Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

[fapfapfap]

I can see Carrot AND Yamato joining but I'm like 90% confident Carrot will join while only 60% on Yamato. People criticize Carrot too much for taking a backseat so far this arc but EVERYONE took a backseat this arc because Oda wanted to tell Oden's story. We'll see how things go down in Act 4 as I assume we'll see more of the Strawhats together as a team.

[Monquito]

While I'm really hyped for the Sulong Showtime, and I find no reason not to enjoy it in the manga. I gotta say its going to look horrible in the anime that all of them turn entirely white, that'll make Carrot look the exact same as the others, specially the females(or only Wanda really).

And das no gud for a character that already doesn't have great details in her design.

[ArmamentHero]

While I'm really hyped for the Sulong Showtime, and I find no reason not to enjoy it in the manga. I gotta say its going to look horrible in the anime that all of them turn entirely white, that'll make Carrot look the exact same as the others, specially the females(or only Wanda really).

And das no gud for a character that already doesn't have great details in her design.

Interesting that this is brought up. There's two things i'm interested in with SuLong coming:

1)Is Carrot going to transform with the other minks?
2)What's Luffy's reaction to it?

If Luffy says anything along the lines of "Cool, it's like Chopper's trnasformations""I wonder if Chopper can do it too?!", Just a lack of acknowledgement of some sort would be really telling.

[Deicide]

I need to re-read it, but did Pekoms explain Sulong to Luffy? I remember his plan was to transform so Luffy could escape Cacao Island. Did Luffy see Pekoms transformed? I can’t remember.

[ArmamentHero]

I need to re-read it, but did Pekoms explain Sulong to Luffy? I remember his plan was to transform so Luffy could escape Cacao Island. Did Luffy see Pekoms transformed? I can’t remember.

Chapter 897, he did kind of and transformed, but Luffy didn't say anything really about it.

[Shift]

Eh, imo, Carrot feels really bland and piggybacks Choppers which doesn't really help to differentiate her. Each of the Strawhats have a youthful optimism to them, but they also have traits that make them feel very vivid in their actions, words, etc. Carrot hasn't done that for me.

I mean that she actually shows excitement about things. Zoro, Robin, Franky and Jinbe are pretty much too cool to show much overt excitement about most things, Sanji only does it for ladies, and Brook, Usopp, Chopper and Nami are more likely to be freaked out by crazy stuff. Luffy has been traditionally the only one to relish the thought of danger with stars in his eyes, but we've seen that Carrot's all for that, like licking her lips to fight the sea king in Tottoland, or being visually thrilled going up Wano's waterfall.

--- Update From New Post Merge ---

While I'm really hyped for the Sulong Showtime, and I find no reason not to enjoy it in the manga. I gotta say its going to look horrible in the anime that all of them turn entirely white, that'll make Carrot look the exact same as the others, specially the females(or only Wanda really).

And das no gud for a character that already doesn't have great details in her design.

By the time the anime gets to it, Wano will likely have ended, the crew will have left with or without her and the matter will be moot.

[ArmamentHero]

I mean that she actually shows excitement about things. Zoro, Robin, Franky and Jinbe are pretty much too cool to show much overt excitement about most things, Sanji only does it for ladies, and Brook, Usopp, Chopper and Nami are more likely to be freaked out by crazy stuff. Luffy has been traditionally the only one to relish the thought of danger with stars in his eyes, but we've seen that Carrot's all for that, like licking her lips to fight the sea king in Tottoland, or being visually thrilled going up Wano's waterfall.

I actually disagree, I think each of the Strawhats do have a youthful optimism to them. They all have certain things they get excited for, react to it, and relish in it. While yes, some of them have exaggerated fear takes, that also doesn't take away anything from them because it's more of a gag and doesn't completely define their characters.

With all due respect, Carrot just doesn't have the other differentiating aspects to her that define her as a 'unique' individual. At least not 'yet' tbf, I really need see and feel that moment of characterization, what are her thoughts, motivations, etc at this current part of the story, something "I' think is missing.

I hope I explained myself well enough.

[Monquito]

1)Is Carrot going to transform with the other minks?

that's a legitimate question and raises lots of possibilities, but Carrot's already mostly white and it'll be a where's waldo ​for her in any case.

--- Update From New Post Merge ---

By the time the anime gets to it, Wano will likely have ended, the crew will have left with or without her and the matter will be moot.

I'm a bit lost into the time lines between manga and anime, but since the Sulong is happening rather early into the battle, that might just not be the case.

[Deicide]

Chapter 897, he did kind of and transformed, but Luffy didn't say anything really about it.

Thanks, I'm re-reading it right now. I see that Pekoms explained Sulong to Luffy, but we didn't see any reaction from Luffy when Pekoms actually transformed. Maybe Oda didn't want to spend panels on something that was already known by the readers, or maybe he's leaving Luffy's reaction for the current battle, either with the minks above the dome or Carrot.

[Shift]

I actually disagree, I think each of the Strawhats do have a youthful optimism to them. They all have certain things they get excited for, react to it, and relish in it. While yes, some of them have exaggerated fear takes, that also doesn't take away anything from them because it's more of a gag and doesn't completely define their characters.

With all due respect, Carrot just doesn't have the other differentiating aspects to her that define her as a 'unique' individual. At least not 'yet' tbf, I really need see and feel that moment of characterization, what are her thoughts, motivations, etc at this current part of the story, something "I' think is missing.

I hope I explained myself well enough.

And I'm not saying they don't have feelings. What I'm saying is that Carrot does set herself apart by how she reacts to certain things vs how others do, precisely because she's young and not as worldly experienced as everyone else on the crew has become. Here's an example of what I'm talking about:

Spoiler:

Besides Luffy from the prior page, Carrot's the only other person excited by the prospect of climbing up a dangerous waterfall. Everyone else is reacting out of practicality.

[Triceron]

that's a legitimate question and raises lots of possibilities, but Carrot's already mostly white and it'll be a where's waldo ​for her in any case.

She's not with the other Minks though, she's with Nami so there isn't really any problem of her getting lost unless she goes rejoin the other Minks in the fight, and there's no reason for her to do that right now since she is part of the Momo Rescue group.

With Sulong happening so early in the fight I wouldn't be surprised if Kaido/beast pirates have some sort of counter measure planned and end that threat early. It would make sense from a drama perspective.

[Deicide]

To me, Carrot was singled out from the minks because it's her story purpose to see Pedro avenged, thus fulfilling her arc in WCI.

If she will just be a witness or do it herself is what will define her chances to be the next (and probably last) crewmate.

[otakufan]

Thanks, I'm re-reading it right now. I see that Pekoms explained Sulong to Luffy, but we didn't see any reaction from Luffy when Pekoms actually transformed. Maybe Oda didn't want to spend panels on something that was already known by the readers, or maybe he's leaving Luffy's reaction for the current battle, either with the minks above the dome or Carrot.

Also might just be due to the fact that Luffy was utterly tapped out after the fight with Katakuri and barely able to keep conscious.

He pretty much instantly passed out after reuniting with Sanji, so I can see Pekoms' explanation simply not getting through or Luffy simply being too exhausted to react to the transformation itself.

[ArmamentHero]

And I'm not saying they don't have feelings. What I'm saying is that Carrot does set herself apart by how she reacts to certain things vs how others do, precisely because she's young and not as worldly experienced as everyone else on the crew has become. Here's an example of what I'm talking about:

Spoiler:

https://s2.mangabeast01.com/manga/On...e/0910-012.png

Besides Luffy from the prior page, Carrot's the only other person excited by the prospect of climbing up a dangerous waterfall. Everyone else is reacting out of practicality.

That is an interesting panel, but I wonder if that if that really sets her apart, personality wise? Even Chopper, with his gags, has shown a level of thinking, perspectives, and emotions that make you really feel the emotional weight that character has in different situations that challenge them, just like the other crew mates. Carrot is missing that type of aspect at this point, for me.

This is just my interpretation of a character's progression through the story.

I can't help, but also say the times Carrot has been put on the back burner, I really felt her overall presence was thin. Really, kind of a mixed bag, honestly.

--- Update From New Post Merge ---

Thanks, I'm re-reading it right now. I see that Pekoms explained Sulong to Luffy, but we didn't see any reaction from Luffy when Pekoms actually transformed. Maybe Oda didn't want to spend panels on something that was already known by the readers, or maybe he's leaving Luffy's reaction for the current battle, either with the minks above the dome or Carrot.

Yeah, which is why these upcoming events are crucial for Carrot's character.

[Shift]

That is an interesting panel, but I wonder if that if that really sets her apart, personality wise? Even Chopper, with his gags, has shown a level of thinking, perspectives, and emotions that make you really feel the emotional weight that character has in different situations that challenge them, just like the other crew mates. Carrot is missing that type of aspect at this point, for me.

This is just my interpretation of a character's progression through the story.

I can't help, but also say the times Carrot has been put on the back burner, I really felt her overall presence was thin. Really, kind of a mixed bag, honestly.

Fair enough. I'm expecting she'll get more focus after the other Minks have their shot, but we'll see.

[ArmamentHero]

Fair enough. I'm expecting she'll get more focus after the other Minks have their shot, but we'll see.

I'll just put this on record. My opinion can/will change if Carrot does get that type of focus that's hard to ignore.

Thank you for the discussion, it was fun, and eye opening.

[Gia Sado]

Really the turning point for Carrot needs to be (and I stress need because its really the only option) her potential encounter with Perospero. She very obviously doesn't have to win (Brook didn't win against Ryuuma for example), but we all need to see growth from her based on what she could potentially say or do to Perospero. Really that is where the growth lies. If Oda avoids this, then I'm afraid I don't see Carrot's potential anymore as a main character. The tragedy of Pedro needs to have affected her as character and her resolve to fulfill his wish.

[Deicide]

Really the turning point for Carrot needs to be (and I stress need because its really the only option) her potential encounter with Perospero. She very obviously doesn't have to win (Brook didn't win against Ryuuma for example), but we all need to see growth from her based on what she could potentially say or do to Perospero. Really that is where the growth lies. If Oda avoids this, then I'm afraid I don't see Carrot's potential anymore as a main character. The tragedy of Pedro needs to have affected her as character and her resolve to fulfill his wish.

A lot of people point Brook's loss to Ryuuma, but I need to point out that the Ryuuma fight was far from the only thing Brook had going for him at that point. He saved Franky and Robin, revealed how Moria's power worked and his connection to Laboon was already revealed. Also, later he would help with the Oars fight, thus making the crew "complete" at that point. Also, Brook was mostly an independent agent during that arc, I feel like Zoro taking his fight and returning his shadow was a way to make Brook feel grateful and provide a deeper link with the crew for him.

[PKRolling456]

Fair enough. I'm expecting she'll get more focus after the other Minks have their shot, but we'll see.

What Carrot really needs right is not simply focus, but depth. The kind of depth that forms the narrative that would carry her into a position with the crew. The problem she's had so far is that Oda has never really explored Carrot as a character beyond giving her the kind of quirky personality you'd expect from a side character. Her total lack of depth going into the climax of one of the biggest arcs yet, an arc overstuffed with loads of other characters who have personal stories that need resolutions, is what makes me doubtful that Oda is setting her up a Crewmate.

[Gia Sado]

A lot of people point Brook's loss to Ryuuma, but I need to point out that the Ryuuma fight was far from the only thing Brook had going for him at that point. He saved Franky and Robin, revealed how Moria's power worked and his connection to Laboon was already revealed. Also, later he would help with the Oars fight, thus making the crew "complete" at that point. Also, Brook was mostly an independent agent during that arc, I feel like Zoro taking his fight and returning his shadow was a way to make Brook feel grateful and provide a deeper link with the crew for him.

I mean:

- Carrot experienced said personal tragedy in real time, outside of a flashback (compare that to Brook's tragedy)
- She used Sulong to save the entire crew (compare that to Brook saving Franky/Robin)
- She may or may not have a personal grudge/connection to Perospero (compare that to Ryuuma)

But really, I'm not sure why we are trying to make Brook look better here. I only compared a simple battle to which Brook didn't win. I wasn't arguing that the first 10 strawhats a level of narrative depth that Carrot doesn't have. Thats my entire point. She needs focus where it counts. She doesn't need a focused arc where she is the central figure.

I mean we all act like its "unfair" to compare complexity and depth to Zoro or Usopp because they are "early" strawhats and designs, but who's to say Oda has to maintain multi-arc levels of complexity like Jinbe or devote entire arcs to characters joining? Who's to say he can't introduce a character that is "simplistic" in nature, character and emotion, and ALSO be a strawhat? Who's to say that said character can't just join without the baggage of having a focused arc about them? While Jinbe is very complex, not one arc pre or post-timeskip really was about him. In the OP world, he is extremely important due to his title and power. Carrot is a lowly 15 year old mink girl who likes adventuring.

I'm not sure why people don't see the difference. In fact her simplicity feels like Oda's return to more simple characters and allies back in East Blue.

I never understood the argument that future strawhats had to be mega central to an arc or really complex in nature. Every previous strawhat before Jinbe (I'll even say Zoro did) had an arc centralized around them. Oda already broke that trend with Jinbe, because he had not 1, but 4 arcs NOT centralized around him that he was included in before officially joining in the 5th arc. Carrot is a much simpler character, and is not centralized in any of the 3 arcs she's been in, but had significant focus at WCI. That's why I'm telling people to wait for a possible moment again in Wano, because many people didn't think that moment with Pedro would happen at WCI. Perhaps it happens again with Perospero.

We just don't know.