View Poll Results: Who is Luffy's 10th Person?

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368. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yamato

    189 51.36%
  • Shinobu

    1 0.27%
  • An Akazaya Samurai (Kin'emon, Kiku, etc)

    1 0.27%
  • Momo

    9 2.45%
  • Tama

    9 2.45%
  • Carrot

    68 18.48%
  • A Supernova (Law, Drake, Bonney, etc.)

    7 1.90%
  • Caribou

    6 1.63%
  • Other

    28 7.61%
  • None: Jinbe is the final Straw Hat

    50 13.59%
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Thread: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

  1. #5981

    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    Who do you guys think will be on the Straw Hat and allies cover? The villain cover will probs just be Kaido, The All Stars and the Flying Six. But I'm very interested who's going to be on the heroes cover, I mean they have a lot of allies in this war

  2. #5982
    Discovered Stowaway Ivotas's Avatar
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    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    Quote Originally Posted by King Cannon View Post
    Again, you're missing the point I'm making. This is not about representation, but rather uniqueness. Jinbe is unique among Fish-Men because he's a combination of different traits that definitely makes him special even among his group. Franky, Brook, Chopper, even humans like Robin (the last Ohara scholar) are special.
    So by that logic I take it that Luffy, Zoro, Nami, Usopp and Sanji are not special unique. No need to answer, I'm halfway joking with this and I know how those characters also can be considered unique. The thing is that by desing already she is unique but that's more a meta level thing than it being something within the world, which is why I understand you and many others have a gripe with that part. I'm talking about her being a rabbit? How is this possible, well there's this entire moon rabbits thing going on with the Japanese culture. It's not something super important that dictates everyone's lives over here but it is something that everybody knows about and is recognizable. And her while all it is true that all minks can use Sulong to a Japanese audience with Carrot you will always have a stronger recognition as a reader because of the moon and rabbit connection. Personally I wouldn't brush this factor aside but I can understand why someone would, so I'm not agruing here. Just stating it.

    Oda really works hard in making his main characters distinct and important-looking, something that Carrot currently lacks. She's very much designed as a secondary character first and foremost. This is why her fighting style is generic Electro attacks, and why her Sulong form is nothing special when put alongside another of her peers. She's not special among the Minks. The only thing she has going is that she witnessed Pedro's sacrifice, which is... very little. Oda didn't even bother in making their relationship matter (to the point people felt that half-page training flashback was tacked on), and yet everybody treats it as "Carrot's tragic flashback moment" in present time.
    I will have to disagree on this part but only a little. Yes, what you say right overall but there are a few cracks on this argument specifically when it comes to unique fighting style. Jinbe's Fishman Karate is not a fighting style only he can use. It has been made clear that Fishmen use this fighting style. Of course he has shown the most moves on this fighting style but then again the arc where Fishman had a chance to shine is widely considered as one of the worst arcs of One Piece, one reason being showing the antagonists (i. e. Fishmen) in a pathetic light. But at least with Neptune we've seen one usage of an attack that Jinbe can also use, so it's fair game to assume that there's more moves that Jinbe has in common with his people. So we could say that Jinbe's Fishman Karate would be a unique fighting style when compared to the other Strawhats. But when compared to his people it's nothing that is exclusive to him. So on that matter Carrot would be literally the same. Heck, he claws are actually more unique a weapon when compared to her people then Jinbei using Fishman Karate.

    Also just to add one thing to the entire, she hasn't gotten much spotlight so far. That's true but as a counter point I would say that so many characters that are even more important than her also are underperforming badly. Sanji and Usopp are developing backwards in various ways. With Sanji who's interest in women was still passable pre-timeskip (to the point where it often even could get a chuckle out of me) being totally unbearable right now on that matter. Also his performance when being confronted with strong opponents right now has been lackluster as has been brought up by many other people before. Usopp on the other hand shows levels of being scared that simply don't add up with everything he went through on his adventures. He was always scared and that's fine. But honestly he was worse in Dressrosa then he was in his hometown or Arlong Park. Why am I getting sidetracked like this? I'm trying to show that there's other characters that are far more of need of some serious spotlight but they don't get it, one of the reasons being Oda bloating the story with new characters and new content without having the time to dedicate to some characters that surely would need a little bit more of a focus. And I think Carrot is also falling victim to this. Yes, she isn't getting a lot of focus. But I don't think it's because she has no chance of joining. It's because Oda is skipping many things at this stage in the story. Does it make for a good characterization? No, it doesn't. But we have to take it for what it is. Oda most likely thinks that sailing sail from Zou and her performance at Wholecake Island was enough time for Carrot. Now the Wano centric characters should be in the spotlight be they potentional Strawhats or not.

    Compare with Yamato, who's super tall, has horns, a club weapon, a unknown DF, is the son of an Emperor... that's a ton of different traits that make the character special and distinct, following the philosophy Oda has been giving to his more recent main characters (Franky, Brook, Jinbe). Brennen himself only needed a look on Jinbe to correctly guess and make an argument that Jinbe would join.

    Plus, in terms of potential, Yamato is a far more interesting character for the endgame, being Kaido's son and all.
    Again, as I stated in my innitial post. I'm not here to argue which one is more likely. I just stated what I personally see in Carrot and why I hope to see her join. I'm mostly replying to you because I find that some points you make about uniqueness are not as clear cut as you make them seem to be. Especially with a huge cast such as One Piece has there's a lot of characters that are unique enough that we could fit it into a mold to add them as canditates, with Yamamto being a very valid suggestion for this position. But to me Carrot feels more like an actual Strawhat crewmember. It's really hard to put this in proper words. It's just the vibe that I get from her.


    Quote Originally Posted by Monquito View Post
    Carrot has literally visited more island than Yamato.

    That makes Yamato a better suited character for this purpose.
    I think that's the wrong way to look at things because now Carrots voyage has already begun. However she left her homeland by boarding the Thousand Sunny, which one could consider her first steps as a Strawhat Pirate. Of course she hasn't been labeled such and for what it's worth she might never be. But if she should become Strawhat Pirate then her heading out to the sea back then would mark the starting point of her Strawhat adventure. Just like like Usopp bonded with the crew before they officially asked him to jump aboard Going Merry. He was already considered a crewmate by the crew itself but it was never stated. Even Usopp himself didn't realize that the others consider him part of their crew until they literally told him to board the ship.

    And even without all that, on just this point Yamato is not better suited. Yes, Yamato has never left the country yet but she knows so much about the voyage ahead that I fear it would ruin even more of the sense of discovery which this series once had. Just look at pre-timeskip when we literally didn't know that the next Island would be Drum, Jaya, Longring Longland, Thriller Bark or Sabaody. Heck even Water Seven the Strawhats didn't expect and only the readers where informed about this when Aokiji spoke to himself. Now compare this to the New World, where literally every location the Strawhats went to intentionally. "Let's go to Punk Hazard to help the person who send the distress call", "Let's go to Dressrosa to defeat Doflamingo", "Let's regroup at Zou", "Let's go to Wholecake Island to take back Sanji", "Let's go to Wano to defeat Kaido". That's literally what the story has been so far. And if somebody who treats Odens journal as their personal bible is joining the crew then we'd have even more of that.

    Actually saying all that, this makes it more likely that Yamato will join because apparently One Piece post-timeskip so far seems to be going the route of following the course someone else sets instead of them going somewhere out of their own intention. But just as I've has been my point all along if Carrot would do one thing, then her character and personality contributing to the exact opposite of this. Yamato however seems to know too much already. It's more of a witnessing with ones own eyes scenario with Yamato whereas Carrot would be learning about something new on first contact. I find this more appealing than the former and is one of the reasons why I got into OP in the first place. Nothing wrong with people having different tastes or expectations from the story than I do.



  3. #5983
    Omne ignotum pro magnifico Zik's Avatar
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    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ivotas View Post

    I know that many say Yamato also wants to see the world and has been imprisoned by Kaido since birth. But still Yamato represents a little a different sense of adventure than Carrot in my book. Whereas Yamato mainly wants to make Odens wish a reality Carrot first and foremost has been established that she wants to just have an adventure. The entire Pedro's will thing can be combined with this but it's not what made her set out to sea. Also in terms of exploration and adventure, Yamato has read Odens journal several times and thus should be well informed at many things that lie ahead. Like is the route to Laugh Tale even written in the journal or are the hints of what One Piece actually really is? I don't know but even with a veteran like Jinbe or an archeologist like Robin there's still things they just don't know about. Yamato might never have left Wano but at the same time she seems like seems like someone who has a lot of advance information. Of course I realize that reading a journal is not the same as visiting a place for real but still Carrot hasn't even got that. She literally was surprised to find out how big the sea really was. And this somehow just hits the right note with me.
    Yamato making Oden's wish a reality will happen immediately after Kaido is defeated/dead. He also wants to explore the world and go on adventures. They're two different priorities. One of which will be achieved shortly. The first thing Yamato asked Luffy was to let him set out to sea on his ship. He doesn't mainly want to make Oden's wish a reality. He really wants to see the world after being caged on Wano for decades.

    Also if you don't think Pedro telling Carrot about the dawn matters at all I'd count that as something against her if you're just hanging Carrot wanting to go on adventures on her to make this point.

    As for the Oden's journal thing, didn't Zeff give Sanji his logbook of his time in the grand line? That didn't ruin anything.
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  4. #5984

    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    Franky's dream as far as we knew it originally was JUST to build the pirate king's ship. So a lot of people speculated he'd build it then they'd leave watthout him.

    Then the moment came and the extra detail of that crystalized... make sure that ship makes it to the end and becomes better and better.

    And Usopp didn't figure out "brave warrior of the sea" until a ways in. Robin was a whole bunch of enigmas.

    The dream doesn't have to be fully crystalized and clear before they join. We just need some idea of it.
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  5. #5985
    Button Pusher Shift's Avatar
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    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    Quote Originally Posted by Zik View Post
    As for the Oden's journal thing, didn't Zeff give Sanji his logbook of his time in the grand line? That didn't ruin anything.
    No, the log only came up once in the manga because Krieg wanted it, but it wasn't mentioned again. Zeff offered it to Luffy in the anime, but he turned it down.



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  6. #5986
    Discovered Stowaway Ivotas's Avatar
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    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    Quote Originally Posted by Zik View Post
    Yamato making Oden's wish a reality will happen immediately after Kaido is defeated/dead. He also wants to explore the world and go on adventures. They're two different priorities. One of which will be achieved shortly. The first thing Yamato asked Luffy was to let him set out to sea on his ship. He doesn't mainly want to make Oden's wish a reality. He really wants to see the world after being caged on Wano for decades.

    Also if you don't think Pedro telling Carrot about the dawn matters at all I'd count that as something against her if you're just hanging Carrot wanting to go on adventures on her to make this point.
    No, I'm not saying that it matters. I just focused on her own desire to set out because that's IMO a big point in what makes her tick. The Pedro thing definitely matters to but that literally happened while the story progressed in doesn't seem to be some part of her backstory iirc. I might remember this wrong.

    I would disagree that fullfilling Odens wish is not a big priority because of one simple thing, Yamatos entire shit with thinking herself to be Oden. Now please don't misunderstand this as be having a problem with gender idenity because I have no problem if you would refer to Ivankov, Inazuma or even Bon Kurei as either he or she since their world view is based around those things not mattering. Yamato however does not want to considered a man because of the same reasons as the previously mentioned characters. She wants to be considered a man because Oden was a man. She literally takes it so far to go "Luke, I am your father" on Momonosuke. I'm sure that if Oden was a woman Yamato wouldn't want to be considered a man. And sorry, I find this thought alone ridiculous on this entire delicate topic. I'm sure I'm rubbing many people the wrong way but Yamato is merely idolizing Oden I wouldn't consider her in the same league as any of the Newcame. Heck, it's not only not the same league, it isn't even the same sport.

    Anyways back on track. I cannot see how fullfilling wishes can not be considered a big priority to her if the entire world is ready to fight a flame war on gender studies in order to defend Yamatos self-identification which is centered around one thing and one thing only Kozuki Oden.

    As for the Oden's journal thing, didn't Zeff give Sanji his logbook of his time in the grand line? That didn't ruin anything.
    As pointed out by Shift, they didn't take it. Luffy refused to take it. And remember how Luffy said he would quit being a pirate if Rayleigh would have spilled the beans on whether One Piece existed or not? That's both the main protagonists aswell as the main outine of what kind of adventure story One Piece is supposed to be right there. That's why it would irk me if we would suddenly make use of such information if Yamato would join (which I still say is very likely).

    Quote Originally Posted by Robby View Post
    Franky's dream as far as we knew it originally was JUST to build the pirate king's ship. So a lot of people speculated he'd build it then they'd leave watthout him.

    Then the moment came and the extra detail of that crystalized... make sure that ship makes it to the end and becomes better and better.

    And Usopp didn't figure out "brave warrior of the sea" until a ways in. Robin was a whole bunch of enigmas.

    The dream doesn't have to be fully crystalized and clear before they join. We just need some idea of it.
    If that's the case then the entire witness the dawn of the world thing would work. It's not as crystalized and clear yet because it was just passed on to Carrot during Whole Cake Island. But hey, if Jinbei wants to make Otohimes dream a reality why should Carrot not feel the same for her people?
    Last edited by Ivotas; May 7th, 2021 at 10:25 PM.



  7. #5987

    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    I'll try to make this my last comment on the subject since it's getting off topic. Maybe there should be a general Yamato thread but I can just imagine how much of a disaster that would be, haha.

    Quote Originally Posted by Robby View Post
    People can grow and change and find new influences and learn, and be better than they once were.

    Yeah the freaky monster okama that chased Sanji were in poor taste, (as were Sanjis nose bleeds after the time skip) but that was over a decade ago. Bon Kurei and Ivanakov were always treated pretty well and their gender stuff is complicated.
    I am aware that people grow and change, but also the track record still stands. There has been nothing that really says he's learned from previous depictions, and with both the Kiku and Yamato reveals, it doesn't seem like he has to me. Previous stuff being from a decade ago doesn't really matter in this situation since the okama in general haven't been in the story, besides a cover story appearance I believe. Guess we'll have to wait what happens if they eventually reappear.

    I agree that Iva and Mr. 2 were treated well, however for Iva and the newkama that's really more so because they were ripped wholesale from Rocky Horror. Mr. 2 is a mixed bag, his character itself is great but he's got a lot of bad baggage with him.

    We just had a discussion about how 23 years ago Oda presented the Kuina situation as "a woman can never be as strong as a man!", and Oda definitely has hangups about male hero characters fighting women, and he has definitely been sexist, but he HAS gotten better about all those things over the years. Look at how many fighters in this arc are women!
    If you think that Oda's representation of women has improved over the years then I think you and I have been reading very different comics lol. We'll just have to agree to disagree on this

    Yes, the magazine for girls uses one of the most prominent new characters that looks feminine. Not a huge shocker.
    Hmm, you don't say.

    I think Oda is having his cake and eating it too here. He's still drawing "cute girl" but then making her a tough manly type that can rough it up with the best of them.
    I mean, in a situation like this you can't really have your cake and eat it too...

    But then if he looked like a man, that loses the shock value of "Kaidous son is a GIRL??!@?"
    Yeah we don't need that shock value and I really wish cis authors would get this through their heads.

    If Yamato had a more flat chested or androgynous look, or a more butch haircut, more Sailor Uranus style, I think it might be easier to wrestle with. (But then if he looked like a man, that loses the shock value of "Kaidous son is a GIRL??!@?" ) Though while Haruka was explicitly gay, and dressed like a man, (and passed for one sometimes) that was always kind of skirted around... in that manga and anime from the 90's. (The the Sailor Stars made things REALLY confusing...)

    Just judging from how Oda has handled it so far, I think he's mostly going with "Yamato wants to be tough and a warrior and not seen as a damsel like all the other dainty Wano ladies. Men get to have adventures while women cook!" and he's pretty much going to leave it there, without actually touching on sexuality or feeling uncomfortable in his body at all.

    So he's very very lightly touching the issue, but he's not going to dwell on it, and that's the level of respect we can get from the guy that did the crass okama jokes before. So the representation is there but it's mild and treated lightly as a character quirk more than a serious issue, in a way Yamato can show off whatever is needed..
    I'll be very honest here, it's hard to read this and some of your previous message without it coming off like you're saying Yamato is a girl/Oda is treating Yamato like a girl, so I'll be blunt and ask: what do you think Oda intends for Yamato's character? Do you believe he's meant to be a trans man, or a butch/gender non-conforming woman?

  8. #5988

    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleWizard View Post
    I'll be very honest here, it's hard to read this and some of your previous message without it coming off like you're saying Yamato is a girl/Oda is treating Yamato like a girl, so I'll be blunt and ask: what do you think Oda intends for Yamato's character? Do you believe he's meant to be a trans man, or a butch/gender non-conforming woman?
    Okay, I'll start by being clear in no uncertain terms.

    My opinion is Yamato is clearly trans.

    Everything in the story screams it, that is the text. Not subtext, but the text.

    That is my opinion. No caveats, no exception, no, "but maybe". That is my opinion.

    What I am saying after that, is what I think about Oda and HIS take on it is. And also, that whatever Oda's opinion actually is, remembering that it has to be filtered through a comic book for 12 year old boys.

    These are two separate things. I understand where the confusion might lie if I don't cleanly separate these two thoughts.

    Hidden:
    I think the way Oda is handling it makes it more of a mixed bag. I think, Oda's *intent* is to write a trans character, but his *execution* is going to lean more towards non-conforming woman... for a variety of reasons.

    Regardless of what his actual *intent* is, what's ending up on the page may not be quite there.

    I think Oda is a straight man in his 40's, that lives in very culturally and slightly sexist Japan. That leads to all sorts of weird biases and the discussions on his sexism in the story are endless.

    He probably also does not have a best friend who is trans as I do, so the overall subject may be something he only really knows third hand, or from television. He might not actually know anyone with the experience, but I have no way of knowing so I can't even guess.

    But Japan IS different from other countries, so social stuff is... different. Not worse or better but... different.


    In terms of the story, he is having his cake and eating it too, like I said.

    He's *interested* in the concept of a trans character but maybe not super heavily informed in it. Hence the inclusion of at least two trans characters in this arc, one a man that feels like a woman, and one a woman that feels like a man. Plus some others before that are in the range of crossdresser or gender bending but not necessarily trans, including Kiku's brother, also in this arc.

    Oda's been to okama bars, and yes obviously likes Rocky Horror, and he's put it into the story, so he has *interest* but no way of knowing how far that actually goes..

    Some of that is also to address Wano's culture in general, but he hasn't super heavy focused on that.

    And as noted he explicitly commented on being surprised by Rose of Versailles, he thought that was an interesting development and reveal.

    So character that is legit trans, wants to be a man... but also looks like a sexy girl with lots of side boob.

    At the end of the day it is a comic aimed at 12 year old boys and Oda's probably never going to do a deep dive on the issue any further than he already has outside of whatever we get in Yamato's likely flashback.

    The surface social issues are probably as deep as he's going to go with it, he's not going to deal with feeling inadequate n their body, it's just not that kind of story.

    Similarly whenever a female reader writes in and goes "you said something that makes it sound like girls can't do a thing" and his response is along the lines of "Of course a girl can have a manly adventure! It's all in your heart!" so that's confusing.

    He puts in stuff like "I am Oden so..." and "Kaidou's daughter" to make it easier to process and start sliding in as a joke before it sets in that its an actual long term emotional thing for the character.


    There *are* different levels of trans identity, it's not a one-size-fits-all thing, and there are some folks that feel they're the wrong gender but aren't particularly uncomfortable with the body they have... but it's hard to say if Oda's thought about, or understand it, that deeply?

    I mostly think Oda thought it would be interesting to have a character that's conflicted. I think Oda thought it would be interesting to mention Kaidou's son for a couple months and then have a surprise reveal. I think Oda thought it would be interesting to have a character with a viewpoint and personality Oda hasn't done before. Those were his concerns first and foremost.

    And maybe to also adress the Kuina issue that goes back decades about how a person born female in Wano (which is specifically called out for being outdated in gender biases) can still have the strengths and freedoms of any man.


    Yamato identifies as a man. If Ivanokov shows up he'll switch. In the meantime, he's not ashamed of his body or it being weak (as Kuina did) so if there's sideboob, oh well.

    We still need to see what happens when other characters take baths, how he interacts with Sanji, how he interacts with Nami and Robin, etc. to get a really clear idea of how exactly Oda's going to handle it or how far he's actually going to take it. It's been too much of a combat zone to really get that nuance and see exactly how Oda is ultimately going to roll with it all.
    Last edited by Robby; May 7th, 2021 at 11:48 PM.
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  9. #5989

    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    Quote Originally Posted by Robby View Post
    Okay, I'll start by being clear in no uncertain terms.

    My opinion is Yamato is clearly trans.

    Everything in the story screams it, that is the text. Not subtext, but the text.

    That is my opinion. No caveats, no exception, no, "but maybe". That is my opinion.

    What I am saying after that, is what I think about Oda and HIS take on it is. And also, that whatever Oda's opinion actually is, remembering that it has to be filtered through a comic book for 12 year old boys.

    These are two separate things. I understand where the confusion might lie if I don't cleanly separate these two thoughts.

    Hidden:
    I think the way Oda is handling it makes it more of a mixed bag. I think, Oda's *intent* is to write a trans character, but his *execution* is going to lean more towards non-conforming woman... for a variety of reasons.

    Regardless of what his actual *intent* is, what's ending up on the page may not be quite there.

    I think Oda is a straight man in his 40's, that lives in very culturally and slightly sexist Japan. That leads to all sorts of weird biases and the discussions on his sexism in the story are endless.

    He probably also does not have a best friend who is trans as I do, so the overall subject may be something he only really knows third hand, or from television. He might not actually know anyone with the experience, but I have no way of knowing so I can't even guess.

    But Japan IS different from other countries, so social stuff is... different. Not worse or better but... different.


    In terms of the story, he is having his cake and eating it too, like I said.

    He's *interested* in the concept of a trans character but maybe not super heavily informed in it. Hence the inclusion of at least two trans characters in this arc, one a man that feels like a woman, and one a woman that feels like a man. Plus some others before that are in the range of crossdresser or gender bending but not necessarily trans, including Kiku's brother, also in this arc.

    Oda's been to okama bars, and yes obviously likes Rocky Horror, and he's put it into the story, so he has *interest* but no way of knowing how far that actually goes..

    Some of that is also to address Wano's culture in general, but he hasn't super heavy focused on that.

    And as noted he explicitly commented on being surprised by Rose of Versailles, he thought that was an interesting development and reveal.

    So character that is legit trans, wants to be a man... but also looks like a sexy girl with lots of side boob.

    At the end of the day it is a comic aimed at 12 year old boys and Oda's probably never going to do a deep dive on the issue any further than he already has outside of whatever we get in Yamato's likely flashback.

    The surface social issues are probably as deep as he's going to go with it, he's not going to deal with feeling inadequate n their body, it's just not that kind of story.

    Similarly whenever a female reader writes in and goes "you said something that makes it sound like girls can't do a thing" and his response is along the lines of "Of course a girl can have a manly adventure! It's all in your heart!" so that's confusing.

    He puts in stuff like "I am Oden so..." and "Kaidou's daughter" to make it easier to process and start sliding in as a joke before it sets in that its an actual long term emotional thing for the character.


    There *are* different levels of trans identity, it's not a one-size-fits-all thing, and there are some folks that feel they're the wrong gender but aren't particularly uncomfortable with the body they have... but it's hard to say if Oda's thought about, or understand it, that deeply?

    I mostly think Oda thought it would be interesting to have a character that's conflicted. I think Oda thought it would be interesting to mention Kaidou's son for a couple months and then have a surprise reveal. I think Oda thought it would be interesting to have a character with a viewpoint and personality Oda hasn't done before. Those were his concerns first and foremost.

    And maybe to also adress the Kuina issue that goes back decades about how a person born female in Wano (which is specifically called out for being outdated in gender biases) can still have the strengths and freedoms of any man.


    Yamato identifies as a man. If Ivanokov shows up he'll switch. In the meantime, he's not ashamed of his body or it being weak (as Kuina did) so if there's sideboob, oh well.

    We still need to see what happens when other characters take baths, how he interacts with Sanji, how he interacts with Nami and Robin, etc. to get a really clear idea of how exactly Oda's going to handle it or how far he's actually going to take it. It's been too much of a combat zone to really get that nuance and see exactly how Oda is ultimately going to roll with it all.
    Okay, thank you for the clear and honest answer, I appreciate it. Unfortunately I don't fully agree, I've been burned enough times by cis authors trying to tackle this stuff, and I would have liked it if many things were handled differently, but it is what it is. Like you said, there's still a lot we need to see depending on where things go, so I guess we'll see when we see. Despite misgivings I do hope we get to see Yamato stick around for a while, I'm rooting for him.

  10. #5990

    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    When you think about who could've thrown the diary near the river where Yamato found it, Toki, Banzaburo and Tenguyama hit your mind as the immediate suspects.

    But..

    Tenguyama wasn't around when Oden's castle was attacked, wasn't even in the flashback at all.
    Does not seems likely that Toki threw it, even by mistake, it was an horrendous error on her side if she did.
    Banzaburo, or Bonzaburo, can't recall his name correctly, he makes the most sense, he was serving to Hiyori in the Castle last time we saw him, he could drop it by accident not knowing the actual content of it, or could have get killed midway to whatever he was running to.

    BUT, I also believe, this could be hinting at Previous Jack person, who was also in the castle according to Kin'emon memories, could've found the diary before anyone else, and betrayed Kaido by throwing it away, that's how presumably died.

  11. #5991

    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    If Oda were ever to take things into a place where Yams would be made to live and die in Wano, with his own wants and needs subsumed by some enforced duty to fix everything that noted piece of human garbage Oden broke it would probably be one of the darkest things he ever put to paper and a total crushing of the spirit of adventure. Him being born to serve the will of others, given a small hope at having his own life of adventure and then being made to serve again for the rest of his existance. Talk about a Robin level shit tier life, moving from one cage to another with no agency of his own simply because he chose to idolize Oden.

  12. #5992

    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    To me, Yamato seems like he could really only have two endings for the arc.

    1. Joining the crew.

    2. Leading a crew of redeemed Beast Pirates like the ones who Chopper healed.

    I just find the 2nd possibility not all that likely since there doesn't seem to be any lost love between Yamato and the beast pirates, and it doesn't seem like something he would do rather than joining Luffy, who he's asked to join and has explicitly been stated to be waiting a long time for.

    For that matter, I don't see any reason to think Yamato will stick around Wano. His reason for wanting to open Wano's borders is taking up Oden's final wish when he thought Momo & the scabbards were dead. He's shown no real personal interest in Wano outside of that wish which will be completed by the end of the arc. His excitement always comes from whenever he hears about pirates or adventures abroad.

  13. #5993

    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    Like imagine Oden had racked up 100.000 dollars in credit card debt living his fun life and they went oh well Yams now that you are trying to live a life like Oden surely you will want to pay off his massive debt, how nice for you to get to spend a few decades working off this great Oden debt, just like you always dreamed about.

  14. #5994
    Chocolate or raisins? Coookie's Avatar
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    Default Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    Yeah, Yamato is definitely going to leave Wano, the question is only with whom.

    He could try Oden's method and just sail out on his own but as a Devil Fruit user he would reach his demise pretty quickly in the hazardous New World waters.

    He could take over the remnants of the Animal Kingdom Pirates and force them to help him sail across the oceans. I don't see that happening because he doesn't care about any of them and he already had his "screw you guys, I'm not on your side anymore" moment. Also if given the choice between them and the Straw Hats, Yamato’s preference is very clear, so Luffy would need to have a good reason to refuse Yamato’s request.

    He could become the official leader of Wano's navy fleet/ambassador or something along those lines. It would be the best compromise between being able to chase his dreams while at the same time supporting Momonosuke. But he would still be limited and not truly as free as Oden was.

    He might start his own pirate crew with people like Carrot, Tama and whoever else is interested. Those three are however the only ones we know of that desire to go out and they'd be doomed pretty fast as well if they're on their own. Chances are even worse if either Carrot or Tama does end up joining the crew and Yamato doesn’t.

    Yamato has absolutely no reason to go with Kid, Law, or the Big Mom Pirates, the Minks will probably just go back to Zou and keep in touch with Wano. He might leave with Marco if the latter offers to take Yamato to Ace’s grave but then why wouldn’t the Straw Hats also go there? And afterwards we’re back to the question where Yamato would go next and with whom.

    He could just temporarily tag along with the Straw Hats but that would raise the question what makes them go separate ways at some point before Laugh Tale. Does he just lose interest in adventuring? Will he find other people that will take him in? Will he decide to stay somewhere else for some reason? Or go back to Wano?
    Last edited by Coookie; May 8th, 2021 at 04:24 AM.

  15. #5995

    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    I would also assume that any redeemed Beasts Pirates would need to stay in Wano to fix the mess they made.

  16. #5996

    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    Quote Originally Posted by King Cannon View Post
    I would also assume that any redeemed Beasts Pirates would need to stay in Wano to fix the mess they made.
    Overlord Tama won't allow her servants to leave.

  17. #5997

    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    Quote Originally Posted by wolfwood View Post
    Overlord Tama won't allow her servants to leave.
    She can always open a zoo and earn that sweet tourist money.

  18. #5998

    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    Quote Originally Posted by Monquito View Post
    Does not seems likely that Toki threw it, even by mistake, it was an horrendous error on her side if she did.
    Isn't that precisely what she does at the end of 972, though ? Upon hearing about Oden's death, Toki steps on the balcony, tears down his journal and spreads the pages in the wind and the river below (high chances of a river being at the foot of the castle since we know Kawamatsu swam away with Hyori a while later)
    Last edited by Seafarer33; May 8th, 2021 at 06:36 AM.

  19. #5999
    Chocolate or raisins? Coookie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    That's Oden's farewell letter to Toki that she tears apart.

  20. #6000

    Default Re: Next Straw Hat Crewmates (Vol. 8 - Onigashima)

    I'm not saying Yamato absolutely will stay in Wano, but it's shortsighted to say there's zero possibility. Either Yamato wants to be Oden or doesn't. Leaving Wano isn't something Oden would do right now. Oden grew up in the course of his voyage. He left with Whitebeard for fun, but split from Whitebeard to go with Roger because it was his destiny. He wanted to stay on Wano when he returned, but Toki forced him to go back out to sea with Roger because it was his destiny and because what he was doing was even more important for the entire world. Unless Yamato has an even more important mission, which, I have said is possible if it's tied to the New Dawn prophecy, simply leaving for the sake of having fun isn't something Oden would do right now. So if Yamato does leave for the pure joy of adventure, it isn't predicated on Oden reverence. Which is entirely fine, it means finding a personal drive to accomplish a different dream which isn't at all tied to Oden anymore. So, as I said, possible, but there's nothing in the story right now. It's purely speculation. I'm not saying there's no chance of Yamato joining, but there's a lot that needs to happen to make it work - like coming up with a completely new motivation for setting out to sea.
    Luffy, Zoro, Nami, Usopp, Sanji, Chopper, Robin, Franky, Brook, Jimbei, Carrot, Vivi, Smoker

    "ONE PIECE, IT EXISTS" - The Great Pirate Edward Newgate

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