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Thread: Random News Article Discussion II

  1. #7821

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Hitler was a psychopath who systematically persecuted and killed approximately 6 million Jews for no known reason at all. He's atheist? Who cares what religious preferences surrounded him was. He's a psychopath, and Islamic State is of the same kind...
    Here’s how Naruto should end: Last panel is Naruto standing proudly over Konohagakure. Slowly zoom out to reveal Luffy staring into a snowglobe with a miniature Konoha inside it. Usopp asks him what he’s doing. Luffy replies “Thinkin’ bout ninjas! Ninjas are cool!” and then chucks it off the ship

  2. #7822

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    While I was initially involved in Christianity because of the social aspect, I have ultimately come to believe that religion should be and works best when it is put to use personally.

    Like, I'm no longer a christian, but I do have a "religion" that I believe in that more or less guides my thoughts and feelings about the world on a day to day basis. And I'd be hard pressed to say that there is anyone else who really believes in the same things that I do.

    And, about Hitler, I wouldn't say that he did what he did "for no reason at all". He had his reasons, one of which (I think) was to essentially purge the human race of people who were less than what he thought was optimal. Right? Also, it's probably more appropriate to say that he was a sociopath, not a psychopath.

  3. #7823

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by Robby
    Its values that are passed around.
    You don't go to church because it's a "cultural" thing. A church is a place of worship. You don't have to follow any religion for the values or traditions you're referring to. How are you going to refer to yourself as a Christian if you don't follow the teachings of Jesus Christ? That's what being a christian means.
    For most people their holy book isn't something they live by word for word.
    Then there would be no point in following it or having it.
    Or the fringe terrorist hate group ISIS?
    Of course I'm only talking about ISIS.
    Hate for other groups is not instinctual. It's *learned*. Be it racism or sexism or religious zealotry... but it is *always* learned.
    Yes, but people don't change so easily. Islamophobes know that all muslims aren't all terrorists yet they still hate them anyway.

  4. #7824

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Actually, I think that there are a lot of people who go to church simply for the social aspect. There are a lot of people who wouldn't be "true" christians in your eyes, and yet they identify with the religion because they go to church every week.

    I mean, I admired and even "believed" in the religion for a while. I was baptized, confirmed and everything. But ultimately, I think that I did it just because everyone else I knew was doing it.

  5. #7825

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by benjamminbrown View Post
    While I was initially involved in Christianity because of the social aspect, I have ultimately come to believe that religion should be and works best when it is put to use personally.

    Like, I'm no longer a christian, but I do have a "religion" that I believe in that more or less guides my thoughts and feelings about the world on a day to day basis. And I'd be hard pressed to say that there is anyone else who really believes in the same things that I do.

    And, about Hitler, I wouldn't say that he did what he did "for no reason at all". He had his reasons, one of which (I think) was to essentially purge the human race of people who were less than what he thought was optimal. Right? Also, it's probably more appropriate to say that he was a sociopath, not a psychopath.
    Well fine, maybe I posted in an annoying fashion, for that I'm sorry. Hitler has been described in so many ways, it's hard to tell why he did what he did. Sociopath or Psychopath doesn't matter, as the point made was he was able spread his ideas across an entire country that resulted in 6 million deaths of innocent Jews and caused World War II.
    Here’s how Naruto should end: Last panel is Naruto standing proudly over Konohagakure. Slowly zoom out to reveal Luffy staring into a snowglobe with a miniature Konoha inside it. Usopp asks him what he’s doing. Luffy replies “Thinkin’ bout ninjas! Ninjas are cool!” and then chucks it off the ship

  6. #7826

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by Horizon View Post
    You don't go to church because it's a "cultural" thing. A church is a place of worship.
    Where you... gather with like minded individuals, and share in a community activity that shapes who you associate with and the values you learn, where you're preached to as a group by a specific leader and you share in specific songs and rituals based around what has been the norm for that area. Where you all donate money and have ocassional picnics and develop a bond with a particular preacher that can last decades. A community.

    A black church and a white church are going to have very different feels and ceremonies and sermons, for instance, even if they're both the same religion and within a 2 mile radius of each other. And you go to the one that feels better for you, with the people you want to be with.


    You don't have to follow any religion for the values or traditions you're referring to. How are you going to refer to yourself as a Christian if you don't follow christian teachings? That's what being a christian means. Then there would be no point in following it or having it.
    Most people accept that the books were written thousands of years ago and, appropriately, ignore some of the things that are out of date. Like selling daughters, handling a football, wearing shirts made of multiple fabrics, stoning, punishing someone for working on a sunday, etc. Heck, its outright recommended that you just ignore the old testament entirely for reasons, and stick with the new (2000 year old) testament. And there are passages and stories that downright contradict and conflict with each other, where you HAVE to choose the moral of one or the other.

    Some put more stock in some bits than others, its picked and chosen and there are regional differences... but no one follows their holy book to the letter on every single thing... (nor do most know the entire thing by heart word for word.) For the most part they follow the general guidelines and maybe a few specific ceremonies. It'll vary depending on what you learned to be important from... your parents and the community.

    You can go "Jesus said love thy brother, donate to the needy, and no adultery" and live by those things, without dealing with the archaic stuff and be a Christian.

    ...You can also do none of those things and be offended by a coffee cup, and still be a Christian.

    And if you're choice picking specific negative hateful passages and taking them out of context while ignoring all the positive stuff, in order to be an asshole, its because you want to be an asshole, or because your parents and neighbors taught you to be an asshole, not because your religion specifically is forcing you to... and still be a Christian.

    Yes, but people don't change so easily. Islamophobes know that all muslims aren't all terrorists yet they still hate them anyway.
    Sure they do. Happens all the time, especially between generations. The US no longer hates Russia or Japan, and while there's still lots and lots of racial problems, and sex based discrimination, we're able to elect a black man as president, and possibly a woman. Things change and move on.

    And again, most americans didn't give two thoughts about Muslims until after 9/11. We loved Aladdin in 1992, but ignored its re-release in 2004. Its a learned thing, and it can and does change, sometimes overnight though a single bad experience.. or a good one.

    Harder in the actual region where all the violence is perpetually going on, of course.
    Last edited by Robby; November 16th, 2015 at 06:19 PM.
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  7. #7827

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by benjamminbrown View Post
    Actually, I think that there are a lot of people who go to church simply for the social aspect. There are a lot of people who wouldn't be "true" christians in your eyes, and yet they identify with the religion because they go to church every week. I mean, I admired and even "believed" in the religion for a while. I was baptized, confirmed and everything. But ultimately, I think that I did it just because everyone else I knew was doing it.
    Following the teachings of Jesus (The bible) is what makes someone Christian. You can go to church for the social aspect, but if you aren't following the religion then you aren't Christian. Most people willingly go there to worship not because other people do it.

  8. #7828

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by Horizon View Post
    If Islam was as peaceful as claimed, wouldn't the extremists be extremely peaceful?
    Extremist almost always implies a violent purist strain of something. Purism as well not implying "accuracy" so much as inflexible literalism mixed with the usual conservative notion of an imagined past that never existed.
    That's a pretty ridiculous thing to insinuate honestly, I don't know of any time a pacifistic entity was called extremist.

    If the religion is based on interpretation then
    All religions are based on this. And all sects. Whether they admit to it or are aware of it or not. Salafists are like all fundamentalists in that they think they're the only ones that have it right and are being the most accurate and untainted. Whatever that means exactly.

    neither side would be wrong since there's no way of knowing the true context.
    I'm pretty sure the reason people say is ISIS wrong is because most people believe it is wrong to be rampaging murderous rapist genocidal thrill seekers.
    You're being either very dense or very disingenous if you that is Islam, because I'm just guessing here but that statement would imply you think that all these places on this map are just in a constant state of wild near anarchy.
    This also requires you to be blind to the fact ISIS is mostly murdering Muslims of all sorts.
    It also requires you to gloss over the "all sorts" thing entirely.

    Or are you thinking people are trying to apologize for the specific brand of Islam ISIS expouses? Because NO ONE is doing that here, we're actually pretty much cheering their deaths! Don't know how much more condemnatory we'd have to be than that!

    Yes we shouldn't assume that all muslims are like ISIS, but criticising Islam isn't the same as criticising all muslims.
    Critisizing a massive many faceted widespread really old thing like Islam can take place. That isn't the really what you're doing though. It imples nuance, experience, and education on it all that even I'm pretty lacking in largely.

  9. #7829

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by KageKageKing View Post
    how many times is anonymous gonna declare war on ISIS? this has to be like the 3rd time


  10. #7830

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by Horizon View Post
    I'd love to meet anyone who follows their religion verbatim.
    There isn't such people. Such a concept is inherently flawed.
    Where are you getting that people follow a religion because it's a cultural thing?
    ....ok..uh. What religious background do you have? And where do you live because how can you be unaware of this? Name an ethnic group and I will tell you what religion it culturally associates with as a general rule.
    Their religion is an influence to them. This is fact. ISIS rules by Sharia law.
    Please tell us what Sharia law is.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    Quote Originally Posted by Horizon View Post
    You don't go to church because it's a "cultural" thing.
    Do you live on the moon? This is so disconnected from like...the population of much of humanity it baffles me.
    I'm thinking you're either a rural American Protestant or a young atheist from somewhere in the western world in general also of Protestant extract historically. No offense, just you fit the profiles of the few people unaware of this thing. It's ok that's half my family, if I didn't have the other half I might not get it either (though I WOULD be aware of it so I dunno dude).
    A church is a place of worship.
    It's also historically and today a community center. Sometimes literally. Family and wider group identity tie into them.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    Quote Originally Posted by ArmamentHero View Post
    Well fine, maybe I posted in an annoying fashion, for that I'm sorry. Hitler has been described in so many ways, it's hard to tell why he did what he did. Sociopath or Psychopath doesn't matter, as the point made was he was able spread his ideas across an entire country that resulted in 6 million deaths of innocent Jews and caused World War II.
    If you're looking for monsterous fascist groups who were extremist Christians then the Nazis aren't the right fit exactly.
    Look to the Croatian and Romanian fascist parties. The former of which in particular were gruesomely brutal.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    Quote Originally Posted by Horizon View Post
    Following the teachings of Jesus (The bible) is what makes someone Christian. You can go to church for the social aspect, but if you aren't following the religion then you aren't Christian. Most people willingly go there to worship not because other people do it.
    Welp sorry dude but other people have wider more differing social definitions of such terms as Christian. This fits into that interperative aspect.

    Oh btw I have a homework thing for you.
    If you want to understand ISIS there's a neat trick that you and everyone here can do.
    Go watch the movie Taxi Driver. Even if you've seen it before watch it again. And keep in mind all the young dudes (and the dudettes as well I suppose) who flock to join them and other such groups? All of them are some form of Travis Bickle.
    It's a masterpiece movie anyway so it'll be worth your time just as a flick.
    But yeah, a Quran? That won't tell you anything. Go watch the best portrait of lonely frustrated anger ever made.

  11. #7831

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    There isn't such people. Such a concept is inherently flawed.


    ....ok..uh. What religious background do you have? And where do you live because how can you be unaware of this? Name an ethnic group and I will tell you what religion it culturally associates with as a general rule.


    Please tell us what Sharia law is.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---



    Do you live on the moon? This is so disconnected from like...the population of much of humanity it baffles me.
    I'm thinking you're either a rural American Protestant or a young atheist from somewhere in the western world in general also of Protestant extract historically. No offense, just you fit the profiles of the few people unaware of this thing. It's ok that's half my family, if I didn't have the other half I might not get it either (though I WOULD be aware of it so I dunno dude).


    It's also historically and today a community center. Sometimes literally. Family and wider group identity tie into them.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---



    If you're looking for monsterous fascist groups who were extremist Christians then the Nazis aren't the right fit exactly.
    Look to the Croatian and Romanian fascist parties. The former of which in particular were gruesomely brutal.
    You're exactly right, I was just focused on the current topic of the recent posts. Are you referring to the Ustashi?
    Here’s how Naruto should end: Last panel is Naruto standing proudly over Konohagakure. Slowly zoom out to reveal Luffy staring into a snowglobe with a miniature Konoha inside it. Usopp asks him what he’s doing. Luffy replies “Thinkin’ bout ninjas! Ninjas are cool!” and then chucks it off the ship

  12. #7832

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    We gather once a week on Thursdays to share in the ritual of reading One Piece, and then we discuss it and the lessons and sense of joy it gives us. Some of us bond over it, become friends for life, even find love and get married. That makes us a community, right?

    But not a religion, because we only praise Oda as a storyteller and give him money on a regular basis, rather than try to shape our lives around the positive messages the stories presented to us that teach things like family is thicker than blood, and that racism is bad, and all people should get along if they can, while following the narrative of a magic man who goes around making other people's lives better thanks to his simple philosophy of making friends and treating people well, and has at least one burning object and one resurrection.


    Alternate comment.

    The KKK are mostly Christian. Ergo, all Christians rule by hate, wear masks, and burn black people on crosses, and we should bomb all them off the face of the planet because they're living by evil christian laws that seem to promote rampant hatred, violence, racism, sexism and slavery. Truly a nasty people motivated by their awful religion that I haven't read the book of to get any context from.
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  13. #7833

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by Horizon View Post
    Following the teachings of Jesus (The bible) is what makes someone Christian. You can go to church for the social aspect, but if you aren't following the religion then you aren't Christian. Most people willingly go there to worship not because other people do it.
    Pretty much what Robby and Zephos said.

    A christian is a christian is a christian. There's all sorts, but they all kind of call themselves the same thing (except when they take the holier than thou approach like you're doing and say "no, I'm the better christian"). Even when I really did believe in and tried to follow the teachings of Jesus, I still probably wasn't what you would call a christian, but that's not my problem. I think it's yours.

    And, seriously, I still think that a huge fraction of people who go to church don't do it just for the worship. In fact, I think for a lot of them that worship is just a secondary thing.

  14. #7834

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by ArmamentHero View Post
    You're exactly right, I was just focused on the current topic of the recent posts. Are you referring to the Ustashi?
    Yeah them. The Iron Guard from Romania also fit the bill, though they never really took power thank god, so we'll never know how far they would have gone.

    Here's a cool read on some of what they got up to before the Romanian government squashed them.
    There was a description in a book I read about one of those killings they did where they danced around a guys chopped up body in some sort of religious frenzy.

  15. #7835
    ウサギ joekido the Second's Avatar
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    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    I must point out that being a Christian means relationship with God; it's not about going around killing people, banging non-believers heads with the bible, saying that i'm right and your wrong, sell your daughter, stone homosexuals etc, etc.

    There are people who calls them Christians but goes do what they want and not listen to God

    Me as a Christian as you see how I behaved recently that I do not try to impose my belief in you guys and only said it if you want to hear it, however I always let you guys think for yourself and correct me if i'm wrong. So why is that? Because God showed me what's in my heart


    However I really don't wish to clutter this thread farther about this, I just hope we can finally agree that whatever answers we have may be correct depending on a person.
    Currently writing a book

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  16. #7836

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    Yeah them. The Iron Guard from Romania also fit the bill, though they never really took power thank god, so we'll never know how far they would have gone.
    When that fucker Antonescu thinks you're too evil, there's something wrong with you.

  17. #7837

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by joekido the Second View Post
    I must point out that being a Christian means relationship with God; it's not about going around killing people, banging non-believers heads with the bible, saying that i'm right and your wrong, sell your daughter, stone homosexuals etc, etc.
    Normal Muslims will say pretty much the exact same thing jfyi.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyan D. Funk View Post
    When that fucker Antonescu thinks you're too evil, there's something wrong with you.
    Hell Hitler apparently figured Antonescu was a better puppet choice. I'd like to look into whether Hitler thinking they were too openly cray cray had anything to with that choice.

    After all the Nazis were pretty freaked out by the Ustasi. Though man, whose really creepier?
    The Ustasi for being barbaric animals in their genocides? Or the Nazis being organized professionals in their genocides?

    Good essay topic.

  18. #7838
    ウサギ joekido the Second's Avatar
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    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    Normal Muslims will say pretty much the exact same thing jfyi.
    Yeah, because that's how the world works. We live in a shade of grey world were people thinks different things.

    However i'm not imposing that Christianity is a true religion, it's up to you to decide that. In my view I believe it is because I have seen many things in 3D.
    Currently writing a book

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  19. #7839

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by benjamminbrown View Post
    And, seriously, I still think that a huge fraction of people who go to church don't do it just for the worship. In fact, I think for a lot of them that worship is just a secondary thing.
    This is pretty much 50% of the church going Northeast US.
    It's funny how many lapsed Catholics still miss the ritual and community even if they ended up rejecting the religion. My dad is a textbook example. There are things he looks back on fondly about it all.
    My mom is cluelessly irreligious by birth lol. That's what old New England wasp blood'll get ya.

    *WASP family rummages through attic*
    *patriach lifts dusty old PROTESTANTISM out of a cardboard box*
    I say, Maude will you look at this. Forgot I had the old thing!

  20. #7840
    The Nice Guy Outerspec's Avatar
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    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by Horizon View Post
    What are you talking about. You don't have to defend it to accomplish any of that. There's no way to stop attacks or villainization. There's already protections against religious discrimination. The people who hate muslims hate them regardless. They'll attack them regardless. It's not like that's legal. They simply use terrorist attacks to justify their hatred.
    Wrong, you actually have to voice out against ignorance and stupidity in order to prevent more of it. Defenidng Islam is not only about standing up for something a billion people follow but also educating others about something they know nothing about except for what they see in the media and hear from their less informed peers. It's to prevent the spread of more ignorance as much as possible and influence others to have a more open mind about a religion and culture that's different from there's but is not evil. You see, you're missing the big point here. It's not solely about the bigots and idiots who "hate muslims regardless". It's about the scores of others who can be influenced in one direction or another. It's about the people who are listening and can be educated. That's the real fight.

    So I'm going to defend Islam or any other religion that's unfairly attacked because if all society does is let people attack it how do you think people will feel about it? There must be nothing good about it if no one is defending it. That's how ignorance and stupidity thrive.
    Everything's Eventual...


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