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Thread: Random News Article Discussion II

  1. #11541

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyclone_Baroness View Post
    In other news. Another unarmed black man shot and killed by police.

    The 3 cop in question on paid leave.

    http://www.tulsaworldtv.com/Graphic-...tcher-31411497
    Saw two videos and neither of them really give a good view of what happens. There's no way to know he was unarmed until after the fact. Apparently the woman who shot him did it after he was tazed though so that is a pretty big fuck up.

    In other news

    https://weather.com/news/news/mosaic...ant-fertilizer

    Quote Originally Posted by Article
    A massive sinkhole opened up underneath a storage pond in Florida, causing more than 200 million gallons of contaminated wastewater from a fertilizer plant to leak into one of the state's main underground resources of drinking water.

  2. #11542

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by Sakonosolo View Post
    Saw two videos and neither of them really give a good view of what happens. There's no way to know he was unarmed until after the fact. Apparently the woman who shot him did it after he was tazed though so that is a pretty big fuck up.

    In other news

    https://weather.com/news/news/mosaic...ant-fertilizer

    But it's not as simple to say "There was no way to know" if he was unarmed, as that implies that he did something to cause officers to be suspicious of him to act violent or have a weapon in the first place. His car was stuck in the middle of the road and the officers were responding to some other incident when they stopped because his car was "in the way". At that point what happened really isn't clear except for the officers account that he simply was acting hostile and disobeying the cops. And they stated that he "reached inside the vehicle" when they shot him, meanwhile both the door and window of the car were closed. The officer that stated that may have meant that he reached towards the vehicle, but even so that's no indication of a weapon.

    In any interaction that I've ever had with the police where I've been told to get out of the vehicle(I've been stopped a few times with friends with pot in the car) and the first thing the officers did everytime was say "Do you have any weapons on you, or anything that can poke or stick me". Even if they didn't do a pat-down, they would still ask. As far as what's been shown with this incident none of that transpired. It baffles me how if the officer that took the shot thought he may have had a weapon he could have reached for, why didn't they tell him to get on the ground so they could do a pat-down. He had his hands up right until he put them down as he walked near the car.

    And just to imagine from his perspective(From the little we know about the beginning of the incident) If I was coming home from class, my car broke down in the middle of the lane on the road, and a bunch of police officers pulled up and let the situation escalate to the point of my hands being up and guns drawn...who knows in the stress of the situation you might just be pacing back and forth like he was(still with his hands up).

    The whole incident just is covered in poor training from the police. Even if this guy had some flip out on the cops when they arrived and they thought he was hostile, there are multiple ways to de-escalate the situation, or take him down/disarm him if you think he's a life-threatening person.
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  3. #11543

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyan D. Funk View Post
    I don't get why this report on police abuse of black people only focuses on black people??????????
    The entire point of a report on police abuse of black people is to highlight the fact that black people are disproportionately affected by police killings. If girls are disproportionately affected by cyberbullying, bullying in general, or abuse in general there should be some evidence to indicate that. We live in a society where women are intrinsically more sympathetic than men, and I have personally experienced the utter lack of remorse that most professionals and most people show whilst questioning the validity and motivations of a male abuse victim's claim.
    Quote Originally Posted by Outerspec View Post
    To ignore something is to refuse to acknowledge its existence. Focusing on a specific group does not mean they don't recognize bullying goes on far beyond the group they're focusing on.
    This is true. However, the amount of attention and sympathy that something gets should be proportional to the scale of the issue: see below.
    Quote Originally Posted by dirt monkey AL View Post
    guys, guys, guy

    don't forget that blue lives matter
    You're trolling, and ironically that serves my point perfectly.

    Why do people view Black Lives Matter with respect and Blue Lives Matter with disdain? The answer is obvious: Black Lives Matter highlights the massive problem of black people being disproportionately killed by our militarized police force, and Blue Lives Matter disrespectfully piggybacks off of the larger issue by claiming that we should really focus on the (still important, but far less so) issue of cops being killed by Black Lives Matter supporters.

    In short, Blue Lives Matter is a punchline not just because it's a protest protesting a protest, but because the scale of the two issues makes it very hard to sympathize with that side. When it becomes easier for male abuse victims to speak out without fear of mockery, vilification or further abuse, I'll stop asking "why does x focus on women exclusively?".



    ...As a sidenote, why are some of you being so dickish in your responses? Please stop that.

  4. #11544
    BEST! BREAST!! CON-TEST!!! dirt monkey AL's Avatar
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    I'm sorry, but did you just say MEN FIRST THEN JUSTICE FOR WOMEN? Because that's what I'm getting.

    The thing about orders or laws or even training to help stop discriminating against blacks, Latinos, women, Muslims, what the fuck have you usually directly helps white men or rather EVERYONE. Giving women paid maternity leave opens up the opportunity for spouses to get the same treatment. Getting proper anti-discrimination training or retraining for police officers would hopefully allow them to make better split second decisions. Retraining on sensitivity for abuse/rape victims would also extend to men.

    Laws that help abuse victims or are intended to end some sort of discrimination don't usually say shit like "except for that dick head white man".

    The only place I can think of where a law to end discrimination has hurt white people is from a part in a Darwin documentary when white people in South Africa couldn't find work because of the color of THEIR skin. (This wasn't the focus of the documentary obviously - it covered all sorts of discrimination in all of the places that Darwin stopped in his voyage and environmental stuff.) If this was a weird one sided view of this that I'm not aware of, realize it's the first time I was made aware of such a thing. I think I was under the impression that things are still shitty in South Africa for blacks. A feeling that honestly hasn't gone away even knowing about possible white victims.

    But really? Why are we focusing exclusively on women?

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  5. #11545

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by dirt monkey AL View Post
    I'm sorry, but did you just say MEN FIRST THEN JUSTICE FOR WOMEN? Because that's what I'm getting.
    No, I literally and figuratively did not. I don't know why you're assuming that and the rest of your post has nothing at all to do with what I said. Slander's not cool dude.

  6. #11546

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Uh Robo, cops are being killed by people unaffiliated with BLM. The last shooting of cops during any sort of black lives matter march were not part of that movement.

    Blue Lives Matter and All Lives Matter are looked at with disdain because it washes away a very real problem. Oh hey everybody dies not just black people. It's infuriating because it's so completely unsympathetic and it's like watching millions of people trying to bury their heads in sand.


    Also there's helicopter footage shown that shows that man had his hands up the whole time. It proved the cops were lying about his actions.

    Do you not realize how many people are waying the pros and cons of even calling the police? My white roommates can deal with them. I'll stay out of sight if there's an emergency. Cause I have a very real chance of just being shot for just being black. It's saddens me that people constantly try to say well so what of black people are being shot white people get shot too.

    Except that happens far less frequently...Cops use non lethal tactics on white peope that actually shoot at them. But nope...Black people having car issues, kids and calling the cops for their assistance shot or humiliated.

  7. #11547

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyclone_Baroness View Post
    Do you not realize how many people are waying the pros and cons of even calling the police? My white roommates can deal with them. I'll stay out of sight if there's an emergency. Cause I have a very real chance of just being shot for just being black. It's saddens me that people constantly try to say well so what of black people are being shot white people get shot too.

    Except that happens far less frequently...Cops use non lethal tactics on white peope that actually shoot at them. But nope...Black people having car issues, kids and calling the cops for their assistance shot or humiliated.
    I do realize that, and it must be horrible. I don't think anything I said indicated that I wasn't aware of or sympathetic to that problem though...

    On that subject, a study came out recently suggesting that cops are significantly more likely to use or threaten force when dealing with black people, but less likely to kill.

    I don't really know how to react.

  8. #11548

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    In news from the subcontinent,there was yet again another attack on an Indian Military Base,supposedly by Jem.
    this time,Pakistan hasn't even condemned the attack.
    if thinks keep going like this,who knows what will happen.while state sponsored terrorists will keep making things shittier,the indian army also could have prevented a sneak attack on a vital base near the LOC
    that which cannot be stopped:inherited will,a man's dream,and the flow of time.as long as man continues to seek out the answer to freedom,these things shall never be stopped.-PK Gol D. Roger

  9. #11549

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    I do realize that, and it must be horrible. I don't think anything I said indicated that I wasn't aware of or sympathetic to that problem though...

    On that subject, a study came out recently suggesting that cops are significantly more likely to use or threaten force when dealing with black people, but less likely to kill.

    I don't really know how to react.
    All these studies coming out and weird statistics confuse the living shit out of me. How bad is it? Like what are the actual statistics on how many black men are killed by law enforcement unlawfully?
    As a European I basically only hear about this BLM stuff through very filtered media sources who are far more interested in pushing political narratives than telling the truth. Googling the question doesn't make you much smarter either, every single article and study claim different things.

  10. #11550

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    I do realize that, and it must be horrible. I don't think anything I said indicated that I wasn't aware of or sympathetic to that problem though...

    On that subject, a study came out recently suggesting that cops are significantly more likely to use or threaten force when dealing with black people, but less likely to kill.

    I don't really know how to react.
    I don't buy into this for a second especially as some actually train their officers to profile
    minorities specifically blacks, and how almost every time an officer does something
    against a minority individual whether it's shooting them without probable cause or assaulting the cop is super likely to be cleared of any wrong doing if they're white than if they're a officer of color.

    Simply put the idea that other actions police take against minority individuals can be influencedby race but shootings aren't just leaves me super skeptical.
    Last edited by Green_vs_Red; September 20th, 2016 at 01:33 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ubiq View Post
    I've often wondered about that myself; seems like being supported by people who only want you there so the world can end in fire (with you going to Hell in the process) would be somewhat off-putting
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  11. #11551
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    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    First, sorry for the late anwser.

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    The context changed..

    South Asia, Southeast Asia.
    Also South Asia has about 1.5 billion people, Asia as a whole has about 4.5 billion people. So "half" what?
    Asia is in general dumb to talk about without dividing it up by about five or so regions. Which are not at all hard to learn.
    Rereading your previous quote, I can see that you mainly objected to me taking asia as a whole and I can agree with that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    We're talking about how per capita skews things in a way that makes China look better than it is...which is also what Jabberwok was saying...

    China polluting horribly isn't really a controversial topic at all? Like even remotely? It takes three word "China", "Pollutes", "Horribly".

    Why would someone praise China for having really bad pollution.
    The reason I don't want to talk about China is that they can rightly say "Clear your own mess before complaining about us!" Doesn't change the fact they are the number one polluter as a country but then again, I believe that per capita is a better way to analyse things because we are all humans and shouldn't be penalized simply because of the place we live in.

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    The fact that this is the biggest stumbling block to doing something about it tells you that talking about the issue like a direct cause and effect system...makes no sense.

    Where I live and New York City in general would become water so yeah just because Bangladesh goes first doesn't make tons of the earth not in big trouble.
    Careless emissions require an attitude of dismissal to the entire concept of climate change.
    But generaly climate deniers have a bigger effect (individually) in developped countries though (although there are always exceptions). Anyways, I'm aware it's all about wealth since there are many rich people in poor countries who produce as much or even more greenhouse gases per capita then theirs counterparts in rich countries. But... just like wealthy afro-americans may not be affected much by minimal sentences for drug offences doesn't means that the concept isn't racist anyways.

    Also, I have no doubt that New York will be mostly able to cope with the effect of climate change and you probably at worst will have to move elsewere if your land is flooded (perhaps some more or less important financial losses). Meanwhile, the bengladesh potential climate refuges the effect risks being much more dire.

  12. #11552

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by Sparsebeard View Post
    The reason I don't want to talk about China is that they can rightly say "Clear your own mess before complaining about us!"
    How can anyone rightly say that? Least of all one the absolute worst polluters on earth, who by population alone holds significant beyond significant environmental footprint.

    I believe that per capita is a better way to analyse things because we are all humans and shouldn't be penalized simply because of the place we live in.
    You still seem to be under the impression that government policy and private companies aren't a massive part of the issue (all the more in China's case), and seem to see it entirely in terms of individuals choosing to use hairspray or something.

    But generaly climate deniers have a bigger effect (individually) in developped countries though (although there are always exceptions).
    They have the biggest effect in countries producing more problems, where they stand in the way of reform and regulation. Developed or Developing (which is another vague term in this context) is not the factor.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    The entire point of a report on police abuse of black people is to highlight the fact that black people are disproportionately affected by police killings. If girls are disproportionately affected by cyberbullying, bullying in general, or abuse in general there should be some evidence to indicate that.
    You're looking at the wrong factor. It's that the form of bullying and nature of it is different for girls (in general), so its ...y'know...a different subject. You're not comparing different size apples, you're comparing apples and oranges.
    We live in a society where women are intrinsically more sympathetic than men, and I have personally experienced the utter lack of remorse that most professionals and most people show whilst questioning the validity and motivations of a male abuse victim's claim.
    Then wait for the (or go look up the already existing) articles and documentaries and whatever else that focus on male bullying. They are out there.

    Black Lives Matter highlights the massive problem of black people being disproportionately killed by our militarized police force, and Blue Lives Matter disrespectfully piggybacks off of the larger issue by claiming that we should really focus on the (still important, but far less so) issue of cops being killed by Black Lives Matter supporters.


    In short, Blue Lives Matter is a punchline not just because it's a protest protesting a protest, but because the scale of the two issues makes it very hard to sympathize with that side. When it becomes easier for male abuse victims to speak out without fear of mockery, vilification or further abuse, I'll stop asking "why does x focus on women exclusively?".
    And you never responded to my post about how you're complaining that Lung Cancer got a documentary because that documentary wasn't on Pancreatic Cancer. Which doesn't make any sense at all.

  13. #11553
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    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    This is true. However, the amount of attention and sympathy that something gets should be proportional to the scale of the issue.
    Are you saying since women only make up roughly 50% of the population there's something wrong with a documentary which focuses 100% on them because the issue affects more than just that demographic?

    Because there are no differences whatsoever (there are) in how the genders approach and handle bullying which can warrant its very own seperate topic of discussion?
    Everything's Eventual...


  14. #11554
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    How can anyone rightly say that? Least of all one the absolute worst polluters on earth, who by population alone holds significant beyond significant environmental footprint.
    I truly dont want to defend China but it's hard to criticize them when my own house is made of glass... I mean at least they sign environemental treaties and try to do their part (the chinese government doesn't deny climate change). Meanwhile, many political parties in the west are deniers and are sometime elected (for exemple, Harper in Canada and Abbot in Australia amongst the worst).

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    You still seem to be under the impression that government policy and private companies aren't a massive part of the issue (all the more in China's case), and seem to see it entirely in terms of individuals choosing to use hairspray or something.
    I understand that, but those government and companies are made of people (at lot of people) and frankly that's what I meant when I said previously that the more influence you got, the more you cause the problem.

    While lower class citizen may only be responsible for the way they vote (in election and as shareholders if it applies) and their comportements. More influent people have more influence on climate change... and saying that all these people are oblivious to the consequence of their actions... I don't agree or at least it's voulontary blinding ourselves...

    Why I say that black lives matters ain't entirely wrong by trying to act against climate change (whether or not those actions are effective, well...) and when they say it's a racist crisis is that people with more influence are mostly in the North while those who suffer are mostly in the South...

    Hope I made my point clear.

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    They have the biggest effect in countries producing more problems, where they stand in the way of reform and regulation. Developed or Developing (which is another vague term in this context) is not the factor.
    I kind of agree but while deniers are everywhere, their effects are worst in countries that have the margin of maneuvre to act...

  15. #11555

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by Sparsebeard View Post
    I truly dont want to defend China but it's hard to criticize them when my own house is made of glass...
    You're turning a universal issue of extreme importance into a personal squabble, and then you are legitimizing that squabble as meaningful.
    Why would you do this.
    The way you describe it doesn't even make any sense (again).
    The point isn't being made that China specifically has to change, the point is being made that everyone has to change including China.
    I mean at least they sign environemental treaties and try to do their part


    A statement this vague can apply to literally any country.
    And of course, I really don't think China tries to do their part beyond what looks good.
    (the chinese government doesn't deny climate change).


    Are there any governments that deny climate change?
    Meanwhile, many political parties in the west are deniers


    China doesn't have political parties, so this is a bizarre comparison to try and make. There aren't factions that can represent specifically ignorant and insular parts of the population.

    You have an almost condescending view of China (of all countries) like some sort of guileless child nation, and really anything you compare to "the West".

  16. #11556
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    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    You're turning a universal issue of extreme importance into a personal squabble, and then you are legitimizing that squabble as meaningful.
    Why would you do this.
    The way you describe it doesn't even make any sense (again).
    The point isn't being made that China specifically has to change, the point is being made that everyone has to change including China.
    [/COLOR]

    A statement this vague can apply to literally any country.
    And of course, I really don't think China tries to do their part beyond what looks good.


    Are there any governments that deny climate change?


    China doesn't have political parties, so this is a bizarre comparison to try and make. There aren't factions that can represent specifically ignorant and insular parts of the population.

    You have an almost condescending view of China (of all countries) like some sort of guileless child nation, and really anything you compare to "the West".
    You're the one who brought China into the discussion... what I mean is they are bad but were a bit worst.

    Of course they've got to do a lot but we've got to do even more. I mean, a coal plant is stupid anywhere, but in rich countries it's simply disgusting.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    Are there any governments that deny climate change?
    Pretty sure Australia does.
    Last edited by Sparsebeard; September 20th, 2016 at 07:00 PM.

  17. #11557

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    You're looking at the wrong factor. It's that the form of bullying and nature of it is different for girls (in general), so its ...y'know...a different subject. You're not comparing different size apples, you're comparing apples and oranges.


    Then wait for the (or go look up the already existing) articles and documentaries and whatever else that focus on male bullying. They are out there.


    And you never responded to my post about how you're complaining that Lung Cancer got a documentary because that documentary wasn't on Pancreatic Cancer. Which doesn't make any sense at all.
    The way I started this conversation was a bit awkward, I'll admit that. The two issues aren't completely unrelated though, so I can't really work with those analogies. A week doesn't go by without me hearing about how horrible the internet is for women and girls from one or more mainstream news sources; I'm confronted with the story on a regular basis. At the same time, I can't remember ever seeing seeing similar attention (from mainstream media) about maltreatment of men and boys online. I personally responded to a close relative's anti-male facebook post today. I've talked to people online who regularly justify cyberbullying and bizarre antisocial behavior by bringing up the same stories about how horrible it is for women online.

    Quote Originally Posted by Outerspec View Post
    Are you saying since women only make up roughly 50% of the population there's something wrong with a documentary which focuses 100% on them because the issue affects more than just that demographic?

    Because there are no differences whatsoever (there are) in how the genders approach and handle bullying which can warrant its very own seperate topic of discussion?
    That sounds fine in theory, but see above. The media coverage isn't even close to equal, and it's insane to me that we now have cyberbullying apologists using those same reports to justify more hate and harmful behavior.

  18. #11558

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by Sparsebeard View Post
    You're the one who brought China into the discussion... what I mean is they are bad but were a bit worst.
    China came into the discussion (along with many places) when you made an assertion about climate change being the product largely of the west.

    Of course they've got to do a lot but we've got to do even more. I mean, a coal plant is stupid anywhere, but in rich countries it's simply disgusting.
    This is another thing thats bugging me. China is an economic Godzilla, living standards on average are not on the standard of North America/Western Europe, but they're eons beyond Sub-Sahara Africa, and most of South and Southeast Asia.
    Implicit (and actually I mentioned this earlier) in everything you're saying is a very outdated and always flawed world outlook based on that olde "Global South/North" framing. Which was questionable when it was relevant. And it hasn't been relevant for a decade or two.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    The way I started this conversation was a bit awkward, I'll admit that. The two issues aren't completely unrelated though,
    The Beatles aren't unrelated to the Rolling Stones, but you still make a Beatles documentary separate from a Rolling Stones documentary. You're grasping at straws here.
    The analogies all work. Your problem is seeing some sort of agenda in people not paying attention to you in a documentary not about you.
    A week doesn't go by without me hearing about how horrible the internet is for women and girls from one or more mainstream news sources;


    Then you're hyper sensitive about this weird hangup of yours and are seeing phantoms.
    I'm confronted with the story on a regular basis. At the same time, I can't remember ever seeing seeing similar attention (from mainstream media) about maltreatment of men and boys online.


    I'm willing to be thats because generally male on male bullying is more physical and less clique based, so doesn't translate as well to cyber bullying?
    Which is of course entertaining the idea that your anecdotal experience actually means anything here.

    I personally responded to a close relative's anti-male facebook post
    today.
    What does this have to do with bullying and/or documentaries about bullying.

    I've talked to people online who regularly justify cyberbullying and bizarre antisocial behavior by bringing up the same stories about how horrible it is for women online.
    Whatever you're currently talking about has nothing to do with bullying articles about either sex.

  19. #11559

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by RoboBlue View Post
    ...As a sidenote, why are some of you being so dickish in your responses? Please stop that.
    Because you're being a dick yourself, missing or dismissing the points made entirely, and it's impossible for anyone to take you seriously at this point, and calling you out on it is the only reaction people can have to some of the things you are saying.
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  20. #11560
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    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/n...085326658.html

    Well looks like the entire internet division in North Korea may have an appointment with the firing squad soon after this.

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