Well, it just might be that Zoro knows Kumas powers and as he is the first mate and all.
Chapter 483 "End of a Dream" Discussions
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All right… so many holes... so little time
- Zoro told them to stay back, in the way a big brother is protecting his little brothers from a mugger: desperately. Zoro is the strongest one left, so he has the best chance of taking him down. However that chance is near zero. Zoro will NOT defeat Kuma, just delay him to buy enough time for the Deus Ex Machina.
- There will be no more bounty rises for a while. a) they just had a HUGE one b) the marines are keeping this whole thing quiet, that's what we just heard. They can't increase the bounties without explaining things.
- Since Zoro's fight with Mihawk is gonna be his final fight, it's gotta be cool and desperate. And even if Mihawk IS the strongest SBK, Zoro being able to take out Kuma here would be too quick a rise in his power.
Unrelated note: Am I the only one who thinks that Kuma's power is NOT telelportation? But something COMPLETELY unrelated? The fact that the world teleportation was used in this chapter makes me doubt it even more…
How did they explain the bounty rise after Alabasta? I doubt the bounty will rise, but i dont remember them explaining it.
I'm not so sure that it's teleportation either.
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Lobolover, end the off-topic discussion. If you have a problem with a post you see in the forums, report it, but this thread is not the place to bring your personal grievances up. Back on-topic, please.
More like stop advertizing OPHQ and it's overprotective mods.
All right… so many holes... so little time
- Zoro told them to stay back, in the way a big brother is protecting his little brothers from a mugger: desperately. Zoro is the strongest one left, so he has the best chance of taking him down. However that chance is near zero. Zoro will NOT defeat Kuma, just delay him to buy enough time for the Deus Ex Machina.
- There will be no more bounty rises for a while. a) they just had a HUGE one b) the marines are keeping this whole thing quiet, that's what we just heard. They can't increase the bounties without explaining things.
- Since Zoro's fight with Mihawk is gonna be his final fight, it's gotta be cool and desperate. And even if Mihawk IS the strongest SBK, Zoro being able to take out Kuma here would be too quick a rise in his power.
Unrelated note: Am I the only one who thinks that Kuma's power is NOT telelportation? But something COMPLETELY unrelated? The fact that the world teleportation was used in this chapter makes me doubt it even more...
I agree, except in the thing of Zoro's last fight being the one with Mihawk.
Anyways, I dunno how Oda will explain Kuma's powers besides some transmission/teleportation Devil Fruit.
OFF-TOPIC QUESTION:
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MUDDY?! What the hell is that Manga about? Become the king of the farmers?
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Since we know nothing about Kuma's powers yet it's safe to say he's not going to get defeated any time soon. So as much of a Zoro lover as I am I'd say he's probably going to be put down unless something happens.
Plus Zoro said to stay back but that doesn't mean they're going to listen to him.
It's pretty sudden/early for another shishibukai defeat but I really don't see an exit out of this one without one side going down.
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so when will there be a non watermarked trans or at least a raw?
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so when will there be a non watermarked trans or at least a raw?
when it happens
unless you are doing something about it, please don't complain
How did they explain the bounty rise after Alabasta? I doubt the bounty will rise, but i dont remember them explaining it.
Zoro got his for beating Mr 1, and that was fine 'cause according to the press release Mr 1 and Croc had NOTHING to do with each other.
As for Luffy… dunno
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This post is deleted!
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All right… so many holes... so little time
Can't fix what ain't broke.
- Zoro told them to stay back, in the way a big brother is protecting his little brothers from a mugger: desperately. Zoro is the strongest one left, so he has the best chance of taking him down. However that chance is near zero. Zoro will NOT defeat Kuma, just delay him to buy enough time for the Deus Ex Machina.
Where's your proof that Zoro won't take down Kuma? I can't see the chapter 484 discussions thread?
- There will be no more bounty rises for a while. a) they just had a HUGE one b) the marines are keeping this whole thing quiet, that's what we just heard. They can't increase the bounties without explaining things.
And Kuma is suppose to be the answer to "keeping things quite." If Kuma gets beat, that idea gets thrown out. Bounties will be raised.
- Since Zoro's fight with Mihawk is gonna be his final fight, it's gotta be cool and desperate. And even if Mihawk IS the strongest SBK, Zoro being able to take out Kuma here would be too quick a rise in his power.
Wait what? How would Zoro taking out a Shichibukai be to quick in power rising? Luffy just beat one.
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lobo: the word you are looking for is "scan" or "scanlation"
a trans is what Kudo posted in the trans/scanlation section or stephen on his page.
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Zoro? Lack of skill? You aren't reading the same manga as me, are you?
Zoro is the ONLY one who requires practice. People like Sanji are naturally good.
They don't ever practice and can easily dominate their opponents whenever they become serious.
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Phenomenol is on a roll. Dude, give up.
Wait what? How would Zoro taking out a Shichibukai be to quick in power rising? Luffy just beat one.
Zoro isn't Luffy.
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I don't remember Oda ever saying that Sanji never needs practice.
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Where's your proof that Zoro won't take down Kuma? I can't see the chapter 484 discussions thread?
lord… there is no goddam proof. this is a hypothesis. It's all guesses. Yours too. So calm down about me predicting the future. Look. I've been reading fantasy books and stories since I was 5. And Zoro beating Kuma seems very out of place at this point in the story.
And Kuma is suppose to be the answer to "keeping things quite." If Kuma gets beat, that idea gets thrown out. Bounties will be raised.
Who's gonna tell people? The SH? They don't give a shit. They don't go around tooting their own horns. Even if the SH do defeat Kuma, he and Moria will limp back to the WG. Then the government will cover it up becuase 3 SBKs getting beat by the same crew (or at least 2, since they covered up Croc) is too big a deal and they will simply ignore it. That is how things will be quiet and there will be no bounty raises. Through government propaganda. The same reason we don't know about the lava rats that live in my house and control me unless I wear a tinfoil hat.
Wait what? How would Zoro taking out a Shichibukai be to quick in power rising? Luffy just beat one.
This is true. yet Luffy is stronger than Zoro. Plus We've all been assuming that Luffy has to beat at least a few of the Yonkous and some marine officials to be the pirate king. You know, the strongest people in the world?
Zoro has to defeat Mihawk, who despite being a pimp is probably not as strong as the people Luffy has to beat down. So Final Luffy has to be stronger than Final Zoro. Which means that Current Luffy should probably be stronger than Current Zoro.
Get it?
and if you don't: here is a simpler version
@AD-HD:
Zoro isn't Luffy.
Thanks AD-HD
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Who's gonna tell people? The SH? They don't give a shit. They don't go around tooting their own horns. Even if the SH do defeat Kuma, he and Moria will limp back to the WG. Then the government will cover it up becuase 3 SBKs getting beat by the same crew (or at least 2, since they covered up Croc) is too big a deal and they will simply ignore it. That is how things will be quiet and there will be no bounty raises. Through government propaganda. The same reason we don't know about the lava rats that live in my house and control me unless I wear a tinfoil hat.
There's like 990 other people on the island.
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@Cap'n:
There's like 990 other people on the island.
…............................................................................................
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crap
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@AD-HD:
Zoro isn't Luffy.
Zoro just got the shit knocked out of him by a giant, red ogre, and even before that, fought a samurai who kept up with him him on a pretty even playing field. Now, he's about to face a Scichibukai presumably near Moria's level
Zoro pulling some ''I'l beat you….BECAUSE I BELIEVE IN MYSELF!'' shit isn't going to work here.
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so when will there be a non watermarked trans or at least a raw?
Kylara has started posting the raws so it should be here soon, i guess.
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Zoro just got the shit knocked out of him by a giant, red ogre, and even before that, fought a samurai who kept up with him him on a pretty even playing field. Now, he's about to face a Scichibukai presumably near Moria's level
Zoro pulling some ''I'l beat you….BECAUSE I BELIEVE IN MYSELF!'' shit isn't going to work here.
Actually I dont doubt Kuma might be quite alot stronger than Moria in terms of physical combat skills…Moria's ability was very dangerous in and of itself, Kuma might just be a more combat centric character...Bounty isnt just for your combat strength, more for the danger you present to the balance of affairs
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ABSOLOM IS AWAKE!!!
Maybe Hogback and Absolom will sacrifice themselves to defeat Kuma and let the Strawhats escape!!!
(they better not, or I will be totally pissed…)
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@AD-HD:
Phenomenol is on a roll. Dude, give up. Zoro isn't Luffy.
Your starting this dupe crap again? Okay it's quite obvious now Gaiyea/Zephos is your alias ..
@Zephos:your Phenom,
@Gaiyea:
Lol, you've just proven that you are PHENOMENAL.
Stop trolling me Zephos/AD-HD/Gaiyea.
As for your Luffy isn't Zoro comment, what about it?
lord… there is no goddam proof. this is a hypothesis. It's all guesses. Yours too. So calm down about me predicting the future. Look. I've been reading fantasy books and stories since I was 5. And Zoro beating Kuma seems very out of place at this point in the story.
I didn't see an IMO (In my opinion) in your post. You said My argument had holes in it, You stated Zoro is going to lose to Kuma as if it were gospel.
Who's gonna tell people? The SH? They don't give a shit. They don't go around tooting their own horns. Even if the SH do defeat Kuma, he and Moria will limp back to the WG. Then the government will cover it up becuase 3 SBKs getting beat by the same crew (or at least 2, since they covered up Croc) is too big a deal and they will simply ignore it. That is how things will be quiet and there will be no bounty raises. Through government propaganda. The same reason we don't know about the lava rats that live in my house and control me unless I wear a tinfoil hat.
@Cap'n:
There's like 990 other people on the island.
This is true. yet Luffy is stronger than Zoro. Plus We've all been assuming that Luffy has to beat at least a few of the Yonkous and some marine officials to be the pirate king. You know, the strongest people in the world?
Zoro has to defeat Mihawk, who despite being a pimp is probably not as strong as the people Luffy has to beat down. So Final Luffy has to be stronger than Final Zoro. Which means that Current Luffy should probably be stronger than Current Zoro.
Get it?
and if you don't: here is a simpler version
Thanks AD-HD
Your last post isn't surprising considering you have Luffy in your avatar. Your post is based on assumptions we don't know who is stronger and what's going to happen.
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Zoro just got the shit knocked out of him by a giant, red ogre, and even before that, fought a samurai who kept up with him him on a pretty even playing field. Now, he's about to face a Scichibukai presumably near Moria's level
Zoro pulling some ''I'l beat you….BECAUSE I BELIEVE IN MYSELF!'' shit isn't going to work here.
Eh, I know. That's my point.
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Man! it's been a while. Firstly i'm surprised anyone is realistically thinking any of the SH's are going to defeat Kuma never mind zoro on his own. Kuma will either have to be distracted, loose interest/focus or some kink in his armour will be discovered enough for them to make an escape. Another thing though this is the second time iv'e ever really reastically been worried for their safety as a whole though. In watery 7 or for that mater any other arc they always had places to run to. With crocodile being the first realistic worrying experience for me personally. Maybe dragon will turn up and cause a scene… or someone else no one expects like blackbeard or ace.
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Remember the weird ocean stream ? Maybe D created it :D Long shot eh.
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I didn't see an IMO (In my opinion) in your post. You said My argument had holes in it, You stated Zoro is going to lose to Kuma as if it were gospel.
IT'S ALL AN OPINION GODDAM IT!
That's what I said earilier! And guess what? IT WAS AN OPINION!Your last post isn't surprising considering you have Luffy in your avatar. Your post is based on assumptions we don't know who is stronger and what's going to happen.
Luffy is in my avatar, becuase that moment was the funniest thing to ever happen in One Piece and I always ALWAYS crack up at the sight of it.
The only character I would even consider myself a fanboy of is Brooke, but you notice that I don't declare him to be able to beat Kuma do you?
I like One Piece. I read One Piece. I talk about One Piece.
In my opinion, Zoro will NOT beat Kuma
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I like One Piece. I read One Piece. I talk about One Piece.
Just where is this thread going!?
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IT'S ALL AN OPINION GODDAM IT!That's what I said earilier! And guess what? IT WAS AN OPINION!
You didn't say it the first time.
Thanks for clarifiying.Luffy is in my avatar, becuase that moment was the funniest thing to ever happen in One Piece and I always ALWAYS crack up at the sight of it.
The only character I would even consider myself a fanboy of is Brooke, but you notice that I don't declare him to be able to beat Kuma do you?
I like One Piece. I read One Piece. I talk about One Piece.
In my opinion, Zoro will NOT beat Kuma
Thanks for your opinion.
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@Lobster:
Just where is this thread going!?
after I wrote that, I looked at it and said: "If I post that, it will look really odd."
But then I realized I don't care
And since then my life has been pretty decent
You didn't say it the first time.
Thanks for clarifiying.oh? I didn't? Then what the hell is this?
@skarlath:lord… there is no goddam proof. this is a hypothesis. It's all guesses.
I'm sorry if you don't know what the word "hypothesis" means. But that's why I put the word "guesses"
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You didn't say it the first time.
Thanks for clarifiying.Thanks for your opinion.What would a post in here be if not an opinion? I don't think it's necessary to add an IN MY OPINION after every line of text of a chapter discussion.
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Sometimes, no matter how good your intentions are, when trying to talk to some people you'll always, always lose.
Back on topic, it looks like Moria really is KOed, huh? I'm really curious as to what can save the SHs from another shichibukai now.
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Sometimes, no matter how good your intentions are, when trying to talk to some people you'll always, always lose.
Back on topic, it looks like Moria really is KOed, huh? I'm really curious as to what can save the SHs from another shichibukai now.
You know, sometimes it's better to let people sort things out, after that a mod can delete the OT posts is he or she feels obliged to.
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I have a theory about the rank of powers. First the list:
1. Yonkou (being Whitebeard the most powerful of them)
2. 3 Admirals and Sengoku
3. Shichibukai
4. Vice-Admirals
5. CP9The reason why Shichibukai are in league with the World Government is because the Admirals are more powerful than them and the most logical thing is that Kuma was talking with one of the 3 Admirals or Sengoku, they know that they aren´t at the level of the Admirals and the Yonkous. This is what Moria was talking, the combination of the 3 Admirals+4 Yonkou is letal for the Shichibukai, this is why their dreams were shattered.
The Yonkou are another story, Whitebeard is in the group because he is the only surviving pirate who fought equally with Roger and no one have discussed his position, the other 3 surpassed all the dangers, even the 3 admirals (3 admirals=3 yonkou) have been surpassed by them but no one can fight againt Whitebeard and win because if one of the Yonkou surpasses Whitebeard then the other 2 and the Admirals will attack him and his crew.
The reason why Kuma is in the island is because the World Government knows that any Viceadmiral crew will be owned by the Strawhats and they don´t want to lose time in a "rookie crew" but Moria defeat and Kuma failure will change the things and give two possibilities: the first one is an Admiral (I believe that Aikanu) as the next enemy, the second one is the apparition of Blackbeard but I believe that Blackbeard next objective is different than going to fight against Luffy.
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I'm pretty sure that this has been pointed out already, but here goes:
Sanji: All the strange creatures and events that we've seen since we've entered this island was all just an "illusion" that Moria has shown us. Now that he's defeated, there nothing left on this island…!!
Sanji: It's like waking up in the morning from a bad dream.Sanji said this after Moria was defeated. Does anybody remember what Vivi said when Luffy beated another Shichibukai, Crocodile?
Vivi: The rain falling now…
Will fall again, as in times past.
THE NIGHTMARE… IS ALL OVER…!!!Nice one from Oda.
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@Cap'n:
There's like 990 other people on the island.
I think that was just the zombies, the people who had their shadows stolen by Moria seemed to come from all kinds of other places, those pirates at sea, the marine officer, and that girl in the village.
Also on another note, I think Luffy's the only one capable of defeating Kuma. Only problem is, he's unconscious. Luffy needs to wake up so Kuma can tell him about Ace.
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Sometimes, no matter how good your intentions are, when trying to talk to some people you'll always, always lose.
Back on topic, it looks like Moria really is KOed, huh? I'm really curious as to what can save the SHs from another shichibukai now.
I've been having similar thoughts. I'm honestly expecting an EL type situation like when they were faced with the 9 BC ships about to destroy them, and the biggest DEX in the entire show happens LOLOL :p Luckily, nothing should ever be as bad as that. Sorry, I loved the GM, but that was way out of whack… But this is fantasy, so whatever, moving on....
i posted my current theories about how the next chapter will go down....
Zoro vs. Kuma... this'll be a few pages, then Kuma will put him down and the rest of the SHs... then the chapter will end with all SHs down and we'll have to wait forever for the next chapter. And then we'll get the interruption that will save our SHP.sticking my nose in the Luffy vs. Zoro just for fun...
Luffy is presented stronger than Zoro by Zoro himself.
/me runs away! -
I think that Zoro will beat Kuma perhaps with the help of other Strawhats, the reason I think this is because what better way to show that the strawhats have developed is to show that before it took everything they had to take out 1/7th of Shichibukai, and barely make it out alive. This time it would be that they take out 2/7th of the Shichbukai, and barely make it out alive.
Plus, i think there are 2 Shichibukai that are at Yonkou level but don't necessarily have the crew to back them up. Personally I think that Mihawk is stronger thank Shanks but only by a bit so if there was a battle Mihawk would be at his limit, and Shanks would have the rest of his crew backing him up which are all very powerful. Blackbeard is now in a similar situation where he is as powerful as a Yonkou Captain but his crew wouldn't hold up to Yonkous crew.
The reason I added that middle part is because I think that Zoro would need some serious development in battle to be strong enough to beat Mihawk. I personally think the last couple battles he has been in have been "easy" battles for him. Thus they haven't shown his real strength, him beating a shichibukai of similar strenght to the one Luffy just defeat would show that Zoro is almost equal to Luffy which was the case at the beginning of the series. What a better way to show this than for Luffy to beat a 320 million beri Shichibukai, then Zoro to turn around and beat a 296 million beri Shichibukai.
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I don't know, I think I'm going to hop on the Zoro can take Kuma wagon. It would be nice to see another crew member take a Shichibukai down.
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That chapter was kinda OK.
Hope the next chapter will be much better.
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There's just something odd about Zoro fighting against a non-swordsman to prove his abilities.
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Oh, well, besides the next chapter, now I'll look forward to Muddy. I hope whoever will make that one has decent storytelling abilities.
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On the topic of Zoro, this was a twist that Oda pulled having him pitted against Kuma. As of what Kuma's powers are, we know that they haven't been revealed yet, however here is my theory. I haven't read all the spoilers for the latest chapter, so I don't know if anyone stated this, but here is my theory:
Kuma is actually a Swordsman.
(You heard it here first)
We know Kuma carries a Bible around, and according to Christian religion the Bible is considered:
The sword of the Spirit. I know this sounds crazy, but..
Ephesians 6:17 - "..the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God"
And the word of God is the Bible.
I believe the way Perona disappeared was Kuma Judged her based on the answer he gave her and sent her off somewhere. Here is more evidence based on the Bible, the book Kuma holds:
Hebrews 4:12 (New International Version)
"For the word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart."Someone said on here that Kuma was refered to a tyrant. In olden times, missionaries came into different lands, islands, and countries, and imposed the Christian religion onto people. I believe the history of Kuma may lead him forcing his religion onto people, and whoever didn't follow would be excecuted. (Contradicts the beliefs of the bible of Thou shalt not Murder but ya know how people are….....)
Currently Oda has set up what it seems to be a Religious Fanatic vs The Ultimate Atheist and it should be a great fight.
In other words, this fight depicts God vs The Devil. Even though it appears Kuma doesn't look like he wields a sword (literally) he technically does.
Who knows how Oda may handle this if my theory holds true. A twist would be Kuma can actually transform the book into a literal sword and this justifies why Zoro should fight Kuma.
Lets say my theory is NOT true: Zoro should fight Kuma. Sure the argument floating around is he fought Odz and Ryuuma, however during East Blue Sagas, he still fought after he suffered hits from Mihawk, the Strongest Swordsman.
Zoro has demonstrated great durability, willpower, and strength. Of course the argument of Mihawk saying that being Pirate King is harder than being the Strongest Swordsman, however, taking the Strongest Swordsman path is still a difficult one. Why should Luffy take ALL the strongest enemies aside from Mihawk? Just because he's captain? First mates need love too (Naruto hasn't taken out all of Akatsuki now did he?)
Yes Im a Zoro fan, I also love Luffy, however, I believe that everyone on the crew should have a chance to shine. Luffy currently defeated 2 Shichi, Top govt Assassin, and a GOD. There are still more Shichi, Yonkou, Marines, and unknowns to go around, and everyone should get at least 1 major enemy.
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Vivi: The rain falling now…
Will fall again, as in times past.
THE NIGHTMARE… IS ALL OVER…!!!Beautiful quote <3
This day belongs to you (in soul caliber 3 narrator voice)
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I think that was just the zombies, the people who had their shadows stolen by Moria seemed to come from all kinds of other places, those pirates at sea, the marine officer, and that girl in the village.
Also on another note, I think Luffy's the only one capable of defeating Kuma. Only problem is, he's unconscious. Luffy needs to wake up so Kuma can tell him about Ace.
But still, even if that was the case, they'd know that Moria had been defeated if their shadow came back. And even if that isn't the case, there's definitely a big enough crowd on TB to make the word spread significantly.
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every enemy zoro fights being a swordsman is pretty lame, id like to see him fight kuma
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I forgot Zoro was an atheist…. that was established dureing skypiea right?
thats not exactly what he said LPS... he said it was lame that Zoro only gets to fight swordsmen not that the swordsmen he fight are lame.
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Funny how there's also people out of TB that could spread the word. Just think about all the fuss that would happen if some of the pirates that just got their shadows back told more pirates in a bar or any other neutral place about Moria's defeat.
I think WB wouldn't waste the chance to charge against the WG for what one of it's Legal Pirates did to Ace and the 4th division captain whose name I can't remember.
PS: No, gorlom, by "every enemy" I think he actually meant that all of Zoro's swordmen opponents had been "Lame" so far…
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^Meaning he only thinks Mr. 1 was hot stuff
But what about the swordsman Kaku and Hatchi? Octopus-man fought with 800 pound swords. That's pretty amazing in itself~
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Not trying to burst your bubble FF Ace, but considering Aokiji already has a logia DF. I doubt any of the other admirals will have a logia DF. But hope i'm wrong.
Well, the idea was that Sakazuki is kept in check by Kuzan because extreme cold can stop or slow the flow of lava, causing it to cool and form igneous rock.
… Well, that was the plan at least.
As for Kuma, the best guess is he opens his book, picks a page that resembles where they want to go, zaps him with his wind tunnel, and shuts the book. It may not even be a devil fruit, it could just be something like Goldenweek's power.
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Wouldnt he have said "all the swordsmen Zoro fought" instead of "every enemy beeing a swordsman" then Kaimei?
I think the key part is "beeing" rather then "every enemy".
But I guess we will have to wait for silverson to explain it himself.
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Zoro fought Brahm
he wasn't a swordsman
that was cool