Battle of the 3 logias- which is the strongest

[Crimz]

The following thread was created before, but the results weren't fulffilling. therefore i have created another thread to ask for views about this three characters. I hoped it would not be closed down.

Here are the candidates:

1.God Enel: His goro goro no mi fruit grants him the power of electricity. Able to turn into lightning to avoid physical blows. For those hu have seen, his lightning powers are virtually invincible.Posses a great skill called mantra which allows him to know what the opponent is gonna do next.
Attacks like raigoh can obliterate an entire island easily.his electricty produces heat which ables him to melt and reshape metals. Able to restart his heart after being attack by wiper's kairouseiki and reject dial combo. From the fight with luffy we can conclude that he is very fast.

2. Aokiji : His hie hie fruits grants him the power of ice. Able to turn into ice to dodge physical blows. his ice power his extremely powerful as it can last for a week. From the fight with luffy, he is also quick and physically well-built.

3.BlackBeard : His yami yami no mi grants him the power of darkness. He is unable to turn into darkness to avoid blow. His power in return allows him to absorbs blow and return double the damaged to the opponent. BB is physically-fat but from the fight with ace he is fast. Able to create dark vortex to suck
his opponent towards him. When he hold his opponent, their devil's fruit ability is neutralized. Due to his fats, he is likely able to stand alot of powerful blows.

Now if this 3 candidates fight with each other, who do u think will win. I have a feeling that enel will be the winner as he has mantra to predict his opponents moves. His lightning attacks are godly as well too. I feel that if he somehow managed to be attacked by BB or aokiji he can restart his own heart too. he can reshape metals to his advantages too.
Aokiji and BB is left, i think bb will win since he defeated ace so easily. His darkness fruit also allows him to suck aokiji to his advantages and his powerful punches could deal much damaged. on the other hand, i feel that aokiji's ice power will not be able to do much to both of them. Anyway plss state ur views and opinions as well too.
so my order of power is

Enel
BlackBeard
Aokiji

[Monkey.D.Johnny]

BlackBeard Pwns all. Mantra so what? lol.. Sucks you into a vortex. Good Bye.

[mujushin]

Mantra wing over blackhole
Enel knwos when BB is going to use that

[whaleblue]

IT REALLY DEPENDS WHO CONSUME THE DEVIL FRUIT!

If follow the current storyline i will asume blackbeard > Aokiji> or = Enel.
blackbeard will own not only because of his yami yami DF power. is because his believe and strong spirit.

but if three others person have the same level of martial skill, IQ, and spirit consume this three DF.

goro goro no mi > hie hie no mi > yami yami no mi

1. goro goro no mi is fast, powerful, nearly invincible. it electric wont hurt luffy rubber, but heat do hurt luffy. is not the goro goro no mi power that lost to rubber, is the person who use it fail to utilise this great power.

2.not much can hurt the hie hie no mi user. heat(ace/enel) may neutralize the freze power. but cant hurt/hardly hurt the hie hie no mi user. i asume goro goro no mi > hie hie no mi because electric faster then ice. speed does matter!!

3. yami yami is darkness fruit not black hole fruit. this is a weird logia that not fully immune to physical blows. if the user dont have a physical like blackbeard. he will suffer.

[SabZ]

BLACK HOLE!

… everyone dies.

[fixius]

enel is out,the question is BB vs aokiji,aokiji is the strongest marine so i bet he is not just a logia but what oda is planning for BB is unknown as aokiji's powers so…....dunno

[Archtyrant]

I think that Blackbeard is currently the strongest of the 3, followed by Aokiji. I don't know, i just can't see Enel as being close to either of them.

If going by fruits alone, then i think

Yami yami no mi > Goro goro no mi > Hie hie no mi.

What made me root for Aokiji is seeing his Ice Age attack, which I don't think could be performed by any ordinary person who's eaten the fruit, perhaps not even Enel.

And the Yami fruit is the most evil fruit. C'mon, it nullifies any of the other Logias.

[whaleblue]

@Archtyrant:

And the Yami fruit is the most evil fruit. C'mon, it nullifies any of the other Logias.

Yes!
yami yami no mi is most evil fruit. blackbeard knew most of the stronger character
are logia, so he want darkness fruit power to nullifies their power.

Paramecia and zoan wont be a trouble for him because he is strong in Physical.

but yami yami DF user do takes damage.
meaning luffy grandpa garps may own him. since there are no df power for blackbeard to nullify.

i believe luffy will own him in future.

[Impel Down]

Without adding in ANY other factors except for DF, BB.

[Gorlom]

since we havent seen blackbeards fight concluded i think hes a bit hard to judge but from what i HAVE seen of him hes a bit slow in attacking.

i would rate him the loser in a tournament between the three.

i dont know if the other two would be equal (in the sense that neither can really beat the other) but i cant see enel beeing defeated by aokijis power at all.

@whaleblue:

1. goro goro no mi is fast, powerful, nearly invincible. it electric wont hurt luffy rubber, but heat do hurt luffy. is not the goro goro no mi power that lost to rubber, is the person who use it fail to utilise this great power.

electricity has no such power, heat is a biproduct (or energyloss) of running through a bad conductor. since rubber is an isolator the electricity wont run through it at all and will therefor not generate heat. (ofcourse instead of locking luffies arm he could have encased luffy totally in gold but then i think its more a matter of sufficating him then burning him.)

since Blackbeard needs to touch his opponent to neutralize the DF power hes at a disadvantage versus both of them.
*Ace DF power is fire and of little use to him vs BB in the sense that it doesnt help him move around or stand his ground. and therefor have to submit to BBs gravitational powers.
*Enel can turn into an electrical current and move at highspeed freely through air
*Aokiji can just make a block of ice around his legs effectivly anchoring himself.
and since both of them can turn into their own elements blackbeards longrange black hole powers arent really effective.

enels volt output can most likely be far more effective then aces fireblasts since ace must work from the outside-in while enels power cooks vital organs from the inside.

dont know if blackbeard would be able to escape beeing encased in ice. even if he did im sure aokiji could hit him with icespikes or something.

definetly think enel can escape aokiji's powers though since water (liquid or frozen) is an excellent conductor. which is why i dont think enel would hurt aokiji either. not enough resistance to generate heat.

enel = aokiji
enel > bb
bb > aokiji

atleast untill we know what the last attack against ace was.

(edit: i might have spoken too soon. i realized aokiji was a close range fighter just like blackbeard. its very likely that aokiji will lose against BB if he needs to touch him to freeze him)

[whaleblue]

@Impel:

Without adding in ANY other factors except for DF, BB.

no other factor just fruit
still..
goro goro no mi > hie hie no mi > yami yami no mi

normal logia(Smoke Smoke Fruit, Flare Flare Fruit, Sand Sand Fruit, Rumble Rumble Fruit, hie hie no mi) no body can hit you in normal Circumstances , means that u wont get hurt/ injure.

yami yami no mi cannot let attacks simply pass through user, meaning he takes damage like any human would, and perhaps even suffering more than others would.

In normal circumstances, logia will own many of the paramecia and zoan df user.

but yami yami power is to againts others logia power.

diffirent devil fruit will counteract each other.

if logia user make a surprise strongphysical attack on yami yami user(assume BB never consume yami fruit), goro goro no mi user will
win.

normal logia take no physical damage.

i personal think every logia stand
a chance to escape from BB, separate from the part blackbeard hold and run like hell. but blackbeard knows real hero won run,
ace can escape but he choose to fight like a man.

if a logia fight like a guerrillas, yami yami stand no chance, yami yami not always active like luffy rubber and crocodile sand.

but it wont happen in the story of one piece, since all the stronge person have their own honour and pride.

the reason i said goru goru no mi is the strongest fruit because beside electric, user can create heat sound and lights, even
destroy an island.

much more creative way to use it ability, it just depands on user how to use it.

[whaleblue]

@Gorlom:

electricity has no such power, heat is a biproduct (or energyloss) of running through a bad conductor. since rubber is an isolator the electricity wont run through it at all and will therefor not generate heat. (ofcourse instead of locking luffies arm he could have encased luffy totally in gold but then i think its more a matter of sufficating him then burning him.)

yaya!

what i mean is biproduct, sound and heat.
lightling speed + hot spear
melt metal and perfome like a magician. you name it.

i try to type the previous thread for a long time, because of my poor english. i cant deliver the idea very well.
if i saw what u write, i will not say electricity generate heat . i will say enel is good for earth…ozone.

[CodedTech]

Well we haven't seen the limits of any of them save for Enel. Though going by Oda's comments on Enel, he's likely far from being on the level of Blackbeard or Aokiji.

In terms of the fight itself, well Enel against Blackbeard. Even if he has mantra and speed, Blackbeard's Dark Vortex will simply force him into Blackbeard's hands, and he's not one to take hits lightly, from there Blackbeard could simply repeatedly hit him. There's also the possibility of simply expanding his darkness and increasing the gravity to stop and consume him. So his powers would work good against speed. Aokiji has yet to be in a serious fight unlike the other two, though we know that he can at least freeze a large area in a short amount of time. It'd be a matter of how the other two could defend against na attack like the Ice Age, though Enel would have the advantage in flying up, as we haven't seen him do any large aerial attacks, only smaller scale ones like the Ice Capsule and Ice Spear, there's also a matter of what is needed to put him down.

Between them, I'd say Aokiji is likely the strongest. At the moment, Aokiji is the strongest Marine, the top of one of the 3 World Powers, giving the respect Garp and Sengoku get from even Whitebeard, and he's above them (at least their current age, though he himself isn't young), the top-level Marines aren't weak. He's possibly on the level of the Emperors and upper-level Shichibukai. To add to that he's had his fruit for over 20 years (I think longer than we've known anyone else to have a fruit, save for Robin). While Blackbeard barely got his, and would likely still be improving. But Aokiji's mastery of his fruit my exceed that of any of the others by far.

Though one thing is I don't think that Aokiji has ever used ice to "bypass" a physical blow. He stood up to Luffy's punches without even budging slightly, so depends on whether he may have formed a layer of ice or he might just be very strong physically. Though when he was shattered, he simply reformed, Blackbeard only de-activates the fruit upon contact, so how much that would affect him is also questionable.

[mujushin]

BB black vortexx.. he need to USE it first, and Enels mantra wil conter that..

No matter if his powers nullifys or takes enels real body, he has mnatra to help his logia power.

[fixius]

BB said it himself that he can even absorb electricity,the question is aokiji

is aokiji depending only on his DF?? could aokiji beat enel or would it be a draw like smoker vs ace???

now can BB absorb all the ice aokiji's fruit makes?? it isn't like ace's or enel's,if aokiji touches BB,BB may not be able of using an arm

it could be that enel vs aokiji=draw,BB vs aokiji=aokiji BB vs enel=BB

as i said it all depends on Oda,is BB at the level of WB or mihawk?? aokiji most propably is since he is the strongest in the marine HQ but has aokiji a way to fight logia??

it all depends on what we will see,no sure predictions can be made,only speculations and i speculate that aokiji has a way to fight other logia and that he is stronger than BB

[boiga]

Hmm… some interesting analysis here.

The problem is that the only character of this group that we have seen defeated is enel. We don't know how to defeat aokiji. Would heat be enough? If so, enel's golden spear or another such weapon would give him the advantage. If that's not enough to hurt aokiji though, I can't see how they would get past a draw. Their powers are complimentary like smoke and fire, so any combat between them would likely end in a stalemate.

Blackbeard is the other unknown here. We haven't yet seen him use his abilities in a desperate situation. If you go over his battle with Ace you'll notice that he was playing with Ace. The entire "black hole" attack which took down the town was just showing off. The vortex/neck chop technique was only used because blackbeard really wanted to see a logia's reaction after being hit with a regular attack. All of the rest of his moves happened off screen.

For example, near the end of the fight, we see ace desperately
launch a cross fire attack and then see blackbeard doing something with his hands and laughing maniacally. We never see the attack hit and at the end of the fight, blackbeard is unscathed while ace is looking drawn out and beaten down. What happened during that little Van Auger dialog that wiped ace out so much?

Here's my speculation: Blackbeard can make himself immune to missile attacks by deflecting them with a gravitational pull off course. Any good marksman will tell you that you have to correct for gravity's acceleration towards the earth. Blackbeard can make that sort of correction impossible because you can not tell what direction gravity will be pulling.

If blackbeard can get his darkness shroud underneath someone's feet, he can then increase the gravitational acceleration down with a similar effect to those 10x g or 100x g training rooms in DBZ. Someone strong enough may be able to escape the pull, but it will be physically exhausting to do so.

As electrical current requires some matter through which to flow it should still be effected by gravitational techniques like vortex or black hole. Once Enel is immobilized, he would be easy prey to blackbeards strength.
Aokiji would have no defense against a black hole attack. Glaciers still flow downhill and icicles fall down eventually. Blackbeard would take down any of them.

The reason blackbeard looked so long for the yami yami fruit is BECAUSE it could trounce logias. He can hurt them where no one else can.

[fixius]

@boiga:

He can hurt them where no one else can.

smoker has a sea stone sword so he can hurt them too,WB is considered the strongest man in one piece,that means he can beat anybody including logia users,mihawk is the strongest swordsman,if cabaji ate ace's fruit would he won against mihawk?? no,if zoro in alabasta could cut steel then mihawk can cut elements

As electrical current requires some matter through which to flow it should still be effected by gravitational techniques like vortex or black hole. Once Enel is immobilized, he would be easy prey to blackbeards strength.
Aokiji would have no defense against a black hole attack. Glaciers still flow downhill and icicles fall down eventually. Blackbeard would take down any of them.

The reason blackbeard looked so long for the yami yami fruit is BECAUSE it could trounce logias

as you say BB may be able to make the ground heavier but isn't he stepping on the ground too??? aokiji could freeze it

and ace's cross missed,nothing new happened while van auger was talking,BB just continued to destroy him

now ace was able to hit BB 3 or 4 times and one of them was when he dodged an attack,if aokiji manages to do one hit to BB he may lose an arm or be unable to use it in battle,aokiji isn't like the other logia we saw,an ice age on the ground and either BB becomes a big fat ice cube or he is going to have trouble moving

aokiji is the strongest marine,WB is the strongest yonkou,MHQ=schichibukai=yonkou,so from the equation it is easy to figure aokiji is in WB's level and BB fled from WB,on the other hand shanks is in WB's level too and BB scared though that was long ago and he may not won that fight too

so wait and see but don't make any results yet,we will see eventually

[CodedTech]

@mujushin:

BB black vortexx.. he need to USE it first, and Enels mantra wil conter that..

No matter if his powers nullifys or takes enels real body, he has mnatra to help his logia power.

I don't see how mantra would matter. Unless you're arguing that he'd be able to sense the vortex, and somehow knock Blackbeard unconscious before he can even activate his powers.

And if he's in his grasp, even if he can see the next move, he may not be able to escape. After one hit, who knows if he can get up on time (if Blackbeard doesn't continue gripping him), before he's repeatedly hit again, just like when Luffy hit him, his next hit was too fast for him to escape.

[Kma]

Currently,

Aoi Koji > BB > Enel

Later

BB > Aoi Koji > Enel

[Tsuchirinhon]

Aokiji doesn't stand a chance against Blackbeard. He lacks the speed to 'dodge' Blackbeard's Vortex. Fuck, it's unlikely that any person could 'dodge' the Vortex, as Blackbeard states that it is powerful enough that even light cannot escape.

However, Enel's Mantra would likely give him a bit of an edge, but he'd need to take Blackbeard down quickly. If Ace would nearly K.O.'d from two of Blackbeard's punches, Enel's fortitude could probably only take one.

Nevertheless, it's been shown that most people can survive Enel's lightning. Blackbeard's fortitude is incredible, so it's likely that he'd be able to take a shot or two, suck up Enel, then proceed to lay waste to his face.

[SabZ]

@Kma:

Currently,

Aoi Koji > BB > Enel

Later

BB > Aoi Koji > Enel

But the real question here is:

If three people, who are all exactly the same strength (fighting ability), had one of these abilities each… which would be stronger?

Aokiji is naturally a powerhouse, as is Blackbeard. Aokiji may be stronger, in terms of natural strength. But it's not about who is stronger... it's about which ability is better.

[fixius]

@Kma:

Currently,

Aoi Koji > BB > Enel

Later

BB > Aoi Koji > Enel

people are saying BB will become stronger than WB cuz he scarred shanks and we don't even know if he beat him,how old is that scar,how the fight took place and how older was BB from shanks then

so why can't other people get stronger too?? why can't aokiji,mihawk,shanks,WB and other become stronger too???

[Impel Down]

The only way I can see Ao Kiji beating BB is this:

He incases BB in ice, BB absorbs it, and then Ao Kiji incases him again. He does this until he fills the void, and according to physics, the black hole would collapse.

[fixius]

@Impel:

The only way I can see Ao Kiji beating BB is this:

He incases BB in ice, BB absorbs it, and then Ao Kiji incases him again. He does this until he fills the void, and according to physics, the black hole would collapse.

the black hole isn't a hole in the ground so it can be filled,it even absorbs light

[Impel Down]

It has to have limits. Even the universe isn't infinite.

[fixius]

@Impel:

It has to have limits. Even the universe isn't infinite.

do we know that??????????

[Impel Down]

We may know that, you might not.

[fixius]

@Impel:

We may know that, you might not.

dear god i've been flamed!:blink:

mommyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy! (running with 100km/h at unknown direction like haidi)

[Gorlom]

@fixius:

BB said it himself that he can even absorb electricity,the question is aokiji

what does he mean with it? and i think he is saying that his power can absorb anything rather then that he can. if you read it as he can whitstand everything he contradicts that statement on the very same page when he says that in exchange for power he still takes damage (same as other humans or more) unlike other logias. So his resistnace to damage hasent gone up imo.

he still takes damage from ace's attacks.

enels lightning should kill BB just the same as long as he can avoid getting grabbed. (still dont think dark vortex should be a problem to avoid for an electrical current, he is more affected by magnetism then gravity in that state)

electrical currents need matter? yes.
need solid matter? no.
my reasoning is that he can outrun the yami yami gravitational pull through the air. gravitational force is a pretty weak force compared to every other force thats involved on an atmoic level, by the time blackbeard got enough pull on enel his advent thunder is ready to crush any island BB is standing on and then BB drowns

[boiga]

@Gorlom:

electrical currents need matter? yes.
need solid matter? no.
my reasoning is that he can outrun the yami yami gravitational pull through the air. gravitational force is a pretty weak force compared to every other force thats involved on an atomic level, by the time blackbeard got enough pull on enel his advent thunder is ready to crush any island BB is standing on and then BB drowns

The point is that BB's gravitational power is much stronger than our universe's gravitational power. Also the power is described on the blackhole scale and not the atomic. The strength of gravity on the large scale is greater than any other force (magnetism doesn't alter the path of planetoids, after all.)

Here's another thought: BB's gravity ability can even pull in light. Electrons are many times larger than photons so blackbeard should be able to vortex enel without too much of a hassle.

As far as Aokiji is concerned, I still don't really see where aokiji would have the advantage. Blackbeard's feet are covered in darkness which would render him immune from freezing from the ground up (the ice would simply be taken in by the darkness and crushed.) Getting close enough to launch an icy fog attack or a touch attack would bring make him vulnerable to vortex/grabbing combo. Admittedly, we don't know which of the two is physically stronger, but my money wouldn't be with the good admiral.

[sadrhg]

Well he is the Strongest Marine and the Marines have people like Smoker, Garp,the other Admirals, and Sengoku. So I imagine Aokiji is fairly powerful.

[Kma]

The reason why I think Aoi Koji could beat BB now is because Aoi Koji seems to have more experience and probaly better tactics (the latter maybe becaus hes pretty lazy…)

In general I think BB logia is the best, but as Crocodile said, you must train to use your abilities to the maximize their potential.

Currently I find that BB will be the main villian, but Oda has portrayed him as a character that will grow. Yes Aoi Koji can grow too but I think BB will surpass him.

Although Aoi Koji might seem "slow" especially in the fight with Luffy, Im sure he wasnt remotely serious. He really could have beat them without activating his Logia IMO.

although Enel can move at the speed of light, dosent mean he can CONSTANTLY do it.
What I mean is that he seems to be able to only warp to certain places but must have a moment of pause and think of his next move. This is only logical, its most likely impossible to guide yourself while moving at the speed of light. So although he can move from point A -> B at the speed of light, I doubt he can go from A -> B -> C without take a pause at B

[SabZ]

Again… it's not about the user... it's about the logia type.

boiga has it pretty much cleared up.

[Kma]

@$abZ:

Again… it's not about the user... it's about the logia type.

boiga has it pretty much cleared up.

Uh did you read the original posters thread?

@Crimz:

Now if this 3 candidates fight with each other, who do u think will win. I have a feeling that enel will be the winner as he has mantra to predict his opponents moves. His lightning attacks are godly as well too. I feel that if he somehow managed to be attacked by BB or aokiji he can restart his own heart too. he can reshape metals to his advantages too.
Aokiji and BB is left, i think bb will win since he defeated ace so easily. His darkness fruit also allows him to suck aokiji to his advantages and his powerful punches could deal much damaged. on the other hand, i feel that aokiji's ice power will not be able to do much to both of them. Anyway plss state ur views and opinions as well too.
so my order of power is

Enel
BlackBeard
Aokiji

Also if you were to just measure the powers of the logia fruits, then what evidence do you have to go by? Obviously the users themselves or else we wouldnt be able to base our predictions on anything.

[SuperStar]

Black Hole >>>>> Ice and Lightning….........

Blackbeard owns them all.

[Impel Down]

He can just be overwhelmed by pain, but that's unlikely.

[BlackGalleon1]

Why are so many people underestimating Enel? And secondly, why are so many people using physics to explain a comic. Remember Oda might be smart and all but I seriously doubt he has a physics degree. This is shonen manga, thereby theories involving physics are made redundant. Now that I have got that off my chest, let me address a few other issues.

Firstly, how the hell could Aokiji beat Enel? From the manga, Oda stated that Enel electricity created heat, as demonstrated when Luffy got burned and when Enel was able to melt solid gold in seconds. So how is Aokiji supposed to freeze someone whose body is generates such heat? It's generally accepted in manga that fire > ice because fire's heat would melt ice, so if electricity generates more heat than fire, what would it do to ice? Also, Aokiji's fruit's power is quite short range and he, Aokiji, looks like a pretty slow character (his motto is lazy-ass justice), so how is he supposed to reach Enel, who in a battle can hit someone from the sky, as well as having mantra and being really fast as gifted by his fruit? The only reasons I can think of why people believe Kiji can beat Enel are: because Luffy beat Enel relatively easily but lost miserably to Ao; Kiji came after Enel in order of opponent so he "should" be stronger. For the first reason I believe the rock paper scissors explanation is in order; for the second reason, though this may be shonen manga, this pattern is not necessarily in place (I dare anyone to genuinely say that Foxy is stronger than Enel, Croc or even Arlong).

If you find my reasoning or information flawed, by all means reply pointing it out. However please don't reply using physics eg "If Aokiji was not grounded then he would be able to survive the lighting" or "Aokiji would win because he would create paths of no resistance away from him, and Enel would not be able to hit him" (if OP followed real life physics, Enel would not be able to aim a straight bolt of lighting, or shaped ones for that matter, because when he shoot one at someone, it is likely to change direction, following a different path with less resistance)

Secondly, about BB. IMO BB > all other logia users for the simple reason that his power can nullify all the others, and he is a physical beast without his fruit (scarring Shanks is proof of this).

[Kma]

@ Blackgalleon

Don't get me wrong, Im not trying to underestimate Enel. Hes a beast.

While it is true that heat melts ice, Ice is very good at absorbing heat. Most people think that heat would dominate ice but in reality (i know you said shonen, but other mangas, video games portray ice and fire as equal devastating to one another) it can go either way.

You tell me not to get specifically into physics but I kind of want to… i wont but simply put ice can easily rob energy from from heat or lightning. Considering how both sides can generate pretty much unlimited amounts it would be a stalemate. (the specific heat capacity to melt ice is quite impressive)

I think Aoi Koji > Enel because as Luffy said there are many strong guys that would own Enel in the Blue Seas. Considering that Aoi Koji is one of the strongest people we know in the blue seas at the moment, I speculate Aoi Koji is more powerful.

[Rai]

Methinks this thread is no good. I don't think I need to start explaining why, right?

[fixius]

logia vs logia is a draw,either it is ace vs aokiji,salt man vs aokiji,enel vs onix,or cafe vs decaf

look at it this way,can't flame break the smoke? look at it in the microworld,trillions of furious moving atoms in an undetermined shape vs atoms close to each other that carry also the atoms of what is burned but smoker vs ace was a draw

also smoker's smoke is "solid" enough to lift or to trap a person so don't go to physics,this is a manga

every logia regenerates it's element in an equal way so all logia are equal except of special ones like BB and maybe dragon

now if aokiji that doesn't regenarate ice but can freeze things is considered another form of logia let it be

[Impel Down]

Obviously, Logia vs. Logia ISN'T a draw, with Ace vs. BB. And it's not like every logia will come in a draw, that's just dumb. Ace would be able to harm Ao Kiji.

[CodedTech]

This post is deleted!

[Generic_Soda]

BlackBeard or Ao Kiji. Enel knows he's gonna get his balls broken by Black Hole via Mantra so he runs away. Ao Kiji doesn't really seem too strong to me. I mean, his power's nifty and all, but he wouldn't be the type of person I'd really see BB losing to. BlackBeard just needs to shut off his DF. But if he needs him close to him, Ao Kiji does have good hand to hand abilities… Hadn't thought of that... Ehm, Not sure, either Ao Kiji Or BB.

[fixius]

@Impel:

Obviously, Logia vs. Logia ISN'T a draw, with Ace vs. BB. And it's not like every logia will come in a draw, that's just dumb. Ace would be able to harm Ao Kiji.

did you even read the post???:getlost: there was a part about special logia

[Gorlom]

@boiga:

The point is that BB's gravitational power is much stronger than our universe's gravitational power. Also the power is described on the blackhole scale and not the atomic. The strength of gravity on the large scale is greater than any other force (magnetism doesn't alter the path of planetoids, after all.)

Here's another thought: BB's gravity ability can even pull in light. Electrons are many times larger than photons so blackbeard should be able to vortex enel without too much of a hassle.

considering this is a manga what im about to say isnt relevant but i just cant give up on a good physics discussion

this is all theoretical mumbo jumbo and hypothises if it was not takeing place in odaverse =P

considering he still needs to punch his opponent after the dark vortex its gravitational pull is a few g (1-4) at most. if it was higher bones would break even on resilient guys such as the pirates in this manga.

1g is an acceleration of 9.8m/s. if BB uses the same power on his vortex against enel as he did against ace he would theoretically get far enough away before hes overcome easily

a black hole can bend light enough to prevent it from escapeing yes. but light isnt really activly trying to escape, enel has a free will and will be bending back. It is very rarely traveling directly away from a black hole while outside its event horizon (come to think of it isnt that what happens at a supernova? so light CAN escape a black hole if traveling at a 90degree angle from it?)

acording to the theory of relativity (forgot if it was the general or special) gravity has an impact on time as well since BB's not haveing that impact one could imagine that for black hole kind of gravity one must touch the dark fog (or whatever you want to call it) hes got otherwise its merely a few gs.

back to odaverse:
BB's technics are all relativly slow. all enel needs to do is bang a drum call forth a lightningbeast and fry teach.

hell with mantra enel doesnt even need to be in visual range to bolt the shit out of teach. i cant see how teach can win at all with those kind of odds.
the only reason enel lost against luffy was that he was immune to lightning and didnt get taken seriously.

and against aokiji… i dont think melting him would worry him to much. hel just refreeze himself like enel restarted his heart. and enel will either melt the ice or just turn into an electrical current and step out of the cold.
dont think anyone of them can win against each other unless some seastone gets involved.

aokiji vs bb: far to little is known to acctually gauge their relative strenght.

@BlackGalleon1:

If you find my reasoning or information flawed, by all means reply pointing it out. However please don't reply using physics eg "If Aokiji was not grounded then he would be able to survive the lighting" or "Aokiji would win because he would create paths of no resistance away from him, and Enel would not be able to hit him" (if OP followed real life physics, Enel would not be able to aim a straight bolt of lighting, or shaped ones for that matter, because when he shoot one at someone, it is likely to change direction, following a different path with less resistance)

agree with you totally, aokiji got no chance of avoiding other then completly dodgeing. real life physics about conducting electricity doesnt apply to enel at all, considering enel seems to be able to shoot bolts of lightning from the sky to his enemies it seems that he can remotely controll the path of electrones.

but i fail to see why aokiji would be hurt by beeing heated up. it would probably be a nausiance to him but i dont think it would acctually hurt him in an elemental state.

[Impel Down]

Or.

BB claws their eyes out and they can't see and he smashes a beer bottle over their heads and he wins and we all make peace.

[Gorlom]

@Impel:

Or.

BB claws their eyes out and they can't see and he smashes a beer bottle over their heads and he wins and we all make peace.

what kind of beer? it all depends on what kind of beer it is!

[boiga]

@rai, yeah probably. The problem with vs threads between characters (or logias) that have not met in the series and likely are not going to meet is that they are based on pure speculation that are almost guaranteed never to be resolved. It's like people of different religions arguing about who is right.

In any case it's still amusing in the short term and there are worse ways to waste ones time.

@black galleon: the reason I like to invoke physics into my analysis of devil fruit powers is that Oda invokes physics. For nearly all of the devil fruits seen so far, Oda invents a pseudoscientific explanation for how they work. For example, Oda could have just said what foxy's ray beam did and leave it at that. Instead, he invented subatomic "noronoro particle" that havn't been discovered by science yet. My thinking is that Oda has a subscription to popular science magazine and browses it to get ideas for abilities.

Blackbeards powers are most certainly physics based. The average person doesn't know that blackholes are black because they suck in light. Most people still think a blackhole is the gateway to another dimension. So, if Oda is going to use physics to invent his devil fruit powers, we can use physics to analyze their limits and abilities.

@Gorlom: I get what you're saying, but this power reallllly wouldn't work very well in real world physics. The level of gravitational pull required to alter the path of light to that degree would in our world create a horrendous air vacuum and crush all matter within hundreds of miles into a grain of sand. Blackbeard's power doesn't do that… which makes sense artistically because he would die from the pressure difference if it did.

My personal impression is that if Enel created a lightning beast like you are referring, Blackbeard would be able to deflect it by expanding the darkness away from his body like he did against Ace's giant fireball.

Unfortunately... Enel's on the moon right now and it doesn't look like he's coming back. So, we can both just pretend that we are right due to a lack of convincing evidence to the contrary

Edit: oh I forgot: I vote for a good dark ale. If it were an american style lager he would just laugh it off as being too weak and tasteless.

[grimmjow05]

Lets not base who is going to win just by their logia abilities, look at the zoans for example, we all know that wolf are smaller and weaker than bulls but in one piece's case, the wolf was more bigger and stronger (as we can all assume) than the bull. So basing who is stronger by elements alone would be wrong. If we go by that then I could easily say that Crocodile is stronger than Enel since earth can withstand lightning. But in One Piece's case it seems that the character's determination/mental strength, physical strength, stamina and skills are factors that affect how strong/powerful a character is, and Luffy acquiring gear 2 is an example of that. Another example of this would be the fight between Luffy and the Noro Noro oyabun, although oyabun did lost to luffy, he gave him a rough time, which surprised some people.

Anyway, in my opinion, right now BB looks more powerful than the other two. Enel without a doubt is the weakest of the three, possibly weaker than smoker and/or Ace. Yes his lightning is tough but did anyone really died from his lightning? NO! Everysingle person he struck with lightning in skypiea survived (even if most people believe that oda doesn't want to kill anyone.). I'm not saying that the number of kills a person made is a factor but everyone was partying after 24 hours of getting struck by lightning, which is just weird. It is true that he could have sunk the whole sky island but he needed the help of his air ship if i'm not mistaken. And Mantra is a bit of an asset but what good can it do if everyone is faster than you. And sure he can make his heartbeat but the only thing it will do for him is help him survive a deathblow only to be striken down again.

As for Aokiji, we can't really say if he is stronger than BB since we haven't seen his full capability in his easily won fight against the strawhats. He easily took out the strongest strawhats and he did it in less than 5 minutes or something. Something the former enemies haven't done before, but could have been done by smoker and crocodile.

And sorry bout my grammar, i'm not a native english speaker.

[Crimz]

Hello? This is one piece. No one in the currently story line has died so far. And from all the post i feel that enel is really underestimated. He himself ares to call him self god. And god isn't something to be taken lighty. For those who made this statement, i would also like to say the same thing that enel's mantra is a huge advantage to him. Before BB does his blackhole, enel will see it and quickly escape it. By turning into pure electricty and i feel he will rise up to the sky and rest there on this cloud. BB's black hole would not reach that far. From there he forms his ultimate raigoh and tears down the whole island BB is on the now we can say BB to BB. But of course, we do not know the full potential power of BB yet.

For aokiji, enel can do the same raigoh combo and attack him. I dun see how aokiji will escape from that unless freeze the ocean and travelling on it very fast. But enel can travel fast as electricity is very fast. In a close combat battle, eneru's electricty 's heat will do a lot of damaged to aokiji. Maybe i feel that it will melt his ices easily but not immediately. The heat generated can melt gold within a few seconds. And gold's melting point is nearly 2000 degress celcius( shld be arnd there). However aokiji's ice can stand a week on the ocean. The temperature there should be around 35 degree celcius. From there i feel that the heat shld be able to melt the ice.

And last of all, enel can also restart his heart do not forget this. So enel would be able to bounce back into action until both of them tires out.

Enel>Aokiji>BB

The reason for this thread is to understand what others view. For one who said why create this thread when nothing like this has happened, that is a very dumb question. Cause this thread would not be create if the fight had already taken place and there would be no more speculations