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Thread: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

  1. #21
    I'm a bad boy! ;) Nitwit's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Can I also make my own game list?


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  2. #22
    Charming Man Nobodyman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    So I've been (slowly) playing this game over the last few days. Thoughts so far:

    Spoiler:
    The first hour or so of the game is pretty standard. It's the same Earthbound style of gameplay, plus a few extra bells and whistles, and I guess the game just wants to get the player acclimated to that, which is fair enough. It's also interesting how you've actually been in control of Flint most of the time, even though Lucas is supposedly the main character. Also funny how playable characters only talk when they're not in your party (seems like a meta joke).

    Also, playing on a computer.......ugh. This is why I like to play games the way they were meant to be played. It's not insufferable, but it's so annoying having to remember which buttons do which and not having them readily pressable. I so wish this game will get an official NA release eventually.

    But now for the thing I'm sure you all want to hear:

    AAAAAAAAGGGGGHHHHH!!! They killed Hinawa!

    Man, just...seriously sad. This is just a huge shift from Earthbound/Mother 2, which was pretty much a fun goofy adventure from beginning (at least I can't remember any major emotional moments like that). This game has teeth...I mean...ah, dammit.

    Well, with an emotional hook like that I pretty much have to keep playing.

  3. #23

    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    When you think Luigi is the unluckiest guy in Nintendoverse.

  4. #24

    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Oh man. Missed this thread completely.

    Gonna definately jump on board with this. Here's my own little conditions for myself to make playing it a little more tolerable.
    -I'm using a cheat code to avoid using the whole combo system altogether. I prefered the more quick, hit/crit system from Earthbound and I feel the combo thing doesn't really add much aside from dividing overall damage that I could be doing. Plus it doesn't make the game much easier. Also heard there is a bit of an input lag in the emulator, but I've never noticed it much myself. I just don't care much for the rhythm based combo thing.

    Aside that, looking forward to playing this again. It's up there with my top 5 games, and unlike everything in that list... this one I mainly like for the art, setting, music and flavor text more than the actual main story or gameplay. Not to say the main story is bad. I just had more of a blast interacting with the world and experiencing all the trippy sequences during the plot.

  5. #25

    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Just went through Chapter one.

    Thoughts below! Spoilers, of course ... spoilers, everywhere.
    Spoiler:

    So, naturally a bunch of thoughts outlined from the moment I started.
    The naming returns from Earthbound and is as lovely as ever, and I particularly love the music in this one. What I also like though, is the focus on the family from the get-go. There's no four meant to save the world, no "name your best friend" or any of those shenanigans. The game explicitely tell you who the characters are and what their personalities are. Definitely more of a story sort of game just from there.
    Same goes for the way the game is introduced. The beginning is almost pretty much a tutorial, with it establishing Lucas as the main character even if he doesn't necessarily seem the most heroic (and you won't be using him for a while.) Also at this part it becomes obvious how much the sprite work in these games has evolved, since there's sooooo much emotion and movement and character in how the sprites move, like when Alec implies Lucas is weak and you see the sweat on him. Another little touch of course is the fact you can talk to the animals and they say phenomenal things ("what the pig next to me says worries me", and next to that pig the pig says "don't worry") ... I'll talk more about this later because there's more brilliant ones later on.
    The touch of nature is also immediately more obvious. Little touches I like are stepping outside from home and a flash of sunlight greeting you while awesome music plays in the background and you come out into the most possibly open environment. The dragos are also a nice touch being so intimidating but in the end just plain, simple natural creatures that live with their families and interact with you.
    How the game goes about teaching you stuff is also something I love. The series as a whole is super-self aware but even with that the little touches are really notable. I'm a fan of Alec going "Imagine a thing called a B button" while teaching you how to dash. Later on there's another one I also like, which is Mapson telling you to "let your right index finger make a wish" to then later explain he means to press R. The first fight is also really amusing as a whole, with the mole cricket, and the little touch of it wanting to prove itself to be strong only to be easily squished unintentionally by Hinawa. He'll be fine I'm sure.
    Oh, and before I move on, I like the little touches of the dialogue. The Hinawa-Lucas conversation in the beginning is one I love, because I love how Hinawa responds when you refuse to get out of your jammies. Also, did you know that she gives you nut bread if you slam into her? She also surrenders xD. She's a very easy character to love, definitely a great Mom. Alec and Claus, meanwhile, only laugh at you when you dash at them.
    Also really like how cinematic it gets once you go back home, with the slow scene establishing how peaceful everything is, then the Hinawa letter, and then the interruption of the music and entry of the pigmask leitmotif ... and then BAM, this. IS. MOTHER 3. Fucking love it, reminds me of the Lion King starting with the epic music and then BOOM, logo and name.

    Moving into Flint's part, there's again just a lot of gushing over all the little details. Flint's gesture where he adjusts his hat is a brilliant addition, and says all about his character that we need to know. Still, I'm a fan of Thomas's "times like these need a nice reckless guy like you!" which also gives us the little insight in that Claus is more like Flint and Lucas probably more like Hinawa.
    I generally like to use this time to talk to Tazmilians as much as possible, mostly because I'm still trying to get to the point where I remember all their names. And it helps a lot that they all have considerably distinct personalities. Bud and Lou always have some weird meta-comedy gag going on, like the one where Bud blames gagging on you pressing the button. I also like Jonel always including himself in his statements. But my favorites come up later.
    Now that fighting starts with the ever-awesome Batty Twist, I have to say, I don't get why as a whole a lot of people dislike the battles in this game. From here to the very end of the chapter I only fought monsters I ran into, and I leveled up really nicely without an issue, had no problems beating anyone, had more than enough battle and healing items ... in other words, no difficulties whatsoever. What also helps, I guess, is that to me the battle rhythm thing is almost intuitive, and for most of the themes doing 16-hit combos is genuinely easy. It's later on in the game that it becomes to hard that it's not that worth it, but by then you have other things to be doing with your turn. But here? Where you just have Flint to wallop things with, battle rhythms made it all go like a breeze. I also feel like it all goes super easy given all the weapon upgrades are distributed fairly evenly, first with the Stick in boney's home, then Lighter's Lumber, and finally the Better Stick later on in the "store." They power you up sufficiently so even the tough enemies are no problem.
    Regarding Flint's skills, I also discovered I was only really using them during "boss" battles. For example, when doing the flying mouse I actually raised my defense and offense before going all-in with attacks. I only used swing probably three times, two of those against the fireflies. Power Smash I never even touch, I feel like missing that much makes it worthless.
    A note I had forgotten to bring up: Save frogs. I love love love save frogs. It's such a simple concept, the whole saving thing, but I love how they pulled it off, and while it's not so visible yet, the personality of the frogs is genuinely enjoyable. I think I'll highlight my favorite frogs of each chapter whenever I write about this game.
    Once you save Fuel and return him to a weak Lighter is one of those moments that remind you how human this game is. The Lighter-Flint relationship overall isn't really explored a lot in the game, since other larger things take hold, but I really appreciate that they gave them this moment and we got to have these villagers fleshed out. To me it gives more meaning to rescuing Fuel knowing that Lighter is pretty much Flint's childhood friend and Fuel is the same to Lucas and Claus. The fact that this scene goes on with Gentle Rain also makes it extremely touching, as does the fact later on that the whole village is intent on helping Flint find his family.
    But before that, I also want to geek about the Hinawa letter. The game has you read the same letter TWICE, and each time the weight it has is completely different. When Hinawa is reading it the scenario is peaceful and wholesome and you just get this appreciation for the sort of environment Lucas is growing up in. Then when Flint reads it there's a whole new twist to it where all those words are words from YOUR wife, who is STILL not home. There's no urgency at that point, nothing like when the fire was going on, just an uncomfortable sense of worry. Uneasiness. Crafted fantastically.
    On that note, I like that the game is not shy in giving you the suspicion of what it is that may happen. The chapter itself begins with the title "Night of the funeral", Isaac tells you he heard a scream, you read the letter, you see Hinawa's torn dress ... it doesn't beat you over the head with it, but it's letting you know. And the greatness of it is that when playing it you still want to see what follows and have that sense of actually being able to do something.
    Before that revelation though, I have to give props to the cutscene of Boney getting Duster. Fantastic introduction to a fantastic character. Who at this point is with you for just what happens to be the world's easiest boss fight. But that's enough for the character to start making his mark.
    There's not much to say about Hinawa's death that hasn't been said. The game lets you know beforehand that it happened, and I particularly love that Lucas and Claus hint at it if you talk to each one twice, Lucas saying " Mom's ..." and Claus going " ... darn it" (also a great use of their distinct character to tell the story without telling it) ... but the best is how the whole revelation comes into play. First of all, Bronson is terrible at relaying these news, and it's one of those things where a lot of the shock is just in how he says it. And then how everyone reacts. Flint has possibly one of the most human reactions to grief I've seen in a video game, easily. I also really really like the way Tessie is executed. She approaches Flint gingerly, and he pushes her back, then she's on the floor crying, but when Flint starts beating up people she goes and covers Claus and Lucas ... this game is SOOOO human, my god. And the fact that it's Lighter, Flint's best friend, who has to knock him down ... uuggghhh.
    Then is more of the game breaking your heart without saying a single thing when we see the last time hinawa and flint interacted. Not a single word, but between the sprites and that music, this is one of those golden scenes where if we were talking about a movies we'd call it a classic. And it's stuff like this that make me say without hesitation that this game is one of the greatest examples of art in this medium and why I will shove that in everyone's face as much as I can.
    After the Hinawa bit I moved a lot faster and took less notes, since in part I was also devastated (again.) Something I noticed more this time is that after Lucas got yelled at by Alec and ran away, he went to Boney and didn't really speak again. It's a little touch that makes future situations I won't speak of now have a deeper angle.
    And before I forget to talk about it again, the animals. My god. So, when you go to Butch's pig farm southeast, the pigs give you a fantastic revelation. It seems, there's important, behind-the-scenes MOTHER 3 info that only pigs know about. And then when you talk to all the pigs to get this info ... LMAO, great stuff. Also extremely enjoyable to me was one of the cows doing a save frog impression. God bless this game.
    Alec as a whole is a character I don't care much for, but I do appreciate his lightness and constant desire to get people to just smile at everything they do. Gives you an idea of why he can get along with magypsies. I won't talk of magypsies yet though. I can say, though, from this chapter, that Doria is super awesome.
    And from here I pretty much just played on until the end. Normally I would be afraid of the exploding trees, but I fought them all as I was unexplicably overpowered for some reason. It also gave me an excuse to use healing items and open up my inventory a bit. Then Mecha-Drago fight, where I went all out with three thunder bombs, running bombs, sprinting bombs, and then a couple hits. Overall a fairly easy chapter.
    The end bit is an interesting one I wonder about, since here's a gap in what the game tells us. We can assume that this is the drago that killed Hinawa, and if I looked correctly I think one of its fangs is missing? Or at the least colored differently, I didn't see properly. But like the caribou, we can assume it was mostly a reaction from rage and confusion at this electronic stuff the pigmasks installed on it, but then later on when its weakened and its baby saves it, we see it cry ... does that mecha-drago die or continue living? Is it able to control itself? Something I don't think is really addressed in full. There are some implications as to what happens to the dragos, but that's later I guess.
    And my god, the pigmasks are such a piece of work. On one hand they have that silly slapstick thing going on with their pig squeals and falling and just being derpy. But then you couple that with cult-like salutes and overall just really really wrong stuff ... quite unsettling. Also, why were they just burning the forest? For fun? Those jerks! I love their theme though.

    Ok, so that's all the juice I was able to squeeze out of chapter one, or at least all I wanted to do for now. Some things like Tazmily stuff I'll talk about more, probably.
    Meanwhile...
    Favorite save frog of the chapter:
    "A story is a series of memories. Memories are remembered with other memories, and in turn become memories themselves. If you don't take care to preserve your memories, you'll forget them. So, please tell us frogs your memories of everything so far... That is what people refer to as "saving". Now, then... *hop* Save your game"
    (probably the chapter with the least variety in save frogs xD)

    And something else I want to do ...
    Favorite songs from this chapter:
    Alec's Log House
    Mom's Hometown
    Gentle Rain
    Run, My Dog, Run!
    Sorrowful Tazmily

    Limiting these to five a chapter. Which is really really difficult ...

    Ok, that's all for chapter 1. Now to end this all with a sparrow-like ...
    *Chirp, chirp!*
    Last edited by Noqanky; May 11th, 2015 at 02:07 PM.

  6. #26
    Voici La Chévre Wagomu's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Hiroy View Post
    Oh man. Missed this thread completely.

    Gonna definately jump on board with this. Here's my own little conditions for myself to make playing it a little more tolerable.
    -I'm using a cheat code to avoid using the whole combo system altogether. I prefered the more quick, hit/crit system from Earthbound and I feel the combo thing doesn't really add much aside from dividing overall damage that I could be doing. Plus it doesn't make the game much easier. Also heard there is a bit of an input lag in the emulator, but I've never noticed it much myself. I just don't care much for the rhythm based combo thing.

    Aside that, looking forward to playing this again. It's up there with my top 5 games, and unlike everything in that list... this one I mainly like for the art, setting, music and flavor text more than the actual main story or gameplay. Not to say the main story is bad. I just had more of a blast interacting with the world and experiencing all the trippy sequences during the plot.
    The combos can make a big difference if you can pull them off regularly and I think they add a little needed action to the RPG experience. The songs and beats are varied enough that you're always on your toes in trying to pull them off. Even if you can't, though, you can still make it through pretty easily and it still has value. I'm honestly not that great at the combo system, but pressing the button to the beat still engages me in the battle in an interesting way that you don't see outside of rhythm games. Even if I'm adding negligible damage with my poor combos, it is satisfying to pull them off, especially when you get into a real groove. That's because it doesn't only serve the purpose of helping you a little with the fight, but it also engages you with the music (and this game has some great music). I would argue that that's the more important and interesting part about the rhythm combos. If you just want the extra damage, you can grind a little, but you still lose something experiential in ignoring the combos.

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  7. #27

    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    The comboing system can also suck on an emulator if the lag between button presses is significant.

  8. #28

    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Wagomu View Post
    The combos can make a big difference if you can pull them off regularly and I think they add a little needed action to the RPG experience. The songs and beats are varied enough that you're always on your toes in trying to pull them off. Even if you can't, though, you can still make it through pretty easily and it still has value. I'm honestly not that great at the combo system, but pressing the button to the beat still engages me in the battle in an interesting way that you don't see outside of rhythm games. Even if I'm adding negligible damage with my poor combos, it is satisfying to pull them off, especially when you get into a real groove. That's because it doesn't only serve the purpose of helping you a little with the fight, but it also engages you with the music (and this game has some great music). I would argue that that's the more important and interesting part about the rhythm combos. If you just want the extra damage, you can grind a little, but you still lose something experiential in ignoring the combos.
    I'm not disagreeing with you and I do get the appeal behind the system. It just wasn't something I was invested in after 6 hours of gameplay. Felt like it got a bit old and it got to the point where I just wanted to mash through repeated fights with the same monsters.

  9. #29
    Colin Baker Apologist Mr. Zoro's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Noqanky View Post
    Just went through Chapter one.

    Thoughts below! Spoilers, of course ... spoilers, everywhere.
    Spoiler:

    So, naturally a bunch of thoughts outlined from the moment I started.
    The naming returns from Earthbound and is as lovely as ever, and I particularly love the music in this one. What I also like though, is the focus on the family from the get-go. There's no four meant to save the world, no "name your best friend" or any of those shenanigans. The game explicitely tell you who the characters are and what their personalities are. Definitely more of a story sort of game just from there.
    Same goes for the way the game is introduced. The beginning is almost pretty much a tutorial, with it establishing Lucas as the main character even if he doesn't necessarily seem the most heroic (and you won't be using him for a while.) Also at this part it becomes obvious how much the sprite work in these games has evolved, since there's sooooo much emotion and movement and character in how the sprites move, like when Alec implies Lucas is weak and you see the sweat on him. Another little touch of course is the fact you can talk to the animals and they say phenomenal things ("what the pig next to me says worries me", and next to that pig the pig says "don't worry") ... I'll talk more about this later because there's more brilliant ones later on.
    The touch of nature is also immediately more obvious. Little touches I like are stepping outside from home and a flash of sunlight greeting you while awesome music plays in the background and you come out into the most possibly open environment. The dragos are also a nice touch being so intimidating but in the end just plain, simple natural creatures that live with their families and interact with you.
    How the game goes about teaching you stuff is also something I love. The series as a whole is super-self aware but even with that the little touches are really notable. I'm a fan of Alec going "Imagine a thing called a B button" while teaching you how to dash. Later on there's another one I also like, which is Mapson telling you to "let your right index finger make a wish" to then later explain he means to press R. The first fight is also really amusing as a whole, with the mole cricket, and the little touch of it wanting to prove itself to be strong only to be easily squished unintentionally by Hinawa. He'll be fine I'm sure.
    Oh, and before I move on, I like the little touches of the dialogue. The Hinawa-Lucas conversation in the beginning is one I love, because I love how Hinawa responds when you refuse to get out of your jammies. Also, did you know that she gives you nut bread if you slam into her? She also surrenders xD. She's a very easy character to love, definitely a great Mom. Alec and Claus, meanwhile, only laugh at you when you dash at them.
    Also really like how cinematic it gets once you go back home, with the slow scene establishing how peaceful everything is, then the Hinawa letter, and then the interruption of the music and entry of the pigmask leitmotif ... and then BAM, this. IS. MOTHER 3. Fucking love it, reminds me of the Lion King starting with the epic music and then BOOM, logo and name.

    Moving into Flint's part, there's again just a lot of gushing over all the little details. Flint's gesture where he adjusts his hat is a brilliant addition, and says all about his character that we need to know. Still, I'm a fan of Thomas's "times like these need a nice reckless guy like you!" which also gives us the little insight in that Claus is more like Flint and Lucas probably more like Hinawa.
    I generally like to use this time to talk to Tazmilians as much as possible, mostly because I'm still trying to get to the point where I remember all their names. And it helps a lot that they all have considerably distinct personalities. Bud and Lou always have some weird meta-comedy gag going on, like the one where Bud blames gagging on you pressing the button. I also like Jonel always including himself in his statements. But my favorites come up later.
    Now that fighting starts with the ever-awesome Batty Twist, I have to say, I don't get why as a whole a lot of people dislike the battles in this game. From here to the very end of the chapter I only fought monsters I ran into, and I leveled up really nicely without an issue, had no problems beating anyone, had more than enough battle and healing items ... in other words, no difficulties whatsoever. What also helps, I guess, is that to me the battle rhythm thing is almost intuitive, and for most of the themes doing 16-hit combos is genuinely easy. It's later on in the game that it becomes to hard that it's not that worth it, but by then you have other things to be doing with your turn. But here? Where you just have Flint to wallop things with, battle rhythms made it all go like a breeze. I also feel like it all goes super easy given all the weapon upgrades are distributed fairly evenly, first with the Stick in boney's home, then Lighter's Lumber, and finally the Better Stick later on in the "store." They power you up sufficiently so even the tough enemies are no problem.
    Regarding Flint's skills, I also discovered I was only really using them during "boss" battles. For example, when doing the flying mouse I actually raised my defense and offense before going all-in with attacks. I only used swing probably three times, two of those against the fireflies. Power Smash I never even touch, I feel like missing that much makes it worthless.
    A note I had forgotten to bring up: Save frogs. I love love love save frogs. It's such a simple concept, the whole saving thing, but I love how they pulled it off, and while it's not so visible yet, the personality of the frogs is genuinely enjoyable. I think I'll highlight my favorite frogs of each chapter whenever I write about this game.
    Once you save Fuel and return him to a weak Lighter is one of those moments that remind you how human this game is. The Lighter-Flint relationship overall isn't really explored a lot in the game, since other larger things take hold, but I really appreciate that they gave them this moment and we got to have these villagers fleshed out. To me it gives more meaning to rescuing Fuel knowing that Lighter is pretty much Flint's childhood friend and Fuel is the same to Lucas and Claus. The fact that this scene goes on with Gentle Rain also makes it extremely touching, as does the fact later on that the whole village is intent on helping Flint find his family.
    But before that, I also want to geek about the Hinawa letter. The game has you read the same letter TWICE, and each time the weight it has is completely different. When Hinawa is reading it the scenario is peaceful and wholesome and you just get this appreciation for the sort of environment Lucas is growing up in. Then when Flint reads it there's a whole new twist to it where all those words are words from YOUR wife, who is STILL not home. There's no urgency at that point, nothing like when the fire was going on, just an uncomfortable sense of worry. Uneasiness. Crafted fantastically.
    On that note, I like that the game is not shy in giving you the suspicion of what it is that may happen. The chapter itself begins with the title "Night of the funeral", Isaac tells you he heard a scream, you read the letter, you see Hinawa's torn dress ... it doesn't beat you over the head with it, but it's letting you know. And the greatness of it is that when playing it you still want to see what follows and have that sense of actually being able to do something.
    Before that revelation though, I have to give props to the cutscene of Boney getting Duster. Fantastic introduction to a fantastic character. Who at this point is with you for just what happens to be the world's easiest boss fight. But that's enough for the character to start making his mark.
    There's not much to say about Hinawa's death that hasn't been said. The game lets you know beforehand that it happened, and I particularly love that Lucas and Claus hint at it if you talk to each one twice, Lucas saying " Mom's ..." and Claus going " ... darn it" (also a great use of their distinct character to tell the story without telling it) ... but the best is how the whole revelation comes into play. First of all, Bronson is terrible at relaying these news, and it's one of those things where a lot of the shock is just in how he says it. And then how everyone reacts. Flint has possibly one of the most human reactions to grief I've seen in a video game, easily. I also really really like the way Tessie is executed. She approaches Flint gingerly, and he pushes her back, then she's on the floor crying, but when Flint starts beating up people she goes and covers Claus and Lucas ... this game is SOOOO human, my god. And the fact that it's Lighter, Flint's best friend, who has to knock him down ... uuggghhh.
    Then is more of the game breaking your heart without saying a single thing when we see the last time hinawa and flint interacted. Not a single word, but between the sprites and that music, this is one of those golden scenes where if we were talking about a movies we'd call it a classic. And it's stuff like this that make me say without hesitation that this game is one of the greatest examples of art in this medium and why I will shove that in everyone's face as much as I can.
    After the Hinawa bit I moved a lot faster and took less notes, since in part I was also devastated (again.) Something I noticed more this time is that after Lucas got yelled at by Alec and ran away, he went to Boney and didn't really speak again. It's a little touch that makes future situations I won't speak of now have a deeper angle.
    And before I forget to talk about it again, the animals. My god. So, when you go to Butch's pig farm southeast, the pigs give you a fantastic revelation. It seems, there's important, behind-the-scenes MOTHER 3 info that only pigs know about. And then when you talk to all the pigs to get this info ... LMAO, great stuff. Also extremely enjoyable to me was one of the cows doing a save frog impression. God bless this game.
    Alec as a whole is a character I don't care much for, but I do appreciate his lightness and constant desire to get people to just smile at everything they do. Gives you an idea of why he can get along with magypsies. I won't talk of magypsies yet though. I can say, though, from this chapter, that Doria is super awesome.
    And from here I pretty much just played on until the end. Normally I would be afraid of the exploding trees, but I fought them all as I was unexplicably overpowered for some reason. It also gave me an excuse to use healing items and open up my inventory a bit. Then Mecha-Drago fight, where I went all out with three thunder bombs, running bombs, sprinting bombs, and then a couple hits. Overall a fairly easy chapter.
    The end bit is an interesting one I wonder about, since here's a gap in what the game tells us. We can assume that this is the drago that killed Hinawa, and if I looked correctly I think one of its fangs is missing? Or at the least colored differently, I didn't see properly. But like the caribou, we can assume it was mostly a reaction from rage and confusion at this electronic stuff the pigmasks installed on it, but then later on when its weakened and its baby saves it, we see it cry ... does that mecha-drago die or continue living? Is it able to control itself? Something I don't think is really addressed in full. There are some implications as to what happens to the dragos, but that's later I guess.
    And my god, the pigmasks are such a piece of work. On one hand they have that silly slapstick thing going on with their pig squeals and falling and just being derpy. But then you couple that with cult-like salutes and overall just really really wrong stuff ... quite unsettling. Also, why were they just burning the forest? For fun? Those jerks! I love their theme though.

    Ok, so that's all the juice I was able to squeeze out of chapter one, or at least all I wanted to do for now. Some things like Tazmily stuff I'll talk about more, probably.
    Meanwhile...
    Favorite save frog of the chapter:
    "A story is a series of memories. Memories are remembered with other memories, and in turn become memories themselves. If you don't take care to preserve your memories, you'll forget them. So, please tell us frogs your memories of everything so far... That is what people refer to as "saving". Now, then... *hop* Save your game"
    (probably the chapter with the least variety in save frogs xD)

    And something else I want to do ...
    Favorite songs from this chapter:
    Alec's Log House
    Mom's Hometown
    Gentle Rain
    Run, My Dog, Run!
    Sorrowful Tazmily

    Limiting these to five a chapter. Which is really really difficult ...

    Ok, that's all for chapter 1. Now to end this all with a sparrow-like ...
    *Chirp, chirp!"
    Good read, I love looking into games as forms of art as you just did. I'm all for the argument that video games can be art! (reminds me of a time when I got in an argument with a classmate about this, and his argument is that video games can't be art because they haven't been around long enough… as if time was always a factor in what is considered art… Long story short, no one really sided with him because he was always cracking jokes and anytime he tried to make serious arguments, no one took him seriously). It always frustrates me when someone says video games can't be art, and yet they can consider films to be such. If anything, video games offer an additional level of immersion, since you're the one in control of a lot of things. Like in MGS 3, when (MGS3 spoilers, obviously)
    Spoiler:
    The cutscene after the final boss battle won't proceed until you have to press the button (pull the trigger) to kill the final boss, who had such a significant relationship and emotional impact on Snake.
    .

    Okay, onto actually discussing Mother 3…

    I started playing it last year when I took a study abroad trip to London, and I must've got caught up in the trip and life that I unfortunately never took the time to go back and finish the game (and I only finished Chapter 1!). So I just decided to start over and start "fresh".

    Spoiler:
    A (few) things I noted:

    After the screen where you confirm the names in the beginning, some animal sound effects start to play, and then start to morph into mechanical sounds. I never noticed that the first time around, but it's a great touch that also plays as a bit of foreshadowing.

    I do appreciate when a game shows you how to do things, rather than tell it. Much like the basic principle in creative writing: Show, don't tell. Majora's Mask had some nice moments of it, such as when you're following Darmani's ghost with the Lens of Truth, and he starts floating up a cliff, which naturally leads you to look up and see the hidden ladder on the cliff wall.
    While Mother 3 kinda tells you at times, it does it in a fourth way breaking manner, and it's part of the charm of the game, and not a hindrance.

    Agreed about the whole Bronson thing. The way he brings up the Drago tooth and Hinawa's death was just so unintentionally brutal. In a really dark way, it's funny (I wasn't laughing), but it's just such a wrong way of delivering the news, and makes it all the more shocking.

    Flint lashing out is another scene that sticks with me. In front of his kids. There was so much emotion on. The villagers feeling sorry for Flint, the kids who were undoubtedly saddened by the news, and then seeing their father beat up people… Yikes.

    I haven't gotten up to the drago boss fight yet, but I think I recall it missing a tooth. I do remember feeling awful after the fight though, since the baby Drago was crying after it's momma, and I realized I was the one who had to defeat it… and how it really wasn't the Drago's fault that it was mechanized and attacked me.

  10. #30
    Voici La Chévre Wagomu's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    I don't give people any quarter when they deny the art of games. The art of experience is something undeniable and I think this game really nails it in some scenes, using the RPG medium to really put the player in some situations. The biggest highlights for me include Salsa's chapter, Tanetane Island and the final boss.

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  11. #31

    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Just did Chapter 2.

    Hot off the presses, my thoughts below. Plenty of spoiler patches below:

    Spoiler:

    Ok, traditionally, this to me has always been the weakest chapter just in nature of how it's structured. Given that Duster is the only character for most of it, not just playable but in terms of personality, and that it's strictly confined to the gloomy halls of Osohe, I always thought it was the weaker of all the chapters in many ways. I also found it to be a rather brutal chapter with enemies truly overwhelming you and actually killing you more than once.
    This time, due to experience and not failing to go to the hot spring first, I was actually able to progress more smoothly and enjoy the chapter more as a result.
    First way I did this was by eating food a lot more liberally. I have an issue with most RPGs in that I am insanely paranoid about item usage since I'm always afraid of using up something I'll wind up needing later, but now with the security of how many times I would die without eating, I was much more liberal than ever in just constantly eating. I also got lucky in that I didn't get the awful nausea status condition which keeps you from eating. I hate it so much.
    I was also much much better with the thief tools this time around. I love those things, extremely useful. Most random enemies go to sleep fairly easily, and with the larger fights like Mr. Passion I love making them cry as soon as I start and then being able to cripple their stats while they miss continuously, before I go on and pound them into submission.
    The enemies in this area are an obnoxious bunch, but there's a lot of redemption in a lot of the music choices, as well as certain attacks and gags from the enemies. For example, I always crack up when fighting the painting since there's this moment where the painting explain/does some abstract concept and Duster fails to understand. I also really enjoyed the bit with Mr. Passion attacking with the mouse, as well as the little toy knight attacking each other when you fight them at the same time. Overall I think the personality of the enemies is not as great early in the game as it is later, but this was still really enjoyable.
    They can also be really really brutal. I was put to sleep and paralyzed so much. The pink slime nearly killed me. But thankfully I woke up in time and fought back reasonably well. As a whole it reminds me of the times in Earthbound where you're just Ness and have to deal with everything.
    But I'm really just blowing through this part of my playthrough so I can talk about something else.
    The dialogue in this chapter blew my mind.
    Ok, so last time I just went normally, from place to place, didn't really explore. This time, I actually did so and found some nuggets that really made me get hyped. These are below further spoilered for those who haven't played beyond chapter 2
    Spoiler:

    - The animals, once again. Remember the pig that said there was Mother 3 background info only pigs knew about? Well, I found that pig and he said something like that again, and when I talked to it again it asked if I really wanted to know! I did so I talked to it again and BAM, easter egg about the game. I was sooo freaking hyped and amused. I was somewhat also once again amused by one of the cows, this time one of them asking what "ground sirloin" means ... oh man.
    -Mayor Pusher said that there was a project they were working on, to establish an old folk's home. He wasn't sure how long it'd take or when it'd happen, but there was an associate visiting to discuss it. AN ASSOCIATE. The only character visiting at this point is FUCKING FASSAD. So yup, there you go, that dickhead is also responsible for putting all the old folks in a dingy home. Goddamnit Fassad.
    - This one isn't really a spoiler or anything but belongs in this string of WTF revelations. There's a married couple in the game called Paul and Linda. It literally hit me during this chapter that they're probably referencing Paul and Linda McCartney.
    - Also, this one happens long before the events really start. When Wess is telling Duster what he needs to do, he keeps saying, at the end of the sentences "or so I remember." When I answered no to going on the quest, he began explaining that it was the thief training that fucked up Duster's leg (or so he remembers), and that there was reason for duster to hold grudges towards him because of a lot of things being his fault like failing at interacting with other villagers (or so he remembers) and he even explains how long ago he hid the secret as duty to the old King of Osohe (or so he remembers.) This is the part where it finally hit me how much the game is hinting at the fact that NONE OF THAT HAPPENED. Naturally, given the fact they're all there with fake memories. It's not something huge, but it slapped me in the face with how self-aware portions in the beginning were about the whole thing.
    - Also, last bit of questioning. So Kumatora and Osohe are kind of the last relics of a civilization that was there before, the only real relic and history of this world. So ... are the ghosts in Osohe ghosts of that old culture that Kumatora is a part of?


    In any case, once with Wess revisiting the castle felt like a breeze and the pigmasks proved to be no problem at all. The introduction to kumatora was as great as I remember, immediately making her super lovable, as does the interaction she has with Wess and Duster before the boss battle. Regarding the boss, that's another example of a tremendously brutal enemy, particularly with the waves, but somehow both my characters survived and so it went into the end of the chapter.
    Here I found out a nice little easter egg with scamp. When you visit him normally he comments on how bad things are coming to the town. When you talk to him with kumatora he says good things are coming, and one may be coming to him ... maybe? ... which is very very wrong, fucking dirty old man!
    In any case, I leave it at that since there's not much I wanted to talk about. Much simpler chapter with less things to comment on overall, and more enjoyable in the re-visit even if it still probably remains the weakest of the chapters for me. Although Kumatora stealing the show makes me like it all the same.

    Favorite save frog:
    huh, save frogs are like super simple in this chapter. The default winner is the one that feels the need to clarify it's not a ghost. Weak chapter for frogs. Other animals stole their thunder I guess xD

    Favorite songs:
    Mind of a Thief
    And El Mariachi
    Ragtime Osohe
    Serious
    Piggy Guys

    That's all for chapter two. Now to end this with a sparrow-like ...
    *Achirpa chirp chirp!"

  12. #32
    Colin Baker Apologist Mr. Zoro's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    I've been doing my best to stay away from Mother 3 spoilers, but saw a video on the Earthbound 64's development. I was aware that the game got cancelled and knew a little about it, so I watched it, not realizing that the game was scrapped and remade for the GBA…

    And was spoiled about the end boss for Mother 3. Definitely one of the things best to discover on your own in the game.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    Quote Originally Posted by Noqanky View Post
    Spoiler:

    - The animals, once again. Remember the pig that said there was Mother 3 background info only pigs knew about? Well, I found that pig and he said something like that again, and when I talked to it again it asked if I really wanted to know! I did so I talked to it again and BAM, easter egg about the game. I was sooo freaking hyped and amused. I was somewhat also once again amused by one of the cows, this time one of them asking what "ground sirloin" means ... oh man.
    Spoiler:
    Oh really? Where's that pig at? I must've missed him, and might be beyond the point of being able to retrace steps and find it.

  13. #33

    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Zoro
    Spoiler:
    Oh really? Where's that pig at? I must've missed him, and might be beyond the point of being able to retrace steps and find it.
    Spoiler:

    These are the pigs in Butch's farm. I'm not sure at what point the relay of information stops, but this specific dialogue happened all throughout chapter 2, with the first instance of them mentioning Mother 3 secrets happening in chapter 1 with flint.
    I look forward to seeing what they have to say in chapter 3. Beyond that I imagine it's not possible to talk to them again
    Spoiler:
    since in the timeskip for chapter four that area becomes a training camp for pigmasks ... can't recall if the pigs remain there or not.


  14. #34

    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Hmm. A bit way in within Chapter 1.

    I feel like I'm still failing to understand the intentions behind the Lou and Bud NPC dou. They tend to tell situations as they are, but end it with the "smack" gag, followed up with a bow as if they did some sort of comedic sketch (ironically without the comedy) in front of a spectator. I guess that's their whole point! They got this ongoing gag and just make standup satire out of it. But I unno. Maybe the ARE telling jokes and maybe it's a craft they'd probably improve as the timeline moves forward.

    And oh. Sorry I'm not actual talking about analyzing the story. Atleast yet. I'm just really more interested in little things like this.

  15. #35

    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Hiroy View Post
    Hmm. A bit way in within Chapter 1.

    I feel like I'm still failing to understand the intentions behind the Lou and Bud NPC dou. They tend to tell situations as they are, but end it with the "smack" gag, followed up with a bow as if they did some sort of comedic sketch (ironically without the comedy) in front of a spectator. I guess that's their whole point! They got this ongoing gag and just make standup satire out of it. But I unno. Maybe the ARE telling jokes and maybe it's a craft they'd probably improve as the timeline moves forward.

    And oh. Sorry I'm not actual talking about analyzing the story. Atleast yet. I'm just really more interested in little things like this.
    Yes, Bud and Lou are supposed to be "comedians" and I think at points they do clarify they're practicing their comedy bit. Not the expert on japanese culture, but a lot of what they do is in the style of Manzai, which admittedly I'm only really aware of because of Nintendo products in the first place xD

    I also recall hearing somewhere that the naming of the characters is based on Abott and Costello (William "Bud" Abott and Lou Costello) who are also famous for that straight man/funny man comedy bit.

  16. #36

    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Noqanky View Post
    Yes, Bud and Lou are supposed to be "comedians" and I think at points they do clarify they're practicing their comedy bit. Not the expert on japanese culture, but a lot of what they do is in the style of Manzai, which admittedly I'm only really aware of because of Nintendo products in the first place xD

    I also recall hearing somewhere that the naming of the characters is based on Abott and Costello (William "Bud" Abott and Lou Costello) who are also famous for that straight man/funny man comedy bit.
    I somehow knew they were going for the Abott and Costello thing. Mainly from the looks of their silhouettes(a tall guy thin guy and a shorter pudgier guy with some sort of hat), but the naming thing flew over my head. If that's really true and not coincidence that's a neat find. If not, then I'd still buy it. Looking forward to seeing how their dialogue changes throughout the game, and maybe even a few other background characters if one stands out. Like this one the guy in the back of the line leading to that woman's bathroom. His mini story is pretty great!

  17. #37
    Charming Man Nobodyman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Just finished Chapter 2

    Spoiler:
    2nd Half of Chapter 1:
    -Yeah, still had to finish the rest of Chapter 1 last I posted.
    -The second half actually got pretty tough, especially with the rock monsters and the Mecha Drago (which killed me the first time), but I think that's because I wasn't using my special skills properly (which is, to say, at all).
    -Speaking of which, I don't know. Special skills are neat and all, but it really bugs me how often they miss.

    Chapter 2:
    -Have to agree with Noqanky this was kind of a so-so chapter. Granted, Chapter 1 is a tough act to follow, and I did need a bit of a breather after the intensity of said chapter.
    -I hate to say, but I got stumped pretty much immediately upon entering the castle (the part where you have to charge at the statue). So yeah, had to look that up and maybe one or two other things during this chapter.
    -And again, as Noqanky said, the enemies were really tough during the first visit to Osohe castle. Not helped at all by the fact that there's very few heal stations and a limited amount of space to carry items.
    -On the other hand, I never had a problem at all with nausea. I think I got it two or three time and I always had an abundant amount of Breath Mints.
    -Ah, so THAT'S the Snake Rope.
    -Mr. Passion kicked my ass the first time. Decided to go back and level up a bit. Also, didn't help that I initially skipped that room with the supposedly really strong armor.
    -The Snake Boss wasn't that bad at all. Only used the wave attack once, which actually did deliver a fatal blow to Kumatora, but I managed to save her in time.
    -And of course the game continues to showcase its absurd sense of humor. Loved the friendly ghosts, the painting that bores you with its pretentious speech about art, and the spirit that makes you sad by lamenting its past life (which is actually pretty tragic when you think about it).

    Beginning of Chapter 3:
    -Hmm...I have a sudden urge to listen to a Peter Gabriel song
    -And I guess another chapter that won't focus on Lucas. Really interesting the way they're doing that. But it makes my anticipation for him all the greater.

    Oh yeah, and as sacrilegious as it may seem, I'm now playing the game with my PS3 controller. Gruesome irony notwithstanding, it's a lot more convenient than playing on the keyboard (of course, I'm also playing this on a Microsoft computer, so...).

  18. #38

    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    I have to get to chapter 3 soon. Been finishing a bunch of games I had left undone midway, but reading stuff about the game hypes me to return to it ...

    Also, regarding skills:
    USE THEM

    Skills that alter stats are particularly important and helpful. Point is, if you go into the game thinking you can just constantly attack, attack, heal, attack, attack ... you're going to have a very hard time.

    Bring it up mostly because I notice a lot of new players ignore them completely, or take Flint and abuse power smash like it's the only thing you could do.

  19. #39
    A dog exists somewhere David Ludwig's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Unlike in Earthbound stat altering is proportional to how high the stats are. So in the beginning you may lower them by 10, but by the end you'll be lowering them by 45 or so. Meaning it's consistently useful throughout the game, instead of doing like 10 points the whole game, making it useless soon after you get it.

    So yeah, use them thief tools.

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  20. #40
    Charming Man Nobodyman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Retro Game Party: HD + Remaster May - Mother 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Noqanky View Post
    Also, regarding skills:
    USE THEM

    Skills that alter stats are particularly important and helpful. Point is, if you go into the game thinking you can just constantly attack, attack, heal, attack, attack ... you're going to have a very hard time.
    Quote Originally Posted by David Ludwig View Post
    Unlike in Earthbound stat altering is proportional to how high the stats are. So in the beginning you may lower them by 10, but by the end you'll be lowering them by 45 or so. Meaning it's consistently useful throughout the game, instead of doing like 10 points the whole game, making it useless soon after you get it.

    So yeah, use them thief tools.
    Yeah, I know that now. It just didn't occur to me to use them at first since, in my experience, stat-changers are generally pretty useless in RPGs.

    The rest of the skills (sleep, turn around, staples) I still used kind of sparingly since they usually only last one turn, which isn't terribly useful when you have only one player. But once I get more players, hopefully they'll be more useful.

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