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Thread: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

  1. #61

    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    I will sit out on nominations because I also want beyond good and evil to win this time.

    Mother 3-wise, I'll probably be posting thoughts on the last two chapters this weekend. Good way to close the month!
    Where is Kitsune anyway?

  2. #62
    MALKIOR THE DESTROYER KaizokuJinbei's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    I nominate Crusin' Exotica
    PSN: Ryuunaga, Nintendo Switch Friend ID: SW-1971-9767-4001, Steam: Malkior7, 3DS FC: 4167-5777-1464



  3. #63
    Charming Man Nobodyman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Just finished Mother 3

    ....*sniff*...I, uh...it's late and I need to sleep on this, so I'll tell you guys more about it tomorrow.

  4. #64
    Voici La Chévre Wagomu's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    I do urge all of you who have embarked on Mother 3 to get through the ending, because it is incredible.

    3DS FC: 0662-3589-2887
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  5. #65
    Charming Man Nobodyman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Okay, thoughts on Chapter 8

    Spoiler:
    -A limo? ...Well...okay then
    -And here's New Pork City! It's every bit as gaudy and vulgar as I imagined and it's got cardboard buildings to boot!
    -So playing a game me feel totally satisfied "in a sense". More commentary!
    -What the...Leder? Oh man, I forgot all about him! So he's the one who knew everything all along (hmm...strangely, it makes sense). So we've been living a post apocalyptic world this whole time? Hmm, kinda cliched, but I'll buy it.
    -Wow. I got EXTREMELY lucky in my fight against Fassad. I thought I had everything under control for a while, but then he started belting out the Brainshocks and PK Starstorms and...yeah, I was just not prepared for that. Eventually, only Boney was left standing with about 20 HP so I had resigned myself to defeat. Fassad prepares another Starstorm and....he's out of PP? I just attack again. Surely he'll do another regular attack or something that'll finish me off? Nope, just more PK attacks that he can't use since he's out of PP. So I revive everyone else and just WAIL on him until he's dead! WOOOOOOOOOO!!!!
    -Missed the fight with the Porky Statue. Oh well, maybe next time.
    -And now it's time for the Empire Pork Building. And as far as final dungeons go, it's pretty rockin'
    -Ah yeah! One last DCMC reunion! But they pulled the plug on them. BOOOOOOOOO!!!
    -Hippo room is fine. Nothing special
    -Bathroom floor, however, is much better
    -Men's Restroom Sign? Well, yeah, I kinda have to love that.
    -Whoa. I got killed by the Ultimate Chimera (didn't even realize it just kills you without even going to the battle screen). A shame that's you're never able to have an actual battle with it.
    -Magypsy Floor. Wait, so Fassad was a Magypsy the whole time?!
    -Construction floor. As mean as it is, I just love ramming into the construction workers and using them as bridges.
    -Boa Transistor. Yes.
    -Laboratory floor. Ooh, diverging paths, eth?
    -And there's the full-fledged Mecha Lion and it...somehow seems weaker.
    -What?! Those robots can kill in one hit?! What the...
    -People (and animals) being brainwashed in tubes full of green liquid. That is both disturbing and infuriating.
    -Mini-games were...whatever. Only had to redo the second one once.
    -Alright, made it to the top floor and it's finally time to face off against Porky. And...honestly, none of the final bosses really gave me that much trouble. They were challenging, but I was never on the ropes like with previous bosses throughout the game. But I guess it's fair enough since we're at the point of no return.
    -And, personality-wise, Porky proves himself to be one of the most hateable characters in any game I've played.
    -Okay, I cheered when DCMC ran in and took care of the rest of the Porky bots.
    -So Porky's a weird cryogenically preserved old man now. Eww.
    -Hey! There's Flint!
    -And now we go through cave, the final area in the game. Not much to say except that it's creepy as hell (and I love that sound it makes when you walk on the purple stuff).
    -I hate to say it, but I totally forgot what that doorknob was.
    -And we face off against Porky one last time. As I said before, he didn't give me too much trouble.
    -So now Porky's trapped in that orb thing forever. Good. Stay there and rot you disgusting pig.
    -Alright, time to finally face off against Claus one last time and....Oh man. Just...oh man, this scene.
    -Honestly, this whole final battle is magnificently crafted. You don't even fight Claus, you just need to hold out as Hinawa calls out to him. First first 5-10 I'm just trying to survive, wondering if there's anything else I can do (I tried reviving Kumatora and Duster to no effect) and just hoping the next call out by Hinawa will be the last one.
    -Then we get to the flashback and...oh man *sobs* oh c'mon. I'm not made of stone! God that was beautiful.
    -And it looks like Claus is finally coming to his senses. He takes off his helmet and...there he is. My brother. My brother who I love so much has finally come back to me.
    -A lightning bolt? What?
    -"Claus took mortal damage". Well, that's okay, I'll just heal him or give him a Cup of Lifenoodles and it'll be fine....right?
    -......No.......No No No NO NO NO! You can't do that! You can't FUCKING do that! GODDAMMIT! You can't do this to us! You can't take away Hinawa AND Claus! *inhales* Okay, okay, maybe after I pull the Seventh Needle the Dragon and Apocalyptic stuff (great scene btw) will revive him...............GODDAMMIT! What the fuck is this?! We were supposed to save him! (and don't give me any of that "We save his soul" crap!). AAAAAAAAAAGGGHHHHH!!! This is supposed to be a fun adventure game! God! How is it that Shadow of the Colossus brings back Agro, but these guys, they just went and....AAAAAAAAAHHHH!!!
    -*sigh* Anyway, the Dragon awakens, the world gets torn apart and....the screen goes blank.......huh?
    -Oh wait, I can move the END? around and...people are talking? Characters from the game? Well, I can't see them, but they're talking and...I guess everything worked out? Peace has come to land? Well, that's great, but...CLAUS STILL DIED!
    -Well, I dunno. They did say that "everyone was alive" and that there was a "miracle" so...I don't know. Maybe he was resurrected?
    -Credits Roll. End Screen and that's the end of the game.

    Well, no matter how you look at it, that was one hell of a final chapter. What really throws me off is just how dramatic it got. The starts with one tragedy and then ends with another. And, honestly, I think this was even more emotional than the first chapter. And of course we get that insane Evangelion-esque ending, which definitely leaves a lot room for interpretation. But...I'm just still so bummed that Claus died.

    I'll post my thoughts on the whole game later today.

  6. #66

    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Yeah. That ending messed me up for weeks

  7. #67
    Hunter X Hunter X Hunter JarmenKell's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    I feel like nominating a Harvest Moon/Rune Factory/Story of Seasons/Farm Story. Now the only problem is which one...

  8. #68
    Charming Man Nobodyman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    All right, my thoughts on Mother 3 as a whole

    Spoiler:
    So there are three games in the Mother franchise and this is the second one I've played and beaten. The first one I've played being Earthbound/Mother 2, and the one I have not played being Mother 1 (and, from what I've heard, I'm not missing much). So as far as how Mother 3 stands as a Mother game, I really only have Earthbound to compare it with. So with that out of the way...

    Well, what can I say? As many people have already said, it's a fantastic game, totally worthy of its predecessor. Not only does it have the same engaging humor, art design, and gameplay of Earthbound, but it's also much more experimental and emotionally deep. If Earthbound was an idiosyncratic RPG about kids on a larger than life adventure, than Mother 3 is an idiosyncratic RPG about a diverse group of people who go on an emotional journey of redemption.

    So with that being said, and I'm sure I might make a few enemies here, I don't think I like it as much as Earthbound. Part of this is due to personal preference and part of it is because I do think, structurally, it's a bit iffy in a few noticeable places. I know this game has a troubled production history in that they originally wanted to release it on the N64 and...I guess that shows? Apparently they wanted to implement even more into the game and maybe it was due to the limits of the GBA hardware that they couldn't, but yeah, it really does feel kind of unfinished.

    What do I mean by all that? Well, let's get started with my thoughts on the characters:

    Lucas - Awesome main character. As much as I liked Ness, Lucas got me much more emotionally involved in his plight and nearly moved me to tears at the end. He's a kindhearted boy who has gone through a tragedy that's practically impossible not to sympathize with. And of course his kind nature is reflected in his PK techniques, almost all of which are recovery and assist spells (rather unusual for an RPG protagonist). Honestly, I never thought much of him in Super Smash Bros Brawl, but from now on I'll see him in a whole new light (and yes, I'll definitely download him for SSB Wii U).

    Boney - Your faithful dog. Obviously not a very complex character, but he really doesn't need to be anything more. Honestly, he deserves to be remembered as one of the great video game pets/sidekicks. He only has one skill, he can only equip two items (well, three at the end), and he's a dog living in a world of men and monsters, but he still stands by you throughout all of it, out of nothing but sheer motherfucking loyalty. Man's best friend indeed.

    Duster - Another character you just have to love. At first he's a thief in training who must suffer the scorn of his father, but then he konks his head and becomes the bassist for the famous DCMC band, whom he eventually must give a tearful goodbye to. Perhaps not as deep a character as Lucas, but there's definitely enough material here to get invested in the character. And I'm not sure what it is, but there's just something inherently likeable about him. Maybe it's that awesome mustache-goatee combo.

    Kumatora - I know Noqanky is gonna hate me for this, but...I really think they dropped the ball with Kumatora. Don't get me wrong, she starts out fine as the spunky lost princess of Osohe who can also do kickass magic, but then they never really do anything with her. We don't learn anything about her or her past, she doesn't go through any unique personal adventures like Duster, and even her status as a princess never really comes into play. Thinking back, I'm not even sure what her motivation was. I think she was looking for that egg in Osohe Castle and then just...decided to help Lucas because it was the right thing to do. In a less story-driven game I guess this would be fine, but I just expected more from this game.

    Salsa - I really liked playing as Salsa. A cute character with a simple motivation that you can sympathize with. So how come they just dropped him after the Second Needle in Chapter 7? We have him all throughout Chapter 3, we have a brief re-encounter in Chapter 7, and....that's it. He apparently plays no real role in the overarching story, so what gives? Like I said, I enjoyed playing as him, but looking at the game as a whole he just seems like a filler character. And you could say that the point of Salsa's story is more to build up and make us hate Fassad, but even he doesn't appear that often after this. I think we see him once or twice in Chapters 4 and 5 and then we have two boss battles with him (and of course the characters battling him don't have nearly as big an emotional connection to him as Salsa), but that's it. I don't know. I guess I was hoping I'd get this monkey strong enough that, one day, he himself could send Fassad flying.

    Flint - I really like Flint. Again, it's easy sympathize with what he and his family have gone through. Which is why it's such a shame that we see so very little of him after the first chapter and never get to play as him again. At least he had that badass moment in the final battle against Claus.

    So yeah, this game is about 3, maybe 4, for 6 in the character department, and...yeah, that really is probably by biggest complaint about how the story was told, because they pretty much knock it out of the park with everything else. I mean, the overall plot and structure is solid. The first three chapters set everything up and introduce the characters (one of whom will be ultimately inconsequential to the overall story). Then in the fourth chapter we get some escalating action, Lucas goes off on his adventure, and the party is slowly assembled, which continues into Chapter 5. We then get a pleasant and brief chapter that reinforces the theme of the story and then we get the hulking seventh chapter where we travel the world and see many crazy sights as we work to prevent a global catastrophe. And then everything comes to a dramatic emotional conclusion in Chapter 8. On the whole, this is really solid stuff, but...I just wish some of the individual parts had been implemented better, particularly with Kumatora and Salsa. Heck, if they had a party-swapping system, they could have brought along both Salsa AND Flint. But maybe they just couldn't due to software limitations. But that's when you have to pick and choose. If you have the capability to put more in the game, then give more to the characters who seem to fall a bit short of their potential. If you don't have room, then it may not be unwise to omit them or at least downplay them so the player doesn't expect too much. Anyway, moving on.

    Another issue I have is, and I know this is hella subjective, but I don't think the imagination is as...umm...imaginative in this game. There's plenty of crazy ideas and visuals to be sure, but Earthbound was just insane in the number of inventive and unique visuals and concepts the designers had to show to us. In Earthbound you spent pretty much the entire game going from one place to the next, each having a different atmosphere and a new gameplay concept. In Mother 3, you spend a good chunk of the game in Tazmily. Heck, even a good number of the ideas in Mother 3 are recycled from Earthbound, which I suppose isn't totally fair since I'm sure Mother 2 recycled some concepts from the first Mother and if I played Mother 3 first I'm sure the recycled ideas would seem fresh and new to me. And maybe it's also true that I'm looking at Earthbound through rose-tinted glasses, but I do know that when I was going on that boat through the hall of memorabilia from Mother 1 and 2, it just brought back so many fond memories of all the wonderful sights and experiences I had while playing that game. So, I don't know. Fair or not, Earthbound left a bigger impression on me in the imagination department. And yes, you could also say that imagination is more besides the point of Mother 3. That it's a more introspective game about the soul and emotion of the characters and what their families and the town mean to them. And that leads me to my next point about personal preference.

    I'll just come out and say it, the game is too much for me during the two emotional peaks of the story, and those who have completed the game know which two I'm talking about. Don't get me wrong, it hasn't destroyed my life or anything. I wasn't bawling my eyes out into a pillow (in fact, I think I'm about over the whole Claus thing now), but still....it hurt, man. And you can go ahead and dismiss me as an overemotional wuss who can't handle the hard truths of reality, and maybe that's true to a certain extent, but we all have our baggage and I must deal with mine in turn. The point is, I play video games to have fun, but sometimes it's not as simple as that. We've long since reached the point where games can have a story that's just as engrossing as in any other media, and with that comes all styles and tones of storytelling. As for me, yes, I usually prefer more upbeat stories that make me feel good, where things work out and people get what they deserve. But I also understand bleakness and tragedy have their place in storytelling; it's part of the human condition after all. And I can totally accept a sad or tragic event if it serves the story. Ultimately, what really matters is how well the story is told. Those two scenes in Mother 3 however, they're just....emotionally taxing, and I'm not sure that's always a good thing. Now I will say that, for the story the writers wanted to tell, Hinawa's death absolutely was necessary, but I'm not so sure about Claus. It seems a strangely dismal note to leave off on, especially when the game apparently expects us to celebrate just a few minutes later during the ending sequence (though, again, I suppose that's left up to interpretation). So maybe it's just me or maybe they did go a little too far. Anyway, I think I've rambled enough, so I'll conclude by saying, yes, it's true I tend to prefer the joyful over the somber, but I respect craft above all else.

    And that's why I absolutely respect this game. Despite my personal feelings and some oversights with the characters, this really is a very good game and I really enjoyed playing it. The gameplay is great, the art design is great, the characters (for the most part) are great, the story is great, and the Mother series continues to have one of the best sense of humor I've seen in any video game.

    And, of course, this is the game that embodies and explores the Mother concept probably better than any of the other games. I believe the creator of Mother once said something to effect of, Mother is about a kid who goes on an adventure and, no matter what situation he may face, can always go home and rely on his mother to be there for him. And while that's a comforting concept, the actual Mothers in 1 and 2 never really had a big role to play story-wise. Now in Mother 3, not only are the Mother (and Father) brought to the forefront, but the Mother actually dies. With this development, one would think that Mother 3 has veered from the previously stated concept, but, in fact, it solidifies more than the other two games. By sacrificing her life for her sons, Hinawa has proven the absolute love and devotion of a Mother. Not only that, her presence lingers for both Lucas and the player throughout the game, acting as a guiding force even after she's gone. And it is ultimately Hinawa who saves Claus in the end. She's there for her children even in the afterlife.

    Previously I called this game comparatively unimaginative and maybe that's not fair. But what it lacks in imagination it definitely makes up for in ambition. Sometimes that ambition doesn't pay off, at least in my eyes, but for the most part it succeeds amazingly well and at the very least I have to respect that ambition.

    So to anyone who hasn't played this game, do I recommend it? Absolutely. Except I would recommend playing Mother 2/Earthbound first, both for story purposes and to see if it's a game you even like before, well, going through the emotional hell I and so many other people have gone through.

    Farewell, Mother. Until we meet again.


  9. #69

    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    I actually find some things you said in there more flammably disagreeable to me than the ones you thought I'd hate you for, though those also bother me, but I'll expand on those situations later this weekend when I finish the game myself and can pull more resources.

    And no, you're not the first one or the last one to like Earthbound more than Mother 3, a lot of people do. The two games are so different and interesting individually that from what I see they have a fairly equal amount of following within the series's fanbase.

  10. #70
    Discovered Stowaway fedcom's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    I nominate Jet Set Radio
    NNID: julsjacket

  11. #71

    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Lol, weekend ended and I have not finished the game. Splatoon kind of took over my life <_<

    So I'll just go ahead and post closing thoughts on the game, respond to some stuff as well. Spoilers everywhere of course, be warned.

    Spoiler:

    The big thing to keep in mind is that while comparisons to Earthbound are a fantastic thing to do, given it helps you appreciate what each game is all about and how they function as members of the same series, it is unfair to qualitatively compare them. I think in every respect they are both fantastic games, with their minor flaws and unique attributes, and in the end the question of which one is "best" is more of a question of what each individual likes more.

    Earthbound is indeed about the journey and the experience. Going everywhere braving everything and living everything while knowing mom and dad are supporting you from where they are and you can always just go back and eat some Steak. So it's like being a kid, really, having that safety net from your parents to feel comfortable in going out and living the world which is full of weird shit, a lot of scary, terrifying stuff, but that you just pull through because you can.
    In that sense, the Earthbound immersion is almost fully about you, and what you experience. Even particular bits of genius, like the Dalaam moment with Poo and the end fight, are all about how you react to things and how YOU, the player, did it in the end. And that makes the game awesome.

    Mother 3 is an entirely different monster. Its immersion is completely different, and its themes, while having some similarities, are also much more extensive and far-reaching. This one isn't about you, but about the world. Yes, your experiences and your reactions matter, but not as much as how the world changes around you. And for that purpose, the story is much more elaborate, and a lot of the situations are less about the fun of the adventure and more about the experience the developers want you to have to shape your thoughts about the situations presented by the story.
    I've seen a number of people complain about the multiple characters making the game disjointed, but that's the thing. Not being Lucas all the time hammers the point that it's not about you entirely, it's about Tazmily and those around you. And Tazmily, we come to learn, is a metaphor for what's left of humanity.
    It also completely moves away from the idea of home is safe, go have fun outside exploring. Not this game, in this one the darkness hits home. The changes being made in the world by others directly damage the safety of your home. Hinawa dies as a result of change. Claus's situation is a result of that change. Tazmily changes for the worst because of that, relationships eroding and corruption being born. And that's because, I believe, the point in this game brings everything back a lot more to Mother not being just mom at home, but the world around you. You are a product of the world you are in. And what goes on in it will affect you.
    And that's a really obvious theme. Nature is completely corrupted everywhere in the game. The game functions more as a sci-fi satire of modern life than anything else really. Happy boxes mocking our materialist emptyness, chimeras mocking the idea that us humans need to be meddling in nature with our technology to make it better ... it's all so dark. Also notice how fantastic the animals are in this game. There's so many of them and they shine stupendously, from save frogs to advice sparrows to ants to mole crickets and even giant Dragos. This game is placing you in a stature of equality with nature, and Porky corrupting that becomes a glaring issue.

    Now I'm getting to the character situation. First of all, what I want to mention is that looking at something in the game that didn't seem right to you shouldn't lead to the conclusion of "software limitations?" particularly because this is a game where they are likely to shape things in order to tunnel your experience in certain ways. The thing about game design sometimes, at least with RPGs like this one, is that it's not about giving the player all the options they could possibly have because they'll want them, but to give just as much as you think, as a developer, will be necessary for the point to be precisely across.
    So, for example, Salsa and Flint not participating in the majority is clearly, obviously, deliberate. Salsa is not a main character for you to make uber and rock into a bunch of dangerous situations while in your party. Salsa's story is strictly and mainly about the monkey and how much he goes through for his love monkey. There is no reason to expect salsa to give a shit about thunder tower, or new pork city, or needles. Why? It's a fucking monkey. The character was designed to be weak, and to be helpless, because not only does it pit you into a contest of whether you hate fassad more than anything else in the world, but it also brings home the point of how helpless this poor little animal is, and how EVEN THEN, it is capable of demonstrating tremendous spirit and courage and turning the tables even on the ultimate chimera.
    Same goes for Flint. Hinawa's death is seen by a lot of people as "oh man, this game just really wants to punch you in the gut with all the unnecessary fridging and drama" but ... MAYBE, just ... MAYBE, there's a point to it? And what I've come to notice in this playthrough more than others is that this game is one of the greatest discussions on mortality and even immortality and how we as humans respond to it. I've spoken before how there's a lot to say about Claus's perceived strength and how he responds to Hinawa's death, compared to Lucas, who was always seen as the weak one. Flint is another special case, in that he responded to the death pretty pretty badly. Everyone in Tazmily even tells Lucas about it ... tell your dad to just give it up, to stop, to go home. Flint was a pillar of Tazmily, made obvious by his involvement in saving Lighter and Fuel, and after Hinawa's death and failing to find Claus he becomes a ghost. That's something that's necessary for the storytelling, and it's necessary for Lucas's journey as a character. And I find it unfair to detract points from the game because it didn't let you walk around with all these characters so you could level them up and bond with them. This isn't a pokemon or band of misfits journey.
    Before I get to other things I want to talk about, let me talk about why I like Kumatora. Kumatora and Osohe are some of the more glossed over aspects of this world, and for good reason: they're the leftovers of a culture and history that no longer exists. As a result, there was no reason for Kumatora's past to have much of a role in the story or in her character growth as it just had no role in the story, since Osohe's past just has no more presence. So yes, perhaps she does get the short end when it comes to development. However, there's still plenty of things about the character all over the place throughout the story that make her shine tremendously, such as her relationship with Salsa and her dedication to the Duster situation in Tittiboo. She is also interesting to me as a character who was raised by the Magypsies, who while being genderless are still super feminine, and meanwhile Kumatora went the opposite way and became rather boyish. And it's kind of awesome to have a character with that history be so awesome, strong, and capable, much in the same way it's awesome Duster has a leg disability that hardly gets mentioned and is never treated like a handicap. In that sense Boney for me is always a weird fourth and I'm not sure what was the thinking behind him being so much more prevalent than, say, king. However, Boney's moments in the story are HILARIOUS and I like how there's a meta awareness to how straight a character he is and how smart as a whole. Again, keeping nature on equal footing with humans.
    And actually, this whole character thing is something I WILL fault Earthbound for. Paula is likable as a character, but it bothers me how the extent of her role is praying for help and knowing that things are just this way because they are and jeff and poo will help because they will. I know I know, it has its purpose in Earthbound, but when you have this and then you play Mother 3, where the girl character rocks and the support characters rock and everyone just rocks so hard and has so much personality ... yea, it's not hard to fall in love with them. All of them.

    OK, now the main thing I want to address, the thing that was most glaring to me in this playthrough, was something I mentioned above, regarding this game being a fantastic discussion on mortality. Namely because we're shown completely different takes on responses to immortality.
    On one hand you have six of the magypsies. Now, I know there's some people who look at the magypsies and don't take them seriously or deem them a tasteless joke or caricatures. I have no idea why, seeing how in this entire world of Mother 3 they're the creatures that are depicted pretty much the best. Mannerism and all, they're extremely light beings. They've lived for so long that they're completely unfazed by nearly everything, even death. And there's a lot of beauty to that. There's a lot of beauty to the fact that beings so perfect and free and light are depicted as a cross of male and female. Like Itoi says, like many things in this game they're a cross of two things, and in this case it's a cross of two genders. And we can even look at them individually as demonstrations of what's good in the world. Phrygia is terrible at the beginning, but when it's her turn its her attention to detail that helps you proceed with the journey. Lydia's generosity to ANYONE leads to a reformed pig mask, which is huge considering THEY'RE CHEMICALLY BRAINWASHED by Porky. In the end though, my favorite is still Doria because she's just soo great, such an awesome person, and her lines when reacting to the different chimeras are just awesome.
    Anyway, then on the other hand we have Fassad and Porky. These two saw immortality in the face. Fassad and Porky both share the fact that upon seeing the greater context of everything, their only conclusion was to just lose sight of everything entirely and treat the mortal, doomed world as a playground and ... fuck, might as well destroy it. And the creepy thing is, they're not wrong. There's a line by Leder that I find very deep, where he says that "everyone knew in the back of their minds that it would happen someday, until it actually did happen" in regards to the destruction of the world. And then between that and the whole situation with the needles, it leads to this beautiful analysis of how humanity can respond to imminent finality and mortality. Even then claymen can be linked to this ... isn't it uncomfortable to see these creatures "live" as tools and then just ... melt into nothingness when deemed useless? I visited the factory after it was closer and ... it felt disturbing but ... were they really alive?
    But back to responses to mortality, we already have an idea of how the main cast responds to the situation given Hinawa. Now, these immortal beings ... the Magypsies respond to death with acceptance of the beauty they lived in and the beauty and romance of how they leave. Fassad and Porky took finality to absurdist means. If everything is ending, then what really is the meaning of it all? Why not treat the world like a playground, make it yours, and when you're bored just end it because might as well, there's NO OTHER POSSIBLE CONCLUSION. And what's creepier even still is that while Fassad was, in the end, able to accept his death with the knowledge it would end for everyone else and it was all futile ... Porky just could not deal with that shit. And it ties back to Earthbound on how much of a coward he was, how much fear that poor creature has in that wretched little heart that it constantly feigns strength and calls for attention and wants to be noticed and admired and loved, but is SO FUCKING AFRAID of anything ending that ... it led to placing himself in the situation where the only thing he has is himself as he sees literally everything else but himself end. It's tough stuff, and I cannot stress enough how fascinating of a presentation it is to me. I think it's the villains that keep me loving the Mother series, because I don't think many other games have such layered villains where you can clearly see their breaking point and the moment where that one weakness completely fucked them over and sent them spiraling into darkness.
    Lastly, regarding Claus, I want to bring up how accepting Lucas and Flint are of his death. There's no rage from Flint. No anger, and seemingly only a sense of calm and relief that flows over him. There is also the line from Hinawa that always makes me bawl like a mofo ... "you must be tired." That is such a strong line to me, because it frames just how much Claus was destroyed by Hinawa's death and the ensuing situation. Psychologically it's jarring to even think or imagine what Claus had to go through and what that brave, confident little boy from the beginning was left as, essentially a shell. Even when the needles he pulled were noticed, the magypsies commented on how there was no feeling of goodwill or evil, just, nothing. And him being so broken, and Hinawa acknowledging how tired he must be, it makes the final fight such an emotional ordeal. Could he have lived? I think so. But as it is, with him choosing to die and rest, I think the story works just as well and I cannot feel towards his death the anger and frustration caused by Hinawa's.

    Ok, I guess I wound up talking a lot about the themes that this game tickles in my brain, and that's not even going over all the little details and nuggets of awesome. The music, the writing, the absurd things like oxygen tanks and bird fishing, the awesome things like the Porky bots fight concluding with DCMC crashing (and presumably mambo'ing) the scene, the bit at the end where people say it's fine and go out and enjoy the world ("world, be nice to [name]!") and they thank you, Osohe sinking into the ground demonstating a clean slate away from past history and culture ... There is just so much joy and fun and grief and love and depth to find all over this game. It's a taxing game, and it takes a while, obviously since I'm still not fully done with my playthrough, but every bit of it is so layered and deep and fun that I can't help but want to play this game on a constant loop. And it is my wish, my genuine hope, that one day this game is something we can all grab, take a look at, and analyze intellectually because there is just so much going on. Awesome, awesome, awesome game.


    Holy pork I need to sleep @_@
    Last edited by Noqanky; June 1st, 2015 at 03:23 AM.

  12. #72
    Charming Man Nobodyman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    @Noqanky: That was a very good read. You made a lot of excellent points, though I still stand by many of my opinions about the game. And again, personally, I just prefer the more lighthearted Earthbound.

    Great analysis though.

    And not for nothing, but are we ever going to vote on the next game?

  13. #73
    Voici La Chévre Wagomu's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Hey there, everyone.

    KitsuneInferno has been busy being a real human being and junk, so I'm taking up the responsibility of maintaining these threads. It's June already, so it's a little late to start voting, but here's what we're going to do:

    Nominations will be open for one more day

    All nominations mentioned before are valid and will be considered. Nomination will continue until sometime around 2-3AM EST tomorrow or until we have too many nominations which I doubt will be the case). Once the nominations are taken care of, then we can move on to voting.

    Voting will be open through the end of the week, through June 7th

    The nominating and voting processes are being expedited, since we've fallen a little behind.

    In order to align the thread with the monthly schedule, the next month's thread will start at the beginning of July, while this coming one will stay open alongside it for a week. The overlap may be a little confusing, but it will give each game equal time for discussion.

    Long story short, y'all should get nominating, since you've got 24 hours left. Remember, folks, one nomination per person!

    Current nominations:

    Beyond Good and Evil (Purple Hermit)
    Paper Mario (Galaxy 9000)
    Breath of Fire (Nobodyman)
    Cruisin' Exotica (KaizokuJinbei)
    Jet Set Radio (Fedcom)

    JarmenKell, you're going to have to specify a game if you want your nomination considered.

    3DS FC: 0662-3589-2887
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  14. #74
    Discovered Stowaway Panekai's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    We do a link to the past yet?

    If we did I nominate donkey kong country.

    NNID: Panekai

  15. #75

    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Would DKC be long enough for a month? Like, at least personally I can knock it out in like 90-120 minutes, if not less.

    Maybe make it the DKC trilogy?

    Idk, just thinking outloud.

  16. #76
    Discovered Stowaway Mickamott's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    How 'bout a race to see who can beat Mike Tyson first, if anyone at all??? Not me of course. I have a save state at the beginning of that match and every now and then I think "maybe I can do it this time" and then I get punched in the face.

    Nomination is.... Hmmmm.... let's just say... Moe.

    Serious nomination is Final Fantasy IV.

    The one with Cecil and Kain.

    3DS: 1993-7490-6080 NNID: Mickamott PSN: Mickamott

  17. #77
    Hunter X Hunter X Hunter JarmenKell's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Harvest Moon 64 then.

  18. #78
    Voici La Chévre Wagomu's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Just bumping this to remind you that nominations end tonight at 2AM EST

    Panekai, A Link To The Past was done before in the 2012 run of this series. If you want that to be your nom, I'll allow it, but I'll give the choice back to you (if you don't get back in time, I'll make that your nom).

    Current nominations:

    Beyond Good and Evil (Purple Hermit)
    Paper Mario (Galaxy 9000)
    Breath of Fire (Nobodyman)
    Cruisin' Exotica (KaizokuJinbei)
    Jet Set Radio (Fedcom)
    Final Fantasy IV (Mickamott)
    Harvest Moon 64 (JarmenKell)

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  19. #79

    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    just to FORCE me to play it...
    Donkey Kong Country 3.

    For the life if me, I do not have the drive to finish that game all the way through so...yeah. Besides, no one really talks about that game so it would be interesting to see why it isn't nearly as close to perfection as DKC2.

  20. #80
    Discovered Stowaway Panekai's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Since link to the past was done already Donkey Kong Country it is. The whole trilogy if possible, those being so short. If not, just the first one.

    NNID: Panekai

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