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Thread: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

  1. #8601

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by DaphneDescends View Post
    I'm not talking about a metaphorical ending. One Piece is the name of the "treasure" on Laugh Tale and is a physical object. In the SBS when asked if the manga was really ending in five years, Oda specifically stated that the story of what exactly One Piece is will be concluded as a response. Not really sure what is contrived about distinguishing between the object that exists in the story of One Piece and the actual manga series itself. As zeltrax stated above I think he's just kind of backpedaling on what was a marketing attempt on his/Shueisha's part after thinking it through more carefully.
    I understand what you're saying that One Piece is an object/treasure, but the story of said object is not only its revelation and secrets, but also its consequences, repercussion and debate. The whole manga is about the One Piece since page 1 from chapter 1, and all of the series' trajectory and ending is also the "story of what One Piece is". The final war that will engulf the world is part of that same story since they're connected, so there's no need to separate one from another.

    It is contrived since this is such an ambiguous distinction that is completely unnecessary as an answer, especially when you think about the context that originated this question for the SBS. It implies that all of Oda's previous comments about OP ending in 5 years (which were very straighforward) were also secretly layering this sophisticated distinction without ever mentioning it, and that Oda was never actually saying that OP would end in 5 years.

    Of course, you're saying that this happened because Oda is backpedaling from his previous comments, and that's also why it sounds so weird, since Oda is finding a loophole to do this backpedaling. That's a possibility, but I don't think it's very likely.

    Btw, Greg just said that the Arashi interview happened after volume 97 was submitted for printing, so if Oda was already backpedalling when he answered the SBS, then he wouldn't have said that OP would end in 4 or 5 years in the interview.

  2. #8602

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    I don't think Oda is back-peddling; I think he Ben Kenobi'd the shit out of his past statements. "What I told you was true, from a certain point of view."
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  3. #8603

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by Vongola_Boss_XI View Post
    I don't think Oda is back-peddling; I think he Ben Kenobi'd the shit out of his past statements. "What I told you was true, from a certain point of view."
    Been saying he's doing something like this for a year and some change. It was interpreted as "you know more about Oda's story than Oda". Never forget lol

  4. #8604

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Just going to quote myself from the Vol 97 thread because it seems more relevant here:

    Quote Originally Posted by Gia Sado View Post
    Do people not understand how this doesn't make sense? Why are we supposed to find out what the World Government, the great big bad of the series, did during the Void Century AFTER they are defeated in the Final War? Why would we care about the origins of the Ancient Weapons, AFTER they've been used for whatever function necessary in the final war?

    Even One Piece has been directly referred to as the catalyst for truly starting said "Grand War". This is directly from Whitebeard's own mouth before he died. Roger himself found One Piece, and ONLY then did he realize he couldn't do anything.


    Essentially the point I'm making is, the main characters have to have a motivation, a reason for fighting the World Government. Oda has to entice his readers to feel invested in the same thing. You know those wonderful flashbacks he does virtually every single arc? Tha'ts because he sets the villains up with atrocities so we can feel anger or sadness towards them. The Void Century is virtually One Piece's biggest version of this narrative method, and it has to be used at Laugh Tale, because that is where it is meant to be revealed, just like many other questions.


    This doesn't come AFTER the conflict is over, it must come before. One Piece isn't just a treasure, its something the World Government fears. This is extremely important to understand.
    It's almost a logical fallacy to expect Laugh Tale, One Piece, The Void Century, The Will of D and the Ancient Weapons to be explored AFTER they are 100% likely to be central topics in the Final War. It almost doesn't make any sense from story perspective. I have, not once, read a mystery or a work of fiction that hides its most interesting plot points to the absolute most end of its story, unless you are trying to make the whole story one giant plot twist (aka, you've been reading or understanding everything wrong now go read it again). It doesn't make sense to not have payoff for a story like this however. "What is the protagonist going to do with this information? How will the story evolve?" Those would be the biggest questions I'd have.

    Not only that, but I do in fact expect the War to start prior to this, I just don't expect it to be about One Piece or the WG's national treasure or Joy Boy, etc. I expect it to be simpler at first: Revolutionaries or Alabasta declaring war and rivaling countries starting to escalate conflicts with each other. Maybe Blackbeard did actually find Pluton but he uses it for threats and subjugation, and maybe not its intended usage. But before Luffy becomes PK? I don't see it. It almost doesn't make any sense for the reasons I stated above.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    Also, I think the pure fact that Oda didn't just say "The Story is ending in 5 years", instead of "Luffy's Adventure" or the story to "know what One Piece is" is already interesting point of discussion because of Oda's past statements about "Luffy's Adventures"

    A few years ago, he called Amazon Lily, Impel Down and Marineford a "side-story", and yet it seems to be one of the most important events in the manga. So its pretty clear to me at least that he refers to this as a "side-story" because it does not advance the physical progress of Luffy's voyage to Laugh Tale and One Piece.

    So in that case, if you look back at this SBS question, you can 'sort of' make the same connection (assuming its what Oda is intending here) when he means "Luffy's Adventure" or "knowing what One Piece is", because after this point, Luffy's adventure would be over. The War that (presumably) would follow is not "Luffy's Adventure", its the fallout of the story reaching its conclusion DUE to Luffy's adventure.

    Idk, just my 2 cents on it, not that it means anything right now.
    Last edited by Gia Sado; September 16th, 2020 at 06:13 PM.

  5. #8605

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by andre View Post
    Sweet. Look forward to reading it! We need as much conversation-worthy stuff as possible as we get deeper into the story and the breaks keep coming! :D
    A brief preview for the Nico Robin post.

    First, please rewatch this scene in the anime.

    Now reread the scene in the manga.

    How are they different from each other?

    Also, how do you interpret Nico Robin’s smile in the final panel? Did Toei meet the mark?

    “Nico”

  6. #8606
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    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by gyuukarubi View Post
    A brief preview for the Nico Robin post.

    First, please rewatch this scene in the anime.

    Now reread the scene in the manga.

    How are they different from each other?

    Also, how do you interpret Nico Robin’s smile in the final panel? Did Toei meet the mark?

    “Nico”
    Just checking, does this have something to do with Greg's analysis? If not, I'll ask that this conversation be continued in a different.thread.



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  7. #8607

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    One interpretation I see to the final war thing is that if an actual world war starts after Wano, when the government decides to step in to take advantage of the dethroned yonkou, for example, but that war doesn't end yet. It just starts, as a merely terrotorial thing with no big ideology behind it.

    As the war escalates, the strawhats mostly ignore it and continue with their own quest, eventually reaching Laugh Tale. Then they learn about the Void Century and decide to get involved in the war, defending the New World from the government's attack. So what started as a marine vs yonkou war turns into the Final War to bring the Dawn of the world.

  8. #8608
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    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Well, the NW went 'it's free real estate' when Newgate died, so I suppose that's guaranteed to happen again at the very least.

  9. #8609

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Best part of these statements, that have gone through a game of online telephone, is that it allows each one reading it to see what they want to see. Like oh if i tilt it this way it plays in to what i think is likely. It's words through a translation filter interpreted by our biases. This is going to be such fun conversation bait, best/worst part is that even if a no doubts clarification is made you pretty much can't correct it retroactively once the ideas have taken root lol, so let the hot takes roll

  10. #8610

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    I hate the 5 years statement, but it is better than nakamate speculation, “who is going to die, because I don’t like them” speculation.
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  11. #8611

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    I, like some others, would take it as Luffy reaching Laugh Tale in 5 years time. Aftermath follow thenceforth.
    “When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always.”


  12. #8612
    POE WUN BGR Greg's Avatar
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    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    There's really no way to 'take' or 'interpret' it.

    Especially not the 'We'll find out OP but the story will go on'.

    Given the question, and how Oda definitively approaches it, there's no reason to question his intention and what he meant. The only remotely ambiguous aspect is his first, 'hai' response.

    So, Oda's confirming here (for the first time in the manga) that he intends to be finished in 5 years.

    And so long as you don't deify Oda, and have been a fan long enough, you shouldn't bat an eye.


    Oda said 5 years summer 2019.
    Now he's saying 5 years ***a year later*** *in the manga*. On TV, most recently, 4-5 years.

    Oda teased year of Sanji at Jump Festa.
    Didn't get to fully focus on him.

    Oda teased heading into Wano at Jump Festa.
    Didn't get to Wano that year, *or* the next.

    Oda teased a crew member dying the next year at Jump Festa.
    Didn't get there until *four years later*.

    Oda teased Blackbeard showing up at Jump Festa.
    Never showed up that year.

    Oda said OP is half over around vol.24.
    Then again around vol.50

    Oda envisioned OP as five years.
    Here we are at year 23.


    I uh... I dunno what more people are looking for?

    Oda statements are determined. There's zero reason to doubt the resolution behind them. But the man gets ideas, wants to do a proper job, and ends up expanding his story. Do people not recognize the pattern here? I think he can absolutely wrap in 5 (or are we holding him to 4 from last year's statement?) if he wants to. No question! But will he? Doubt it. That comes with the caveat, I don't think it will be as long as some optimists project. But OP ending on its 30th anniversary is where I'd be comfy placing my bet now.

  13. #8613

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg View Post
    Oda statements are determined. There's zero reason to doubt the resolution behind them. But the man gets ideas, wants to do a proper job, and ends up expanding his story. Do people not recognize the pattern here? I think he can absolutely wrap in 5 (or are we holding him to 4 from last year's statement?) if he wants to. No question! But will he? Doubt it. That comes with the caveat, I don't think it will be as long as some optimists project. But OP ending on its 30th anniversary is where I'd be comfy placing my bet now.
    Do you think "years" should be the proper metric regarding how much One Piece is left? I think we should rather be talking about chapters or volumes, especially when we take into account that Oda will probably be taking more breaks from now on. I'd say the ending should be aroung 1300-1400 chapters. If you're talking 7 years more, 39 chapters per year (or how many do you calculate?), it would be 1273 or so, right?

  14. #8614
    POE WUN BGR Greg's Avatar
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    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Always years.

    For all the reasons I listed above. There is no chapter or volume goal. Chapter counts are relative to the random factor of author's whims and Jump breaks. Hitting a chap or volume number is playing a 12-digit lottery. Hitting years is hitting a 4-digit lottery.

  15. #8615

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg View Post
    There's really no way to 'take' or 'interpret' it.
    Factually i'm sure you are right, but tell that to the internet. I'm calling it here, this will be making the rounds for years to come. The new pirate summit is upon us

  16. #8616

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    If wano lasted 30 chapters only, WCI another 25-30, maybe.

  17. #8617

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Before WCI I always paced the series as finishing "in about 10 years around chapter 1200." That was just always the breakdown that seemed about right given the arcs we knew that remained and how long Oda tends to take for a given location if its not a mega-arc and that's been my estimate for a loooong time now.

    After WCI ran for two years instead of one, I switched to about 1250-1300. And that still makes sense to me, and that's about 7 years off with 35-40 chapters a year. (Which is about what Oda has doing)

    Wano- 1 more year (counting the rest of this year, wrap up after fighting is done, but done before 2022)
    Misc-1 year mystery island, revolutionaries, poneglyph, side stuff, Vivi, Vegapunk, Shanks, odds and ends. Can all be included in other stuff
    Elbaf- 1 year
    Raftel- 1 year (includes flashback)
    War finale-3 years (includes year of fighting BB crew and epilogue)

    I still include mystery island in there because I think it'll be really weird if the guy that always wants to surprise the readers gave us a clear roadmap of everything years and years in advance, and we knew the entire route with no surprises since Punk Hazard, that seems wrong. I feel like there's still got to be a surprise in there. The final island before Laugh Tale, God Valley, or something else, I dunno. But SOMETHING, even if its just a quick 10 chapter thing like Amazon Lilly or something.


    Especially if the war actually starts BEFORE One Piece is found as Oda's statements are implying so some of those odds and ends get merged into the other stuff and a lot of those bits go on in the background without Luffy's direct involvement... I can see it being done in 5, especially if Elbaf or Ratel are actually really short, but 7 still seems about right to me. If Oda gets to year six I don't see him resisting getting to the 30th anniversary, even if that means only doing 20 chapters that year.
    Last edited by Robby; September 17th, 2020 at 02:26 PM.
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  18. #8618
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    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg View Post
    So, Oda's confirming here (for the first time in the manga) that he intends to be finished in 5 years.
    If that's the case then this is

    a) brutally honest

    and

    b) really, really cruel. Out of character cruel, warping my limited perception of Oda quite a bit.

    Like "people are literally crying right now due to the 5 years announcement, so let me double-down on it in the SBS "


    There is nothing comforting in his words the way you lay them before us, at least. Not saying you are wrong or that I personally even need some comforting phrases, but it's obvious what kind of role One Piece plays in a lot of people's lifes. He just shoudn't have said anything, really.


  19. #8619

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg View Post
    Always years.

    For all the reasons I listed above. There is no chapter or volume goal. Chapter counts are relative to the random factor of author's whims and Jump breaks. Hitting a chap or volume number is playing a 12-digit lottery. Hitting years is hitting a 4-digit lottery.
    I like this analogy lol.

  20. #8620

    Default Re: Greg: Teacher of SUPER " OP " course !

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg View Post
    Always years.

    For all the reasons I listed above. There is no chapter or volume goal. Chapter counts are relative to the random factor of author's whims and Jump breaks. Hitting a chap or volume number is playing a 12-digit lottery. Hitting years is hitting a 4-digit lottery.
    I'm not talking about an specific chapter or volume, but a range, for me I think that chapter counts are better because they don't depend on Jump breaks, while year counts do because there might be less chapters in a year because of those breaks.

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