Personally I've always felt that Dragon seemingly carrying the wind with him may be a hint at him having a wind Logia, because we've seen two other instances - Ace in Drum Island and Crocodile in Arabasta - where a Logia's mere presence was able to influence the climate itself. Ace implicitly stopped the snow from falling, and I don't think anyone would say that it was purely a coincidence that the rain started in Arabasta literally seconds after Crocodile was dealt the finishing blow.
General Devil Fruit Discussion
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Maybe Monkey D. Dragon has the Dragon-Dragon Fruit Model: ''Wind'' ''Blue'' ''Eastern Dragon'' or something like that. Some kind of Legendary dragon of the western wind or something simular.
The wind always blows when he is present so there…That means there are more dragon fruits out there ;).
Dragon Dragon Fruit Model: Green (You become a stereotype Western-European dragon.)
Dragon Dragon Fruit Model: Red (You become a stereotype Chinese dragon.)Etcetera.
That would make dragon unoriginal
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@Doc:
That would make dragon unoriginal
Does that really matter? You could just make the other dragons appear briefly or in movies or something like that.
If there are only like 4 versions of the fruit, and those would then be extremely rare. So would it really matter?
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I don't know i guess but it would be better just to have one dragon out there
I wonder what fruit doflamingo ate? (if he ate one) -
Doflamingo seems to have the String-String fruit or some such. It could be a similar deal as with Pauly, but the strings (assuming that's what it is) seem to be fully invisible, and unbreakable - even Jozu couldn't break free of them - and on top of that he was seen controlling Sarquiss while not even looking at him. Screams "magical" to me, which in turn screams "Devil Fruit".
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It's quite obvious Doflamingo has a DF.
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Yeah he seems like he can cut things with his power too
hes pretty overpowered
i wanna know his story/past -
Puppetman would be a better choice for Doflamingo. It'd cover his ability to control others along with how he's able to create these strings to slice up a giant like Oars III.
Like how Hawkins would fit as a voodooman instead of just having the ability to create and control straw or something. It explains how he's able to create said straw, but also the damage transferred to those two other people when Borsalino beat him up at Sabaody.
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@Doc:
Yeah he seems like he can cut things with his power too
hes pretty overpowered
i wanna know his story/pastSomething with strings, the puppeteer thingy in the Whitebeard war was a proof of that.
He can randomly create ''indestructible'' and almost invisible strings and attack those to for example a persons limbs. Making him the controller of said limbs?
Just a theory. :wassat:Puppetman would be a better choice for Doflamingo. It'd cover his ability to control others along with how he's able to create these strings to slice up a giant like Oars III.
Damnit I got ninja'd!
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Puppetman would be a better choice for Doflamingo. It'd cover his ability to control others along with how he's able to create these strings to slice up a giant like Oars III.
Like how Hawkins would fit as a voodooman instead of just having the ability to create and control straw or something. It explains how he's able to create said straw, but also the damage transferred to those two other people when Borsalino beat him up at Sabaody.
My sentiments exactly.
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Personally I've always felt that Dragon seemingly carrying the wind with him may be a hint at him having a wind Logia, because we've seen two other instances - Ace in Drum Island and Crocodile in Arabasta - where a Logia's mere presence was able to influence the climate itself. Ace implicitly stopped the snow from falling, and I don't think anyone would say that it was purely a coincidence that the rain started in Arabasta literally seconds after Crocodile was dealt the finishing blow.
Ok. the Rain falling in Alabasta at that precise moment was an interesting phenomenon, but what on earth are you trying to say here? That Crocodile somehow prevented the rain from falling with his DF power, and that as soon as he was defeated his control vanished? I'm not seeing anything in the text or anywhere else that supports such a notion. Ace basically generating heat from his body due to his DF makes sense to me, (though I am reluctant to agree he stopped all the snow falling all over the island–I need to reread and see if there's anything definitive in the chapter.) but as far as Croc is concerned, it's one thing to control sand storms if your power controls sand, but to control whether the rain falls or not seems a stretch... so do you have anything to back this up?
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Puppetman would be a better choice for Doflamingo. It'd cover his ability to control others along with how he's able to create these strings to slice up a giant like Oars III.
Like how Hawkins would fit as a voodooman instead of just having the ability to create and control straw or something. It explains how he's able to create said straw, but also the damage transferred to those two other people when Borsalino beat him up at Sabaody.
Good point. The strings would just be the side-effect of being a puppetman, in that case… although that leaves me to wonder how in the world you can combat him, if he is able to simply control you at will? I tend to figure that if you can shake of the strings, you can shake of his control, but if the control is simply magical and someone as strong as Jozu couldn't break out then I really wonder what the "trick" to fighting him is.
Also, it kinda looks to me as if he's actively controlling people with strings when he does that little movement with his fingers. For example, when he stopped Jozu there was a panel displaying his arm and fingers right before Jozu froze in place, and it also looks like he's sort of pulling his arm backward, as if to hold Jozu still, and he retains the same position when we see him next chapter.
So, I dunno. I think it could go either way.
@I:
Ok. the Rain falling in Alabasta at that precise moment was an interesting phenomenon, but what on earth are you trying to say here? That Crocodile somehow prevented the rain from falling with his DF power, and that as soon as he was defeated his control vanished? I'm not seeing anything in the text or anywhere else that supports such a notion. Ace basically generating heat from his body due to his DF makes sense to me, (though I am reluctant to agree he stopped all the snow falling all over the island–I need to reread and see if there's anything definitive in the chapter.) but as far as Croc is concerned, it's one thing to control sand storms if your power controls sand, but to control whether the rain falls or not seems a stretch... so do you have anything to back this up?
Well, let me start by citing Crocodile:
"The essence of the power of sand
IS DRYNESS!!!"Dryness, the ability to dry things out, is the essence of Crocodile's power. He basically radiates dryness, to put it that way, in the same way that Ace radiates heat. Now, obviously the amount of dryness that he radiates wouldn't be enough to actually affect the climate if we're looking at it from a real-life perspective, but considering what Ace did at Drum - because I'm sure you will agree with me that it was Ace's doing - it can reasonably be thought to be enough to affect the climate in the OP-verse, at least on a smaller scale. Combined with how Crocodile would have every reason to hold back the rain - it would essentially screw up his entire plan if it actually fell - and how the rain started falling literally seconds after his defeat, my conclusion is that it was Oda's intention to portray that Crocodile did indeed hold back the rain with his Devil Fruit ability.
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I wanna see a good fight with him in it and him actually trying
all we have seen is him toying around with people
he must be pretty powerful if he still hasn't shown his true potential -
If anything, it's a strength feat when you look at Doflamingo's feats in the war.
Fodderizing Atmos, easily controlling Joz, casually slicing off Oars' city block sized foot.
Doflamingo looks to be a New World Powerhouse.
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Oh snap… There's about a 1/100,000,000 berry chance of that happening but still! Two people biting the same fruit at the exact same time, with the exact same force...
inb4 pulling statistics out of your ass. There's literally zero chance of that happening, for two people to bite it at exactly the same time with exactly the same force.
It's not going to happen in the story anyway, so why worry about it?
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@Coruscation:Uh…what are you talking about? The strings aren't a side effect. Doflamingo needs to use them in order to control someone.
Using them as a cutting tool is just finding another way to utilize what he was given. Like Ace making spears out of fire that can pierce through or Crocodile making Desert Spada or La Spada as a cutting move.
You're overthinking things.
@I:
Ok. the Rain falling in Alabasta at that precise moment was an interesting phenomenon, but what on earth are you trying to say here? That Crocodile somehow prevented the rain from falling with his DF power, and that as soon as he was defeated his control vanished? I'm not seeing anything in the text or anywhere else that supports such a notion. Ace basically generating heat from his body due to his DF makes sense to me, (though I am reluctant to agree he stopped all the snow falling all over the island–I need to reread and see if there's anything definitive in the chapter.) but as far as Croc is concerned, it's one thing to control sand storms if your power controls sand, but to control whether the rain falls or not seems a stretch... so do you have anything to back this up?
That was because of the dancing powder. Smoker found the Baroque Works ship emitting it during the final part.
Also dramatic purposes, makes things look better that Crocodile's defeat coincides with rain finally coming back to Alabasta.
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Vanessa knows her shit!
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@I:
Ok. the Rain falling in Alabasta at that precise moment was an interesting phenomenon, but what on earth are you trying to say here? That Crocodile somehow prevented the rain from falling with his DF power, and that as soon as he was defeated his control vanished? I'm not seeing anything in the text or anywhere else that supports such a notion. Ace basically generating heat from his body due to his DF makes sense to me, (though I am reluctant to agree he stopped all the snow falling all over the island–I need to reread and see if there's anything definitive in the chapter.) but as far as Croc is concerned, it's one thing to control sand storms if your power controls sand, but to control whether the rain falls or not seems a stretch... so do you have anything to back this up?
Well as you said, the Rain had started to fall just when Crocodile was defeated, whereas it hasn't rain for 3 years…You can call it a mere coincidence, but you can't deny the possibily that Crocodile's power had something to do with this.
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Okay, I'll drop the Crocodile argument. I'd forgotten about Smoker finding that ship. Thanks for pointing it out.
Coriscation:Uh…what are you talking about? The strings aren't a side effect. Doflamingo needs to use them in order to control someone.
Using them as a cutting tool is just finding another way to utilize what he was given. Like Ace making spears out of fire that can pierce through or Crocodile making Desert Spada or La Spada as a cutting move.
You're overthinking things.
But then Doflamingo is essentially a Stringman, as opposed to a Puppetman. The difference between the two terms would be whether the essence of his ability is to create and control strings, or whether the ability to create and control strings is simply something that comes with being a Puppetman. If it is the former, it would be more appropriate to label him a Stringman, since his entire power revolves around strings and puppeteering people is just one way he chooses to use them - using them as cutting tools another.
Or am I misunderstanding you? :wassat:
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Having a limit like needing to get the strings/wires/whatever on isn't anything new.
It's akin to Buggy having a limited area where he has full control as a splitman or Law only being able to affect the area he creates, or Shiki with how he can't affect living things with the Fuwa Fruit. There are other examples like Moria or Bentham, if you need those explained I'll do so.
You're overthinking things when it really isn't needed.
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puppetman sounds better
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That was because of the dancing powder. Smoker found the Baroque Works ship emitting it during the final part.
Also dramatic purposes, makes things look better that Crocodile's defeat coincides with rain finally coming back to Alabasta.
I thought of this possibilty, but when Hina wonder why it's raining, if it was because they took the Full and so stop the use of dance power, they should've been able to make the link.
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I still don't quite understand what you're trying to say, which makes me feel really horrible since it seems like everyone else does and it apparently shouldn't be a hard concept to grasp. Why, exactly, is it better to deem Doflamingo a Puppetman if what his Devil Fruit gives him is simply the ability to create and control invisible, unbreakable wires/strings? With you using Hawkins as an example, I thought it made sense because Hawkins' ability isn't merely to create straw, but to do a bunch of other fancy stuff as well, all relating to voodoo. But if Doflamingo's ability to puppeteer people is merely an offshoot, an application of his given ability - to create and control invisible, unbreakable wires - then it does seem more appropriate to me to deem him a Stringman.
I genuinely don't get it. It seems to me as if deeming him a Puppetman is similar to deeming Crocodile a Dryingman, as opposed to a Sandman, because one of the applications of his power is to dry things out. Where in my reasoning do I go wrong?
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That's just it, where we differ is that the puppeteer part is the base and the strings are what make it possible. Using them for controlling others is probably the first thing one is capable of doing, and in learning to use that particular Devil Fruit better is what let Doflamingo be able to cut up people.
Throw in visuals and I'd compare it to Teach, since his abilities as a gravityman are represented using a dark shroud. Plus I don't think he would be able to control people to the degree that he has done so were he a stringman.
@Monkey:
I thought of this possibilty, but when Hina wonder why it's raining, if it was because they took the Full and so stop the use of dance power, they should've been able to make the link.
Read the last sentence in what you quoted.
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Hm, I think I see what you mean with Teach. His power is darkness, in speech, but in practice his power is rather gravity that he can control however he wants. So Doflamingo's power is puppeteering, in speech, making his fruit the Puppet-Puppet fruit, just like BB's is the Dark-Dark fruit, but in practice it is the ability to create and control invisible, razor-sharp and unbreakable wires?
If that's correct, then I think we're on the same page.
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That was because of the dancing powder. Smoker found the Baroque Works ship emitting it during the final part.
Also dramatic purposes, makes things look better that Crocodile's defeat coincides with rain finally coming back to Alabasta.
This was one of the greatest things about the Alabasta arc. It was Smoker who stopped the war and saved Alabasta, Luffy and co. just beat Crocodile and his top minions. Beating Croc's and his minions wouldn't have done much to help the country, it still would have been torn by civil war for some time. Thousands would have died and the country would have fallen into a decline. I always felt that this was the greatest example shown of the good the marines do in the world. They really do help the people, there isn't enough of that shown in the manga in my opinion.
As to Doflamingo being a stringman vs a puppet man, I would say that if he were a string man we would both have been able to see were the strings were attached, and they would have been likely to cut into those manipulated by them which would have been visible. Also from the words spoken by the victims of flamingo's ability it sounds more like he controls their body as a whole rather than just their limbs.
if I were to guess I would say he is a puppetman who can manipulate set number of invisible strings (say as many as he has fingers), when these strings make contact with a person flamingo gains control over that persons movements. He can also use the strings as weapons i.e. cutting people with them.
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Hm, I think I see what you mean with Teach. His power is darkness, in speech, but in practice his power is rather gravity that he can control however he wants. So Doflamingo's power is puppeteering, in speech, making his fruit the Puppet-Puppet fruit, just like BB's is the Dark-Dark fruit, but in practice it is the ability to create and control invisible, razor-sharp and unbreakable wires?
If that's correct, then I think we're on the same page.
Pretty much yeah.
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when these strings make contact with a person flamingo gains control over that persons movements
I'd like to add that it seems like whether he's able to actually control them or not seems to be dependent on the victim's strength, judging by how he was making Atmos (13th division commander) dance like a puppet, but was seemingly only able to restrain Jozu (3rd division commander). IMO, this seems like Oda giving a clue as to the limits of Doflamingo's power - if the person is sufficiently physically strong, he can't control their movements.
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I'd like to add that it seems like whether he's able to actually control them or not seems to be dependent on the victim's strength, judging by how he was making Atmos (13th division commander) dance like a puppet, but was seemingly only able to restrain Jozu (3rd division commander). IMO, this seems like Oda giving a clue as to the limits of Doflamingo's power - if the person is sufficiently physically strong, he can't control their movements.
the war.
Fodderizing Atmos, easily controlling Joz, casually slicing off Oars' city block sized foot.
Doflamingo looks to be a New World Powerhouse.
:wassat:
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I agree that he seems like a powerhouse, probably a top-tier, but… is there a reason you quoted my previous post? I assume there is, but I can't figure it out, and thus I can't give you whatever reply you might have been expecting - so a bit of clarification on that, if you don't mind?
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I agree that he seems like a powerhouse, probably a top-tier, but… is there a reason you quoted my previous post? I assume there is, but I can't figure it out, and thus I can't give you whatever reply you might have been expecting - so a bit of clarification on that, if you don't mind?
I think you stole my story.
But I'm more than likely overreacting.
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Oh. Well, actually, I did notice your post, and agree with it - but you didn't touch upon how those instances possibly showed a limit to his power, and that's what I wanted to point out
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I think the limit to his power is that he can only control one person at a time, two at most. I don't think Jozu was able to resist I just think Flamingo wasn't trying to move him around.
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Understood, thanks for pointing out my ignorance.
=)
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Puppetman would be a better choice for Doflamingo. It'd cover his ability to control others along with how he's able to create these strings to slice up a giant like Oars III.
Just to further help your case. Puppet in Japanese (according to google translate anyways) has two syllables while string has three. Since it's just one word, it's most likely accurate. And no devil fruit has been named with more than two syllables so far.
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I think the limit to his power is that he can only control one person at a time, two at most. I don't think Jozu was able to resist I just think Flamingo wasn't trying to move him around.
That's an entirely plausible possibility, I admit. But it would feel better to me if he wasn't quite that irresistible that even a legitimate top-tier and guy who can tango with the Admirals can be easily controlled by him. There should be some kind of limit, IMO, and the strength of the victim seems to be a feasible one.
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I was very interested to read the above posts as I was trying to argue with a friend that Dofla used a physical element, ie, his strings as it seems the only plausible explanation for being able to control people and cut Oars's leg off.
That said, I am not sold on it being a DF power, as it stands I still think it merely extraordinary control over strings as a weapon similar to how a swordsman has extraordinary control over their sword.
I like the idea of a string string fruit enabling the production of the string and if it is a df then it seems more reasonable to assume this is the effect rather than assume the df allows control over others by virtue of the contact via string with an opponent.
I also agree that it probably is down to strength as to how much control one might have. Mind you could haki be invoked to defend against it? Something Jozu had but Atomos maybe not?
I can well imagine that when Dofla becomes more of a direct antagonist, Oda will show us the string in some way.
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I was very interested to read the above posts as I was trying to argue with a friend that Dofla used a physical element, ie, his strings as it seems the only plausible explanation for being able to control people and cut Oars's leg off.
That said, I am not sold on it being a DF power, as it stands I still think it merely extraordinary control over strings as a weapon similar to how a swordsman has extraordinary control over their sword.
I like the idea of a string string fruit enabling the production of the string and if it is a df then it seems more reasonable to assume this is the effect rather than assume the df allows control over others by virtue of the contact via string with an opponent.
I also agree that it probably is down to strength as to how much control one might have. Mind you could haki be invoked to defend against it? Something Jozu had but Atomos maybe not?
I can well imagine that when Dofla becomes more of a direct antagonist, Oda will show us the string in some way.
Just having control over strings wouldn't be enough. At least twice we have seen Flamingo make people attack one another. If it was just strings then why didn't the people simply drop their weapons, also why didn't we see any evidence of the strings being wrapped around either their flesh or clothing? The people who were controlled would have been trying to resist as well, if the strings are thing enough to cut people legs and heads off why didn't they cut into the controlled people's skin or clothing? The idea of Flamingo's power just being about strings is simply too full of holes to be workable.
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Or he might have a psychokinesis devil fruit and also uses strings as his weapon of choice.
EDIT: or something like/not like what Shiki have, but he could only control living things.
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Adding in his personality will help convince people of his DF honestly…
He is a controling, vindictive, erogant, smug bastard who likes toying with people, so if he does have a string DF and found out that he can use it to control people, then he would do that than kill them himself. The main reasons why people should believe he has some connection with string is because of the main two things we've seen. Him controling people, and cutting off oars jr's leg. As to why it should be a DF and not him using string like Zoro would a sword... Come on, there are super powered beings in this world, but a thing ass piece of string being able to cut through a skyscraper basically? Nah, won't happen.
I just hope we find out a weakness to it, cuz it's too Overpowered. lol*Also, one reason why I don't think it's physcokenisis with strings, same reason, he sliced a leg clean through! And look at the way he jumped while doing it. I would have a better time believing that he ate the marionette fruit.
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Just having control over strings wouldn't be enough. At least twice we have seen Flamingo make people attack one another. If it was just strings then why didn't the people simply drop their weapons, also why didn't we see any evidence of the strings being wrapped around either their flesh or clothing? The people who were controlled would have been trying to resist as well, if the strings are thing enough to cut people legs and heads off why didn't they cut into the controlled people's skin or clothing? The idea of Flamingo's power just being about strings is simply too full of holes to be workable.
The way I read it was that they simply couldn't drop their weapons because the control of the muscles had been restricted to such a level that Dofla had forced them to hold them.
It is a good point about showing the string making an imprint on the clothing, but I would say that cutting Oars's leg off shows that there is a probable physical element to it. The way I would explain it would be that the strings are placed in such an expert way as to not be so obvious. That you wouldn't see the tightening effect as they had been placed so effortlessly following the same principle as when you see a Aikido being used to control a person by only grabbing their thumb as a more brutish example. So the way I see it is that Dofla has such minute control over the strings, that he needs minimal constriction in the correct places to create the effect he wants as opposed to being somewhat inexpert and therefore showing a physical result of the contrsiction. Which applies the same to resistance, the control is so expert that one cannot resist, you would be simply robbed of all function bar your mind.
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I just hope we find out a weakness to it, cuz it's too Overpowered. lol
Of course we will find a weakness to it if Luffy fights him eventually, which he probably will.
Besides, it's pretty clear that some fruits are more powerful than others, and that the fruit has just as much as potential as the one who consumes it. Mr. 3 and Mr. 5 have awesome devil fruit powers, but because they themselves aren't strong (or at least not monster strong) they don't go to their full potential. Meanwhile Luffy has a very simple paramecia - he's rubber and he can stretch, yet Luffy has brought up hidden potential in it because he himself has trained himself to be powerful. -
is daflamingo's power any effective against a logia??
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We don't even know how it works on a normal person ^^
I think he uses wires, it's pretty obvious because of what he does with his hand when controlling someone, and because he cut Oars Jr's leg…
I think the puppetting is only an application of his DF powers. Wire paramecia, I guess.
Maybe this application is due to a combination between his fruit and Haki? It would be nice, and make resistance possible... His fruit would be less imba.
And if it works like this, I think it would be really hard to control a logia user. -
stuff
I dunno, that all sounds waaayyy to complicated, especially when you can simply say, "It's a DF", instead.
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And my problem with that is what devil fruit? I would totally have agreed with you before the Oars Jn incident. For all intents and purposes he moved his hand and blam someone moved without any self control-screamed body control with puppetry being more of an affectation.
With the cutting one has to conclude with almost no doubt that a physical aspect is present. With the puppetry it makes sense to assume it is a string. So the conclusion becomes that he either produces string or something physical that enables control. How would you define a power based on this? Surely it would either be a control fruit or a string fruit. I don't see any precedent for a fruit that can produce something physical with a directly obvious effect implicit by it's production, eg, Doku doku produces poison which, by virtue of what it is, poisons/produces a range of detrimental effects. Saying string can control because it is string wouldn't be as directly obvious and so seems unreasonable in my opinion.
We have seen plenty of experts using weapons and the possibility that there exist people in the New World without DF's yet still able to compete with those that do points to the possibility that there are levels of physical mastery as yet unrevealed - just look at Mihawk and Zoro to an extent.
I could go with a string string fruit. A control fruit makes no sense as of yet regarding Oars. A string string fruit seems plausible, but hardly necessary as the strings could technically be manufactured and constantly accessible for Dofla to use. In which case it would have to be down to string mastery to be able to control someone to the extent we have seen, which isn't beyond possible given what other things we have seen in OP.
I apologise if that sounds too restrictive, just my interpretation which seems logical to me at least :)