I was doing a research paper on the properties of rubber and such and I came across a fact that said synthetic rubber and vulcanized rubber is more durable and element withstanding towards the elements, heat/cold/etc.
I know that Luffy is normal rubber but his gear 2 when he heats himself to get faster, would that count as vulcanized/synthetic and if so wouldn't aokiji be less effective?
Rubber vs Ice
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It would probably make sense as Aokiji is the reason why Luffy created Gear Second and Third.
"The Accumulated Filth of All Their Sex and Murder Will Foam Up About Their Waists and All the Whores and Politicians Will Look Up and Shout "Save Us"…and I'll Look Down and Whisper "No"." - Rorshach
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Well he said that after the fight he wanted to get stronger, but do you think that the attacks like ice time would be less effective
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Considering Oda's logic (naming a smoker who ate the smoke devil fruit Smoker), I would say that Luffy will beat Aokiji by swinging around sacks of Salt.
THREAD OVER
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I did use salt and ice on my arm one time when a friend told me it was fun, i have a big scar down my arm
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see? this was already scientifically proved by the person who started the thread.
Aokiji will be scarred for life after his fight with Luffy.
PS: what a dramatic way to get a scar.
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i think that gear2 is a good way to defeat aokiji but surely not the end resolution…maybe he will be defeated by a tagteam ace&luffy...but i hope or better iam sure luffy will manage to defeat aokiji someday cause thats the way of the PK...defeating the strongest marine
...maybe ace will show him a way do power-up his gear second so that his body can`t be freeze -
i mean luffy may end up vulcanizing himself with no way out of it (in scientific terms there is little to do to devulcanize) but i don't see that happening until maybe the last fight
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… WTH is with all this vulcan crap. I think it's pretty much obvious that if Luffy fights Ao Kiji in Gear second, it will be the heat from his body that will nullify his DF powers.
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Vulcanization refers to a specific curing process of rubber involving high heat and the addition of sulfur and other equivalent curatives. It is a chemical process in which polymer molecules are linked to other polymer molecules by atomic bridges composed of sulfur atoms or carbon to carbon bonds. The end result is that the springy rubber molecules become cross-linked to a greater or lesser extent. This makes the bulk material harder, much more durable and also more resistant to chemical attack. It also makes the surface of the material smoother and prevents it from sticking to metal or plastic chemical catalysts.
Uncured natural rubber is sticky and can easily deform when warm, and is brittle when cold. In this state it cannot be used to make articles with a good level of elasticity (where elasticity is defined as the possibility to return to the original shape after a deformation).
There are various vulcanization methods. The economically most important method i.e the vulcanization of tires uses increased pressure and temperature. A typical vulcanization temperature for a passenger tire is 10 minutes at 170 dgrees C. This type of vulcanization is an example of the general vulcanization method named compression molding. The rubber article is intended to adopt the shape of the mold. Other methods for instance those used to make door profiles for cars use hot air vulcanization or microwave heated vulcanization (both continuous processes).
-maybe ace and luffy
i dont think gear 2 is that hot so there must be a Gear 4 down the line in the end -
Uhm… Kaimei, if you think the thread is useless, just don't post.
My impression is that luffy gains the properties of vulcanized rubber when he goes into gear three.
Think about it. When in gear three, luffy inflates his bones to gain a hardness equivalent to that of a car tire, which are generally made of vulcanized rubber mixed with synthetics. So, in gear three, Luffy should be relatively resistant to freezing.
On the other hand, in gear two, Luffy increases the speed of oxygen transfer through his body, allowing his muscles to work considerably harder and therefore produce excess heat. Although it would be extremely damaging to his body to do so, Luffy actually could produce enough heat to melt through any icebarrier produced by aokiji, especially using a high friction spinning attack like rifle.
Luffy developed the gears with the express purpose of defeating Aokiji and others at his level, so we have to imagine that the gears will help him match up better against the ice man.
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but to get to vulcanization one must be heated to x amount of degrees, i do think that gear 3 has vulcanized properties as well as gear 2 but i dont think that those are hot enough or strechy enough for vulcanization, also vulcanization is almost impossible to be undone, meaning that the gear has not yet been discovered.
I think that ace will make Luffy vulcanized. its the most logical explanation -
My understanding is that Luffy's bones are made up of vulcanized rubber to begin with. If his body were completely untreated natural rubber, he wouldn't be able to stand up straight or maintain form because his body would slosh around like a water balloon. Instead he has a skeleton of a higher density tougher rubber, with what seems like all the characteristics of vulcanized rubber.
In Gear 3, he can expand those characteristics of hardness and durability to protect his entire body, which may give him enough resistance against aokiji.
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I know what vulcanised rubber is, I just think it's a crappy idea.
And seeing as how his body is hot enough to evaporate the sweat off his body to the point that it produces steam, I think it's pretty much safe to say that his body WOULD be hot enough.
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Vulcan 300 = Aokiji's Weakness
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then gear 2 should be vulcanized but this is disproved with the properties of vulcanized rubber, you can't devulcanize yet and im sure you cant back whenever OP is set
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@God:
then gear 2 should be vulcanized but this is disproved with the properties of vulcanized rubber, you can't devulcanize yet and im sure you cant back whenever OP is set
And when exactly is OP set? Do I even need to list why that's just a stupid comment.
Wheel of morality turn, turn, turn.
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@God:
then gear 2 should be vulcanized but this is disproved with the properties of vulcanized rubber, you can't devulcanize yet and im sure you cant back whenever OP is set
Perhaps Luffys fruit allows him to switch between vulcanized and natural and syntethic and whatever at will?
Perhaps in the spirit of elasticity he allways returns to his normal rubber after the gear he is currrently using expires, and he needs to maintain the gear to maintain the vulcanization?
Or maybe all of this is a bit too much science for this manga, and it never will make sense?
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Has everyone forgotten about "Gear Giganto"?
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Vulcanization has been discussed to death during Enies Lobby time frame.
Let it die.
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@Don:
i think that gear2 is a good way to defeat aokiji but surely not the end resolution…maybe he will be defeated by a tagteam ace&luffy...but i hope or better iam sure luffy will manage to defeat aokiji someday cause thats the way of the PK...defeating the strongest marine
...maybe ace will show him a way do power-up his gear second so that his body can`t be freezeDude, no Luffy tag teams unless it's really well written. Luffy's never needed help in his fights unless it's very briefly, like against Wapol with Sanji's launch move (Armiee l'air shoot, I think.) That'd be pretty stupid if he just started needing help. Especially from his OP'ed brother (much as I like Ace.)
Banner by 8bit of Otakuboards. I'm using it here too because it's that awesome.
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Heh. Luffy didn't go help Ace when he knew he was dying so I assume it can go the other way too. I know Ace will fill a little sentimental that Luffy is his little brother but they are established pirates that have their own lives so a tag team is out. Plus, Luffy wouldn't allow it. One on one fight.
Anyway, I still fail to see how Gear 2 or 3 could do something against Aokiji. He wasn't even trying when he beat Luffy, Sanji, Zoro and Nico Robin. In addition, I don't think Aokiji will bother the Straw Hat Crew any time soon.
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Gear Second=a lot of heat>ice
Add to that Luffy's super increased speed and add to that if he combines Gear Third with it well…
It's not rocket science.
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Well yeah, his body temperature went up but I didn't see anything close to melting the likes of the ice that Aokiji creates. I mean, if it was that hot then the hits wouldn't just hurt, they would burn and none of the characters attacked by Luffy felt any intense heat…..just a super powerful hit, at least from what we saw. It was said that Gear 2 makes Luffy faster and stronger, but nothing was said that it raises the temperature of his body so high that it can melt stuff.
As to Gear 3, well smashing Aokiji won't do much at all. Plus, we don't know the extent of his powers. He beat all of the heavy hitters in Luffy's crew without any effort. Now they are stronger, but with the recent revelation of 11 pirates with bounties exceeding 100 Million having to keep a low profile in Shabandy to not attract attention from the Marines(Admirals), I think that Aokiji is still a bit out of reach.
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Dude, no Luffy tag teams unless it's really well written. Luffy's never needed help in his fights unless it's very briefly, like against Wapol with Sanji's launch move (Armiee l'air shoot, I think.) That'd be pretty stupid if he just started needing help. Especially from his OP'ed brother (much as I like Ace.)
yeah my opinion also
,take better the second half of my post as a theory,which gives ace again an important role to help his brother to become the PK–-how ironic than for ace who swore this to WB lol)...
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none of the characters attacked by Luffy felt any intense heat…..just a super powerful hit, at least from what we saw.
Congratulations for making one of the best points I've seen on the whole "Luffy + Gear Second = Melt Aokiji" theory.
And to comment on the vulcanization part, yeah that so far is the best way to go against any elements. Only question is how the hell he's gonna get vulcanized.
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You're kinda underestimating the heat generated from Luffy's body and overestimating the melting point of ice. Luffy's heat is enough to evaporate the sweat of his body. It takes a lot more heat energy to evaporate water than melt ice ( I take Physics so I know) so the heat emitted from Luffy's body should be sufficient to nullify his power. You don't need flaming hot hits to melt ice that would burn human skin since proteins have a way higher bond strength than water.
Oh and I meant Luffy use Gear Third WHILE in Gear Second like he did against Nightmare Moria.
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well, IMO the only two people that can beat Aokiji (from what we've seen) are Ace and Teach, but since Ace is in Impel Down it makes Blackbeard the only one. well, maybe Dragon if we knew sth about his powers…
but Luffy STILL CAN NOT BEAT AOKIJI.
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It takes a lot more heat energy to evaporate water than melt ice
That hardly applies to Aokiji imo. he is able continiously apply cold to counteract any heat.
Hell his icetime was supposed to last a week and he flash froze the strawhats. Just how cold is he? if its close to the absolute zero i imagine it would require more energy to melt his ice then to evaporate roomtemperature water in the same ammount of time.
bioling down to it we just don't know what rules Oda has set for Aokijis Ice powers, heat might not be the way to go to defeat him.
What the…? Holy smurf am I slow! Until this statement of yours I never even realized that an octopus is actually serving octopusballs. Talk about not seeing the forest because of too many trees. facepalm
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I'm not saying he can defeat him but I am saying he can at least hit him now.
It's really quite simple, heat is a weakness of cold therefore it naturally nullifies his powers allowing him to be hit.
But just because he can be hit doesn't mean that he's beaten. As Crocodile and Enel proved, it takes a lot more to beat a Logia than figuring out how to hit him.
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It's really quite simple, heat is a weakness of cold therefore it naturally nullifies his powers allowing him to be hit.
You missunderstood what i meant.
I'l repeat it again a bit differently:
We just don't know what rules Oda has set for Aokijis Ice powers, heat might not be the way to nullify his power.I mean if heat just nullifies his powers why would steaming be any better then room temperature? It seems to me we arent talking about melting Aokijis ice anymore, are we? So what rules would govern that?
for all we know he might be able to generate more cold faster then any source of heat that can be produced on earth. We have only assumed taht heat will be his weakness.
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well, on the other hand Luffy came up with Gears especially to kick Aokiji ass, so if you think about it, Gear 2 can be useful somehow, couse wats the sense of creating an atack that is pointless anyways?
about Aokiji temperatur - I think its close to absolute zero, else how would that path was supposed to last for a week?
Luffy with his Gear 2 may not create enough steam to defeat Aokiji, but maybe he can avoid being frozen? -
Where was it said that he came up with g2 and g3 to beat Aokiji ? I remember that he came up with them to become stronger. He observerd CP9 and copied them. He wasn't thinking about Aokiji at that time. It was just a mean to get stronger.
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Why are we discussing steam? Steam is just a by-product of his high body temperature which I suspect is hot enough to nullify Ao Kiji's powers.
To Gorlom: No, we don't know the rules but we can have educated guesses and my guess is that a high temperature (enough to melt ice) can nullify his powers.
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that a high temperature (enough to melt ice) can nullify his powers.
Anything above 0*C melts ice. He'd be nullified by room temperature if that was the case.
Edit: Just how hot do you think Luffy is in Gear 2?
Is he ~43+C (as in the highest possible before a human dies in the real world)
100C (H2O boiling point.)
or is he even hotter?What the…? Holy smurf am I slow! Until this statement of yours I never even realized that an octopus is actually serving octopusballs. Talk about not seeing the forest because of too many trees. facepalm
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Don't forget that ice can't form at room temperature to begin with and that Ao Kiji is forming it with his DF powers. Think of it this way, do ice cubs automatically melt if you take them out of the freezer? Same case with Ao Kiji. Room temperature won't nullify his powers because it isn't hot enough to melt him to the required degree.
I always thought that was a plot hole of his technique actually. His heat comes from his increased metabolism. Yet if his body heat is high, his enzymes will be denatured and he'd die. Unless his rubber powers make himself an insulator to heat. However it has been proven in the past it is not the case.
Regardless I believe it is safe to assume that Luffy's body is really hot if it's enough to heat the sweat of his body to the point where it forms steam and so, I assume, would be enough to melt ice.
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do ice cubs automatically melt if you take them out of the freezer
Yes. they just dont turn liquid instantly.
Room temperature won't nullify his powers because it isn't hot enough to melt him to the required degree.
How can anything "melt him to the required degree"? He seems to be able to flash freeze it all close to the absolute zero with any part of his body (unlike Crocodile who could only use his hand to drain moisture).
(Hmmm.. I'm not sure about my physics anymore.. but couldn't a different preassure cause the water in Luffys body to steam before 100*C? or would that put the boiling point higher?)
What the…? Holy smurf am I slow! Until this statement of yours I never even realized that an octopus is actually serving octopusballs. Talk about not seeing the forest because of too many trees. facepalm
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Lower pressure means lower boiling point.
That's what I meant, they don't instantly melt.
And it's simple, I mean to nullify Ao Kiji's power you have to be hot enough.
Do you think you could nullify Croc's power with a palm full of Water?
Or how one small ball of salt wasn't enough to remove Odz's shadow.
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Do you think you could nullify Croc's power with a palm full of Water?
Or how one small ball of salt wasn't enough to remove Odz's shadow.
Oggy wasn't a logia. and yes, a palm full of water is enough to nullify the area it touches. Robin only had a small vial that she intended to use to stab him.
Personaly I'm more inclined to belive it's some form of matter that stops logias reaction power then another reaction.
so far water nullifies airid and rubber nullifies electric current. heat is so immaterial so unsubstantial and the laws get iffy.
What the…? Holy smurf am I slow! Until this statement of yours I never even realized that an octopus is actually serving octopusballs. Talk about not seeing the forest because of too many trees. facepalm
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It was an example. My point is that you need to have enough of something to have an effect. One drop of Water isn't gonna do shit to Crocodile.
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It is going to allow him to get stabbed if you drive a knife through that drop of water…. might be a bit hard to hit though.
What the…? Holy smurf am I slow! Until this statement of yours I never even realized that an octopus is actually serving octopusballs. Talk about not seeing the forest because of too many trees. facepalm
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That's your opinion. Does one drop of water turn a bunch of sand into mud?
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And electricity doesn't become solid because you slap it with some rubber.
It passes as a current through a conductor and most likely wont even notice if you slap that conductor with an isolator, unless you put the isolator in the path of the current.That water makes sand turn to mud is just something people thought was a reasonable logical explanation. Physical laws does not apply to Logias and their weaknesses.
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And it's simple, I mean to nullify Ao Kiji's power you have to be hot enough.
When was this stated? And once again, I doubt that Luffy creates enough heat to lay a hand on Aokiji. The thing is, we don't know what it takes to nullify his powers, and if it is heat it'll be more than Luffy produces. The type of heat needed for nullification would be on the level of Ace or Diable Jambe, not a Luffy with a higher body temperature. Besides, as I have said I doubt Gear 2 and 3 will do anything against the likes of Aokiji.
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I was guessing -_- I was assuming, what if…
You could be right for all I know, I'm just assuming.
Quit being such a fan boy:/
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A fanboy of what? I'm just using what I know to come to a conclusion. I just didn't see how a Gear 2 and/or 3 Luffy could beat Aokiji.
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I just explained it -_-
ASSUMING Luffy's body heat can nullify Ao Kiji's unhittabillaty (yes I invented a damn word so you get the point), Luffy has a chance of beating Ao Kiji. He also has the option of combining Gear Third with Gear Second like he did against Nightmare Moria. Not just use Gear Third because then he couldn't hurt him.
Now just because he can hit him doesn't mean he can beat him otherwise Crocodile and Enel would have been a walk in the park. I just think that it is probable that Luffy's body heat would be enough to nullify his powers when he's in Gear Second. That's all, just a guess which may or may not be wrong.
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A fanboy of what? I'm just using what I know to come to a conclusion. I just didn't see how a Gear 2 and/or 3 Luffy could beat Aokiji.
I don't think any one is saying that it necessarily would. It's just that if Luffy had to fight Aokiji and DID win, how would he do it?
Gear two would give Luffy a reasonable shot at defending against Aokiji's quick freeze attack because the greater heat could prevent him from being immediately frozen and rendered helpless.
Gear three would give luffy an attack that would at minimum smash aokiji into ice cubes thanks to the greater power and area of attack. Also, if
I'm right that Gear three will give the inflated part of Luffy's body greater resistance against cold thanks to transmission of some aspects of Luffy's vulcanized bones to the rest of his body, then luffy could repeatedly smash Aokiji without being frozen.So, if Luffy WERE to defeat aokiji, he would at least have a CHANCE of doing so by combining the heat from gear two with the greater resistance from gear three and smash Aokji over and over and over again until all his little ice shards were melted.
Even if I'm right about the above assumptions, it would still take a Jet Gigant Gatling and a hot day to pull it off. But I do think that the gears would give Luffy the chance at victory that he lacked on Long Ring island.
That is why he developed them after all.
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it`s stated that luffy thought about this gears after loosing against aokiji…so luffy made this new techniques
a) to protect his nakama and becoming a stronger fighter
b) getting something in his hand against some well-known ice-manalso the steam from luffy shows that their is a huge pressure which gives luffy a higher temperature and this is surely one way to handle aokiji
s DF.. in my opinion its sure not the end resolution to defeat aokiji but in TB we saw that luffy could combinate the gears which will give him like boiga said, surely a chance to survive his attacks without being frozen and to actually "hurt" aokiji...
but i think we can be sure that
a)the gears get some upgrades(like already with combining G2 and G3)
b) luffy will get also some new techniques in the new world(maybe using his "spirit" for some direct attacks, like to bunch a laser beam(not that he will produce some laser beam just for better understanding that he could use his spirit better when he uses it in a concentrated form ,not like i think of it now just"flowing" around his body orso)
c) to defeat aokiji he will find a unique way to be resistant against ice for the fight..(but i don`t doubt that heating his body up with G2 is this special way...:happy:)
