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    Naruto Thread IV

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    • Cyan D. Funk
      Cyan D. Funk @Tamaki Kawazoe
      @Tamaki Kawazoe last edited by
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      @Fire Fist:

      Well, this one isn't 100% true. There's Nawaki, the two sound ninja Gaara killed, and the other two sound ninja that Orochimaru sacrificed to do Edo Tensei. Plus, Obito. But that's about it.

      Okay, let's rephrase that:

      Anyone under eighteen that we give two shits about is immortal.
      @Tamaki:

      No your thinking of Danzo.

      ugggggghhhh

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      • Kaiolino
        Kaiolino
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        Is there a plot twist in this series that hasn't been predicted by everyone.

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        • Cyan D. Funk
          Cyan D. Funk @Kaiolino
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          @Kaiolino:

          Is there a plot twist in this series that hasn't been predicted by everyone.

          The terrible, crippling price for using the jutsu that completely fucks with the natural order and revives zombies to fight there family and friends is

          ! fame

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            Tamaki Kawazoe @Robby
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            @RobbyBevard:

            Thanks for the insight, Juju.

            Sorry but im not Juju. I was just making that joke for the guys who actually thought that it really was danzo.

            People check this AWSOME anime out! It may not be as good as one piece but its still pretty awsome non the less!

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ZPGiZQ9XQw

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            • Smudger
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              I personally want it to last at least another year. (50 chapters roughly)

              Anything less than that and I'd doubt Kishitty would have enough page space to cover the secondary characters, as well as wrap up the mass of foreshadowing made the past few years and beyond. At least to some decent degree.

              Then I might be able to justify keeping up with this series all these years.

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                Tamaki Kawazoe @Smudger
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                @Smudger:

                I personally want it to last at least another year. (50 chapters roughly)

                Anything less than that and I'd doubt Kishitty would have enough page space to cover the secondary characters, as well as wrap up the mass of foreshadowing made the past few years and beyond. At least to some decent degree.

                Then I might be able to justify keeping up with this series all these years.

                Unlike bleach….

                People check this AWSOME anime out! It may not be as good as one piece but its still pretty awsome non the less!

                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ZPGiZQ9XQw

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                • Skadi
                  Skadi
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                  i hope they hurry to show up kakuzu, i wanna know more about him 😧

                  ♥ FishyOctopus Art Tumblr|Fishy_Octopus @ Twitter ♥

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                    Tamaki Kawazoe @Skadi
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                    @Skadi:

                    i hope they hurry to show up kakuzu, i wanna know more about him 😧

                    Hes a guy who likes money and hearts. whats there to know?

                    People check this AWSOME anime out! It may not be as good as one piece but its still pretty awsome non the less!

                    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ZPGiZQ9XQw

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                    • Cyan D. Funk
                      Cyan D. Funk
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                      Kakuzu's an interesting character, therefore we will learn nothing of him and he will be talked to redeath off screen by Choji.

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                      • Flux
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                        So Haku and Zabuza are back? (With the Impure World Ressurrection I take it)

                        Originally Posted by sanji499

                        I wonder what was Bale's reaction when the stunt double broke the imax camera?

                        Originally Posted by Silvers Rayleigh

                        In the United States we don't have much manga around, specifically One Piece, and mainly the newer chapters - Jan 2011

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                        • T
                          Tamaki Kawazoe @Cyan D. Funk
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                          @Cyan:

                          Kakuzu's an interesting character, therefore we will learn nothing of him and he will be talked to redeath off screen by Choji.

                          Nope just give him money and he will fade away on the spot.

                          People check this AWSOME anime out! It may not be as good as one piece but its still pretty awsome non the less!

                          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ZPGiZQ9XQw

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                          • Silverblade
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                            In his childhood Kakuzu was saving money to by a dog named Tiny from the petshop. But evil communist ninja nationalized the petshop and Kakuzu never saw Tiny ever again.

                            Just another tragedy.

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                            • ChesCa
                              ChesCa @Silverblade
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                              @Tamaki:

                              Nope just give him money and he will fade away on the spot.

                              Like using Bribe in Final Fantasy X? That's the stupidest thing I've ever–
                              @Silverblade:

                              In his childhood Kakuzu was saving money to by a dog named Tiny from the petshop. But evil communist ninja nationalized the petshop and Kakuzu never saw Tiny ever again.

                              Just another tragedy.

                              …
                              I all of a sudden want to believe that the former is more likely.

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                              • M
                                Muah @Kaiolino
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                                @Kaiolino:

                                Is there a plot twist in this series that hasn't been predicted by everyone.

                                Sure!

                                It turns out that itachi was actually good.(well as good as you can be killing everyone who ever loved you).

                                And there's an eye technique stronger than the ichigogan and byakuyagan.

                                Really thoughvI hope sasuke kills everyone.

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                                • F
                                  Friend of Luffy and Gon
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                                  Jiraiya not coming back is confirmed, I really do hope though Hidan can't come back because I would ask, how? He didn't die. I must admit I do like Kabutomaru being hax but not this much…

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                                  • Silverblade
                                    Silverblade
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                                    Itachi always wanted a dog for his birthday. He even thought out a name for it - Tiny. But his parents gave him a brother instead.

                                    Everything went downhill from there. Just another tragedy.

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                                    • Cyan D. Funk
                                      Cyan D. Funk
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                                      Clearly, Tiny gets reincarnated after he dies/gets taken by communists.

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                                      • Outerspec
                                        Outerspec @Robby
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                                        @RobbyBevard:

                                        If by "an arc ago" you mean some 200-300 chapters and several arcs back, sure.

                                        Holy crap does time fly. I didn't realize it was so far back but true enough it was awhile ago. My main point though is that Shikamaru already got a good amount of development compared to his fellow peers. Probably the most development outside of Team 7, but I digress. It's a moot point.

                                        @RobbyBevard:

                                        Well beyond the fact Choji hasn't done ANYTHING since… it would demonstrate that the ninja world has risks, missions can be failed, sacrifices can be meaningless, and that anyone could die, all while giving Shikimaru development.

                                        The entire mission was a failure and that in itself gave Shikamaru development since he was the leader of the mission. The taste of failure is something to digest and learn from.

                                        ! Of course you're right to say it would have had a greater impact if Neji and/or Chouji would have died, but as I said before I liked that none of them died so early in the story.

                                        @RobbyBevard:

                                        Instead it laid down the edict that anyone under 18 is immortal, which hasn't been contested since. Loses some of the drama and significance that way.

                                        @Cyan:

                                        Okay, let's rephrase that:

                                        Anyone under eighteen that we give two shits about is immortal.

                                        ugggggghhhh

                                        What about Haku? Somehow he has a plethora of fans and he died in the first major arc of the story. Young and dead. Well, right now he's young and dead-ish.

                                        Everything's Eventual…

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                                        • Badass SnoCone
                                          Badass SnoCone
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                                          Question: on a scale of 1 to 10 how much better has Naruto gotten and is it worth picking up again?

                                          Cyan D. Funk Outerspec 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                          • Cyan D. Funk
                                            Cyan D. Funk @Badass SnoCone
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                                            @Badass:

                                            Question: on a scale of 1 to 10 how much better has Naruto gotten and is it worth picking up again?

                                            -4 .

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                                            • Robby
                                              Robby @Friend of Luffy and Gon
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                                              Tiny is the core key missing in all the dark hearts. Only Tiny can make them feel loved again.

                                              @Friend:

                                              Jiraiya not coming back is confirmed, .

                                              How do you figure that? Because Kabuto couldn't find his body?

                                              Well duh. No body, no funeral… He ain't dead.

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                                              • Outerspec
                                                Outerspec @Badass SnoCone
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                                                @Badass:

                                                Question: on a scale of 1 to 10 how much better has Naruto gotten and is it worth picking up again?

                                                I'd give it a 7 but I'm one of the oddballs on here that still likes Naruto.

                                                Everything's Eventual…

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                                                • F
                                                  Friend of Luffy and Gon
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                                                  It depends on what you want from the series. As far as I'm concerned there are few deaths that remained powerful in the series. As it happens I'm a massive Jiraiya fan so I appreciate that he wasn't resurrected. Kisame died a fairly shitty death although it was by Maito Gai one of the remaining alive awesome characters. Of course it depends how we look at the series since we all have different tastes. Sasuke fans probably have it best overall. I still don't get how Kabutomaru had the time to get all those bodies, but then again I'm pretty sure the explanation for edo tensei is pretty stretched now, it's not like I remember back in the days of Old Man Sarutobi.

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                                                  • Robby
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                                                    It's really annoying when you point out the author has a problem utiilizing death properly and that none of the lead hero characters can ever die, and then someone always jumps to point out "Hey, fodder villain 3 died that one time!"

                                                    It's… not the same thing in any sense of storytelling.

                                                    Particularly when all the deaths happened earlier in the story, and there haven't been any since, in years and years.

                                                    And particularly when every random shmuck that ever died is suddenly back and cameo-ing as a zombie, including characters that died before the series even began that we never met.

                                                    Its the main reason I don't really think Jiraiya is dead. I don't think Kishi has the stones to have a heroic character actually die, no matter how good a scene they might have had.

                                                    @Friend:

                                                    As it happens I'm a massive Jiraiya fan so I appreciate that he wasn't resurrected.

                                                    Of course he wasn't. He never died.

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                                                    • Cyan D. Funk
                                                      Cyan D. Funk
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                                                      The last good heroic death Kishi wrote was Sarutobi's.

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                                                      • Outerspec
                                                        Outerspec @Robby
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                                                        @RobbyBevard:

                                                        It's really annoying when you point out the author has a problem utiilizing death properly and that none of the lead hero characters can ever die, and then someone always jumps to point out "Hey, fodder villain 3 died that one time!"

                                                        It's… not the same thing in any sense of storytelling.

                                                        Particularly when all the deaths happened earlier in the story, and there haven't been any since, in years and years.

                                                        And particularly when every random shmuck that ever died is suddenly back and cameo-ing as a zombie, including characters that died before the series even began that we never met.

                                                        Its the main reason I don't really think Jiraiya is dead. I don't think Kishi has the stones to have a heroic character actually die, no matter how good a scene they might have had.

                                                        Of course he wasn't. He never died.

                                                        There hasn't been any young deaths since then but Kishi has killed off Hiruzen, Asuma, Jiraiya (though you believe him to be alive), and most of Akatsuki including Itachi. I can't say he doesn't know how to kill off characters when he needs to.

                                                        I do think Kishi has the will to kill off one of the main young shinobi who you think are immortal in Kishi's writing. I can bet you one of them will die in fact by the end of the series.

                                                        I wouldn't count Haku as some random fodder villain even if I admit his time in the overall story was spectacularly short.

                                                        Everything's Eventual…

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                                                          Hisoga @Cyan D. Funk
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                                                          @Cyan:

                                                          The last good heroic death Kishi wrote was Sarutobi's.

                                                          totally agree with you.. jiraiya's death scene sucks..:cwy:

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                                                          • Cyan D. Funk
                                                            Cyan D. Funk @Hisoga
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                                                            @Hisoga:

                                                            totally agree with you.. jiraiya's death scene sucks..:cwy:

                                                            Jiraiya's not dead.

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                                                              Friend of Luffy and Gon
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                                                              Jiraiya's death scene was beautiful. One of my main problems with Naruto is the Uchiha stuff, I don't mind sage prophecies but that's because I like senju characters. Obviously not all the Uchihas were dicks, for example I can see where Sasuke's dad came from in not acknowledging him, and I really liked Obito in the Kakashi mini arc. I would have preferred expansion on the byakugan because that was a good technique, powerful but with sufficient weakness.

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                                                              • choperman
                                                                choperman @Friend of Luffy and Gon
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                                                                alright did some naruto reading and came up with something…. here's some stuff that's important to remember

                                                                I doubt madara is the last time we'll see Izanagi whether we like it our not here's I'll hide the text for people who don't care
                                                                lots taken from naruto wiki to sum up easily.... copy/paste
                                                                [hide]

                                                                The Sage of the Six Paths use of Izanagi was not limited to avoiding death; with it he split the chakra of the Ten-Tails into the nine tailed beasts. The process he used is explained to have initially involved the administration of imagination, and the spiritual energy which forms the basis of Yin chakra to create shape and form from nothingness. Then, through the application of vitality, and the physical energy which forms the basis of Yang chakra, he would breathe life into the prior form. Thus, a technique with the power to turn imagination into reality was born, known as Izanagi.

                                                                well we found out that naruto has the yang charka of the nine tails as his dad put the yin into himself with the demon dead summoning seal, so currently he has the yang which breathes life into things, hence why when he activated it yamamoto's wood started too grow :ninja:…. no snickering!!!!

                                                                well that means that naruto only has half of energy it takes to use this technique since the other was taken, I'm guessing if you had both it would be meaningless though as killer bee doesn't seem to use the technique

                                                                so why do I bring this up, well danzo used the technique too, he used senju clan DNA and Sharingan eyes, well this is just a guess but I think that this might be because senju has the yang and uchiha has the yin, why do I guess this, because back along time ago at the gokage summit arc madara said that the sage of the six paths made the uchiha clan with his eyes and the senju clan with his body, now I've taken up an assumption that senju got the yang energy and uchiha had the yin, why because senju's brightest member, the first hokage had the ability to make trees which is symbolic of giving life, and uchiha have the ability to cast great genjutsus which to me seems to go right along with creating a shape to nothingness

                                                                so lets say that's the case now naruto has yang, well sasuke was told which I'll try to find the link to latter that the EMS had a technique that the MS couldn't use, I'm guessing this has to do with the yin control, if my prior assumptions were correct

                                                                and Naruto has been talking about a technique that he needs the nine tails for, I'm guessing to full control the yang charaka

                                                                so the final part I get to is that I think after the fight Naruto and Sasuke will team up and some how use both there skills to create something that can battle the ten tails, which madara would somehow bring about (probably finding out someway to get the yin charka of the nine tails from minato and thus forgetting about the other half)

                                                                so basically, with a lot of guess work, my prediction is Naruto and Sasuke will fight, and realize the others got the half they need, madara comes up with the ten tails and everyone is powerless, so naruo and sasuke use there final techniques together and create some big ass monster that beats the ten tails or a seal that seals madara and the ten tails forever

                                                                that's my prediction[/hide]

                                                                Member of Beelzebub is Freakin' Awesome Group

                                                                what I'm catching up on currently: Gintama, lone wolf & cub, Nausicaä of the Valley of the Wind, and lost in poem (by our very own AP member GEPPETTOSMONSTER)

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                                                                • Tsukishima
                                                                  Tsukishima @choperman
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                                                                  @choperman:

                                                                  [hide]
                                                                  well we found out that naruto has the yang charka of the nine tails as his dad put the yin into himself with the demon dead summoning seal, so currently he has the yang which breathes life into things, hence why when he activated it yamamoto's wood started too grow :ninja:…. no snickering!!!!

                                                                  well that means that naruto only has half of energy it takes to use this technique since the other was taken, I'm guessing if you had both it would be meaningless though as killer bee doesn't seem to use the technique

                                                                  so why do I bring this up, well danzo used the technique too, he used senju clan DNA and Sharingan eyes, well this is just a guess but I think that this might be because senju has the yang and uchiha has the yin, why do I guess this, because back along time ago at the gokage summit arc madara said that the sage of the six paths made the uchiha clan with his eyes and the senju clan with his body, now I've taken up an assumption that senju got the yang energy and uchiha had the yin, why because senju's brightest member, the first hokage had the ability to make trees which is symbolic of giving life, and uchiha have the ability to cast great genjutsus which to me seems to go right along with creating a shape to nothingness

                                                                  so lets say that's the case now naruto has yang, well sasuke was told which I'll try to find the link to latter that the EMS had a technique that the MS couldn't use, I'm guessing this has to do with the yin control, if my prior assumptions were correct

                                                                  and Naruto has been talking about a technique that he needs the nine tails for, I'm guessing to full control the yang charaka

                                                                  so the final part I get to is that I think after the fight Naruto and Sasuke will team up and some how use both there skills to create something that can battle the ten tails, which madara would somehow bring about (probably finding out someway to get the yin charka of the nine tails from minato and thus forgetting about the other half)

                                                                  so basically, with a lot of guess work, my prediction is Naruto and Sasuke will fight, and realize the others got the half they need, madara comes up with the ten tails and everyone is powerless, so naruo and sasuke use there final techniques together and create some big ass monster that beats the ten tails or a seal that seals madara and the ten tails forever

                                                                  that's my prediction[/hide]

                                                                  I don't think anyone in this forums is interested enough in Naruto's story to read this post.

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                                                                  • H
                                                                    Hisoga @Cyan D. Funk
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                                                                    @Cyan:

                                                                    Jiraiya's not dead.

                                                                    thats why it suck.. 😉

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                                                                    • Robby
                                                                      Robby @Outerspec
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                                                                      @Outerspec:

                                                                      There hasn't been any young deaths since then but Kishi has killed off Hiruzen,

                                                                      Who?

                                                                      Asuma,

                                                                      In one of the most hamfisted blatantly foreshadowed ways possible.

                                                                      Jiraiya (though you believe him to be alive),

                                                                      No body, no funeral, no marking off of the frog scroll, not dead. He'll show up for a happy celebration at the end. Kishi even went out of his way to excuse him not being a zombie, even though he'd easily be the most potent and dramatically interesting zombie of the bunch.

                                                                      and most of Akatsuki including Itachi.

                                                                      Villains. Do you not understand the distinction between "under 18 heroic lead" and "70 year old villain?"

                                                                      And they're all back for a romp as zombies ANYWAY. I don't even know what to classify Orochimaru as, since he popped out of Sasuke's neck that one time and in 50% Kabuto and… whatever the hell he is.

                                                                      I can't say he doesn't know how to kill off characters when he needs to.

                                                                      I do think Kishi has the will to kill off one of the main young shinobi who you think are immortal in Kishi's writing. I can bet you one of them will die in fact by the end of the series.

                                                                      He's had ample setup to kill Choji, Neji, Gaara, Hinata, and Sasuke on multiple occassions. They've all had death scenes. They've all cheated out of it one way or another.

                                                                      I wouldn't count Haku as some random fodder villain even if I admit his time in the overall story was spectacularly short.

                                                                      VILLAIN. And from the start of the series at that. And now back as a zombie. Show me the young hero character that's died in the last 500 chapters?

                                                                      It's unwritten shonen pact that the hero never dies and always pulls through and thats fine. But when you play the death card, and then go backsies on it, that cheapens everything. Choji taking the SUICIDE PILL was pretty terrible, but Pain dragonballing the entire village that he had just nuked was far far worse, and more recent.

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                                                                      • Kaiolino
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                                                                        Sasuke had a death scene?

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                                                                        • MarcelloF
                                                                          MarcelloF @Kaiolino
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                                                                          @Kaiolino:

                                                                          Sasuke had a death scene?

                                                                          Haku "killed" him.

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                                                                          • Silverblade
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                                                                            During his childhood at the Fishman island, Kisame had a dogfish named Tiny. But one day came the Tenryuubito slavers and Kisame has never seen Tiny again.

                                                                            Just another tragedy.

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                                                                            • Robby
                                                                              Robby @Kaiolino
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                                                                              @Kaiolino:

                                                                              Sasuke had a death scene?

                                                                              Deidara set off a nuke that covered a couple miles that Sasuke was 2 feet in front of.

                                                                              Across the land people remarked "Welhp, Sasuke is dead." but then he was okay the next chapter.

                                                                              And he's had soooo many other opportunities to be killed. I mean, Haku… Orochimaru... the kage summit... Danzo... (where afterwords he was blind and chakra-less and Naruto just let him go...) his ENTIRE fight with Itachi was Itachi going with one hand tied behind his back TRYING to lose... and he still barely survived. If he hadn't been Itachi's great hope, he would have been dead in seconds.

                                                                              If Sasuke didn't have plot hax and was just a regular villain, he would have been dead long ago.

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                                                                              • choperman
                                                                                choperman @Tsukishima
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                                                                                @Tsukishima:

                                                                                I don't think anyone in this forums is interested enough in Naruto's story to read this post.

                                                                                :sad: .

                                                                                EDIT: @ Robby I agree with what your saying… but were on a one piece forum when has anyone but ace and WB died... does oars count? and most likely a SH will never die, so I really don't try to be to critical of stuff like that since I'm a huge one piece fan

                                                                                Member of Beelzebub is Freakin' Awesome Group

                                                                                what I'm catching up on currently: Gintama, lone wolf & cub, Nausicaä of the Valley of the Wind, and lost in poem (by our very own AP member GEPPETTOSMONSTER)

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                                                                                • Silence
                                                                                  Silence @choperman
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                                                                                  @choperman:

                                                                                  :sad: .

                                                                                  EDIT: @ Robby I agree with what your saying… but were on a one piece forum when has anyone but ace and WB died... does oars count? and most likely a SH will never die, so I really don't try to be to critical of stuff like that since I'm a huge one piece fan

                                                                                  That's not really relevant, is it?

                                                                                  I mean, because in One Piece NOBODY dies or people rarely die - not even villains. Or they only die in flashbacks if they're mentor figures. It's a feature of the manga that dying is not the point - it's living.

                                                                                  It's quite a bit different from Naruto where people actually die fairly often: villains and a few good guys actually die with some regularity. What Robby is saying though is that people under the age of 18 have come back from what is stated to be 100% death situations. Choji, Neji, Gaara, Hinata, and Sasuke. Or actual death. It's actually rare that they DON'T. People who are dead are brought back to life on the regular - and that makes death cheap.

                                                                                  Originally Posted by Wagomu

                                                                                  There's a great lighthearted vibe around here, because no matter how serious we might get, we're all together because of some magical pirate.

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                                                                                    Robby is very accurate on Sasuke's death, without plotkai Gaysauce would have died several times, as far as I'm concerned he survived like a parasite, attacking old and sick men, suicide bombers and surviving by sacrificing his summon. Admittedly said summon was later cloned but we have established the meaningless of death in Naruto.

                                                                                    Actually Robby may well have a point on Jiraiya's "death", until we have seen the scroll we can't be entirely sure, that and Kabutomaru could have brought him back if he was alive. Although it doesn't matter how convincing a point Robby or any of us may make, because it is more likely that we will remember the small plot details better than Kishimoto will.

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                                                                                      Benjaman @choperman
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                                                                                      And most likely a SH will never die,

                                                                                      A burning Merry demands an explanation :ninja:

                                                                                      HEROMAN… ATTACK!!

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                                                                                        ponx @Benjaman
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                                                                                        @Benjaman:

                                                                                        A burning Merry demands an explanation :ninja:

                                                                                        Mini-Merry is explaining it to you :ninja:

                                                                                        [Edit] Okay that was way out of topic, before my post got deleted I'll try to add something…..constructive....[/edit]

                                                                                        Well, a war of this scale will have great impact on the rest of the world.

                                                                                        Now, Oda did it by killing off Whitebeard. And even though no top-tier marine is dead, Sengoku and Garp retired thus changing the marines. So there we have the "great impact".

                                                                                        Kubo…..well. The old man (forgot his name, Yamamoto something) didn't die, aaand as far as i remember no big shots from the Gotei 13 died. Aizen got defeated, sure. But he was a new rising power, and not in a status quo position. So him losing doesn't actually change anything, so after Bleach's war........nothing happened.

                                                                                        Now its Kishi's turn. It would probably be nice to see the deaths of a cpl of Kages n high-ranking ninjas. But I think we all know whats going to happen. Tobidara beaten, Naruto's Love no Jutsu unites people, they hold hands n be friends n yadda yadda. Although, in a way, that would be a "great impact".

                                                                                        There, its nice to be constructive 🙂

                                                                                        ![](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/XEZjvYQCMTFCwwmEOXRjtkFYCNB3o75YpHDtdg3X8g3Wp0mOXK nEzbGKgUwmUj0LxZ1fcxor5zCxpPyzXaOFgl_cSP6PbyKe0T-N2pixkRHGCDlFWYJ-UkpIKfVf5gVb62nN2sHNmQ) [RPG Time is now fully colored. Check it out!!

                                                                                        Thanx for everyone's support](http://forums.arlongpark.net/showthread.php?t=37915&p=2813930#top)

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                                                                                        • Outerspec
                                                                                          Outerspec @Robby
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                                                                                          @RobbyBevard:

                                                                                          Who?

                                                                                          The 3rd Hokage. >_>

                                                                                          @RobbyBevard:

                                                                                          No body, no funeral, no marking off of the frog scroll, not dead. He'll show up for a happy celebration at the end. Kishi even went out of his way to excuse him not being a zombie, even though he'd easily be the most potent and dramatically interesting zombie of the bunch.

                                                                                          We'll just have to agree to disagree on this and wait for the outcome which I believe to have already happened, Jiraiya's death.

                                                                                          @RobbyBevard:

                                                                                          Villains. Do you not understand the distinction between "under 18 heroic lead" and "70 year old villain?"

                                                                                          You never said anything about the person having to be a "villain" in your original statement dealing with, "anyone under 18 is immortal" so I never made that distinction. Obito has already been pointed out so I found no need to bring him up again.

                                                                                          I'm talking about death in general and Kishi has done his fair share of it in his manga. Not just to random fodder people either, quite important people on both sides of the forces.

                                                                                          @RobbyBevard:

                                                                                          He's had ample setup to kill Choji, Neji, Gaara, Hinata, and Sasuke on multiple occassions. They've all had death scenes. They've all cheated out of it one way or another.

                                                                                          As I said before I do believe Kishi will kill off one of the main young shinobi by series end despite the actions of the past. Kishi can foreshadow a death at any time. He can deliver a death at anytime. It's not impossible or even unlikely that he'll kill off Sasuke or Naruto in the future and are they not the 2 main characters of this manga? Are they not young and probably Kishi's favorite characters? Surely, Naruto counts as a "good guy" and not a "villain".

                                                                                          You may see them as immortal because they've survived in the past but that does not mean they can be so lucky again. The other young shinobi of Konoha aren't as vital to the storyline as Sasuke or Naruto, and to see one of them die some time in the future would add an unprecedented depth to the manga.

                                                                                          Everything's Eventual…

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                                                                                          • Robby
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                                                                                            Quit trying to find loopholes in wording to try and get a technical victory while entirely avoiding the intent of the statement, which has already been clarified several times.

                                                                                            Yes, there's been death in the series, of villains, old people, and fodder. While anyone at all important from Naruto's peer group, that the audience might actually care about, gets retcons and magic fixes and jutsus that didn't exist before to avoid any potential danger that might befall them, and are thus immortal. Tossing death away so easily from them when it DOES hit other characters, showing that Kishi is willing, makes it even more meaningless.

                                                                                            Unprecedented depth would be really easy. It would just have to exist.

                                                                                            Naruto hasn't even talked to Hinata since she confessed her feelings and nearly died in front of him, nearly 100 chapters and two years ago. But then, he hasn't exactly grieved for Jiraiya either.

                                                                                            If Kishi can't handle a boy interacting with a girl, he certainly can't deal with any harder emotions.

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                                                                                            • Outerspec
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                                                                                              I don't even know how to find loopholes in wordings and a victory is hardly important. I'm being pretty straightforward about this. I honestly believe either Naruto or Sasuke, or even one of Naruto's peers will die by the end of the series. I know they've lived before as that is obvious to everyone, but it doesn't mean they can't die in the future. I'm not trying to say, 'Hey everything's a possibility so why don't you just believe it's possible one of them can die.' No, everything's possible and I'm not coming from that perspective. I see Kishi killing one of them off. Of the original group of the Konoha 12 that includes Naruto or Sasuke.

                                                                                              Sure, you can label everyone that has died in this series as "villains, old people, and fodder" but all that does is generalize the group into an impersonal category of random dead people. The characters do have names, back stories, and importance to the fanbase and storyline. It's not like Kishi can't do death properly which is my primary point. How could you say Naruto didn't mourn for Jiraiya though? He spent long enough I think.

                                                                                              I understand what you're getting at though. You think the young shinobi are immortals. You think Kishi doesn't have the balls to kill off any of these characters. He may kill off other characters who are less important and hold a lesser significance and connection with the readers but no, he can't really HIT the readers with true a death scene for someone like Neji. That's fine. I have a hunch you'll be proven mistaken by series end though.

                                                                                              Everything's Eventual…

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                                                                                              • Silence
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                                                                                                Your argument is mostly speculative.

                                                                                                Robby's argument is supported by fact and trends. Kishimoto utilizes death frequently, but rarely for characters whose loss really means something to the reader, because he so often brings them back to life or narratively mishandles their demise. Tragic deaths remain the domain of villains and the elders. Naruto's peer group remains invincible - this is just the way things are. You can't really argue your way around it but to argue against an entire manga's worth of proof.

                                                                                                Originally Posted by Wagomu

                                                                                                There's a great lighthearted vibe around here, because no matter how serious we might get, we're all together because of some magical pirate.

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                                                                                                • Outerspec
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                                                                                                  I can't deny that my argument is mostly speculative and that Robby does have the more sensible argument. Odds are he's right and we may never see any of these young shinobi die. I'm just stating what I think will happen and I understand Robby thinks it's BS. Of course it's not all speculation though. Naruto at least of all the young shinobi I believe to have been foreshadowed to die at the end a few times throughout the manga.

                                                                                                  !

                                                                                                  I know, they can be looked at differently than a foreshadowed death but it's not like his last statement was just hot air.

                                                                                                  Everything's Eventual…

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                                                                                                    @Outerspec:

                                                                                                    I can't deny that my argument is mostly speculative and that Robby does have the more sensible argument. Odds are he's right and we may never see any of these young shinobi die. I'm just stating what I think will happen and I understand Robby thinks it's BS. Of course it's not all speculation though. Naruto at least of all the young shinobi I believe to have been foreshadowed to die at the end a few times throughout the manga.

                                                                                                    ! [qimg]http://img832.imageshack.us/img832/9496/narutov02ch008015.jpg[/qimg]
                                                                                                    [qimg]http://img534.imageshack.us/img534/8872/narutov02ch008016.jpg[/qimg]
                                                                                                    [qimg]http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/1231/q12l.jpg[/qimg]I know, they can be looked at differently than a foreshadowed death but it's not like his last statement was just hot air.

                                                                                                    Why not?

                                                                                                    You mean you think that if Naruto dies he'll stay dead?

                                                                                                    …What cause do you have to believe that? Because in this case Robby's argument is still pretty valid. I mean, we all see the same sort of hints and I can see where you're coming from, but I honestly don't think Kishimoto has the balls to actually follow through, based what the Pein arc (and all this mounting evidence that suggests Naruto will be the next Sage of Six Paths) shows.

                                                                                                    Originally Posted by Wagomu

                                                                                                    There's a great lighthearted vibe around here, because no matter how serious we might get, we're all together because of some magical pirate.

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                                                                                                    • Gizmo
                                                                                                      Gizmo @Outerspec
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                                                                                                      Oh yeah, I forgot about Naruto's promise to die together with Sasuke. I'm actually hoping that is the ending. Fingers crossed.

                                                                                                      !

                                                                                                      Also, Aohige confirmed that Evil's one piece spoilers are true, so I'm going to post his detailed naruto spoilers.

                                                                                                      ! Chapter Title: We Died
                                                                                                      Title Page is Haku with his hand on a mirror and the reflection.
                                                                                                      ! The others notice it's Zabuza, and someone from the cursed Snow clan who can use Hyouton(Ice Element). The Tensei's are losing their minds, and Kakashi warns the guys to watch out as Zabuza is the best at silent killing. Haku pleads with Kakashi to stop them, and that his dream was to protect and die as Zabuza's tool; however, since Zabuza is dead he thinks he has failed and as he is now he can no longer protect or be a tool of Zabuza.
                                                                                                      ! Kakashi tells him that Zabuza died from something else, and died not thinking of Haku as just a tool. Zabuza, scolds Kakashi for blabbing. The scene shifts to Kabuto who says that Zabuza and Haku are stubborn, but he will succeed into turning them into his tools.
                                                                                                      ! Zabuza's final words to Kakashi are to stop him by any means possible, as he has already died as a human. Kakashi says he understands and reveals his Sharingan as Haku sheds tears and thanks Zabuza.
                                                                                                      ! Kakashi explains that the other two guys are Gari from the Stone village, he uses Bakuton(Explosion) and used to be on the old Explosion Squad with Deidara. The other is Pakura from the sand, and she uses Shaku-ton(Heat?)
                                                                                                      ! Zabuza uses Hidden Mist and Kakashi, Sakura, Lee, Gai form back to back formation. Lee says he'll protect her even if he dies.
                                                                                                      ! The attack starts and Kabuto comments on how he's gained much more control thanks to Orochimaru's chakra, and how not controlling the emotions caused some of the other Tensei's to fail(Sasori). Now he can kill the emotions, but he's not sure how many he can do that with and plans to leave the rest as is as it could be advantageous depending on the situation.
                                                                                                      ! Meanwhile Juugo and Suigetsu have escaped from jail, but Sui cannot find his sword.
                                                                                                      ! Back to the fight, Pakura turns a bunch of ninja's into mummies by evaporating all the water in them and Gari blows another guy up. Haku's about to kill a guy when Gai/Lee kick him.
                                                                                                      ! Kakashi and Zabuza are locked in a struggle when Kabuto takes the next step… he has Gari and Pakura summon...
                                                                                                      ! All the former members of The Seven Swordsman of the Mist along with Zabuza's still broken sword(They don't appear to have theirs, and Kisame is not among them).
                                                                                                      ! The End

                                                                                                      Originally Posted by Nightwing

                                                                                                      Stay focused, cause right now you have a decision to make. Are you a man perpetually looking back at what he’s lost, or a man looking forward, to what he might become?

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                                                                                                      • Malintex_Terek
                                                                                                        Malintex_Terek @Gizmo
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                                                                                                        Masashi "Mediocre Man" Kishimoto

                                                                                                        Steer clear folks, this is a construction zone.

                                                                                                        MUV-LUV ALTERNATIVE

                                                                                                        Making Anime and Manga OBSOLETE since 2006

                                                                                                        PM me for details

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