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Thread: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

  1. #18261
    Discovered Stowaway The D.'s Avatar
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    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by Nobodyman View Post
    Election Year 2036. Bernie Sanders runs for president again while in a wheelchair and hooked up to an IV bag and oxygen tank.

    Bernie Supporters: Yep! This is our guy!
    He'd still be better than anyone else running today. But why do you guys provoke me like this and then throw a fit when I respond in kind? Can't we all just try and keep it civil? With none of this obvious baiting?

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    Quote Originally Posted by andre View Post
    The vast majority of Bernie supporters voted for Hillary. And even if they didn't, it's not at all hard to believe that they could have believed any number of theories about her instead of being sexist. Lots of people are just stupid, gullible, or both.
    I voted for Hillary because she was better than trumpy. Simple as that.
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  2. #18262
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    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by The D. View Post
    Bernie had a heart attack. And? My grandfather had a heart attack when he was younger than Bernie, and he's older than Bernie now. My grandfather didn't slow down after his either. He still drives, works around the house, mows lawn, blows snow, etcetera. I've seen first hand that a heart attack doesn't destroy your life, so people saying it somehow disqualifies Bernie should sit down.
    Does your grandfather have one of the most stressful jobs in the world?

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    Quote Originally Posted by The D. View Post
    I voted for Hillary because she was better than trumpy. Simple as that.
    Yeah. It wasn't at all a hard choice. There are very few democratic (or republican) candidates I wouldn't easily vote for over Trump. I hate everything that man represents. He is personified scum.

  3. #18263
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    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by andre View Post
    Does your grandfather have one of the most stressful jobs in the world?

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    Yeah. It wasn't at all a hard choice. There are very few democratic (or republican) candidates I wouldn't easily vote for over Trump. I hate everything that man represents. He is personified scum.
    No he doesn't. At least not anymore. But I'd wager the fact that he still led a full, physically strenuous life until recently after the heart attack is a good indicator of Bernie being able to handle the presidency.

    And yes, trumpy is a disgusting excuse for a human being so I suppose choosing Hillary over him wasn't an especially high bar, lol.
    Gonna give ya the D.!

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    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by The D. View Post
    No he doesn't. At least not anymore. But I'd wager the fact that he still led a full, physically strenuous life until recently after the heart attack is a good indicator of Bernie being able to handle the presidency.

    And yes, trumpy is a disgusting excuse for a human being so I suppose choosing Hillary over him wasn't an especially high bar, lol.
    I don't have a strong opinion either way. I like the purity of Bernie's passion and believe in the overall message, though not all of his proposed policies. What I mean to say, though, is that much younger and healthier men have quickly aged as president. I think it's a valid concern.

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    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by andre View Post
    I don't have a strong opinion either way. I like the purity of Bernie's passion and believe in the overall message, though not all of his proposed policies. What I mean to say, though, is that much younger and healthier men have quickly aged as president. I think it's a valid concern.
    It's valid, and one I share. But I'm willing to take a chance on the person I feel is best to lead the country and it's people forward. Even moreso if he chooses a good vp.
    Gonna give ya the D.!

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    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by The D. View Post
    It's valid, and one I share. But I'm willing to take a chance on the person I feel is best to lead the country and it's people forward. Even moreso if he chooses a good vp.
    This is also my view. An old candidate, be it Bernie or someone else, would also strengthen the position of the VP. Maybe even with the clear prospect of passing the torch after 4 years.
    It's certainly a chance to somewhat calm, if not unite, a divided party.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Jabra View Post
    This is also my view. An old candidate, be it Bernie or someone else, would also strengthen the position of the VP. Maybe even with the clear prospect of passing the torch after 4 years.
    It's certainly a chance to somewhat calm, if not unite, a divided party.
    Exactly. Someone to carry the torch and light the way, and pass it on when the time is right. I think we're only divided right now because there are two great choices and Biden before us. If Bernie or Warren win the nomination the party will rally around them. Biden...not so much.
    Gonna give ya the D.!

  8. #18268

    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by Jabra View Post
    This is also my view. An old candidate, be it Bernie or someone else, would also strengthen the position of the VP. Maybe even with the clear prospect of passing the torch after 4 years.
    It's certainly a chance to somewhat calm, if not unite, a divided party.
    I don't see any presidential canidate, no matter the age, willingly passing the torch ever. Unless their health really gets that concerning.
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    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by LUFFY#1 fan View Post
    I don't see any presidential canidate, no matter the age, willingly passing the torch ever. Unless their health really gets that concerning.
    It would have to be a public gentlemen's agreement of course, part of the presidential primaries. Something you can fall back on in 2-3 years.


  10. #18270
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    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by Nobodyman View Post
    Election Year 2036. Bernie Sanders runs for president again while in a wheelchair and hooked up to an IV bag and oxygen tank.

    Bernie Supporters: Yep! This is our guy!
    It'll be like the last few premiers of the Soviet Union before Gorbachev, all senile old bastards who were born while the tsar was still in charge.

  11. #18271

    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyan D. Funk View Post
    It'll be like the last few premiers of the Soviet Union before Gorbachev, all senile old bastards who were born while the tsar was still in charge.
    Imagine if the USSR and the USA both fell apart in my lifetime.

  12. #18272

    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    I feel like Chuck Grassley is a perfect example of old politicians keeping power. These guys either have that great healthcare, are luckier than people who've died earlier, or maybe this job isn't as taxing as implied.

    I agree with the sentiment that we need younger people in office, but if these guys can get elected I don't see why they can't live a few more years. Trump should be dead with his diet and lifestyle, but he still survives in spite of all logic.

  13. #18273
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    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    That's because he's evil and made a deal with the devil.

    Quote Originally Posted by wolfwood View Post
    Imagine if the USSR and the USA both fell apart in my lifetime.
    I would imagine you would be glad at that time to live in Scandinavia.

  14. #18274

    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    A painful look at attempts by senior officials such as Mattis to educate Trump on world issues. It goes as badly as you might expect.

    The clash came in the middle of Trump’s first Pentagon briefing on America’s military and diplomatic “laydown”—a term of art used to describe all of the locations around the world with U.S. forces and embassies—on July 20, 2017. Mattis, for whom I was working as chief speechwriter, had hoped the briefing would educate Trump on the United States’ longstanding commitment to the rest of the world. That is not at all what happened.

    Instead, the president burst out in the middle of the meeting.

    “I just returned from France,” he said. “Did you see President Macron’s handshake?” he asked no one in particular. “He wouldn’t let go. He just kept holding on. I spent two hours at Bastille Day. Very impressive.”

    A pause.

    “I want a ‘Victory Day.’ Just like Veterans Day. The Fourth of July is too hot,” he said, apparently out of nowhere. “I want vehicles and tanks on Main Street. On Pennsylvania Avenue, from the Capitol to the White House. We need spirit! We should blow everybody away with this parade. The French had an amazing parade on Bastille Day with tanks and everything. Why can’t we do that?

  15. #18275

    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    It keeps coming back to that huh.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ubiq View Post
    I've often wondered about that myself; seems like being supported by people who only want you there so the world can end in fire (with you going to Hell in the process) would be somewhat off-putting
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  16. #18276
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    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    I don't understand the logic of VP picks. I would rather see the people vote in the VP instead of letting it fall to the choice of the president.

  17. #18277

    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    Well if Trump actively ignores all his intel meetings, he can claim the info he got from his Russian handlers is the best info available to him and that no one ever told him otherwise.

    I mean, he lies nonstop so it doesn't matter, but deep down he knows he gets in trouble if he clearly intentionally works against our best interests.
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  18. #18278
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    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    https://whatthefuckjusthappenedtoday...0/21/day-1005/

    Day 1005: "We prefer peace to war."

    1/ Mick Mulvaney – again – tried to deny his public assertion of a quid pro quo in which the Trump administration held up an aid package to Ukraine because Trump wanted an investigation that could politically benefit him. During an appearance on Fox News Sunday, Mulvaney insisted that he "didn't speak clearly maybe on Thursday" and that there couldn't have been a quid pro quo, because "the aid flowed." Mulvaney also claimed that the administration only held up military aid to Ukraine because of the country's corruption and because other countries weren't giving more aid as well. On Thursday, however, Mulvaney told reporters to "Get over it," calling quid pro quo "absolutely appropriate" and that "we do that all the time with foreign policy." Mulvaney also claimed at the press conference last week that the Trump administration withheld military aid in part to secure cooperation with a Justice Department investigation into the origins of Robert Mueller's Russia probe. (Washington Post / New York Times / Daily Beast)
    • Trump's allies are assembling a list of possible Mulvaney replacements. Among those said to be on the list are former acting Attorney General Matthew Whitaker, former New Jersey Governor Chris Christie, and veteran political operative Wayne Berman. (Bloomberg)
    • 📌 Day 1002: Mick Mulvaney tried to walk-back his claim that Trump's decision to withhold nearly $400 million in military aid to Ukraine was in exchange for an investigation of the hacked Democratic National Committee server. Trump has repeatedly claimed his decision to hold up the aid was due to concerns about corruption in Ukraine and that European nations weren't doing enough to help Ukraine. Trump was reportedly "not happy" with Mulvaney's press briefing, in which his acting chief of staff said "We do that all the time with foreign policy" and that every one should "Get over it," because "There's going to be political influence in foreign policy." Mulvaney later issued a statement, which was first reviewed by Trump, saying that "There was absolutely no quid pro quo between Ukrainian military aid and any investigation into the 2016 election." When Trump was asked to clarify Mulvaney's statement, Trump responded: "I think he clarified it." Meanwhile, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi called Mulvaney's comments a "confession." (Wall Street Journal / New York Times / CNN)
    • 📌 Day 1001: Acting White House chief of staff Mick Mulvaney confirmed that Trump blocked military aid to Ukraine to force Kiev to investigate his political rivals. Mulvaney called the quid pro quo exchange "absolutely appropriate" and that "we do that all the time with foreign policy." Mulvaney added: "I have news for everybody: Get over it. There's going to be political influence in foreign policy." Mulvaney also told reporters the funds were withheld in part because of a request to have Ukraine investigate unfounded allegations that foreign countries assisted Democrats in the 2016 election. Trump has repeatedly denied that there was a quid pro quo arrangement linking his demand for an investigation that could politically benefit him to the release of $391 million in military aid to Ukraine. (Washington Post / New York Times / Politico / CNBC)
    2/ Rudy Giuliani asked the State Department and the White House to grant a visa to the former Ukrainian official who Joe Biden had pushed to have removed when he was vice president. Career diplomat George Kent told congressional investigators in his closed-door testimony that around January 2019 Giuliani requested a visa for Viktor Shokin, who had been pushed out as Ukraine's top prosecutor in 2016 over concerns that he was not pursuing corruption cases. Giuliani, however, previously said he wanted to interview Shokin in person because the Ukrainian promised to reveal dirt on Democrats. (CNN)
    • 📌 Day 987: Giuliani personally gave Secretary of State Mike Pompeo a file of documents of unproven allegations against Biden on March 28th and claimed that he was told that the State Department would take up an investigation of those claims. State Department Inspector General Steve Linick gave Congress the 79-page packet Wednesday, which included nearly 20 pages of communications between State Department employees working to push back against the "fake narrative" that Giuliani was pushing. Linick told Congress that the department's office of legal counsel had provided the documents to him in May, which he gave to the FBI. The documents were in Trump Hotel folders and included "interview" notes Giuliani conducted with Viktor Shokin, the former General Prosecutor of Ukraine who was pushed out at the urging of Biden because he didn't prosecute corruption. (NBC News / CNN)
    3/ The Justice Department confirmed that Trump Jr. and former White House counsel Don McGahn were never called to testify in front of a grand jury as part of Robert Mueller's investigation. Chief Judge Beryl Howell of the U.S. District Court in Washington, D.C. said it was perplexing why Trump Jr. and McGahn were never subpoenaed to testify before the grand jury. "The reason is not that the individuals were insignificant to the investigation," Judge Howell wrote, "To the contrary, both of the non-testifying individuals named in paragraph four figured in key events examined in the Mueller Report." (Politico)
    • Instagram profiles originating in Russia since the beginning of the year have been building a network of accounts designed to look like political groups in swing states. The profiles are linked to the Internet Research Agency, the Kremlin-backed troll group indicted by the U.S. for its alleged interference in the 2016 US presidential election. (CNN)
    4/ Trump won't host next year's G7 summit at his Trump National Doral Resort after all. Instead, Trump said his administration "will begin the search for another site, including the possibility of Camp David, immediately." Trump abandoned his plan to host the summit at his private golf club after the decision alienated Republicans and became part of the impeachment inquiry. During calls with conservative allies over the weekend, Trump was told that Republicans are struggling to defend him. (Washington Post / Associated Press / Daily Beast / NBC News / CNN / New York Times / Politico)
    • Trump claimed he's the victim of the "phony emoluments clause," as he defended his previous decision to host next year's G7 summit at his Doral resort in Miami. (Politico / New York Times)
    5/ Trump insisted that he's "trying to get out of wars," but that "we may have to get in wars, too." Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, meanwhile, said "We prefer peace to war," but Trump is prepared to use military force if "needed." The confusing and conflicting statements come as Trump weighs a Pentagon plan to keep a small contingent of American troops in eastern Syria to combat the Islamic State, and block the advance of Syrian government and Russian forces into the region's oil fields. Defense Secretary Mark Esper said that nearly all of the troops ordered to leave northeastern Syria will move to western Iraq and conduct operations against the Islamic State extremist group from there. (Politico / CNBC / New York Times / Wall Street Journal)
    6/ Trump's top two picks to fill the Homeland Security Secretary job aren't eligible under federal law. Ken Cuccinelli, head of the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services, and Mark Morgan, the lead at Customs and Border Protection are Trump's two favorites for the job, but both men are serving on an acting basis and have not been confirmed by the Senate for a permanent role. The federal statute that governs vacancies states that acting officials in cabinet-level positions must either be next in line for a position or hold a Senate-confirmed position. (Politico / Wall Street Journal)
    7/ The first House Republican expressed openness to voting to impeach Trump on Friday. On Saturday, however, Rep. Francis Rooney announced his retirement. (Politico / Washington Post)
    poll/ 51% of Americans support Trump's impeachment and removal from office – up from 47% in September before the impeachment inquiry was announced. (Public Religion Research Institute)


    https://whatthefuckjusthappenedtoday.com/2019/10/22/day-1006/

    Day 1006: Direct line.

    1/ The top U.S. diplomat in Ukraine told House impeachment investigators that Trump held up security aid and refused a White House meeting with Ukraine's president until he agreed to investigate Tump's political rivals. Bill Taylor said he was told that "everything" Ukraine wanted — a one-on-one meeting between Trump and Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky and nearly $400 million in security aid — was dependent on publicly announcing an investigation into Burisma, the company that hired Joe Biden's son Hunter, and Ukraine's alleged involvement in the 2016 election. Taylor provided an "excruciatingly detailed" opening statement that described "how pervasive the [quid pro quo] efforts were" by Trump and his allies, which they have denied. People in the closed-door deposition described Taylor's testimony as a "very direct line" between American foreign policy and Trump's own political goals. (Politico / New York Times / Washington Post / CNN / Wall Street Journal)2/ Trump's effort to pressure Ukraine came as he was being urged to adopt a hostile view of that country by Putin and Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban, who reinforced Trump's perception of Ukraine as corrupt. Trump met with Orban on May 13th – and 10 days before a key meeting on Ukraine – over the objections of his national security team, who believed that Orban – an autocratic leader who has been ostracized by many of his peers in Europe – did not deserve the honor of an Oval Office visit. Trump then met on May 23rd with Rick Perry, Kurt Volker, and Gordon Sondland, who had returned from Zelensky's inauguration. They assured Trump that Zelensky was a reformer who deserved American support. Trump, however, claimed that Ukrainians were "terrible people" who "tried to take me down" during the 2016 presidential election. (New York Times / Washington Post)
    • 📌 Day 845: Trump praised Hungary's authoritarian prime minister Victor Orbán and called him "highly respected." "Probably like me a little bit controversial, but that's okay," Trump said, because "you've done a good job and you've kept your country safe." (Axios)
    • 📌 Day 1000: Mick Mulvaney put Gordon Sondland, Kurt Volker, and Energy Secretary Rick Perry in charge of managing the U.S.-Ukraine relationship instead of diplomats at the National Security Council and the State Department. The State Department's Ukraine expert, George Kent, testified during a closed-door hearing before the House Intelligence, Foreign Affairs, and Oversight committees that Mulvaney was responsible for stripping control of the country's relationship with Ukraine from those who had the most expertise. Kent also told lawmakers that he had been told by a supervisor to lie low after he raised complaints about Rudy Giuliani's efforts to undermine U.S. foreign policy in Ukraine. Current and former officials said Mulvaney met frequently with Sondland and that details of their discussions were kept from then-National Security Adviser John Bolton and other officials who were raising internal concerns about the hidden Ukraine agenda. Mulvaney was also the one who, at Trump's direction, placed a hold on nearly $400 million in aid to Ukraine leading up to Trump's July 25 phone call to pressure Zelensky to pursue Giuliani’s agenda against the Bidens. (Washington Post / CNN)
    3/ Trump compared the House impeachment inquiry to a "lynching." Trump has previously called the investigation a "coup," a "witch hunt" and a "fraud." (The Guardian / NBC News / ABC News / Washington Post)
    4/ Trump lectured reporters for more than 70 minutes during a cabinet meeting on Tuesday, during which he made at least 20 false or misleading statements. Trump lied about the number of times Obama unsuccessfully attempted to call Kim Jong Un, crowd sizes at his rallies, his position on the Iraq War, and the ongoing impeachment. He also claimed that he was personally responsible for the capture of Islamic State soldiers, complained that people were criticizing him for receiving "emoluments" from foreign governments, and insinuated that Adam Schiff gave information to the whistleblower, who raised concerns about his administration's actions toward Ukraine. Trump's press secretary, Stephanie Grisham, later tweeted: "I hope we see honest reporting from today's mtg." (CNN / Washington Post)
    poll/ 50% of Americans say Trump should be impeached and removed from office. Overall, 41% approve of Trump's handling of the presidency while 57% disapprove. (CNN)

    Notables.

    1. Trump privately floated the idea of replacing Mick Mulvaney with Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin or Kellyanne Conway. Trump has also tested the idea of replacing Mulvaney with Chris Liddell, a deputy chief of staff at the White House. For almost a year, Mulvaney has served as Trump's "acting" chief of staff because Trump has withheld the permanent title from him. (Bloomberg)
    2. The Pentagon began drafting plans for an abrupt withdrawal of U.S. forces from Afghanistan in case Trump orders an immediate withdrawal, like he did in Syria. The contingency plan includes the possibility that Trump orders all U.S. troops out of Afghanistan within weeks. (NBC News)
    3. Mitch McConnell will introduce his own resolution urging Trump to end the withdrawal of U.S. troops from Syria. Senate Republicans last week rejected a House resolution condemning Trump's move, saying they should do something more substantial. (Politico)
    4. More than a million children disappeared from Medicaid and the Children's Health Insurance Program between December 2017 and June 2019. Some state and federal officials claim the 3% drop in enrolled children is a success story, arguing that more Americans are getting coverage from employers. State officials, however, have increased paperwork requirements. (New York Times)
    5. The White House confirmed that it will cancel its subscriptions to the New York Times and the Washington Post. Trump appeared on Fox News' "Hannity," calling the Times "a fake newspaper" and saying that "we don't even want it in the White House anymore." Trump added: "We're going to probably terminate that and the Washington Post. They're fake." (Politico)
    6. The anonymous senior Trump administration official behind a 2018 New York Times op-ed that declared there was a "resistance" within the administration is writing a book. The book – "A Warning" – will be published Nov. 19th and will list the author as "Anonymous." (New York Times / Washington Post / ABC News)

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    You know Statler, after watching the last seven hundred episodes of One Piece, I think I've come to a conclusion.
    Statler: No you haven't.
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  19. #18279

    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaba Kaba Fruit View Post
    I don't understand the logic of VP picks. I would rather see the people vote in the VP instead of letting it fall to the choice of the president.
    I think we kinda did that back in the day which came with problems.


    The resultant method of electing the president and vice president, spelled out in Article II, Section 1, Clause 3, allocated to each state a number of electors equal to the combined total of its Senate and House of Representatives membership. Each elector was allowed to vote for two people for president (rather than for both president and vice president), but could not differentiate between their first and second choice for the presidency. The person receiving the greatest number of votes (provided that it was an absolute majority of the whole number of electors) would be president, while the individual who received the next largest number of votes became vice president. If there were a tie for first or for second place, or if no one won a majority of votes, the president and vice president would be selected by means of contingent elections protocols stated in the clause.[16][17]

    The emergence of political parties and nationally coordinated election campaigns during the 1790s (which the Constitution's framers had not contemplated) soon frustrated this original plan. In the election of 1796, FederalistJohn Adams won the presidency, but his bitter rival, Democratic-RepublicanThomas Jefferson came second and became vice president. Thus, the president and vice president were from opposing parties; and Jefferson used the vice presidency to frustrate the president's policies. Then, four years later, in the election of 1800, Jefferson, and fellow Democratic-Republican Aaron Burr each received 73 electoral votes. In the contingent election that followed, Jefferson finally won on the 36th ballot, and Burr became vice president. Afterward, the system was overhauled through the Twelfth Amendment in time to be used in the 1804 election.[18]
    If this system stuck around Trump would've wound up with Ted Cruz as his VP.
    Last edited by Green_vs_Red; October 22nd, 2019 at 10:36 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ubiq View Post
    I've often wondered about that myself; seems like being supported by people who only want you there so the world can end in fire (with you going to Hell in the process) would be somewhat off-putting
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  20. #18280
    The English Avenger Satsuki's Avatar
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    Default Re: American Politics thread: No Nazis Allowed

    The point of a VP is what it says on the tin. To support the President and to be the back-up President in case of death or illness.

    The reason candidates run with VPs in tow is because voting for a VP separately means the President might fear double-crossing or worse machinations coming from below, which I'm sure they deal with enough already. A President and Vice President have to work as a team, as much as the Pres. and his FLOTUS, and if they are two politicians of conflicting parties and standards/morals, then that's not going to happen.

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