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Thread: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

  1. #4301

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    So, datamining revealed a possible upcoming DLC for Xenoverse2 that includes new versions of Broly and Gogeta.
    This strongly alludes toward Gogeta making an appearance in the Super movie. Your thoughts about this?
    Personally, it hurts me to see the current state of the Dragon Ball franchise and how it is treated as a cash cow.
    This movie doesn't only have Broly, Bardock, and Freeza, but also apparently Gogeta. Who else could they bring back as a fanservice in the future?

  2. #4302

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    The story has been determined by fan demand and editors since early on. So this complaining about fanservice is bizarre to me. I see it everywhere so I'm not addressing anyone in particular.

    DB was doing badly, so editors suggested tournament arcs. Vegeta was kept prominent because he turned out to be popular. All the different Cell forms and androids are all a result of editorial meddling. Goku came back because fans like him and Toriyama thought Gohan didn't fit the main character role.

    I mean it's entirely possible to think the fanservice is badly done, sure, understandable, but I feel like a lot of those "fanservice" choices improved the story and most of the time made sense. I thought Kaioken, Freeza and 17 were some of the best additions, for example.

    I don't think any of this is anything to freak out about, especially since Broly and Gogeta are essentially blank slates. If it all comes together to a good whole, who cares? Of course, it's entirely possible the movie will suck, but using popular stuff by itself isn't bad. Personally I'm also kinda tired of Vegetto and I'm happy we got Kefla in the ToP and now potentially Gogeta in the movie. All the elements here is stuff that has room for expansion and doing something interesting with them.

    I think a potential attempt giving some depth to these hyper popular things is actually a good thing, too. Would be nice.

    Anyway, I ended up watching movie 9 and 12 because those are some of the ones I'm curious about and I remember seeing bits from.

    I liked Bojack because of others besides Goku getting to do stuff. The tournament at the start was pretty cool and Gohan saving the day was cool, too.

    I loved Fusion Reborn because it did the Buu arc right, by which I mean switching between lighthearted and intimidating perfectly. It's such a fun movie because the characters are so expressive and the villain, while not having a personality has a incredibly cool moveset and personality in terms of presentation. The setting is really unique and cool-looking, too.
    I love Goku in the movie because he's such a perfectly balanced wacky and fun and serious. I liked Paikuhan in there, too. In a general sense, it's one of the best-looking DB things I've seen, too. If the new Broly is as good or supposedly better-looking, then that's gonna be great. The addition of *Hitler* in there is some wierd and awkward stuff, but for the most part it was really entertaining.
    Last edited by Kizuchan; August 29th, 2018 at 08:11 AM.

  3. #4303
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    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Of course they are gonna make Gogeta canon. Wouldn't mind them using ssj4 as a superior transformation than this whole rainbow hair shit instead as well.
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  4. #4304

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Yeah let's leave SSJ4 back in the same decade as half bald Satan and bad haircut/dumb moustache Vegeta.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ubiq View Post
    I've often wondered about that myself; seems like being supported by people who only want you there so the world can end in fire (with you going to Hell in the process) would be somewhat off-putting
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  5. #4305

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Since they actually brought in Broli I'm beginning to think they will literally ask Toriyama to help re-create the plot of Dragon Ball GT at this rate.
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  6. #4306

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    If new Broly is something like a Baby done well, I wouldn't mind.

  7. #4307

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Quote Originally Posted by Green_vs_Red View Post
    Yeah let's leave SSJ4 back in the same decade as half bald Satan and bad haircut/dumb moustache Vegeta.
    Half bald Satan was part of the original series' ending, not just yet another bad GT decision.



    Though GT's decision to take place even later than *that* and thus require Krillin, Bulma, Chichi, etc. to be a million years old was definitely a mistake.

  8. #4308

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Whoops going senile at 30.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ubiq View Post
    I've often wondered about that myself; seems like being supported by people who only want you there so the world can end in fire (with you going to Hell in the process) would be somewhat off-putting
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  9. #4309

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    The target was to make Trunks be Future Trunks age or to make Pan a teen?
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  10. #4310

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Quote Originally Posted by maxterdexter View Post
    The target was to make Trunks be Future Trunks age or to make Pan a teen?
    Considering Trunks was 18 (and Goten 17) for the Uub tourney, I have to assume the real and only point in doing that was to age Pan up. Even though Gohan carried things just fine on Namek when he was like, 5, and 9/10 for Cell.

    Also, interestingly, the Japanese version has GT take place 5 years after Uub, but the English for some insane reason has it 10 years later.

  11. #4311
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    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Quote Originally Posted by Robby View Post
    Considering Trunks was 18 (and Goten 17) for the Uub tourney, I have to assume the real and only point in doing that was to age Pan up. Even though Gohan carried things just fine on Namek when he was like, 5, and 9/10 for Cell.

    Also, interestingly, the Japanese version has GT take place 5 years after Uub, but the English for some insane reason has it 10 years later.
    Wait, what? They changed the number of years that had passed in the dub? What madness is that??

    EDIT: Googled it, and do be fair to funimation, the Bulla and Pan literally dating/being hit on when they're 8/9 and 10/11 respectively (as happens at the beginning of the series) is completely ridiculous. I can understand them just upping the age by 5 to do away with all that mess.
    Last edited by AfroSamurai; August 30th, 2018 at 05:21 PM.

  12. #4312

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Not that I think it's an issue for fictional characters in the first place, but I'd offer that Matsui Aya was the head writer of Dragon Ball GT and she continues to make jokes by having Suiren's little sisters continually call Satoshi Suiren's boyfriend in Pocket Monster: Sun & Moon.
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  13. #4313

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    The only thing I would like to see redone at this point is the last saga in GT, with the Evil Dragons. Of course done right.

  14. #4314

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    I'm not familiar at all with the plot of GT. I read snippets about it and saw episodes here and there. It just seemed super wonky.

  15. #4315

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    I think some of the base ideas are quite good. Spoilers if you haven't seen it, I guess.

    In the first arc Goku is turned into a kid by a corrupt dragon and they have to travel the universe to get the Dragon Balls back to turn him back normal. This technically lasts the whole series, but the first 16 or so episodes are just weekly adventures.

    Then a Tsufurujin looking for revenge on the Saiyans shows up, which is really interesting considering the relationship between the two races.

    I think what's done with 17 is the least interesting. They basically turn him evil again. This is also the part I remember least about.

    The final arc is about combatting Dragons born out of too much usage of the DBs. The DBs corrupt and create 7 dragons.

    On paper this sounds like a really fun/interesting series, but by some miracle it's just really boring to me. I think these are some really good concepts to reboot, though. Just like Broly and Gogeta, they are ideas that have a lot of room for expansion and reinterpretation.

    So if they are gonna bring something back again, I think GT stuff would be a very good idea. Too bad GT isn't a cashcow like Broly is.
    Last edited by Kizuchan; September 1st, 2018 at 11:51 AM.

  16. #4316
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    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Quote Originally Posted by Kizuchan View Post
    I think some of the base ideas are quite good. Spoilers if you haven't seen it, I guess.

    In the first arc Goku is turned into a kid by a corrupt dragon and they have to travel the universe to get the Dragon Balls back to turn him back normal. This technically lasts the whole series, but the first 16 or so episodes are just weekly adventures.

    Then a Tsufurujin looking for revenge on the Saiyans shows up, which is really interesting considering the relationship between the two races.

    I think what's done with 17 is the least interesting. They basically turn him evil again. This is also the part I remember least about.

    The final arc is about combatting Dragons born out of too much usage of the DBs. The DBs corrupt and create 7 dragons.

    On paper this sounds like a really fun/interesting series, but by some miracle it's just really boring to me. I think these are some really good concepts to reboot, though. Just like Broly and Gogeta, they are ideas that have a lot of room for expansion and reinterpretation.

    So if they are gonna bring something back again, I think GT stuff would be a very good idea. Too bad GT isn't a cashcow like Broly is.
    A few added notes (watch out for those 20 year old spoilers!) :

    When goku is turned to a kid, "they" means kid-goku, Pan (goku's granddaughter), and teen trunks. Everyone else stays on earth. Very important, if they don't find the bad dragonballs that have gone throughout the universe... earth explodes. Side effect of the dark dragonballs made by King piccolo iirc.

    The Tsufurujin were a race coexistent with the Saijans on their planet, exterminated by the Saijans, and Baby is a parasytic being using Tsufuru genes, meaning he can take over Saijans. He travels to earth after meeting goku and co in space, takes over weaker Saijans like Gohan and Goten, then heads for Vegeta - sort of resulting in Majin vegeta 2.0. The climax of this fight sees Kid Goku (now with a tail) turning super saijan while in great ape form, and reaching SSJ4 as a result of controlling that form. He then faces off against Baby Vegeta, also in Great Ape form.

    Android 17 saga is stupid, but yeah, two android 17s fuse and become Super 17. Also this is done by gero from the afterlife, and you get hijinks like dead Cell and Freeza vs kid Goku, Nappa facing off Vegeta once more, etc.

    Final saga has a few high notes, namely Vegeta putting his pride aside and also achieving SSJ4 by cheating (He gets Bulma's help, creating a Machine to let him transform). Final dragon Omega Shenron is really powerful, absorbs all other dragons, outmatches SSJ4 Goku and SSJ4 Vegeta until they fuse into SSJ 4 Gogeta (but get cocky and lose anyway because transformation ends). Help from the 4 star ball dragon and Universal Genkidama saves the day (because now goku has friends all over the universe thanks to the first saga of GT!).

    Series ends with Goku asking Shenron to resurrect everyone killed by shadowdragons, and gets on Shenron's back to leave the gang forever.
    ---
    It's got some really incoherent parts with retcons, where motivations make no sense, powerlevels scale awfully, Freeza being emperor of Universe makes no sense in GT canon... but on the whole, I like GT, unlike everyone else on this forum ahahah. I also really love the clothing choices for Goku (the blue gi <3), and the animation in GT, as well as liking Pan, kid Goku, and Trunks' dynamics. Yea Goku's character is inconsistent as hell... but I still find it a fun ride. Also Vegeta's 80's hard rock band clothing is lol
    Last edited by AfroSamurai; September 1st, 2018 at 02:48 PM.

  17. #4317

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    I'm one of those people that thinks "Tsufurujin" is really clumsy but I hate the name "Baby".

    That's the theme of GT in a nutshell, right? It honestly DID have some interesting ideas - the Shadow Dragons were brilliant in concept because it was a ramification for a series-wide abuse of the Dragon Balls - from undoing deaths to more ridiculous things like Oolong's panties. But of course most of them had to be forgettable and total fodder for Goku.





  18. #4318
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    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Quote Originally Posted by MetaMario View Post
    I'm one of those people that thinks "Tsufurujin" is really clumsy but I hate the name "Baby".

    That's the theme of GT in a nutshell, right? It honestly DID have some interesting ideas - the Shadow Dragons were brilliant in concept because it was a ramification for a series-wide abuse of the Dragon Balls - from undoing deaths to more ridiculous things like Oolong's panties. But of course most of them had to be forgettable and total fodder for Goku.
    In GT's defence, it probably doesn't sound as idiotic in Japanese. No more idiotic than Saiyajins, at least. That one's on the localizers for not coming up with a sensible naming alternative for the english dub.

    Actually, much of GT's widespread hate in the west may be down to the localizers. From the substitution of the beautiful japanese soundtrack, to the changing of the opening to a really ugly song instead of the really sweet japanese GT opening, to clumsy dialogue choices in the dub. I personally find it's nowhere near as hated in italy, where we actually got a good dub for the series. And hell, it gets reruns to this day! Not that that excuses the dumb bits or explains it's flop in japan... but the fact the english localization process was so atrocious certainly has an impact on it's hate from American DB fans especially, most of whom experienced it for the first time dubbed on american tv, I presume.

  19. #4319

    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Yeah I can see why "Tuffle" isn't very cool either. I just keep thinking of truffle.





  20. #4320
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    Default Re: Dragonball Discussion Kai: Broly but this time it's not Broly

    Quote Originally Posted by MetaMario View Post
    Yeah I can see why "Tuffle" isn't very cool either. I just keep thinking of truffle.
    "The Japanese name Tsufuru-jin is a pun. Specifically, it is a Japanese pronunciation of the English word "fruit" (furutsu). This implies their opposition to the Saiyan race, whose name is a pun on the Japanese word for "vegetable" (yasai). The dub name of "Tuffles" possibly linked to "Truffles", another food found in the ground akin to a vegetable. One difference between truffles and other vegetables is that all the names of Saiyans are "plant" vegetables, while truffles are mushrooms, making them fungi and not plants."

    (from the DB wiki)

    I'm already imagining the 2018 style scandal if they'd named them "fruitjins" and then gone on an explanation about the more manly, powerful saijans exterminating the fruits for being weaker. Not politically incorrect at ALL
    Last edited by AfroSamurai; September 1st, 2018 at 02:49 PM.

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