Was Whitebeard Roger's "Krieg"?

[FireFistAce 0]

I just thought of something.

Was Whitebeard to Roger what Krieg was to Luffy? That is, a very strong villian with a lot of weapons and tools who had several men working under him?

Think about it. Krieg was arguably the strongest human in East Blue. His first commander was a regular sized guy who used iron balls to fight. We have no clue what Marco used to fight, but he's also a regular sized guy. His second in command was a giant man who used fire and his shields/fists to fight. Ace uses his fists and uses fire; he also has a "shield" of sorts in his logia powers. We don't know how Joz fights easier, but he's a huge guy that wears armor; perhaps a brawler, perhaps not.

Just as Krieg didn't know enough about the Grand Line and was forced to retreat (Well, that and Mihawk), Whitebeard may have not known about Raftel and was forced to retreat in the same manner. Plus, even though Krieg treats them a bit rougher, he cares about his crew. That's why he fed his crew and gave them time to recover before making them attack.

Whitebeard is clearly on a different level from Krieg, but in a lot of ways, they're similar to each other. They even both use a type of spear to fight.

Now, this isn't to say Krieg will return later on down the road. Maybe he will, maybe he won't. But so far, the similarities are interesting.

Discuss.

[Polygon]

@Fire Fist:

Plus, even though Krieg treats them a bit rougher, he cares about his crew. That's why he fed his crew and gave them time to recover before making them attack.

The ONLY reasons he gave them food was because they needed strengh to fight and more crewmembers = more power.

[Buccaneer]

A lot of SMALL ways. I can compare Crocodile to Roger or say Coby and Helmeppo will end up like Aokiji and Akainu just as easily.

[Gizmo]

@Fire Fist:

I just thought of something.

Was Whitebeard to Roger what Krieg was to Luffy? That is, a very strong villian with a lot of weapons and tools who had several men working under him?

Think about it. Krieg was arguably the strongest human in East Blue. His first commander was a regular sized guy who used iron balls to fight. We have no clue what Marco used to fight, but he's also a regular sized guy. His second in command was a giant man who used fire and his shields/fists to fight. Ace uses his fists and uses fire; he also has a "shield" of sorts in his logia powers. We don't know how Joz fights easier, but he's a huge guy that wears armor; perhaps a brawler, perhaps not.

Plus, even though Krieg treats them a bit rougher, he cares about his crew. That's why he fed his crew and gave them time to recover before making them attack.

.

One giant problem with this. Krieg doesn't really care about his crew. If one of his so called "nakama" gets killed, he probably wouldn't care. The only reason Krieg fed his crew was that so they could survive to make it to the Grand Line again.

Also we haven't seen Whitebeard in action so he probably is just a formidable opponent instead of a lying downright dirty snake like Krieg was.

There could be connections to Krieg and Whitebeard, but they're really vague and generalizations, its too early to conclude what Whitebeard is gonna be like.

[WSL307]

@Buccaneer:

A lot of SMALL ways. I can compare Crocodile to Roger or say Coby and Helmeppo will end up like Aokiji and Akainu just as easily.

i can understand the thing with coby and helmeppo… but what do u mean wiht Crocodile to Roger?????:wassat:

[Polygon]

@WSL307:

i can understand the thing with coby and helmeppo… but what do u mean wiht Crocodile to Roger?????:wassat:

**They both wear pimpery coats.

Both had dreams

Both were not super fat or skinny.

Both were pirates.

And the list goes on.**

[BlackGalleon1]

No offence man but I really think that you are clutching at straws here. Like Buc said, there are very few similarities and they are quite vague. Remember that Roger and WB were like rivals, if he was like Krieg then he would have been crushed by Roger on his way to being PK.

[Polygon]

@BlackGalleon1:

No offence man but I really think that you are clutching at straws here. Like Buc said, there are very few similarities and they are quite vague. Remember that Roger and WB were like rivals, if he was like Krieg then he would have been crushed by Roger on his way to being PK.

I don't think you read FF's post correctly.

[freedom]

Kreig killed one of his men just for showing a slight disagreement with him, i doubt WB is this way. I see your point, but i think it's a stretch with the comparison.

[Rai]

They are similiar in some ways, yeah, but there are two problems:
-Krieg doesn't put shit on his so called "nakama". That's at least 50% of the emotional vaule of that arc. Gin's case and such. As long as his crew is not useless in ANY way, Krieg will keep them with crappy attitude to them. That's at least how I got it.
-Luffy does not consider Krieg as a rival. When I look at it, Krieg might do so. He even kept his dream not crushed by Luffy after he lost. But, for Luffy, Krieg is one of many who kept going against him and his desires. Plus, the fact that he wasn't heard of since his only time shown only adds up. Yeah, he might make a surprise appearance, but I don't think that happened in OP till today.

For my personal opinion, I'll rather someone else being compared to WB in the WB&Roger relationship. Even so, I want no one on such a spot, because that will take Cobymeppo's rivaly to the 2nd spot. Might be BB, if we'll get clues of him being a little more towards Luffy's justice.

[FireFistAce 0]

@BlackGalleon1:

No offence man but I really think that you are clutching at straws here. Like Buc said, there are very few similarities and they are quite vague. Remember that Roger and WB were like rivals, if he was like Krieg then he would have been crushed by Roger on his way to being PK.

Maybe he was; that would explain why he's not Pirate King already. Maybe he got discouraged. We don't know for certain, but it's very possible Whitebeard, being his rival, was his final opponent, and his defeat discouraged him and that's the reason he's not Pirate King but still the World's Strongest man.

[Polygon]

To me, Buggy is to Luffy like Whitebeard is to Roger.

[BlackGalleon1]

@Polygon:

To me, Buggy is to Luffy like Whitebeard is to Roger.

I think that Teach is to Luffy what Whitebeard was to Roger, seeing as he is aiming for the top spot, not to mention he is this generations [insert colour here]beard.

[Polygon]

@BlackGalleon1:

I think that Teach is to Luffy what Whitebeard was to Roger, seeing as he is aiming for the top spot, not to mention he is this generations [insert colour here]beard.

**Besides the name and biggery, Teach and Newgate are NOTHING alike.

Buggy was one of the first people Luffy fought in the show, he was rounf as strong as Luffy last they met and he seems to car for his Nakama a whole lot more after the mmidget incident.

Blackbeard is just another really strong guy Luffy has to catch up to.**

[Rai]

@Polygon:

To me, Buggy is to Luffy like Whitebeard is to Roger.

Ah.. I forgot him. Yeah, I guess he fits in perfectly. He is also stricly connected with Shanks and maybe WB [he did ask for him].
The only problem is that he is Luffy's mentor's rival. That kinda messes him up and puts him in an unfair spot. But since Luffy's gonna be the greatest, I don't care.

BlackGalleon1: Refer to what I said just now.

[freedom]

@BlackGalleon1:

I think that Teach is to Luffy what Whitebeard was to Roger, seeing as he is aiming for the top spot, not to mention he is this generations [insert colour here]beard.

I agree. There's been no build up for Buggy's character. Sure, he'll be back, but it's simply b/c he doesn't understand Luffy and looks down on him, and while some of you think that makes him a worthy opponent, it's quite the opposite. Blackbeard immediately identifies Luffy's ambition and was surprised his bounty wasn't higher than 30M, and when he sees the 100M, he's reassured of his expectations.

[Polygon]

There's been no build-up for Buggy? You can think what you want and who is Luffy's rival/final opponent, but don't deny the facts.

[AD-HD Pirate]

There's been no build-up for Buggy? You can think what you want and who is Luffy's rival/final opponent, but don't deny the facts.

Eeh…Polygon...
I don't want to be narrow minded, but it seems that in this point Buggy is no match for Luffy. I based this what we have seen and we haven't seen Buggy very much. So I could be wrong.

[Polygon]

@AD-HD:

Eeh…Polygon...
I don't want to be narrow minded, but it seems that in this point Buggy is no match for Luffy. I based this what we have seen and we haven't seen Buggy very much. So I could be wrong.

**That's your mistake. Say our story was being told as some other crew as the main characters. If they met Luffy once, does that mean that Luffy sn't getting stronger? Buggy is getting stronger, be sure about that. Plus he started out at the same level as Luffy.

I'm not saying anything is certain. but he is getting stronger, no doubt. Remember what people said about Cobymeppo?**

[AD-HD Pirate]

Maybe…
When you are in GL you must get stronger or you will be eaten.
And Buggy wasn't very impressed about Luffy's bounty.

We will see.

[ONEinchPUNCH]

I wouldn't doubt buggy he was a great enemy and he hasn't properly lost to luffy yet. As soon as he got his body back he was going straight after luffy so he doesn't seem impressed by luffy.

[Iria25]

Buggy is getting stronger, be sure about that. Plus he started out at the same level as Luffy.

When you are in GL you must get stronger or you will be eaten.
And Buggy wasn't very impressed about Luffy's bounty.

I don't want to be narrow-minded, either, but if you are someone with almost no experience, if you're young and if you've just started your journey, then yes, chances are that you will get stronger.
But if you've already been in the Grandline for presumably a long time, and if you've been a pirate for more than twenty-two years, then your chances of suddenly improving are extremely low. That's the case of Buggy - you just can't say he started out at the same level as Luffy.

The fact that he isn't impressed by high bounties could simply mean that he's blind and overestimating himself. When Ace met them, Buggy was more worried about Whitebeard than about Ace himself - and I'm sure we all agree that it was a mistake: Ace could have kicked his ass into next century.

I can see Buggy causing trouble in the future, but turning out to be a match for Luffy? Can't see it happening. I suppose we'll see.

Back on topic… as others have said, these similarities are really vague. You can compare a lot of characters based on the same criteria… Whitebeard doesn't seem to be a coward, or even a "bad guy" to me, so I doubt it. But that’s me…

(hum, English isn’t my first language, but I hope I managed to speak correctly :) )

[Tony Tony Choppa]

In my opinion, Whitebeard is to Roger as Coby is to Luffy!
Bam!!!

[FireFistAce 0]

@Tony:

In my opinion, Whitebeard is to Roger as Coby is to Luffy!
Bam!!!

Only Coby isn't Luffy's rival. He doesn't actually have a main rival. Roger had two in Garp and Whitebeard.

Here are the similarities between Roger and Krieg. You be the judge:

1. Both are huge men.

2. Krieg is the Strongest human in East Blue (Minus Luffy), Whitebeard is the strongest man in the Grand Line (World).

3. Both use a type of spear to fight.

4. As far as we've seen, neither have Devil Fruits.

5. Both have large crews with fleet commanders.

6. Both of their 2nd in commands fight with fire and their fists.

7. Both of their fist in commands are smaller guys. Though we haven't seen Marco fight, Gin fights with Iron balls.

8. Both want to find One Piece and be Pirate King.

9. Both are arrogant and prideful men.

10. Both have enormous ships as their flagships (Well, Krieg DID, rather).

11. Both had their dream ruined by a D.

Now, the last one isn't speculation on Krieg's part, but it may or may not be on Whitebeard's part. Personally, I think it's accurate. If Whitebeard had not been discouraged, it's likely he would have already found One Piece. Since Pirate King is apparently a postmortem title, he won't have that title until he dies.

[Tony Tony Choppa]

@Fire Fist:

Only Coby isn't Luffy's rival. He doesn't actually have a main rival. Roger had two in Garp and Whitebeard.

Here are the similarities between Roger and Krieg. You be the judge:

1. Both are huge men.

2. Krieg is the Strongest human in East Blue (Minus Luffy), Whitebeard is the strongest man in the Grand Line (World).

3. Both use a type of spear to fight.

4. As far as we've seen, neither have Devil Fruits.

5. Both have large crews with fleet commanders.

6. Both of their 2nd in commands fight with fire and their fists.

7. Both of their fist in commands are smaller guys. Though we haven't seen Marco fight, Gin fights with Iron balls.

8. Both want to find One Piece and be Pirate King.

9. Both are arrogant and prideful men.

10. Both have enormous ships as their flagships (Well, Krieg DID, rather).

11. Both had their dream ruined by a D.

Now, the last one isn't speculation on Krieg's part, but it may or may not be on Whitebeard's part. Personally, I think it's accurate. If Whitebeard had not been discouraged, it's likely he would have already found One Piece. Since Pirate King is apparently a postmortem title, he won't have that title until he dies.

Well, that´s why I said "in my opinion"….
But then, why do I say that:

1.Both are teens;

2.Luffy is working his way to become a PK (Roger) and Coby is working his way to become a Supreme Admiral (Dai Buddah);

3.Both fight with bare hands;

4.Both are making significant progress in their fighting skills;

5.Both are from the same part of the world (East Blue);

6.Both are dilligent and stick to what they say (kinda obstinated);

7.Luffy´s first mate is Zoro who is a swordsman. Coby´s first mate is Helmeppo and he also is a swordsman;

8.Both are driven by a dream;

There, that´s why I think Coby is Luffy´s main rival in OP. Aside from that, I also belive that we will see them fighting eachother in the end... and I expect that to be one heck of a battle!

[Rai]

I believe Coby and Luffy relationship is similiar to Garp and Roger, only that as I think Luffy won't die, Coby won't capture him in the end [although he'll be satisfied with that].

[Tony Tony Choppa]

@Rai:

I believe Coby and Luffy relationship is similiar to Garp and Roger, only that as I think Luffy won't die, Coby won't capture him in the end [although he'll be satisfied with that].

Come to think of it… I guess you are right...
Thanks for the enlightment!

By the way FFA, very nice avatar, very good memories from that game, like Bum Rush and Gau.

[AD-HD Pirate]

Btw, "Fire Fist" Ace, "WHITEBEARD" will freak out when he finds this topic.
Be beware of that.

[Angel emfrbl]

Don't curse things AD-HD Pirate.

Oh everyone will make you suffer a painful death.

[AD-HD Pirate]

Don't curse things AD-HD Pirate.

Oh everyone will make you suffer a painful death.

Oh bugger.
I'm in trouble then…

[Rollo T]

@Fire Fist:

Only Coby isn't Luffy's rival. He doesn't actually have a main rival. Roger had two in Garp and Whitebeard.

Here are the similarities between Roger and Krieg. You be the judge:

1. Both are huge men.

2. Krieg is the Strongest human in East Blue (Minus Luffy), Whitebeard is the strongest man in the Grand Line (World).

3. Both use a type of spear to fight.

4. As far as we've seen, neither have Devil Fruits.

5. Both have large crews with fleet commanders.

6. Both of their 2nd in commands fight with fire and their fists.

7. Both of their fist in commands are smaller guys. Though we haven't seen Marco fight, Gin fights with Iron balls.

8. Both want to find One Piece and be Pirate King.

9. Both are arrogant and prideful men.

10. Both have enormous ships as their flagships (Well, Krieg DID, rather).

11. Both had their dream ruined by a D.

Now, the last one isn't speculation on Krieg's part, but it may or may not be on Whitebeard's part. Personally, I think it's accurate. If Whitebeard had not been discouraged, it's likely he would have already found One Piece. Since Pirate King is apparently a postmortem title, he won't have that title until he dies.

To say Garp was Gol's rival but that Luffy has none seems sorta ridiculous. I can see Buggy, Ace, and Smoker all being rivals to Luffy. If Garp is rival to Gol, then Smoker is rival to Luffy. If Whitebeard and Gol are rivals then it's not hard to see Ace and Luffy as rivals either.

And some of your similarities are too vague.

1. Krieg wasn't that big. He was tall and muscular, I'll give you that, but to compare him being a bit large than the average man to a dude who's like 2 stories taller than an average man isn't very believable.

2. Comparing the East Blue, the tamest of the blues, to the most deadly sea ever is a like unbalanced as well.

3. A bit of a stretch since Krieg fought with a lot more than that spear and Whitebeard's weapon was more like a sword than anything, but I'll give you that.

4. True. Nothing wrong there.

5. Krieg did, but I won't argue that either.

6. That's not true. Pearl fought with shields. Just because he punched Sanji with a shield doesn't make him a fist fighter. He used the shields in ways that normal fists wouldn't hurt. If Pearl had just used gauntlets, then yeah, but Pearl was considered invincible because he was so well defended with SHIELDS. Also we haven't seen Ace fight with his fists to my knoweldge just because he punches to throw fire doesn't mean he's an expert fistfighter.

7. That's not really a similarity. That's like saying Samuel L. Jackson and Patrick Steward are the same because they're bald. Now the two could be compared for both playing famous sci-fi characters, but Marco and Gin have no similarities that we know of yet. Saying their body structure, which are far from extraordinary, is a connection is just trying to make vague connections where there's nothing there.

8. Fine there.

9. Haven't seen too much of Whitebeard to be sure, but fine.

10. I don't remember seeing any other ships of Whitebeard's left. Maybe he only uses one ship. But fine, big flagships.

11. Krieg's dream isn't ruined. He can still find One Piece. He lost a fight. Maybe his views of being a pirate are crushed, but it's not like Luffy broke all his bones so he could never fight again. If he did then Luffy ruined his dream, but as it is now, Krieg could beat Luffy, WB, and whomever, and become Pirate King.

[Welkin]

We know from the story Whitebeard and Roger faught 'many times' (from Shanks and Whitebeard's conversation), and we have yet to find anyone that chased Luffy fast enough for that.

Granted, he did technically fight Buggy and Wapol twice, but I think they need to be a little more recurring then that.

[Sigalovski]

@Rollo:

2. Comparing the East Blue, the tamest of the blues, to the most deadly sea ever is a like unbalanced as well.

Considering that we got almost nada information on the other Blues, no? We got something on West Blue, the Ohara-incident on North Blue and some few things on South Blue.

And what about All Blue? We also got zero information on it, but Sanji is describing it as paradise. Won't paradise be tamer than East Blue?

Point is, there is no way you can prove that East Blue is the "tamest" of all the Blues.

[ONEinchPUNCH]

@Sigalovski:

Considering that we got almost nada information on the other Blues, no? We got something on West Blue, the Ohara-incident on North Blue and some few things on South Blue.

And what about All Blue? We also got zero information on it, but Sanji is describing it as paradise. Won't paradise be tamer than East Blue?

Point is, there is no way you can prove that East Blue is the "tamest" of all the Blues.

Mihawk states the east blue is the weakest of the blues.

You don't know what you'll find is the all blue their might be some crazy super powerful rare seaking there. Or maybe some powerful merman who lives their which will be sanjis final fight.

[BlackGalleon1]

@Sigalovski:

Considering that we got almost nada information on the other Blues, no? We got something on West Blue, the Ohara-incident on North Blue and some few things on South Blue.

And what about All Blue? We also got zero information on it, but Sanji is describing it as paradise. Won't paradise be tamer than East Blue?

Point is, there is no way you can prove that East Blue is the "tamest" of all the Blues.

Except for what Mihawk said, which I believe is canon.

Edit: Damn. ONEinchPUNCH beat me to it.