Huh, seems like Carrot isn’t meant to kick Perospero’s ass after all.
She never necessarily was. Her purpose was always to move forward like Pedro said, not stay stuck on revenge.
Huh, seems like Carrot isn’t meant to kick Perospero’s ass after all.
She never necessarily was. Her purpose was always to move forward like Pedro said, not stay stuck on revenge.
To summarize my feelings, I think this chapter was well written in isolation and it follows up well with the events happening at the rooftop, but things like Jack being beaten without almost any focus is extremely disappointing to me. It's not only about his high rank inside the Beast Pirates, but if you look at the Yonkou Saga from the beginning, back at Zou, there were a lot of stakes and build up in the events that happened there, which makes me expect a proportional payoff. And Zou was a great arc, so I was emotionally involved with that conflict despite how many years have passed since, and I was fairly expecting much more from Jack's defeat, not only of fighting itself, but especially drama and catharsis – in fact, a lot more than I expecting from any Tobi Roppo. The situation with Perospero is not much better as this revenge plot could have been handled better even if I'm fine with its premise. By and large, it feels like everything around the minks was executed with the minimum amount of interest, and that's a big upset.
That said, I'm not in the team "oh no, everything is terrible!" despite some unfortunate issues. This raid is still pretty good and most likely a classic.
I don't know why i keep thinking that tengu guy is going to do something neat, i mean since he hangs around the capital eating cotton candy he's probably not going to take part in any action, but his design seems to neat just to be around. Maybe he'll do some revealing once they've landed the flying rock and face punched Kaido into submission
Well he's all but confirmed to be Oden's dad so that's probably going to lead to something.
She never necessarily was. Her purpose was always to move forward like Pedro said, not stay stuck on revenge.
I guess this means that her closure won't fully come until Neko or someone else goes up to talk to her after all this is over and comfort her in regards to how to move on forward.
@Sibersk:
Well he's all but confirmed to be Oden's dad so that's probably going to lead to something.
It my first time hearing the theory. I don't remember him having any special reaction to Hiyori or Momo. Is it because of owning the kitetsu?
It my first time hearing the theory. I don't remember him having any special reaction to Hiyori or Momo. Is it because of owning the kitetsu?
He and Sukiyaki have the same anime VO, the manga says they both like kokeshi dolls, and when Tenguyama's vivre card was released it originally said 58 years old but a correction was made that said he was 81 years old, which would be an appropriate age for Sukiyaki if he was alive.
It seems pretty cut and dry.
Such a trashy treatment from Oda to Jack
He doesn't even bother to draw him attacks !! How come the flying six received a better attention & care from Oda than an all star ?
Not only he gave him an ugly hybrid form that looks like a smile type, there is nothing creative about him at all despite his significant rank
Oda didn't even try which is very fucking disappointing considering the major importance of the Yonko Commanders in the new world.
@Zik:
I think the speculation about it at all is the problem.
.
Why is that a problem to speculate how Oda is writing his story and what could have is change of plan in his scenario ?
Of course, it is impossible to change the story once it is published but i find it rather interesting to speculate about such things. What was planned and what was not
Also Oda is definitively rushing things. So you will be annoyed a lot if you don't like people saying it
Why is that a problem to speculate how Oda is writing his story and what could have is change of plan in his scenario ?
Of course, it is impossible to change the story once it is published but i find it rather interesting to speculate about such things. What was planned and what was notAlso Oda is definitively rushing things. So you will be annoyed a lot if you don't like people saying it
It's pointless and counter productive.
It's actually worse than the baseless speculation about what would happen in the story.
And yeah, keep pretending you know things for a fact if you want. Guess you gotta find some way for it to make sense to you.
Big Mom really is making Kaido a huge favour, if not for her, imagine the likes of Law and Kidd rooming free thrughout Onigashima without nothing stopping them.
@Zik:
It's pointless and counter productive.
It's actually worse than the baseless speculation about what would happen in the story.
What, would you rather people just praise, whine and hate and leave it at that ? Any speculation is pointless at the end of the day, it's just what we enjoy doing. If one brand of speculation annoys you, keep ignoring it and everyone'll be fine.
@Zar:
In my defence the splitting of double pages on Manga Plus is horrible and this chapter in particular is suffering heavily from that.
Sorry if somebody already responded to this, I haven´t read the whole thread yet, but when you open a chapter on Manga Plus, in the upper right corner are 3 vertical dots (settings), use horizontal reading direction, that one does not split double pages like the vertical one. I had the same issue as you originally. The reading experience is much better (less confusing) that way IMO.
And here I thought forums like these were places where people went to share and discuss different opinions about topics they care about enough to have an opinion on.
Turns out they're actually places where people expect to find big echo chambers of their own point of view, and bursting or even shaking the bubble a little is rude and stupid.
You may think it's an innocent enough thing you're doing when you point out stuff you didn't like in the manga for kids about magic pirates, but you're actualy ruining someone's day.
About the chapter, I liked Luffy's motivational speech to Momo. As a whole their relationship is the best outside-of-crew actual friendship we've seen i think, made good use of the long time spent together to build a unique bond. Also wise Luffy is my personal favorite kind of serious Luffy, wisdom is a a better kingly feature than punching huge people. I kinda wish that a bit of such wisdom was used earlier to help progress Usopp a little, since he's the long running main charachter with the courage issues and is kinda stuck in his arc since the timeskip, but I'mm hesitant to speak such a controversial thought out loud.
Sorry if somebody already responded to this, I haven´t read the whole thread yet, but when you open a chapter on Manga Plus, in the upper right corner are 3 vertical dots (settings), use horizontal reading direction, that one does not split double pages like the vertical one. I had the same issue as you originally. The reading experience is much better (less confusing) that way IMO.
Oh my god THANK YOU.
What, would you rather people just praise, whine and hate and leave it at that ?
Maybe just discuss the story?
But I get it if that's too small of a sandbox for you.
Any speculation is pointless at the end of the day
This is untrue. Stop with the false equivalence as if all speculating is equal and the same.
it's just what we enjoy doing.
Even going by your posts it does not come off that you guys enjoy speculating that Oda is rushing in telling the story.
Oh, well, if what you're looking for is someone to argue with, let's leave it at that. I don't especially enjoy multi-quote posts that dissect arguments down to the last word, much less so if they're about telling me how I should or should not discuss a manga about rubber pirates.
@Zik:
This is untrue. Stop with the false equivalence as if all speculating is equal and the same.
So have we to acknowledge Zik as the one and only true sage who can decide which speculations "about what would happen in the story" are baseless and which are not ?
And here I thought forums like these were places where people went to share and discuss different opinions about topics they care about enough to have an opinion on.
Turns out they're actually places where people expect to find big echo chambers of their own point of view, and bursting or even shaking the bubble a little is rude and stupid.
You may think it's an innocent enough thing you're doing when you point out stuff you didn't like in the manga for kids about magic pirates, but you're actualy ruining someone's day.About the chapter, I liked Luffy's motivational speech to Momo. As a whole their relationship is the best outside-of-crew actual friendship we've seen i think, made good use of the long time spent together to build a unique bond. Also wise Luffy is my personal favorite kind of serious Luffy, wisdom is a a better kingly feature than punching huge people. I kinda wish that a bit of such wisdom was used earlier to help progress Usopp a little, since he's the long running main charachter with the courage issues and is kinda stuck in his arc since the timeskip, but I'mm hesitant to speak such a controversial thought out loud.
As it is valid to criticize and dislike stuff, it's just as valid when someone sees a pitiful attempt at nitpicking and calls it just that.
I'm somewhat confused as to what the idea here is. Is it like this kind of a true artist does not have to answer to the rabble that consumes his work type of thing? Or why would speculating about the whys of a subjective drop in quality or a perceived rushed pace be any different from any other speculation taking place on our little board. Personally i think it is fair game to poke, prod, guess and speculate about any random minutia that catches your fancy
@NER:
As it is valid to criticize and dislike stuff, it's just as valid when someone sees a pitiful attempt at nitpicking and calls it just that.
Except explicit call outs to specific "pitiful nitpickers" are very rare and sparse, while there's an abundance of quite passive-aggressive general anathemas on "cynics" and "nitpickers".
But even if that wasn't the case, how about engaging in a disucussion on statements you disagree with, instead of preemptively dismissing other's stances based on arbitrary classifications?
Best case you unmask the petty nitpicker who just wants to get attention anyway, while the worst thing that could happen is that you actually discover a different point of view you didn't consider earlier.
So have we to acknowledge Zik as the one and only true sage who can decide which speculations "about what would happen in the story" are baseless and which are not ?
One is speculation about the story the other is not.
Pay attention.
I am saddend to see that the term austrich egg pickers has not picked up any traction
As I already said in the spoiler section, there're huge hints Oda is urging to rush things (as he probably is already mentally concentrating on next things). They are:
This is just plain tension building rules, which actually are the very fundament of every One Piece fight. Do you remember when you began wishing for Sai to hit the fuck off of Lao G's head when the old man actually did nothing until a chapter before? That was tension building.
And I am not judging Oda as a "bad writer" or whatever: he's just rushing up things in order to reach a plot point (Luffy vs Kaido's final fight?) and it's not event he first time he does it. This time it is just pretty much undeniable, due storytelling screaming for it. Judging is for later on the arc as a whole.
Except explicit call outs to specific "pitiful nitpickers" are very rare and sparse, while there's an abundance of quite passive-aggressive general anathemas on "cynics" and "nitpickers".
But even if that wasn't the case, how about engaging in a disucussion on statements you disagree with, instead of preemptively dismissing other's stances based on arbitrary classifications?
Best case you unmask the petty nitpicker who just wants to get attention anyway, while the worst thing that could happen is that you actually discover a different point of view you didn't consider earlier.
I shan't be bothered with all that. As some others stated before me, this forum is now reserved for those disposed to dislike and nitpick. I shall leave to never come back again. Better than seeing posts with such scarred logic, so much so that it's offensive for my eyes to read.
The bad mood arc of AP must have followed the proper structures because it has given an emotional resonance. Wolfwoods character arc in particular is a divisive one, is he a hater as salty as the ocean? Or is he the dream boat of the board, a loveable scamp with eyes to drown in. We may never know (but it is of course both)
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@NER:
I shan't be bothered with all that. As some others stated before me, this forum is now reserved for those disposed to dislike and nitpick. I shall leave to never come back again. Better than seeing posts with such scarred logic, so much so that it's offensive for my eyes to read.
It is funny how my memory of you is of a nice fun guy. But here you are talking down to people and acting high and mighty. Not that you care of course, as a offensive complainer like myself is beneath the notice of your grace
I don't mind Oda cutting corners to move the story along, he's been doing it since the timeskip. But there's a difference in cutting something in a way that it's pages instead of entire chapters, or relayed purely in dialogue, and then there's cutting soemthing in a way its just disjointed panels that don't flow well.
When he cuts too much, too deep, it hurts the overall story.
Like I said, I never wanted nor expected some mega 6 chapter battle between the minks and Jack, (that's for the anime to pick up) but the way its presented here, rushed as possible just… makes it not work.
rayleigh92 nailed it, normally there's 1. tension 2. final blow, 3. tension release, 4. satisfaction. When you cut even that four panel setup down to just two panels (for the sake of page space I guess) it's just too much and it hinders the overall impact. That's why Luffy finally splitting the sky didn't quite land emotionally or dramatically..
And yeah, having the minks go sulong for a chapter cliffhanger, then revert back off camera due to an obstacle raised this very chapter, and then undone so they can go all out again... with no real space to breathe and take this idea in... the corner cutting adds up.
Like if we'd just cut the tengu guy at the start of the chapter that would have given the rest time to breathe with that extra two pages. I have to assume this is a volume start chapter and that's why its there, but...
@NER:
I shan't be bothered with all that. As some others stated before me, this forum is now reserved for those disposed to dislike and nitpick. I shall leave to never come back again. Better than seeing posts with such scarred logic, so much so that it's offensive for my eyes to read.
If you truly feel that way, have fun wherever you go next!
But I'm willing to wager you'll be on here again. Lurking at the very least, if not posting.
@Zik:
I think the speculation about it at all is the problem.
But I guess after 20 or even 10+ years of reading, fans feel they're well versed or even experts on storytelling.
@Zik:
One is speculation about the story the other is not.
Pay attention.
There seems to be two things going on here – you both complain that “fans feel they're well versed or even experts on storytelling”, i.e. of fans making critical assessment of the effectiveness of the storytelling, and also of the very idea of speculating on the reason for storytelling choices.
Why is either of those things bad? Surely its better to devote energy to try and articulate why certain storytelling choices didn’t land for someone than just going “I did not like this”, even if you personally don’t agree with the reasoning? I don’t see how you could “counter” this “problem” apart from people just stating their feelings with no justification (hardly seems better) or not saying anything at all.
And yes speculating on the reasons for why a thing turned out the way it did is different than speculating on future developments in the story, but both are rooted entirely in trying to get into Odas head, and why exactly is one “better” or “more correct”? Why is dedication to the divination of OP’s futures more worthwhile than engaging with the OP that actually is?
What would “discussing the actual story” look like to you?
Whatever it is, you don’t seem to be doing much of it yourself, because across your six posts in this thread all of them concern not really the chapter, but your railing against people critical of the chapter. You don’t care for people speculating meta-reasons for why Oda writes what he writes, yet over and over you offer such, always unflattering, speculations on the reasons why the people being critical are being critical, and how they must be actually miserable in doing so– the actual people right here engaging in conversation mind, not a world-famous author who will never see this discussion.
The only time you touch on “discussing OP” is when you counter someones negative feelings on Momo biting Kaidou by providing a (non-textually substantiated) justification for it, but worded in a way that frames the other poster as having read the sequence with a faulty perspective.
You may not personally prefer discussing OP through the lens of critically evaluating the storytelling choices, or pondering the underlying reasons for them, but at least the people doing that are actually engaging with the subject of One Piece.
By focusing almost entirely on complaining of other people complaining, you, effectively, are not.
I've read some post, who said that they are not satisfied with how the fight went between the Jack and Dogstorm and Perospero and Catviper. I do understand where you are coming from and I wished for a bit more of a struggle for Perospero and Jack, or showing some cool moves against the two minks.
For me personally the chapter showed the struggle of Catviper and Dogstorm, as without Sulong they are powerless against Perospero and Jack.
I agree it would have been cool to see, them being attacked by Jack and Perospero and than falling down, while reverting back to their normal form, which would help built up tension.
This would have made Luffys clash against Kaido more powerful in the end and the impact of the clouds splitting, revealing the full moon, more powerful and satisfactory.
I'm not an expert if this would be possible to show in a few panels or a page, but well. It did not happen. What we got instead is the single panel, which shows the moon covered and than on the next page we get to see Perospero and Jack seemingly ready to land the final blow. We did not see that as well, does it bother me, a bit yes. But Oda tried to wrap up the mink story line fast, so he could move on to more important story points, which he obviously deems to be more important than the minks, did he succeed with wrapping up the minks story of Zou and WCI? Yes, is it to my full satisfaction, no.
Never the less the chapter accomplished far more important aspects for me personally.
It officially established for me, that Luffy is now able to hold his own against Kaido, will he be able to do that for a whole fight by himself, if Yamato and Momo should leave, is another question. But he grew more into his role of the future Pirate King.
Momo might gain, thanks to Luffy, an even greater strength, finally some confidence in himself. I think he acquired the physical strength needed to stand up to anyone but lacked the confidence to actually do something meaningful. This has changed.
So now I cant wait for the next chapter to drop and see what happens next. I hope that we will see a bit more of Orochi and the conclusion of one of the other minor fights, maybe that of Hawkins and Killer or we might find out what X Drake has been up to the past couple of volumes.
Given the treatment the Mink have gotten throughout the Wano Arc, it appears Oda just wasn't that interested in their story relative to everything else he has going on. It would explain why the conclusion of Inuarashi and Nekomamushi's conflicts feel so rushed - Oda was focused on only wanting to conclude what he started with the Minks and nothing more. I am not sure if Oda gets bored with characters he creates but throughout the Wano Arc, his handling of the Mink has been lacking excitement.
I wonder if Jack were matched up against a Straw Hat Pirate or Marco or Law or Kid or Yamato if he would have been focused on more substantially. He probably would have if only to highlight the Straw Hat Pirate/Marco/Law/Kid/Yamato.
I've said it in another thread but I feel like the only reason Jack got this treatment was because he was the main villain of a previous arc already and so Oda doesn't feel like he neds to treat Jack on the same level as Queen or King. Those two are new to this arc and Queen especially has got a lot of focus, while Jack is a returning character. Perospero is also a returning character, although I'm a little confused at why he is even here to be honest (unlike Jack who has to be here). I'm hoping it has a bigger impact on something later on in the story.
Given the tease of Orochi at the end of this chapter, I reckon the next chapter will be all about defeating him. Start with Raizo and Fukurokuju with the latter explaining Orochi's ability after Raizo notices the corpse has gone, then cut to Orochi with Hiyori (revealing she was the silhouette from before), then Denjiro appears because he suspected Orochi was still alive. End the chapter with either Hiyori or Denjiro taking Orochi out (and maybe Raizo beating Fukurokoju). That's my prediction for 1,027.
When you think about it, when hasn't fandoms been full of fans bitching about the very thing they are fans about?
I don't remember a time when APforum users didn't thought they could do a better job than Oda.
That's an essential part of hanging around these kinda places.
I liked the chapter btw, good art and fun moments. Thats where my thought process about it ends. Maybe i'm a simpleton.
Criticism is not hate.
One can enjoy a story while finding flaws in it. No author is perfect. And an unsatisfying chapter does not make a series bad.
One can find a plot point flawed, or the pacing off, while still enjoying the overall story.
Also, reading weekly means that some weeks may be really underwhelming, because we don’t know what’s ahead.
There’s a complete difference between finding flaws in a work And hating it.
That said, this is one of the most underwhelming chapters in the last few years, IMO. There’s things in there that were set up years ago and the conclusion is really underwhelming. I hope there’s at least some more resolution (not fighting) for those plots ahead.
My stance on the corner cutting so far is that I'm for it, not necessarily on principle, but because so far it hasn't really affected anything I was interested in (I have almost zero interest in any mink character, Nekomamushi is fun and Pedro was great, but that's honestly it).
I personally think the raid has fixed (or is on its way to fixing) a lot of my issues with Wano (zero characterization of Kaido beyond being Orochi's muscle, minimal action, lack of personality throughout the beast pirates ranks, lack of momentum when it comes to Momo's character..etc), but I think the problem is that Oda underestimated how hard it is for the manga medium to accomodate so many characters, Marineford worked quite well, but it also utilized far more inconclusive clashes (which are not an option on a closed setting like Onigashima, esp given that Oda has positioned this raid as a must-win occasion).
Ultimately I don't expect that Wano arc would get more than a 7.5/10 from me, as in, it would take something really, really good happening for me to give it anymore points than that. This is mainly because acts 1 and 2 have honestly dragged a lot and contributed a lot to the high expectations that act 3 so far cannot match.
Criticism is not hate.
One can enjoy a story while finding flaws in it. No author is perfect. And an unsatisfying chapter does not make a series bad.
One can find a plot point flawed, or the pacing off, while still enjoying the overall story.
Also, reading weekly means that some weeks may be really underwhelming, because we don’t know what’s ahead.
There’s a complete difference between finding flaws in a work And hating it.
That said, this is one of the most underwhelming chapters in the last few years, IMO. There’s things in there that were set up years ago and the conclusion is really underwhelming. I hope there’s at least some more resolution (not fighting) for those plots ahead.
You nailed it. Criticism (constructive one) is a form of love. I do not criticize an work for sake of demolishing it, but because I care about it (and I have a déformation professionnelle as having studied storytelling, art and as comics author myself). If I won't I'd already dropped it. There's a various amount of manga (and generally comics) I cared about until a point, then understood the thing was beyond salvation and dropped the whole of it, just updating later about how thing ended. One Piece is by far not the case.
I have lots of things in my mind regarding criticism. I can't shake this feeling that anything I'll say might end up sounding tremendously hypocritical after the massive ammounts of shit I've given Naruto, Bleach or even HxH…but it's something like: Man, do we love to fixate on the negative elements on this forum. And I say this guilty as charged. And I know I'm not quite as negative when it comes to One Piece, hence the hypocrisy.
But still...can't help but feel that the past, what, 20? 25? 30? spoilers threads have been an almost unending avalanche of negative comments, and yes, it does wear down on you after a while. And it's almost always the same type of comments: corner cutting, less focus, too many characters. Like, yeah, I get it, it's proper criticism and I agree with it! But. . .every single week for the entirety of the raid, it gets a bit tiresome. And it seems to instill this idea that the Onigashima Raid has been this draggy mess when...it's not? It's actually quite good, even with its issues?
I don't know. Anyways, to each its own.
And to add something to the thread, proper - 1: This I had 100% forgotten about. And it's just pretty damned sweet.
!
And 2 - Damn at the attention to detail in here. It's taken me a while to realize Perospero's Candy Arm is being shattered here. Really cool detail.
!
And 3 - Momo's journey from insufferable, lecherous child to being beaten down and crucified yet still trying to rally the samurai to sacrificing 20 years of his life and try to surpass his fear of flying…to biting Kaido and not letting go of him, that's one journey right there. One that deserves props to Oda, cause that's commitment right there.
Sorry for the late reply, yes it is for you with no hill intent maybe should have used an emoji to finish it off, anyway just like the current discussion Haki is one of those sore topics that always cause the discussion thread do derail and have people losing their shit. The concern is relevant but in the end the discussion always leads to nowhere but create additional confusion. (I stop trying to figure it out a long time ago).
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Is this directed at me? If so what does that mean?
Sorry for the late reply, yes it is for you with no ill intent maybe should have used an emoji to finish it off, anyway just like the current discussion Haki is one of those sore topics that always cause the discussion thread do derail and have people losing their shit. The concern is relevant but in the end the discussion always leads to nowhere but create additional confusion. (I stop trying to figure it out a long time ago).
I have lots of things in my mind regarding criticism. I can't shake this feeling that anything I'll say might end up sounding tremendously hypocritical after the massive ammounts of shit I've given Naruto, Bleach or even HxH…but it's something like: Man, do we love to fixate on the negative elements on this forum. And I say this guilty as charged. And I know I'm not quite as negative when it comes to One Piece, hence the hypocrisy.
What is a little hypocrisy betwenn friends.
Also it was about naruto, it doesn't count
It's not even about criticism, but passion. Some of you seem more passionate about defending your criticisms than you are about your love of this series.
Luffy just split the sky. This is an amazing accomplishment and it's being met with indifference. That feat was only performed by Emperors prior to this chapter and now Luffy has done it.
This is the first definitive feat of Shanks that Luffy has matched. The promise made in chapter 1 is now that much closer to fulfillment.
Instead of joy over this it's the opposite. This thread is an echo chamber of dissatisfaction. Misery loves company they say. So, it's understandable if some users don't want their enjoyment soured like the rest of yours.
It's not even about criticism, but passion. Some of you seem more passionate about defending your criticisms than you are about your love of this series.
Luffy just split the sky. This is an amazing accomplishment and it's being met with indifference. That feat was only performed by Emperors prior to this chapter and now Luffy has done it.
This is the first definitive feat of Shanks that Luffy has matched. The promise made in chapter 1 is now that much closer to fulfillment.
Instead of joy over this it's the opposite. This thread is an echo chamber of dissatisfaction. Misery loves company they say. So, it's understandable if some users don't want their enjoyment soured like the rest of yours.
These type of you people must be miserable hateful etc posts are starting to hurt a bit tbh.
It's not even about criticism, but passion. Some of you seem more passionate about defending your criticisms than you are about your love of this series.
Luffy just split the sky. This is an amazing accomplishment and it's being met with indifference. That feat was only performed by Emperors prior to this chapter and now Luffy has done it.
This is the first definitive feat of Shanks that Luffy has matched. The promise made in chapter 1 is now that much closer to fulfillment.
Instead of joy over this it's the opposite. This thread is an echo chamber of dissatisfaction. Misery loves company they say. So, it's understandable if some users don't want their enjoyment soured like the rest of yours.
The sky-splitting moment does not matter to judge the subplots that are (seemly) resolved in this chapter. They were underwhelming, and Luffy splitting the sky does not change that. At best, it obfuscates them.
For a reader that was interested in seeing Jack defeated after 200+ chapters or wanted to see Perospero’s side-plot lead to something meaningful after 40+ chapters, this chapter is a disappointment.
It’s perfectly fine criticism. If you don’t like it, avoid forums, they are meant to comment various aspects of the story and not just praise it.
I have lots of things in my mind regarding criticism. I can't shake this feeling that anything I'll say might end up sounding tremendously hypocritical after the massive ammounts of shit I've given Naruto, Bleach or even HxH…but it's something like: Man, do we love to fixate on the negative elements on this forum. And I say this guilty as charged. And I know I'm not quite as negative when it comes to One Piece, hence the hypocrisy.
But still...can't help but feel that the past, what, 20? 25? 30? spoilers threads have been an almost unending avalanche of negative comments, and yes, it does wear down on you after a while. And it's almost always the same type of comments: corner cutting, less focus, too many characters. Like, yeah, I get it, it's proper criticism and I agree with it! But. . .every single week for the entirety of the raid, it gets a bit tiresome. And it seems to instill this idea that the Onigashima Raid has been this draggy mess when...it's not? It's actually quite good, even with its issues?
I don't know. Anyways, to each its own.
I've noticed that I've been increasingly going back to the same old criticisms even though I'm trying to be more positive, and I think part of it is burnout. The first two acts were boring to me so Onigashima was like a breath of fresh air, I loved it… but around the time Luffy got thrown of the island my interest tanked and I'm increasingly feeling like I'm back to reading the series just because it's One Piece. It gives me the same vibe as when Luffy climbed the bean stalk in Skypiea, I just want it to end. On paper the chapters are good (they're always very well done) but my emotional investments in this series aren't being satisfied and it leaves me... well... burnt out. I will try to cut down on the samey criticisms though. Or at least spoiler them.
And if it's any consolation regarding feeling like a hypocrite with Naruto, I've been rereading that series and there's a point in Shippuden where I realize exactly why I went so damn hard on it back then. Some of it was underserved and definitely part of joining the community in having fun, but there are some choices in that series that are so baffling they're hilarious.
It's not even about criticism, but passion. Some of you seem more passionate about defending your criticisms than you are about your love of this series.
Luffy just split the sky. This is an amazing accomplishment and it's being met with indifference. That feat was only performed by Emperors prior to this chapter and now Luffy has done it.
This is the first definitive feat of Shanks that Luffy has matched. The promise made in chapter 1 is now that much closer to fulfillment.
Instead of joy over this it's the opposite. This thread is an echo chamber of dissatisfaction. Misery loves company they say. So, it's understandable if some users don't want their enjoyment soured like the rest of yours.
More like people have different opinions. The sky splitting did nothing for me, Luffy has measured up against Kaido several times already and the whole measuring thing towards Yonko's and Shanks has never been something I particularly enjoyed in the series.
I was way more excited to see Momo finally get the courage to fight back. Oda's really nailed an eight-year old full-grown dragon, and to me his dragon form has always been what I liked about the character. Plus the way Oda draws the eastern dragons is phenomenal.
People complaining about other people criticism are making these threads more toxic, if any. A forum isn't mean to be an echo chamber. :getlost:
I was invested in Jack after the Zou tragedy, and I was really curious to see the direction Carrot/Perospero was going to take. I understand if some readers didn't really care about these plotlines being deal mostly off-screen with how long the arc has been, not caring much about the cahracters involved, and because of that it didn't affect their enjoyment of the chapter, good for them.
But it's kind of strange I have to shut up because otherwise I'm "nitpicking" and "ruining" it for other people with my "negativity".
Poor Pero and Jack, their faces when they realise they've made the classic villain mistake of monologing, love it!
Still, it's a shame that yet more stuff gets off-panelled, especially as the anime doesn't always have the budget or the will to fill in the gaps.
Poor Pero and Jack, their faces when they realise they've made the classic villain mistake of monologing, love it!
Still, it's a shame that yet more stuff gets off-panelled, especially as the anime doesn't always have the budget or the will to fill in the gaps.
Peros had great banter. One of Odas most succesful creations in my book, you really wanted to see him smacked yet enjoyed his trolling
For a reader that was interested in seeing Jack defeated after 200+ chapters or wanted to see Perospero’s side-plot lead to something meaningful after 40+ chapters, this chapter is a disappointment.
It’s perfectly fine criticism. If you don’t like it, avoid forums, they are meant to comment various aspects of the story and not just praise it.
Hey, you don't like it, then you don't like it. I just find it bizarre that the fate of some side villains can trump the accomplishments of the main character. I understand criticism is important. But you can't blame other users who are disappointed that they can't be involved in some communal joy every once in awhile
Forget nitpicking and just enjoy the chapter. End is in sight. That's how I am going on with this arc for sometimes now.
P.S: Also, since I am seeing random mention of Naruto in this thread, I just want to say that Naruto was great.
Naruto is indeed a good series.
It is a weird feeling being made to feel responsible for another persons enjoyment. Like at the core you don't want to make other people feel bad, but you can't reasonably be asked to erase yourself either. So i don't quite know what to take away from these look what your faults made me do leaving posts
That's why I said I felt super weird voicing these thoughts, cause criticism must exist, and the thing is, most of current day criticisms seen in this forum are basically right.
Thing is, there's lots of good stuff in current One Piece too, yet it feels sometimes that the focus is mostly on its (again, deserved) shortcomings.
Like, damn, Jack went down with 0 named attacks, as redon mentioned on twitter. It's an insanely weird decision by Oda. Same with Page One. It makes you question those decisions, obviously.
But then again, the past two chapters have been filled to the brim with incredible art and great action scenes, with Yamato duking it out in gorgeous fashion…but that seems like almost an afterthought in the face of Jack and Pero's getting unceremoniously defeated.
Again, I don't feel too good mentioning this, cause it does feel like you want to force a certain state of mind unto others and making them feel bad for not enjoying the series at the same level as you. And that's not what you do on a forum, you just voice your opinions, as long as they're not harmful or hateful.
And, also, it feels like derailing the chapter thread. So maybe this can be food for another thread, unrelated to One Piece? Cause I've been thinking a lot about this stuff, but not just related to One Piece chapters but movies, series and so on.
No one wants or expects an epic 4 chapter fight for the minks to get extreme focus, but even a tiny bit after literal years of build up? Heck, if we'd seen Jack fighting the mink army 30 chapters ago and gotten that taste there, it'd be alleviated. Instead of gettign 7 chapters ina row of Luffy running up stairs and facing off against another comedy zoan design.
Or, conversely, if Cat and Dog hadn't gone sulong a couple chapters ago, then had it turned off, then turned on again… if THIS chapter the cliffhanger was them finally getting that power up with the promise of next chapter being a bit of their skirmish and then the same finishers? It'd be fine.
agreed with this.
I really liked the chapter. And I do think the sky splitting was just awesome. Momo facing upto Kaido and biting him down like that was pretty well done imo. And the final panels of the minks' fights were nice as well. But it was really badly paced. Esp Perospero needed some badly needed panel time here. As Robby said, the start of the Raid had wasted a lot of time, and now it's ill effects are being felt here