Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

[Gia Sado]

Simply put, as I've said many years in the past, if he had no plans for Carrot, he wouldn't have brought her along this far to begin with and she would have just remained in the background.
There is always a hidden agenda. Just because you can't see it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Exactly, I feel like this discussion is moot until Wano is actually done. If nothing truly happens soon, then sure it was never meant to be. However just the prime fact that he has kept her around with Nami instead of with Inu like she was in the first half of the arc, is interesting to say the least.

Its sort of my mentality for both Carrot and Yamato. I believe there can and possibly will be opportunities to explore their motivations/backgrounds/etc, but we have to also realize Oda is playing a massive balancing Act with like 40 other major characters this arc. If or when Carrot/Yamato get their moments, it will be a point when Oda needs it to be important to drive the story.

Technically, Carrot has had more to do on Onigashima than Chopper or Usopp as of yet. I personally think Oda is, like many people are thinking, keeping her around to drive an eventual point of relevancy. Possibly this will happen through Perospero or this may happen eventually by some other aspect. She is NOT with the Minks transforming or avenging her country against Jack. Its weird.

Yamato is sort of in a similar boat but even more so due to actual relevancy in the plot currently. He has already proclaimed his allegiance to Luffy, has pretty major ties to a past character, hints at a major flashback, is currently serving a function in the plot (taking care of Momo/Shinobu).


In the end, the point I'm making is that Wano has so much to cover, that it takes weeks or months to even truly realize a full plot point being made. Hawkins was gone for 35 chapters, nearly a full year. It took Apoo 40 chapters to be introduced in the arc, and another 30 to do something relevant. Law hasn't even done much in the last 7-8 chapters. Neither has Kid. There's only so much Oda can draw in a 15-17 page chapter with irregular breaks.

[Lord Monkey D.]

Swerve! The final crewmember is Panda Man!

Secretly he has been with the Strawhats the whole time

[Monquito]

It would be consistent with Greg's words. The original crew Oda envisioned is there, but with an extra member that plays a role far away.

it is kinda strange that the original sketches and Vivre Cards amount to 10 people, but then you have Luffy claiming he'd like to have 10 and Teach's Titans.

it's like a "no but yes" scenario we have here.

[TheGarc]

I think you are all seeing Carrot in a completely wrong way. The whole point of Carrot would be that she DOESN'T have a sad or tragic backstory. She grew up on the peaceful Zou. Pedro trained her in using the gauntlets after she didn't have the talent for swordsmanship. He became her mentor and later even trained her in Sulong. Because of Pedro she is also the only Musketeer with a green (Guardian) cape and also holds the special position as a rulers aide (a position that is no longer needed).

Pedro probably told her about his experiences and that's how she began to dream about this "Wonderland". When the Straw Hats arrived she took the first chance she got to explore this Wonderland, showing how naive she was about the whole thing. During this "fun" adventure she saw her mentor die who told her with his last words about the "Dawn" and that the Straw Hats are important to achieve it.

There is no complex background left to explore for Carrot. This is the START of her journey. She isn't a character who already has set ideals that she wants to achieve in the world, but because of the experiences in Zou, WCI and Wano she will come to realize what it is that she wants to do, what goals she wants to pursue and decide on how to achieve those. And that's what makes her so unique and interesting to me compared to all the other Straw Hats.

If Carrot were like all the other Straw Hats then Pedro would have died in a flashback because of some kind of attack on Zou and with his last words told her about the Dawn. Carrot then began to research the Dawn to find out more about it before she eventually met the Straw Hats and joined them to reveal the mystery of the Dawn. But Oda didn't do that. Instead he is showing us all of this in "real time" and not a flashback.

Does it really make such a huge difference that it was not a flashback? A lot of these comments read like as if all the problems you guys have with Carrot would disappear if it would have just been a simple flashback.

[Deicide]

Simply put, as I've said many years in the past, if he had no plans for Carrot, he wouldn't have brought her along this far to begin with and she would have just remained in the background.
There is always a hidden agenda. Just because you can't see it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

She has a purpose. Doesn't mean that purpose is to be a main character.

And Carrot has been in the background for the entirety of Wano. Why?

To me, it's because she has no role outside of her own mini-arc, which is more related to Big Mom and Pedro. If so, she will have her resolution during the war and stay behind, her purpose fulfilled.

[Shift]

And Carrot has been in the background for the entirety of Wano. Why?

In the background with the crew. That's the key thing here. I've compared her to Chekhov's gun earlier, and it still holds true to me. If Oda has kept her solely with the group this whole time and didn't make a show of giving her an errand to do apart from the group like he did with Yamato, then that implies she has a job to do with the group. When she does that job, it'll be something only she can do, and it'll be in direct service to the crew.

Carrot does not have to change. She just needs to do what she's been there to do. That's how she'll prove she's meant to be a Straw Hat.

[SeaOfHope]

She has a purpose. Doesn't mean that purpose is to be a main character.

And Carrot has been in the background for the entirety of Wano. Why?

To me, it's because she has no role outside of her own mini-arc, which is more related to Big Mom and Pedro. If so, she will have her resolution during the war and stay behind, her purpose fulfilled.

There's no real cause to specifically have Carrot avenge Pedro when you remember Pekoms exist. He was part of the original Nox Pirates, he gave up and led the other barring Pedro and Zepo away till they arrived in Totland and became BM's subordinates. His story is already built for redemption and carry over for what Pedro had started and he abandoned. None of this needed to involve Carrot. So she simply existed to do something another character who had a bit more history with her mentor and actually knew of the circumstances of his shortened lifespan could do, huh?

Don't buy it. A lot of things in the story as it stands could continue regardless of Carrot's involvement, yet why she had to present with the crew throughout Whole Cake Island to Onigashima needs a level of justification, not just for her character, but the story as well.

[Robby]

Newest SBS has Oda clarifying his "done in five years" statement. Basically he expects to be done with Luffy's story, IE, getting to the One Piece, in 5 years, but then there's going to be a big war after that which will take however long it takes. So probably more like 7 or 8 years as we've expected, and more reasonable on Oda's part as well..

Factor that into all future considerations of "there's not much time left."

Swerve! The final crewmember is Panda Man!

I would not be against this. He's been with us the whole time after all. Even had his own sub adventure on the covers!

[Dragon D. Luffy]

So... how about someone different?

[Deicide]

With the five years thing clarified as not containing the final arc, I can more clearly see how the next saga will unfold. No need to rush, after all.

I still think the 11th Straw Hat will join after Wano, probably in the first arc of next saga.

My theoretical roadmap is:

- Wano Act 5 to prep the saga. Shanks meets Luffy and challenges him to come to his territory and defeat his crew. Only then the Straw Hat can be returned. Zoro and Sanji have their arcs (Wano and WCI) finished. Blackbeard's entire crew revealed.
- Mary Geoise arc (Sabo, Vivi, Hancock stuff), meet Bonney. Kuma's story starts. Revolutionary/Robin stuff explored.
- Vegapunk arc. Finishing Kuma's story. Franky gets his arc.
- Blackbeard vs Shanks and we explore the story of Rocks.
- Elbaf arc. Usopp's arc.
- Race to Laugh Tale. Luffy and Blackbeard crews face off.
- The big freaking war.

[PKRolling456]

There's no real cause to specifically have Carrot avenge Pedro when you remember Pekoms exist. He was part of the original Nox Pirates, he gave up and led the other barring Pedro and Zepo away till they arrived in Totland and became BM's subordinates. His story is already built for redemption and carry over for what Pedro had started and he abandoned. None of this needed to involve Carrot. So she simply existed to do something another character who had a bit more history with her mentor and actually knew of the circumstances of his shortened lifespan could do, huh?

Don't buy it. A lot of things in the story as it stands could continue regardless of Carrot's involvement, yet why she had to present with the crew throughout Whole Cake Island to Onigashima needs a level of justification, not just for her character, but the story as well.

What even is that logic though?

You're essentially saying that any interpretation of Carrot's "Purpose" is invalid if that purpose could have been fulfilled by somebody else. You're saying that you believe that Carrot can only exist to do something that no one else can do. What Oda doesn't do is irrelevant though. He chose Carrot to do the things she did, so until a greater purpose makes itself known, then we can only take Carrot as she is and not as we want her to be. You say Pekoms could avenge Pedro, but Pekoms is not here. You know who is here, Carrot, ready to fulfill that purpose in the story.

[Deicide]

In the background with the crew. That's the key thing here. I've compared her to Chekhov's gun earlier, and it still holds true to me. If Oda has kept her solely with the group this whole time and didn't make a show of giving her an errand to do apart from the group like he did with Yamato, then that implies she has a job to do with the group. When she does that job, it'll be something only she can do, and it'll be in direct service to the crew.

Carrot does not have to change. She just needs to do what she's been there to do. That's how she'll prove she's meant to be a Straw Hat.

There's no real cause to specifically have Carrot avenge Pedro when you remember Pekoms exist. He was part of the original Nox Pirates, he gave up and led the other barring Pedro and Zepo away till they arrived in Totland and became BM's subordinates. His story is already built for redemption and carry over for what Pedro had started and he abandoned. None of this needed to involve Carrot. So she simply existed to do something another character who had a bit more history with her mentor and actually knew of the circumstances of his shortened lifespan could do, huh?

Don't buy it. A lot of things in the story as it stands could continue regardless of Carrot's involvement, yet why she had to present with the crew throughout Whole Cake Island to Onigashima needs a level of justification, not just for her character, but the story as well.

In both cases, I think you are confusing what you want to happen with what breadcrumbs are being left for us to follow.

I may be the wrong one here, but I don't see a protagonist being fleshed out, only a supporting character being held to fulfill her story purpose before she goes on her own business.

[SeaOfHope]

What even is that logic though?

You're essentially saying that any interpretation of Carrot's "Purpose" is invalid if that purpose could have been fulfilled by somebody else. You're saying that you believe that Carrot can only exist to do something that no one else can do. What Oda doesn't do is irrelevant though. He chose Carrot to do the things she did, so until a greater purpose makes itself known, then we can only take Carrot as she is and not as we want her to be. You say Pekoms could avenge Pedro, but Pekoms is not here. You know who is here, Carrot, ready to fulfill that purpose in the story.

Simple, the thing is no one knows what her purpose in the story is. She was supposed to stay back on Zou with the Musketeers while Luffy and the Sanji Retrieval Team SH go retrieve Sanji. Pekoms was their guide into Totland and Pedro went under the guise of being a Mink representative. Nekomamushi exclusively allowed Pedro to go because of his connection to Pekoms, which we later find out the more we read the arc. Under no circumstances was Carrot's involvement in the arc necessary and it was strange since she had no narrative ties to the arc at hand or really a reason to go outside of "adventure." The justification the story needs to establish is why was Carrot necessary to set off with the Straw Hats to Whole Cake Island to rescue Sanji, hear Pedro speak of the Dawn and allude to the Straw Hats significance in accomplishing it, strangely help out the crew on her own volition, and even be present for this raid with them as opposed to following Shishillian into battle against Jack. The narrative decisions around Carrot are never clear because she never attracts agency to the plot, but she's always there and I doubt its just her being purely fanservice.
Honestly, I've said this for the past 4-5 years.

In both cases, I think you are confusing what you want to happen with what breadcrumbs are being left for us to follow.

I may be the wrong one here, but I don't see a protagonist being fleshed out, only a supporting character being held to fulfill her story purpose before she goes on her own business.

She can't fulfill the purpose if you don't know what the purpose is.

[Shift]

In both cases, I think you are confusing what you want to happen with what breadcrumbs are being left for us to follow.

I may be the wrong one here, but I don't see a protagonist being fleshed out, only a supporting character being held to fulfill her story purpose before she goes on her own business.

I don't want Carrot to join any more than I wanted Jinbe to join. I see Oda pushing them together with the crew, which I believe is for the purposes of getting them to join.

Carrot was alone with the crew at WCI. She's been alone with the crew up to a chapter ago. That, more than anything, tells me she's there for reasons concerning the crew. I am strictly following breadcrumbs here.

[Deicide]

She can't fulfill the purpose if you don't know what the purpose is.

To me, her purpose is:
- To showcase the minks' abilities (Done)
- To have a mink witness Pedro's sacrifice and grieve for him (Done)
- To have said mink also witness Pedro being avenged (To be done)

I don't want Carrot to join any more than I wanted Jinbe to join. I see Oda pushing them together with the crew, which I believe is for the purposes of getting them to join.

Carrot was alone with the crew at WCI. She's been alone with the crew up to a chapter ago. That, more than anything, tells me she's there for reasons concerning the crew. I am strictly following breadcrumbs here.

Carrot wasn't alone. There were Pedro and Pekoms, and Carrot was the survivor. Her story is intrinsically tied to WCI's plot, to the extent that in Wano she faded away until that plot thread can be picked up again.

I don't think a character that has been treated apart from the Straw Hats in the big SH battle stance is being groomed to become one of them.

[TheGarc]

What SeaOfHope is saying is simply the same thing we have been saying and asking us all the time. Why is she even here when Oda wouldn't have needed her to begin with. Do you really think that Oda thought "You know what WCI and Wano are missing? Yes, exactly, a bunny girl that will stick around for a long time with the crew but just ends up as a small side character." SeaOfHope just presented one option on how Oda could have written the WCI plot without Carrot (add to that that Pekoms could have also been the one to showcase Sulong for the first time).

My opinion as to why Carrot didn't have any role on Wano is still the same. Wano is a big arc that needed to setup a lot of different things and the amount of panels is limited. Oda knew that this would be the case and that's the reason why Carrot got on the ship in the WCI arc. It allowed him to introduce her to the readers and set up her future goals with Pedros death and give her more screentime because the crew was split up and smaller. WCI didn't have that many different plots going on at the same time compared to Wano and the setup for the Sanji rescue and later Big Mom assassination was simpler than the end of a saga war against Kaido. All the setup is done without him having to also introduce us fully to Carrot in Wano and we are now waiting for the final nail that will decide her future.

The new information about finding the One Piece in 5 years and the story possibly continuing after it for a final arc (which I believed from the start) doesn't change anything for me with Wano being the last possible arc for a new Straw Hat to join. For me the next crewmember needs to join a few arcs before finding the One Piece. Wouldn't feel right if somebody joins close to the end with a "cool you guys already defeated two Yonkos and found all the Road Poneglyphs already, when are we sailing to Laugh Tale again? I am ready."

[SeaOfHope]

To me, her purpose is:
- To showcase the minks' abilities (Done)
- To have a mink witness Pedro's sacrifice and grieve for him (Done)
- To have said mink also witness Pedro being avenged (To be done)

1.) Pedro and Pekoms exist(ed).
2.) Pekoms, who arguably has a stronger connection to Pedro, while not witnessing his death, did find out about it as well and grieved about it as well.
3.) Avenging what exactly? His suicide? His lost life-span (which she doesn't know, Pekoms does)? Or seeing through the foundation that he left behind that he hoped would one day get accomplished?

[Deicide]

1.) Pedro and Pekoms exist(ed).

And had their own roles. It fell to Carrot to demonstrate the minks' full capabilities, including the big sulong moment (when both Pedro and Pekoms were absent) that without it would make the recent events in Wano far less hyped.

2.) Pekoms, who arguably has a stronger connection to Pedro, while not witnessing his death, did find out about it as well and grieved about it as well.

Pedro's sacrifice spurred Pekoms' own sacrifice. But he's not the one to avenge Pedro.

3.) Avenging what exactly? His suicide? His lost life-span (which she doesn't know, Pekoms does)? Or seeing through the foundation that he left behind that he hoped would one day get accomplished?

Perospero and the Big Mom Pirates caused Pedro's death. Their defeats will give him vengeance. Carrot will be its witness.

Just because you don't accept the role doesn't mean it's not there. Three minks went with the Straw Hats. One returned to tell the story.

[Shift]

Carrot wasn't alone. There were Pedro and Pekoms, and Carrot was the survivor.

Which is exactly what "alone" means in this case. She starts off in a huge group, which gets whittled down to just her and the SHs. And then the same thing happens here, with Shinobu and Yamato sent off with Momo while Carrot just so happens to stay behind, once again alone with the SHs. Coincidence? I think not.

Her story is intrinsically tied to WCI's plot, to the extent that in Wano she faded away until that plot thread can be picked up again.

SeaOfHope and TheGarc are trying to address why that is. Why was she in WCI at all? What's it leading to? Why did Pedro need to die just to be avenged, when death is incredibly rare and poignant in OP?

I don't think a character that has been treated apart from the Straw Hats in the big SH battle stance is being groomed to become one of them.

If she was in that group shot, the matter would be closed. The fact that she isn't only means it's still open-ended.

[SeaOfHope]

And had their own roles. It fell to Carrot to demonstrate the minks' full capabilities, including the big sulong moment (when both Pedro and Pekoms were absent) that without it would make the recent events in Wano far less hyped.

You didn't need Carrot to be the sole mink to represent the Minks ability to display Sulong when the arc had 2 characters that could have done so. Pekoms even eventually did it, he just got shut down fast and hard.

Pedro's sacrifice spurred Pekoms' own sacrifice. But he's not the one to avenge Pedro.

Pekoms story with Pedro far exceeds what little we know in regards to Carrot and Pedro. So it stands to reason someone with a long-standing, pre-established and pre-existing relationship would handle it as well.

Perospero and the Big Mom Pirates caused Pedro's death. Their defeats will give him vengeance. Carrot will be its witness.

Just because you don't accept the role doesn't mean it's not there. Three minks went with the Straw Hats. One returned to tell the story.

Big Mom is definitely not going down this arc, her fall comes after Kaido. Perospero is a target of frustration for Carrot, but defeating them does not do much narratively to expand/enhance Carrot as a character if you don't really know what she is fighting for without knowing the "purpose," so I don't see what role you're implying here when all you're trying to do is delegate tasks that could have been done without her presence.