki just allows people to inflict dmg uppon logias while they still can go element mode.
Luffy punches Kizaru without haki > he turns to light.
He uses haki > Kizaru turns to light again but he takes dmg ?
@_@ im confused
Yeah but look at the picture I posted. And the following pages after, looks like not a single thing happened to Kizaru unless White Beards Haki was on the fritz.
http://read.mangashare.com/One-Piece/chapter-570/page012.html
Yeah I already covered all of this in the last page except Borsalino. Anyway, like I've said: we see characters get stabbed and sliced through all the time and soon after a scar or anything isn't shown.
Nah, that one is wrong for sure
If Oda didn't want to show bloody cuts, he'd just change perspective, the white right after the slash was intentional
Basically, you can only bypass a person's DF if your Haki is equal to or above theirs. With the case of Marco/Vista vs Akainu, it seems like their Haki wasn't strong enough at the time (since the strength of your will fluctuates depending on the situation) to completely bypass Akainu's intangibility but was strong enough to cause him some discomfort.
I'll be satisfied with that untill we see more in the manga :D
Damn you Oda :P
@ Romance… well hmm.. Only posibble thing is that he also evaded xDD?
Yeah I already covered all of this in the last page except Borsalino. Anyway, like I've said: we see characters get stabbed and sliced through all the time and soon after a scar or anything isn't shown.
With Borsalino, Newgate didn't seem to be utilizing Ambition against him any of the times he attacked with the bisento so that's covered. Unless you can somehow prove Newgate was using the Armament Aspect you've got nothing.
**I know what you've covered. It's just you're very obviously wrong here. It's true that people in OP have healed from pretty nasty injuries without any scars. But no one in OP has ever healed from a giant gash like like so quickly (his neck was fine directly after that). Hell, no one has ever healed from a gash like that period. No one but Marco, and that's only because he has a fruit that specifically allows him to do so.
Akainu's intangibility was never bypassed in the first place. That's the only explanation.**
His void was big enough to hold 2 swords in there, and its probably worse to void yourself too much than to void yourself enough to still have both your hands, eyes, hears and feet ready to attack
Just a theoryHum… Possibly? Who knows?
Still, shouldn't Vista and Marco be at enough level to do such a thing?
**Just barely though. That's my point. If you were a logia, and saw two Haki infused swords coming for your neck would you just barely dodge or try and dodge so that you have the biggest chance of being uninjured?
Yes, they should be. My theory is that their Haki was weaker than usual at the time because they had just witnessed Ace's death. Remember how much mindset affected the Strawhats at the mansion at Water 7. A similar thing may have happened here.**
So…nothing, good to know.
As for examples for injuries? There's Sanji getting stabbed through the heart against Absalom or Luffy taking that hit against Lucci when he first showed the Neko Fruit: Model Leopard like I've mentioned before. Oh and Luffy taking that chakram to the head from Django.
Still waiting on anything for Borsalino by the way.
So…nothing, good to know.
As for examples for injuries? There's Sanji getting stabbed through the heart against Absalom or Luffy taking that hit against Lucci when he first showed the Neko Fruit: Model Leopard.
Still waiting on anything for Borsalino by the way.
**What do you mean "nothing." You're wrong, I just proved it.
None of those examples work. Sanji didn't magically heal from that stab seconds/minutes later. Hell, there's no evidence he ever healed from that stab during the entire duration of Thriller Bark iirc. Luffy ha the entire train ride to heal from the wound Lucchi gave him. You, however, are suggesting Akainu healed from a giant hole in his neck in minutes or less. No, just no.
Waiting on what for Kizaru? He obviously wasn't hit either.**
Its a manga were most injuries doesn
t count..dont take every hit\slice so seriously. I mean even one hour trainride couldn
t heal shit, but still you say thats the time were Luffy finally healed of a fatal damage?
@Don:
It
s a manga were most injuries doesn
t count..dont take every hit\slice so seriously. I mean even one hour trainride couldn
t heal shit, but still you say thats the time were Luffy finally healed of a fatal damage?
Not to be nitpicky or anything, but his injuries healed before the train ride.
While I understand Polygon's point here, I wouldn't say it's the only reason. The concept of Haki itself is still an enigma anyway.
@Polygon: Sanji seemed fine and no attention was brought to it, and Luffy was no worse for the wear even while wedged in between the buildings so I'm gonna go with what we were shown instead of what you think. Also, Sakazuki didn't "heal" from anything, the guy just took the hits and they didn't hurt him much. You're skewing way too much in order for your little speculation to fit into some Ambition battle nonsense when nothing points to magmaman utilizing it any way when getting attacked.
And you said something about Newgate using the Armament Aspect against Borsalino, and I asked you to prove it using scans. Otherwise everything you're suggesting falls apart since it doesn't work.
The most interesting thread/discussion I have read in eons on AP and still after reading it you feel like you have read squat…
I said it some time ago that Oda should explain how Logias/DFs/and later on Haki works to prevent confusion...however it seems we ll be waiting for the great Dr. for some time to come...