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Thread: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

  1. #1

  2. #2

    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    Do people really think the Mafia bosses are stronger than the calamities because of a gag scene with them holding Luffy down?

  3. #3

    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    Quote Originally Posted by Shiebs View Post
    Do people really think the Mafia bosses are stronger than the calamities because of a gag scene with them holding Luffy down?
    This sort of sheenanigans is giving the true powerhouses like Buggy a bad name

  4. #4

    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    Good chapter. I'm loving both Chopper's (albeit small) and Zoro's parts in the group effort. Also, Sword God ?
    The pieces are falling in place nicely as far as the rebellion goes, but I find it almost too easy. At the end of the day, will Kaido so much as flinch faced with all of this anyway ?

    In other news, we still don't know who set Jack/Doffy on Raizo's/Momonosuke's trail, and for all her act Hyori has yet to convince me that she isn't pursuing her own agenda. Her care for the people of Wano seems genuine, but that's maybe the only thing about her that doesn't seem fake. With what we've seen her pull off as Komurasaki, teary eyes and a mellow story are really too little to clear suspicions that she may have sold Kawamatsu.
    Last edited by Seafarer33; August 18th, 2019 at 02:39 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaido King of the Beasts View Post
    Guys what if the world is actually two straw hat planets fused together, with the Red Line being the hats' rims?

  5. #5

    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    Quote Originally Posted by Shiebs View Post
    Do people really think the Mafia bosses are stronger than the calamities because of a gag scene with them holding Luffy down?
    No but so far the calamities have been lackluster (beasts pirates in general have been very disappointing) so I wouldn't be surprised if they were. It doesn't really matter anyway Luffy's side has more than enough people to beat the beasts pirates what's another 4 strong allies?

  6. #6

    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    Quote Originally Posted by Seafarer33 View Post
    Good chapter. I'm loving both Chopper's and Zoro's parts in the group effort. Also, Sword God ?
    The pieces are falling in place nicely as far as the rebellion goes, but I find it almost too easy. At the end of the day, will Kaido so much as flinch faced with all of this ?

    In other news, we still don't know who set Jack/Doffy on Raizo's/Momonosuke's trail, and for all her act Hyori has yet to convince me that she isn't pursuing her own agenda. Her care for the people of Wano seems genuine, but that's maybe the only thing about her that doesn't seem fake. With what we've seen her pull off as Komurasaki, teary eyes and a mellow story are really too little to clear suspicions that she may have sold Kawamatsu.
    I don't see why a 13 year old would sell out their savior.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    So hey Oda what did you have in mind for the ultimate bad guys in this arc, something generic and badass huh? Actually i'm thinking a fat guy in obelix pants and a fu manchu and a really angry fuzzy wuzzy mammoth headed up by a goofy looking bi-polar dragon who drinks alot. Then his editors force him to put in King as a tough guy in a gimp suit to satisfy all the tough guy wankers, only for Oda to get the last laugh when he also makes him into an absolutely adorable pterodactyl

  8. #8
    Your long-lost brother Jabra's Avatar
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    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    Quote Originally Posted by Blissed View Post
    I don't see why a 13 year old would sell out their savior.
    We already had younger children execute their loving father on panel, as well as kill and/or EAT their foster parents.

    Maybe she didn't sell out her savior, but accepting his capture as a casual "shit happens" incident? Sure.


  9. #9

    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    Beasts pirates aren't even the ultimate bad guys this arc they're in a three way tie with BM pirates and Orochi's gang. Big Mom and Orochi are equally important villains with Kaido. Hell they even had more panel time than him.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    Always good to see someone show the Spandam of the arc some love.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    Quote Originally Posted by Blissed View Post
    I don't see why a 13 year old would sell out their savior.
    Maybe it doesn't go as far as selling out, but I don't quite buy her current explanation and it's fishy how vague what little we know is. Anyway, I would put her motivation down to something like ambition. The girl suffered as a fugitive for the best part of a decade, all the while hearing about how important it was to restore the Kozuki name and her kid brother, who (from her point of view) had vanished for good. Ashura's men found it hard to keep faith after 10 long years; maybe she did too and decided to take matters into her own hand.
    She isn't an iredeemable evil and doesn't side with Kaido and Orochi, but she can still have her own idea of who and how ought to topple them, which maybe does not fit Kawamatsu's views of the world. So eventually she parts ways and a confused Kappa becomes reckless because he is desperately looking for her, leading to his capture.
    Back to the present day, she is 10 years wiser and could reasonably deem herself more qualified for shoguning than kid Momonosuke. Their immediate goals are the same, but I wouldn't put it past her to spice things up at some point.

    I'm not saying this is an absolute, though. She could be every bit of the good samaritan the story currently paints her as, and Oda simply ditched the manipulative courtesan in favor of another damsel-in-distress character. We know he likes them after all. I would find it boring.
    Last edited by Seafarer33; August 18th, 2019 at 03:40 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaido King of the Beasts View Post
    Guys what if the world is actually two straw hat planets fused together, with the Red Line being the hats' rims?

  12. #12
    Charismatic Awesome Joy Boy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    Still extremely disappointing that Oda is off paneling Kaido vs Mom. This isn’t him off paneling Sanji vs a third rate opponent in Page One. This is him off paneling a fight between the main 2 antagonists of the whole saga and 2 of the strongest in the series. And all of that to show freaking Gyukimaru.

    Bad move Oda. Worst and most disappointing chapter of the arc by far


  13. #13

    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    Quote Originally Posted by Seafarer33 View Post
    Maybe it doesn't go as far as selling out, but I don't quite buy her current explanation and it's fishy how vague what little we know is. Anyway, I would put her motivation down to something like ambition. The girl suffered as a fugitive for the best part of a decade, all the while hearing about how important it was to restore the Kozuki name and her kid brother, who (from her point of view) had vanished for good. Ashura's men found it hard to keep faith after 10 long years; maybe she did too and decided to take matters into her own hand.
    She isn't an iredeemable evil and doesn't side with Kaido and Orochi, but she can still have her own idea of who and how ought to topple them, which maybe does not fit Kawamatsu's views of the world. So eventually she parts ways and a confused Kappa becomes reckless because he is desperately looking for her, leading to his capture.
    Back to the present day, she is 10 years wiser and could reasonably deem herself more qualified for shoguning than kid Momonosuke. Their immediate goals are the same, but I wouldn't put it past her to spice things up at some point.

    I'm not saying this is an absolute, though. She could be every bit of the good samaritan the story currently paints her as, and Oda simply ditched the manipulative courtesan in favor of another damsel-in-distress character. We know he likes them after all. I would find it boring.
    I just disagree that she would willingly abandon Kawamatsu out of ideological differences. Her doing it out of guilt due to him starving for her sake, yea that sounds like something a kid would do.

    I don't wanna make any absolutes either, I'm just simply saying that even if she has her own thoughts on killing Orochi or even who should be Shogun, none of that necessitates her betraying them.

    Anyhow, her being firmly on the side of the alliance doesn't have to mean she'll never show her manipulative side again. It's just that its probably more likely that she'll direct it at the actual bad guys in this arc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jabra View Post
    We already had younger children execute their loving father on panel, as well as kill and/or EAT their foster parents.

    Maybe she didn't sell out her savior, but accepting his capture as a casual "shit happens" incident? Sure.
    These comparisons don't really work here, because my argument is not that kids can't do messed up things, but that at that time in her life, I don't see her motive for doing such a thing. This should all be before her Komurasaki persona and what not after all.

    But from what she told us, she seemingly didn't even know he was captured to begin with. She said she didn't know where any of the Scabbards were, which matches up with her running away from him. Though we're getting off track a bit, I don't see how her theoretically viewing his capture in that manner supports the theory of her betraying the alliance in the present day.

  14. #14
    Discovered Stowaway andre's Avatar
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    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    Quote Originally Posted by Joy Boy View Post
    Still extremely disappointing that Oda is off paneling Kaido vs Mom. This isn’t him off paneling Sanji vs a third rate opponent in Page One. This is him off paneling a fight between the main 2 antagonists of the whole saga and 2 of the strongest in the series. And all of that to show freaking Gyukimaru.

    Bad move Oda. Worst and most disappointing chapter of the arc by far
    This is one off-paneling I absolutely agree with, assuming that whatever happens in Big Mom's plot is sufficient. We already know how Big Mom handles enemies weaker than her, seeing her against Kaido, either of them at full strength, would spoil the end of the arc. I'm fine with waiting to see what tricks he has beyond the club.

  15. #15
    Your long-lost brother Jabra's Avatar
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    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    Quote Originally Posted by Blissed View Post

    These comparisons don't really work here, because my argument is not that kids can't do messed up things, but that at that time in her life, I don't see her motive for doing such a thing. This should all be before her Komurasaki persona and what not after all.
    At that point in her life she already lived 7 years under Orochi's rule, barely making ends meet. Seven years. Is it really hard to believe that a child would grow into a manipulative and selfish little shit under such conditions? Even growing to abuse the kind Kappa dude who does whatever he can to sustain her? Because some kids are absolutely like that.

    That said, I don't believe that she actively wants to betray the alliance, or that she backstabbed Kawamatsu 13 years ago. But I absolutely can picture her not giving a damn once he got captured. You say this should be all before her Komourasaki persona, I say this might very well be the final straw that made a manipulative child go full bitch-mode.


  16. #16

    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    Didn't like this chapter very much. I was hoping this kind of infodumpy-transitional chapter was behind us.

    Highlight for me was the Hiyori/Kawamatsu reunion, that was sweet.

    EDIT: In regards to the Kaidou/Big Mom fight being off-paneled, I'm not worried. We'll probably get at least one cool image by the end ala Brook vs. Big Mom.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    I saw an argument/discussion on another site about the thematic issues with Tama's powers in this chapter (and by extension, any other ones) and I'm going to paraphrase it here because I think I agree with it.

    Basically, Tama's powers have been used to make people into slaves, and up until now slavery and the suppression of freedom has been presented as the most vile thing in the world. This time however Old Maid/Babanuki is being brainwashed by the Strawhats without as much as a second thought. If a villain did the same thing they'd probably been treated as at least a Doflamingo level bastard. It feels like a contradiction to me.
    Last edited by MrBits; August 18th, 2019 at 07:23 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by MrBits
    Place your bets. Is [AlphaMale/AlphaBro, an obvious ban evader] going to get banned again today, tomorrow, or in a week?
    Quote Originally Posted by AlphaBro
    okay let's bet . Would love to see your losing face next week !
    An actual bet and conversation on the Chapter 905 thread, literally an hour before he got banned again.

  17. #17

    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    Quote Originally Posted by Shiebs View Post
    Do people really think the Mafia bosses are stronger than the calamities because of a gag scene with them holding Luffy down?
    Luffy was held down by fishmen in Fishman Island he could knock out with CoC

  18. #18

    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    Quote Originally Posted by MrBits View Post
    Basically, Tama's powers have been used to make people into slaves, and up until now slavery and the suppression of freedom has been presented as the most vile thing in the world. This time however Old Maid/Babanuki is being brainwashed by the Strawhats without as much as a second thought. If a villain did the same thing they'd probably been treated as at least a Doflamingo level bastard. It feels like a contradiction to me.
    I agree. Overall, nothing good comes out of this idea of Tama taming eveybody.

  19. #19

    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    Yeah, this was a fairly transitional chapter, which surprised me, given that I was expecting the end of volume 94. We're getting an 11 chapter volume then, I guess.

    There's not much here to discuss since it's all cooldown and groundwork. Love that Kawamatsu is back in the fray so soon, and curious to see what his connection to Gyukimaru is, because I also love his design. Kaido VS Big Mom is, I think, the most important ongoing happening for Wano. I made a post in the Wano thread talking about how there's even chance of it resolving in them becoming allies or remaining enemies and how that will decide the direction of the rest of the arc. I would be surprised if Oda doesn't wrap it up in the next chapter or two (possibly for the end of the volume), because something really does need to happen to up the stakes at this point.

    The single hair out of place in Big Mom's fight panel is a touch I liked. Both her and Kaido have that crosshatched bruising/dirt to show how legitimate the battle is. Interesting that this is the point where Kaido first shows anything resembling battle damage. Even against another Emperor, I wasn't expecting his apparent invincibility to be undermined so soon and by anyone other than Luffy.

    Queen's joke bit was actually pretty funny.

    Babanuki is back in one piece, as expected. Chopper really knows what he's doing, huh? Brings to mind an old webcomic...

    Spoiler:



    Oh god, this is from 2007? I'm getting way too old!


    And yeah, that's prettymuch it. The yakuza guys look interesting, but there's not much else to judge them on based on a single panel. There should be one more, right? Wonder if he's anyone we've met already.

    Glad we're not getting a break. It'd be rough to wait after such a lightweight chapter.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Chapter 952: Hiyori and Kawamatsu

    Quote Originally Posted by MrBits View Post
    Didn't like this chapter very much. I was hoping this kind of infodumpy-transitional chapter was behind us.

    Highlight for me was the Hiyori/Kawamatsu reunion, that was sweet.

    EDIT: In regards to the Kaidou/Big Mom fight being off-paneled, I'm not worried. We'll probably get at least one cool image by the end ala Brook vs. Big Mom.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    I saw an argument/discussion on another site about the thematic issues with Tama's powers in this chapter (and by extension, any other ones) and I'm going to paraphrase it here because I think I agree with it.

    Basically, Tama's powers have been used to make people into slaves, and up until now slavery and the suppression of freedom has been presented as the most vile thing in the world. This time however Old Maid/Babanuki is being brainwashed by the Strawhats without as much as a second thought. If a villain did the same thing they'd probably been treated as at least a Doflamingo level bastard. It feels like a contradiction to me.
    I replied to that person on Reddit (and he downvoted me lol Thats why i hate Reddit) and i told him that O-Tama doesnt create slaves. You have to remember Oda loves the concept of animals fighting for dominance. Its similar to Luffy's Conqueror Haki when he tamed the animals in the forest where he trained for 2 years. Basically Tama with her power makes the animals feels like she is the "dominant animal" so the animals feels like its natural to submit to her. Its an 'animal thing'. You dont have to look at that with human standards. By the way of course Tama power in the hands of someone evil would be very dangerous. But she is a good person so she will use it just to defend herself or to lie on the phone like she did in the last chapter.

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