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Thread: American Politics: A Brand New Day

  1. #361

    Default Re: American Politics: A Brand New Day

    Yeah I didn’t get at all that Neko had a “ulterior” reason for hating Bernie.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ubiq View Post
    I've often wondered about that myself; seems like being supported by people who only want you there so the world can end in fire (with you going to Hell in the process) would be somewhat off-putting
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  2. #362

    Default Re: American Politics: A Brand New Day

    Quote Originally Posted by Green_vs_Red View Post
    Yeah I didn’t get at all that Neko had a “ulterior” reason for hating Bernie.
    It's only natural to start wondering after a while.
    When someone hates the most popular active politician so much for such a long period and keeps adopting conspiracy theories and lies as talking points I think it's fair to ask if something else is going on.

    Antisemitism and antisemitic hate crimes saw a huge spike on the right during the same period that Bernie hate skyrocketed on the left, despite the fact that he wasn't even politically relevant for most of that period.
    It's something that should be looked into.

  3. #363
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    Why is Sanders the default villain in so much of politics for you?
    The GOP is my default villain. My dislike of Bernie is the most basic bitch liberal reasons there are. Like him getting in the way of women, who have done far more than he has for progress, from getting into positions of power. Which you know, help the GOP? Bernie is a team player where it usually counts but let's be honest here, he has some awful patterns you refuse to see. Hillary called it right about Bernie. These are very basic bitch liberal reasons as I said, so you don't have to read more into it but since you're going to anyway let's just get the rest out of the way.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    I felt like pointing out that by that logic anyone who attacks Bernie is an antisemite.
    I mean do you believe that? That's really the thing you should be asking yourself here. Because I assume you think that and much worse of anyone that dares question Bernie Sanders and you might want to question that a bit more for your own sake.

    Not like I have to defend my record or point out I'm Jewish to you since it does not matter to this discussion but maybe read my posts more? I take issue with Omar's antisemitism as I see it and rooted for Jon Ossoff's senate run. In this very thread!

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    After your your second post calling Bernie a racist even though you'd already been corrected about Manchin being the real culprit (on the left) behind Neera's failure... I'm seriously starting to wonder.
    I countered that Bernie along with the GOP brought up her these supposed "mean tweets" (that no one can seem to point to but they sure got brought up anyway!) that gave cover to Manchin's bullshit. Make no mistake, Manchin is why she didn't get through. But Bernie sure helped with the sabotage.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    You hate Bernie for reasons that really seem to go well beyond policy and can't easily be explained by you just being misinformed.
    Sure, sure, calling me a "low information voter" along with being called an antisemite for thinking Bernie Sanders is dismissive towards social issues and has gotten in the way of qualified women getting jobs must show there are strange bigoted reasons beyond.... everything I have said I dislike about him?

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    You damage the antiracism movement by saying things like "if she was a white man" about someone who clearly failed because people disagreed with her on policy and distrusted her based on her history.
    Honey, everyone is going to say this and knows this but you. Her politics and history were all great. But not being a white man ensured she would get the axe. Nothing people are scared more of than a qualified woman of color with opinions. How do you not get this already?

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    You think people who believe women are stupid, and freely tell them that when an accuser confronts a candidate that you like
    Oh my god, you still believe that conwoman??? This says more about you than it does me. lol

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    (especially if that accusation might benefit their ethnically Jewish opponent).
    Is Trump Jewish? Because you know it was never going to help Bernie who had already lost at the time get the nom? I mean this is a huge dead horse here, go back and read those posts telling you how you were wrong. I am not doing it again.

    And nice try turning your anger towards me pointing out your gullibility about that conwoman into somehow me being an antisemite.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    Maybe you do have some negative feelings about Jews that you need to reexamine.
    Reexamine your malarkey please.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    It's only natural to start wondering after a while.
    Because you don't read my posts?

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    When someone hates the most popular active politician so much for such a long period
    Nah I like President Biden well enough. Don't hate him at all.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    and keeps adopting conspiracy theories and lies as talking points
    [Citation needed]

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    Antisemitism and antisemitic hate crimes saw a huge spike on the right during the same period that Bernie hate skyrocketed on the left
    The reason hate crimes against Jewish people happen is because Low-Information Liberal Costal Elite Democrats don't love Saint Bernie?

    This..... is one hell of a theory here.
    Last edited by Dorobō Neko; March 4th, 2021 at 12:44 PM.

  4. #364
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    Default Re: American Politics: A Brand New Day

    LOL at calling someone you don't know an antisemite. That was such a smug comment gtfo.

  5. #365

    Default Re: American Politics: A Brand New Day

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post

    Antisemitism and antisemitic hate crimes saw a huge spike on the right during the same period that Bernie hate skyrocketed on the left, despite the fact that he wasn't even politically relevant for most of that period.
    It's something that should be looked into.
    If Bernie hate skyrocketed on the left Iím pretty sure that had less to do with his faith and more to do with
    people still upset at his base being one of the key reasons Trump got elected in 2016.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ubiq View Post
    I've often wondered about that myself; seems like being supported by people who only want you there so the world can end in fire (with you going to Hell in the process) would be somewhat off-putting
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  6. #366
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    I don't think there was ever a huge amount of hate for Bernie? These points are deeply confusing and lack solid foundation in reality.

  7. #367

    Default Re: American Politics: A Brand New Day

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorobō Neko View Post
    A shame Neera Tanden's nomination got pulled. I mean no admin gets 100% of their picks but I guess the GOP, media and Bernie along with those awful scum he picked to run his camp is happy they think they took down a progressive woman of color like her and using "mean tweets" as the "reason." Still waiting to see those mean tweets but guess we never will now!
    I'm just giving my not-very informed opinion here to rep the other side. I'm an outsider who doesn't know much about her track record to be fair
    You call her a progressive, sure everyone is compared to the Face-Eating Leopard Party. Her history of opinions against progressives just makes her a potential threat against anyone to the left of the party mean.
    Also, she pledged that the 33 million the Center for American progress, that she headed for a decade, received, wouldn't influence her decision making as director of OMB. But it still makes her riskier than someone with a cleaner record; where there's 'donations' there's favors. Where there's bribery there's corruption. Corporations don't just give millions out of the goodness of their hearts, they expect favors.
    Maybe she would've been a real unity kumbaya singer with the left, but maybe not. She was just a risky confirmation for the progressive movement. More women of color in government is great, but it doesn't supersede other factors.
    Last edited by DoctorPhil; March 10th, 2021 at 04:36 AM.

  8. #368
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    If there's one thing the GOP doesn't like, it's losing money. Even to Trump.
    https://news.yahoo.com/trump-hungry-...trk=fb&tsrc=fb

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorobō Neko View Post
    I don't think there was ever a huge amount of hate for Bernie? These points are deeply confusing and lack solid foundation in reality.
    Not much to Bernie, really, but more towards the stupid Bernie Bros. and general annoyance that Bernie didn't deal with them properly.

  9. #369

    Default Re: American Politics: A Brand New Day

    I wrote a long response to this right as the forum went down but since I lost the tweet screenshots that went with it, I'm just going to write out the basics.

    I'm sorry I didn't realize you were Jewish and suspected that you could be an antisemite.

    However...

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorobō Neko View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    after this post:
    Quote Originally Posted by Dorobō Neko View Post
    No because the sexism and racism of this is awful and needs to be called out. And thinking she is a "Twitter troll" is a way to avoid the bigotry of pulling a qualified woman of color like her.

    And she'll still get a job in the White House anyway. Meanwhile assholes happy about her nom being pulled will never get a job there. Thank fuck.
    I felt like pointing out that by that logic anyone who attacks Bernie is an antisemite.
    I mean do you believe that? That's really the thing you should be asking yourself here. Because I assume you think that and much worse of anyone that dares question Bernie Sanders and you might want to question that a bit more for your own sake.
    I can't tell if you honestly misunderstood, are trying to make a joke or are just lying. I didn't say that I believed it, and the point that I was making should be pretty clear.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorobō Neko View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    Antisemitism and antisemitic hate crimes saw a huge spike on the right during the same period that Bernie hate skyrocketed on the left
    The reason hate crimes against Jewish people happen is because Low-Information Liberal Costal Elite Democrats don't love Saint Bernie?

    This..... is one hell of a theory here.
    Again, I'm not sure if you misunderstood or are lying.
    I said there was a huge spike in right-wingers engaging in antisemitic hate crimes, you called me a conspiracy theorist and claimed that I was blaming people on the left for said right-wing hate crimes.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorobō Neko View Post
    The GOP is my default villain. My dislike of Bernie is the most basic bitch liberal reasons there are. Like him getting in the way of women, who have done far more than he has for progress, from getting into positions of power. Which you know, help the GOP? Bernie is a team player where it usually counts but let's be honest here, he has some awful patterns you refuse to see. Hillary called it right about Bernie. These are very basic bitch liberal reasons as I said, so you don't have to read more into it but since you're going to anyway let's just get the rest out of the way.
    OK, so you dislike any politician who in any way slows the rise of women to any position of power, because you believe that putting as many women in power as fast as possible is the best way to counter the GOP, and anyone who slows down that process is helping the Republicans.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorobō Neko View Post
    Not like I have to defend my record or point out I'm Jewish to you since it does not matter to this discussion but maybe read my posts more? I take issue with Omar's antisemitism as I see it and rooted for Jon Ossoff's senate run. In this very thread!
    ...But you endorsed a Republican attack on a Democratic woman of color because you disagreed with her policies?
    In your own words:

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorobō Neko View Post
    Honey, everyone is going to say this and knows this but you. Her politics and history were all great. But not being a white man ensured she would get the axe. Nothing people are scared more of than a qualified woman of color with opinions. How do you not get this already?
    Nothing scares people more than a qualified woman of color with opinions... like being critical of the Israel lobby.

    It's this kind of inconsistent ideology that seems mainly focused around attacking progressives ostensibly for surface-level social justice reasons that made me start to wonder if there was some other reason you hated Bernie.

    I still think that, but if it's "the most basic bitch liberal reasons there are" then the reason is that you blindly believe the attacks made on him by DNC and Republican allies.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorobō Neko View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    You hate Bernie for reasons that really seem to go well beyond policy and can't easily be explained by you just being misinformed.
    Sure, sure, calling me a "low information voter" along with being called an antisemite for thinking Bernie Sanders is dismissive towards social issues and has gotten in the way of qualified women getting jobs must show there are strange bigoted reasons beyond.... everything I have said I dislike about him?
    I didn't call you a "low information voter" or even use those words.
    I said you were misinformed about one specific politician.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorobō Neko View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    You think people who believe women are stupid, and freely tell them that when an accuser confronts a candidate that you like
    Oh my god, you still believe that conwoman??? This says more about you than it does me. lol
    No, I don't, but that's not really the point.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dorobō Neko View Post
    That Biden accuser from earlier this year that only idiots believed is also publishing a memoir 5 days before election day.

    They really have nothing left but the same attacks that already failed. lol
    When you talk this way to people who believe women it both seriously undermines the believability of your claim that you care about women's rights/social justice causes and turns people off because it's an extremely shitty thing to do.


    Quote Originally Posted by Dorobō Neko View Post
    And nice try turning your anger towards me pointing out your gullibility about that conwoman into somehow me being an antisemite.
    It's also shitty and weird and not very feminist how you show no empathy whatsoever toward people who believed women that you didn't even after they've changed their mind.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorobō Neko View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    When someone hates the most popular active politician so much for such a long period
    Nah I like President Biden well enough. Don't hate him at all.

    It's interesting how you picked the white man who's in 3rd place and not his female PoC vice president
    (who's in second).

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorobō Neko View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    and keeps adopting conspiracy theories and lies as talking points
    [Citation needed]
    The Bernie Bros smear and the claim that Bernie cost Hillary the election by existing, despite the fact that a much higher percentage of her supporters voted for the Republican in 2008.

    I think you also might've been one of those people who complained that Bernie was actively helping Trump by not dropping out early.

  10. #370
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    Good god the Bernie cult of personality really is almost as bad as Trump’s.

  11. #371

    Default Re: American Politics: A Brand New Day

    Quote Originally Posted by Satsuki View Post
    Not much to Bernie, really, but more towards the stupid Bernie Bros. and general annoyance that Bernie didn't deal with them properly.
    It was both, they sort of bled into each other.

    The Bernie Bros narrative was just a smear, and there really was nothing he could have done to "deal with them properly" because you can't control what people say on the internet and the other candidates had an equally small number of nasty supporters (aside from Trump).

  12. #372

    Default Re: American Politics: A Brand New Day


  13. #373

    Default Re: American Politics: A Brand New Day

    Quote Originally Posted by Satsuki View Post
    If there's one thing the GOP doesn't like, it's losing money. Even to Trump.
    That's okay Trump doesn't like losing money to the GOP raising money using his name.

    Hate what made you rich.
    Last edited by Green_vs_Red; March 10th, 2021 at 02:49 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ubiq View Post
    I've often wondered about that myself; seems like being supported by people who only want you there so the world can end in fire (with you going to Hell in the process) would be somewhat off-putting
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  14. #374
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorPhil View Post
    She was just a risky confirmation for the progressive movement.
    Yeah but this just ensures someone not as progressive will likely get the job though, which seems counter productive. A big part of why she was rejected by the GOP and Manchin was that she is too progressive. That will not bode well for anyone else on the progressive scale here.

    You need someone who knows how to budget progressive policy correctly. This is a low blow here but I am going to say many of the Very Online Left didn't care who the last 3 OMB directors were nor ever thought about the job.

    Last thing I'll add is this a very dumb thing to stall on and take longer to get done. This is in no way a win except for people who were mad at her calling them out for wanting to take a moral stance rather than beat Trump. And those people should not be listened to for obvious reasons.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    I'm sorry I didn't realize you were Jewish and suspected that you could be an antisemite.
    This was all that needed to be said since it's very clear I am not and this was a lazy attack. I'll accept your apology but you really didn't need to go further as it's not helping your case or making you seem sincere.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    I can't tell if you honestly misunderstood, are trying to make a joke or are just lying. I didn't say that I believed it, and the point that I was making should be pretty clear.
    Well it's not. You're defending attacking a progressive WoC by... saying actually Bernie is the victim. And then with these replies, it does feel like you're saying people who dislike Bernie for justifiable reasons are just antisemites. Now if you want to say it was done in bad faith, we can move on.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    I said there was a huge spike in right-wingers engaging in antisemitic hate crimes, you called me a conspiracy theorist and claimed that I was blaming people on the left for said right-wing hate crimes.
    Because you were? That's the exact logical conclusion anyone can make from your words here. There was a rise of antisemitic hate crimes right around the time of the left's "betrayal of poor innocent Bernie Sanders" right?

    Like please do explain this one.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    OK, so you dislike any politician who in any way slows the rise of women to any position of power, because you believe that putting as many women in power as fast as possible is the best way to counter the GOP, and anyone who slows down that process is helping the Republicans.
    Sure, ones with records of this will get heat from me. And I have said qualified women but sure. And yes people who get in their way and slow things down for no reason do just help the GOP. The enemy at hand you tend to forget about plenty.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    ...But you endorsed a Republican attack on a Democratic woman of color because you disagreed with her policies?
    Uhhhh when? And no???

    I take issues with her singling out only Jewish donors of her opponents and while not her usual Jew dislike, she didn't recognize a literal genocide so I am not really going to defend someone who is already not exactly high on social justice points. And besides all that, she is already in a position of power. And she at least, at the very least bugs the shit out of the GOP. So calling bullshit on this claim and "gotcha" of yours.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    Nothing scares people more than a qualified woman of color with opinions... like being critical of the Israel lobby.
    This implies that's my issue with her and that she is qualified. Both of which are not true.

    Of all the Squad members, the only one I think is unfair to Israel in bad ways would be Talib with her retweeting an image that had the motto "From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free" which yeah. So far more love for genocide than Jews from them. lol

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    It's this kind of inconsistent ideology that seems mainly focused around attacking progressives ostensibly for surface-level social justice reasons that made me start to wonder if there was some other reason you hated Bernie.
    It's mainly to do with the fact you don't read my posts and you can't conceive of why people are not big on Bernie Sanders without it being a hate crime in your head.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    I still think that, but if it's "the most basic bitch liberal reasons there are" then the reason is that you blindly believe the attacks made on him by DNC and Republican allies.
    Oh you still think that? Then yeah take your sorry back. And trust me buddy, you're the blind one here.

    I give you reasons here and you're just like.... not able to read or understand them even a little so I don't know if I'll reply after this because you're just going to reach for stuff that makes no sense.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    I didn't call you a "low information voter" or even use those words.
    I said you were misinformed about one specific politician.
    That's the pretty common thing to call people who call it right about Bernie and didn't vote for him. Like when the Bernie Bros started to call black voters in SC and ST states that. I mean you're saying right now I am misinformed about him which is untrue. So might as well go full mask off here.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    No, I don't,
    Then why bring it up? The point you're trying to make is not what you think it is.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    When you talk this way to people who believe women it both seriously undermines the believability of your claim that you care about women's rights/social justice causes and turns people off because it's an extremely shitty thing to do.
    Or it just says I don't like conartists and their marks who believe them. Which actually damages women. A lot.

    And I stand by only idiots believed her. It was obvious from the getgo unless you wanted to be misinformed and wanted Trump to win.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    It's also shitty and weird and not very feminist how you show no empathy whatsoever toward people who believed women that you didn't even after they've changed their mind.
    Because you keep bringing it out of the blue like this. Like if you actually have changed your mind, can you now say how she was never credible? From the start? And maybe it just had to do with your emotional reaction to voters rejecting Bernie Sanders so strongly?

    If you showed some signs of progress there I would be a lot nicer in general but I am still going to think marks who believed in a conartist's lies were dumb. Great if they learned better but yeah.

    Well I mean he was the top of the ticket but yeah you're right. I have no issues with Biden AND Harris. And have said plenty that I can't wait to vote for her for president in 2028. But if you want to keep reaching for stars, go for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    The Bernie Bros smear and the claim that Bernie cost Hillary the election by existing, despite the fact that a much higher percentage of her supporters voted for the Republican in 2008.
    They and he did. Also 2008 does not = 2016.

    I think you also might've been one of those people who complained that Bernie was actively helping Trump by not dropping out early.[/QUOTE]Yeah he wasted our time there instead of actually helping. Much like he did with that stupid tweet nonsense he brought up to Neera that helped cover the real reason she lost the nom. Or the other day when he pushed for that forced vote on the minimum wage increase that was a huge waste of everyone's time since it needed 60 votes to actually pass and hey look, he got people to blame Democrats for not voting yes on a thing that gave the GOP power to halt the whooooooooole American Rescue Plan.... rather than rush to pass it and actually try to win votes for the MW increase in a sperate bill.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    The Bernie Bros narrative was just a smear
    Yeah tell that to Warren. A progressive woman who dared to bring up attention to Bernie's sexism and look what happened to her? The bros are godawful and it's okay to say that!


    Quote Originally Posted by Kirbycide View Post
    Good god the Bernie cult of personality really is almost as bad as Trumpís.
    To be fair, they can and do throw him under the bus as "progressives" love to just thrown themselves under a moving bus that they are driving. But there is still a weird need to defend a career politician that really didn't have much of an impressive resume here.

    Well Hillary pointed this out as well as the fact the senate didn't like him one bit, then these freaks came out and said "well I like Bernie so you're wrong!" when they could have just corrected her and said Biden liked him at the very least. Or you know, defend his record. But that's harder to defend than even his pie in the sky promises.

  15. #375
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    Trump actually has something on a legal standing on this one:



    And hey, I wouldn't want the RNC to use his image to fundraise either. Only for him it's because he wants the money and me because I don't want to see his face ever again.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    Trump still doesn't have his Twitter, but he can release statements that sound exactly like his old Twitter:
    https://secondnexus.com/trump-statem...vC1YVQzXTUfwQ8

  16. #376

    Default Re: American Politics: A Brand New Day

    Quote Originally Posted by Dorobō Neko View Post
    Yeah but this just ensures someone not as progressive will likely get the job though, which seems counter productive. A big part of why she was rejected by the GOP and Manchin was that she is too progressive. That will not bode well for anyone else on the progressive scale here.

    You need someone who knows how to budget progressive policy correctly. This is a low blow here but I am going to say many of the Very Online Left didn't care who the last 3 OMB directors were nor ever thought about the job.

    Last thing I'll add is this a very dumb thing to stall on and take longer to get done. This is in no way a win except for people who were mad at her calling them out for wanting to take a moral stance rather than beat Trump. And those people should not be listened to for obvious reasons.

    This was all that needed to be said since it's very clear I am not and this was a lazy attack. I'll accept your apology but you really didn't need to go further as it's not helping your case or making you seem sincere.

    Well it's not. You're defending attacking a progressive WoC by... saying actually Bernie is the victim. And then with these replies, it does feel like you're saying people who dislike Bernie for justifiable reasons are just antisemites. Now if you want to say it was done in bad faith, we can move on.

    Because you were? That's the exact logical conclusion anyone can make from your words here. There was a rise of antisemitic hate crimes right around the time of the left's "betrayal of poor innocent Bernie Sanders" right?

    Like please do explain this one.

    Sure, ones with records of this will get heat from me. And I have said qualified women but sure. And yes people who get in their way and slow things down for no reason do just help the GOP. The enemy at hand you tend to forget about plenty.

    Uhhhh when? And no???

    I take issues with her singling out only Jewish donors of her opponents and while not her usual Jew dislike, she didn't recognize a literal genocide so I am not really going to defend someone who is already not exactly high on social justice points. And besides all that, she is already in a position of power. And she at least, at the very least bugs the shit out of the GOP. So calling bullshit on this claim and "gotcha" of yours.

    This implies that's my issue with her and that she is qualified. Both of which are not true.

    Of all the Squad members, the only one I think is unfair to Israel in bad ways would be Talib with her retweeting an image that had the motto "From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free" which yeah. So far more love for genocide than Jews from them. lol

    It's mainly to do with the fact you don't read my posts and you can't conceive of why people are not big on Bernie Sanders without it being a hate crime in your head.

    Oh you still think that? Then yeah take your sorry back. And trust me buddy, you're the blind one here.

    I give you reasons here and you're just like.... not able to read or understand them even a little so I don't know if I'll reply after this because you're just going to reach for stuff that makes no sense.

    That's the pretty common thing to call people who call it right about Bernie and didn't vote for him. Like when the Bernie Bros started to call black voters in SC and ST states that. I mean you're saying right now I am misinformed about him which is untrue. So might as well go full mask off here.

    Then why bring it up? The point you're trying to make is not what you think it is.

    Or it just says I don't like conartists and their marks who believe them. Which actually damages women. A lot.

    And I stand by only idiots believed her. It was obvious from the getgo unless you wanted to be misinformed and wanted Trump to win.

    Because you keep bringing it out of the blue like this. Like if you actually have changed your mind, can you now say how she was never credible? From the start? And maybe it just had to do with your emotional reaction to voters rejecting Bernie Sanders so strongly?

    If you showed some signs of progress there I would be a lot nicer in general but I am still going to think marks who believed in a conartist's lies were dumb. Great if they learned better but yeah.

    Well I mean he was the top of the ticket but yeah you're right. I have no issues with Biden AND Harris. And have said plenty that I can't wait to vote for her for president in 2028. But if you want to keep reaching for stars, go for it.

    They and he did. Also 2008 does not = 2016.

    I think you also might've been one of those people who complained that Bernie was actively helping Trump by not dropping out early.Yeah he wasted our time there instead of actually helping. Much like he did with that stupid tweet nonsense he brought up to Neera that helped cover the real reason she lost the nom. Or the other day when he pushed for that forced vote on the minimum wage increase that was a huge waste of everyone's time since it needed 60 votes to actually pass and hey look, he got people to blame Democrats for not voting yes on a thing that gave the GOP power to halt the whooooooooole American Rescue Plan.... rather than rush to pass it and actually try to win votes for the MW increase in a sperate bill.

    Yeah tell that to Warren. A progressive woman who dared to bring up attention to Bernie's sexism and look what happened to her? The bros are godawful and it's okay to say that!


    To be fair, they can and do throw him under the bus as "progressives" love to just thrown themselves under a moving bus that they are driving. But there is still a weird need to defend a career politician that really didn't have much of an impressive resume here.

    Well Hillary pointed this out as well as the fact the senate didn't like him one bit, then these freaks came out and said "well I like Bernie so you're wrong!" when they could have just corrected her and said Biden liked him at the very least. Or you know, defend his record. But that's harder to defend than even his pie in the sky promises.
    Yeah, I think this is going to be the last time I respond too.

    You seem to think that me asking if you had negative feelings about Jews was a shallow, cynical attack.
    It wasn't.
    I really did wonder if that was true, and I've never said that about any other Bernie opponent on the left before.
    I backed down because I felt it would be wrong to doubt that you are who you say you are and it would be really insensitive for me to keep thinking that about a Jewish person.

    I'm having a lot of trouble connecting the ideological basis you give for your views because a lot of the opinions you express don't match up with "basic bitch liberal".
    Even the fact that you called yourself that is really weird.

    I feel like we're speaking different languages at this point, because I keep pointing out "hey I literally didn't say this, why are you claiming I did" while you argue that I did.

    The other thing I wanted to address is the fact that I really don't remember Ilhan Omar denying the Holocaust, and I couldn't find anything about that on Google other than some gross Republican lies.

    Also Elizabeth Warren really shouldn't shouldn't have people defending her cancel culture whining in 2021.
    A bunch of people on Twitter spammed snake emojis at her for a few weeks.
    The snake emojis did not cost her the election, and she was not significantly harmed by them.
    She's still a white multi-millionaire senator, one of the most powerful and privileged people on the planet.
    If you believe that everyone should have immediately seen Biden's accuser as a cynical, lying con artist then you have no right to complain about people who said the same thing about Warren.

    I don't judge people for supporting her because of her policies, but her decision to use that tactic caused a lot of collateral damage and revealed some unsettling things about her character.

    Edit: another one of Trump's attempts to change the election results just came out.

    Last edited by RoboBlue; March 12th, 2021 at 03:18 AM.

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    Default Re: American Politics: A Brand New Day

    As an outside observer, I’d say that Neko’s political positions have been incredibly consistent.

    I highly doubt that I’m the only one who found it incredibly weird for Robo to have jumped to the antisemite conclusion, and I agree that his apology seems half-assed and insincere.

    Though, I guess considering that it’s Robo, I shouldn’t find it all that weird.

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    Also, pretty sure Neko is referring to how Omar decided to vote only as “present” on the Armenian genocide resolution.

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    Default Re: American Politics: A Brand New Day

    Quote Originally Posted by Kirbycide View Post
    Also, pretty sure Neko is referring to how Omar decided to vote only as “present” on the Armenian genocide resolution.
    I don't pay much attention to her but Omar has done some really sketchy stuff. Doesn't look great when 1 of the other 2 people to vote present on that was Paul Gosar.

    I don't know what the reason is either. Seems like she would either have business dealings with Turkey or else it is some religious thing, not being able to vote for recognizing Muslims committing genocide against Christians.
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    Default Re: American Politics: A Brand New Day

    Quote Originally Posted by Kirbycide View Post
    Also, pretty sure Neko is referring to how Omar decided to vote only as “present” on the Armenian genocide resolution.
    Hm... yeah that is pretty bad.
    I'd still make the tough choice to support her over more centrist primary opponents for policy reasons, but maybe someday a replacement who's less flawed will come along.

    I bit the bullet and risked my life to vote Biden in person, sometimes you just have to accept the hand you're dealt and make the best of it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kirbycide View Post
    As an outside observer, I’d say that Neko’s political positions have been incredibly consistent.
    Neko's positions have largely stayed the same but they do seem weirdly in conflict with each other.
    It's really hard to take her claim that she believes in putting qualified women into office as fast as possible when IIRC she was rooting for the entire squad to lose their seats.
    She's really more anti-progressive than liberal.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kirbycide View Post
    I highly doubt that I’m the only one who found it incredibly weird for Robo to have jumped to the antisemite conclusion,
    Well, I do tend to leap to conclusions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kirbycide View Post
    and I agree that his apology seems half-assed and insincere.

    Though, I guess considering that it’s Robo, I shouldn’t find it all that weird.
    It was definitely sincere, I was as honest as possible about my feelings.

    The problem is I'm not as apologetic as you or Neko want me to be, and I honestly don't really know what to do about that.
    I don't like lying or censoring myself, and I doubt Neko would want a more canned apology anyway.

    Maybe I am being a little selfish here, but I really just cannot get over the whole gleeful mocking of people who believed a rape accuser thing.
    That's just completely beyond the pale when it comes to politics in my eyes and while I definitely jumped to the wrong conclusion as to why she does that, it's hard to feel too bad about it when apologizing to the person who keeps doing that, especially considering the fact that I had to also respond to a huge and very snarky misrepresentation of what I said in the same post.

    That's why I put the apology first before responding to the rest of her post. I knew I'd feel much less apologetic after straining to calmly and rationally respond to this:
    The reason hate crimes against Jewish people happen is because Low-Information Liberal Costal Elite Democrats don't love Saint Bernie?

    This..... is one hell of a theory here.
    I welcome any sincere criticism of my response if people want to discuss it further, and I can promise that I will read and consider it.

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    Default Re: American Politics: A Brand New Day

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    You seem to think that me asking if you had negative feelings about Jews was a shallow, cynical attack.
    It wasn't.
    Sure doesn't feel that way. Feels like it came out of left field because I pointed out Bernie's flaws and failures and you can't seem to handle that without resorting to thinking it must be due to bigotry.

    And I still really want to know why in god's name did you bring up the rise of antisemtic hate crimes from the right being what, linked to the left not liking Bernie? Like this is something you need to address because what are you trying to say here?

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    I'm having a lot of trouble connecting the ideological basis you give for your views because a lot of the opinions you express don't match up with "basic bitch liberal".
    I want Dems that can defeat the GOP, be they moderate, moderate acting, progressive or progressive acting, as long as they are viable to take the GOP down I am happy. I want qualified diverse people in positions of power to advance progress of all sorts and achieve the GOP having less power to block said progress. Things that get in the way of all that is bad to me. It sums up my views as well as can be. Not one to box my thoughts and views into a label but for the sake of the discussion and hoping you somehow finally get it, it fits and is not weird at all to say.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    I feel like we're speaking different languages at this point, because I keep pointing out "hey I literally didn't say this, why are you claiming I did" while you argue that I did.
    Same to you. But again I really want to know about that strange ass hate crime point you're bringing up about Bernie dislike on the left?

    Like what am I supposed to do with that? Does social justice begin and end at Bernie Sanders?

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    The other thing I wanted to address is the fact that I really don't remember Ilhan Omar denying the Holocaust, and I couldn't find anything about that on Google other than some gross Republican lies.
    See the posts under yours. She gets no social justice points from me. She can join those losers at The Young Turks.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    Also Elizabeth Warren really shouldn't shouldn't have people defending her cancel culture whining in 2021.
    Just say you're okay with sexism towards women if they dare to bring up Bernie's sexism. Or just say #Justice4BernieAndBernieOnly

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    A bunch of people on Twitter spammed snake emojis at her for a few weeks.
    The snake emojis did not cost her the election, and she was not significantly harmed by them.
    I guess that makes the sexism alright? Jesus Christ.

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    She's still a white multi-millionaire senator, one of the most powerful and privileged people on the planet.
    So is Bernie. I guess you no longer have to defend him now right?

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    If you believe that everyone should have immediately seen Biden's accuser as a cynical, lying con artist then you have no right to complain about people who said the same thing about Warren.
    Actually I do. Since it was obvious Warren was telling the truth. I have already went over that con artist's lies, timing and contexts in this thread. You didn't listen back then and you're not going to listen now.

    But for Warren telling the truth? Well Bernie ran for president so clearly he didn't think a woman could beat Trump and he could not even commit to saying he would pick a woman VP. The whole reason we ending up picking an old white man to run is because a lot of us had this view only an old white man could win. It's internalized sexism we have and have to recognize to improve on. But it's why we didn't run Hillary again, or give Warren, Harris, Klobuchar or Gillibrand the nom.

    Same deal with why Harris and Booker didn't take off as much as they should have with black voters since again an older white man was the best bet. We all just happened to go with the most qualified one that would not let us down. One that didn't have to second guess committing to picking a woman VP. He picked the most qualified WoC VP at that believing that would not hurt the ticket but made it stronger. So Biden, even with gaffes and mistakes, can recognize internalized social issues and can work on them. That's a big deal.

    I just ask you why you can't seem to believe Warren? Why can't you recognize Bernie and you as well, have internalized sexism going on? Like why is it so hard for you?

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    I don't judge people for supporting her because of her policies, but her decision to use that tactic caused a lot of collateral damage and revealed some unsettling things about her character.
    What damage are you talking about? And did it? Seemed to show Bernie supporters aren't actually all that into progressives or social issues as much as they are defending him.

    Why is it always easier to blame the woman? Warren or Neera or any woman that takes issues with some flaws Bernie has and keeps showing.


    Edit: I made this post before your second one so to clear a few things up:

    I was not for "the squad" all losing their seats. Omar and Tlaib only. Because they suck and their challengers were better. Besides the GND nonsense, I didn't even have much of an issue with AOC before this last election. And Pressley is great. She was the only member of "the squad" not to endorse Bernie so a good head on her shoulders though she needs to knock it off with wanting 16 year olds to vote tbh. But again this assumes they are qualified. Besides Pressley, I don't see any of them going further than their House seats but also I don't see them losing them either

    I am not anti-progressive. I voted for Biden after all. A progressive who can and did win. And is running his admin as one.

    And I told you when you were, shockingly not wanting to listen to me, that Fetterman is who you should keep an eye on as a progressive you would like who could win the now open PA senate seat.

    I now take that back since it came out he held a shotgun up on an unarmed black man. So Kenyatta should be the nom instead is my view, a progressive who supported Biden early. I will keep saying that your idea of progressives needs to keep working on social issues before you can expect my support.
    Last edited by Dorobō Neko; March 12th, 2021 at 07:39 PM.

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