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Thread: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

  1. #9861

    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

    Quote Originally Posted by Silverblade View Post
    People love to throw around the word "plot hole" without knowing what it means.
    This. Hell, even at the respective Wikipedia page we have the following example:

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiki
    • In Gremlins, mogwai can't eat after midnight, but it's never mentioned when they can start eating.
    How is this supposed to be a plot hole?

  2. #9862

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    Well, because it is either an important part that never got properly explained and/or a part that the way it got explained doesn't really make any sense.

  3. #9863
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    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

    Quote Originally Posted by Bartholemew Bear View Post
    How is this supposed to be a plot hole?
    In this case, there's no telling as for how long this "After Midnight" deal is. It creates paradox since what comes after midnight is just another day (right?). It's like saying "Mogwais can eat today before midnight, but at the same time they can't because it's already past midnight from yesterday."

    I've never watched it btw so I don't know the details.

  4. #9864
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    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

    Quote Originally Posted by Purple Hermit View Post
    Aren't plot holes things that are discontinuous with the story's logic and not necessarily "this has yet to be explained"?
    Plot holes are logical parts of the plot that clash with others, one can not exist with the other.

    Now, I don't remember very well, but I think that Naruto in fact had some plot holes in the past, but I believe that with the passing of time Kishimoto corrected all, or majority of them.
    In the end it is important that in any given time of the story there isn't any plot holes, even if they are corrected later, is bad that they ever existed.

    Of course, Naruto quality drop has less to do with plot holes(that are something really grave, but becomes harder to not do with increase of complexity(even though I would call Naruto a really complex story ...)), but more to do with the quality of the plot in itself.
    Kishimoto like a lot of mangakas, know how to write interesting things, but don't really now how to write well, in terms of quality. Mangakas normally focus more in the art and less in the writing. The writing basically has to be something cool, and that is it. Unfortunately in the shonen demographic, that is most of the times the only thing that is needed, something cool.

  5. #9865

    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

    But in order to be a plot hole it has to be a paradox that cannot be reconciled with any explanation.

    I don't want to say that the given explanation is that great, but it's in no way a unsolvable paradox . You could just say that they can eat from 12 o'clock onwards at the noon. (It's been awhile since I watched it, however, unless they eat at around 10~11 o'clock p.m. I cannot see any unsolvable paradox here.)

  6. #9866
    Discovered Stowaway Bigivel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

    Quote Originally Posted by Silverblade View Post
    People love to throw around the word "plot hole" without knowing what it means.

    Then again even without the plot holes, Naruto's thematic inconsistency and constant rewriting are much, much bigger issues to consider.
    It could be argued that thematic inconsistencies are plot holes.
    For example, passing the message that working hard people can surpass geniuses, but always showing that geniuses are better than people that work hard, can be seen as a plot hole, because those two plot points(the message and what is shown) clash with each other, creating the inconsistency/hole.

    Some rewriting, if not done well, can be considered plot holes as well. For a rewriting to not be a plot hole, it has to be able to incorporate both parts, the before rewriting and the after rewriting, as logically correct. If that is not done is a Plot hole.
    A easy way to do a rewriting without plot hole, is saying that the "before rewriting" part, wasn't really what was perceived, but something totally different, something that would result in the same end of events, but that now makes sense with the "after rewriting" part.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    Quote Originally Posted by Domingo View Post
    In this case, there's no telling as for how long this "After Midnight" deal is. It creates paradox since what comes after midnight is just another day (right?). It's like saying "Mogwais can eat today before midnight, but at the same time they can't because it's already past midnight from yesterday."

    I've never watched it btw so I don't know the details.
    The "After Midnight" is a McGuffin, basically a plot point that is important during a period of the story story, basically just to progress the story, other than that is not explained in detail nor referred again. There is nothing logically wrong with "after Midnight". In the movies it just means that you shouldn't give food to them at night, being the start of "night" midnight.

  7. #9867
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    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

    Quote Originally Posted by Bigivel View Post
    The "After Midnight" is a McGuffin, basically a plot point that is important during a period of the story story, basically just to progress the story, other than that is not explained in detail nor referred again. There is nothing logically wrong with "after Midnight". In the movies it just means that you shouldn't give food to them at night, being the start of "night" midnight.
    I think I get it. But to me it still translates to "Mogwais shouldn't be fed at all" going with that vague rule, lol. But since you said that the rule only served as plot convenience, I guess I can take it as "Mogwais must not be fed within a vague duration starting from midnight to whenever the plot allows Mogwais to be fed or else they die and the story ends there."

  8. #9868
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    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

    How about the plot hole that Madara supposed give both his eyes to baby Nagato yet now was revealed that he sacrifice one of his eyes to cheat death, so how come there's two magical eyeballs running around if he sacrificed one of then?

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  9. #9869

    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

    Quote Originally Posted by senjuitama View Post
    None of those things are really plot holes, the things you listed are tiny things common in a lot of anime, especially one piece.
    Ugh, if I had a dime for every time I heard THIS.....

  10. #9870
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    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

    Quote Originally Posted by Smiley View Post
    How about the plot hole that Madara supposed give both his eyes to baby Nagato yet now was revealed that he sacrifice one of his eyes to cheat death, so how come there's two magical eyeballs running around if he sacrificed one of then?
    He actually sacrificed his right, but upon awakening, he got his right eye back as Rinnegan. And then, he gave on one to baby(?) Nagato (dafuq man, does the eye socket even fit). But in flashback, Nagato was shown to awaken Rinnegan instead of having one all along (I might be wrong on this). Nagato's other eye was always covered by hair, so I assume the other one is normal eye. The 6 Pains were exceptions since they're just proxies, not with real eyeballs.

  11. #9871
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    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time


    I see two eyes.

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  12. #9872
    A dog exists somewhere David Ludwig's Avatar
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    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

    Young Nagato is plunged into a world of pain!!



  13. #9873
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    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

    Quote Originally Posted by Smiley View Post
    Thanks for the correction. Okay, I give up. Trying to make sense out of that mess is just a waste of time and energy. It could be Madara's Rinnegan infecting Nagato's other eye and turned it into one for all I care. Nothing about eyeballs in Naruto ever made any sense since Uchiha introduced "Plug 'n Play" feature.

  14. #9874

    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

    The funny part is Gremlins 2 actually made fun of the vagueness of the "after midnight" bit itself. Poked a lot of fun at its own weirdness. Discussed what if they traveled through timezones or whatnot.

    Anyway,given its mystical nature and the old man saying it, I always figured "After midnight" actually meant not the literal clock time, but... after mid-night. So not after the absolute middle of the night and before sunrise. (Since the sun kills them that's obviously when they'd be non-susceptible). It's probably not meant to be 12:00 on the dot specifically, (especially since clocks and timezones can vary) but with the shifting of the moon and solstices and such, the length of night can vary between 8 and 12 hours depending on if it's summer or winter or location on the globe.

    So the bad time for the mogwaii and "the dead middle of night" can probably vary between 12:01 and 1:47 as when the bad time actually starts, so "after midnight" is just a general good safety shorthand, or a more literal "mid-night", rather than a precise scientific measurement.
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  15. #9875

    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

    My biggest problem with Naruto, besides the quality of the plot, is the way the plot develops week after week.
    A quick example that i think most people can relate too: Itachi.

    At first he was a bad guy. Evil genius dude that killed his clan for unknown reasons. Ok
    Then it was revealed that he was a good guy, and that, for some reason, he was the one forced to kill his clan to avoid some war or shit (why him and not someone else? Werenīt there any capable ninjas? And did they really have to eliminate the whole clan? W/e).
    Then he was a good guy and Sasuke survived because he loved him.
    Then Tobi was actually after all of this.
    But wasnīt it Danzo that ordered him to do so?
    Where the hell did Tobi came from in the middle of this?

    Iīm sure someone that actually follows Naruto with a lot of attention can explain how much of an idiot I am and how the whole Itachi thing makes a lot of sense, but thatīs not the point.

    This is a Shonen Manga. Isnīt it supposed to be directed at teens?
    Naruto just has too many details, and useless ones. Using Bivigelīs explaination, a lot of McGuffinsīs: things that seem important at some point and then totally lose relevance.
    The thing is, after those things lose relevance, they are still in the plot and only serve to make it more confusing.

    Naruto not only has too much information, it canīt present it in a simple and effective way that makes people remember it without having to reread the whole thing again with a lot of attention.
    I read OP, HxH, Fairy Tail, Ippo, Jojolion, Bleach, TOG and some more.
    Iīve read D.Gray Man, FMA, Gantz and others that have ended.
    I never had so much difficulty following a plot like i have with Naruto.
    Itīs like the information gets presented to you almost like a side note and then BAM, all of a sudden itīs super important and you have to know about it.

    I remember that about the Kyuubi chackra division thing.
    It was first mentioned in a really vague way by some random character i donīt remember. Then it suddenly was something really important to the plot. And is there any difference between the Yin part and the Yang part? Is one more evil than the other or some thing? And was there really any need to make things more complicated?
    If the user died, wasnīt the Bijuu supposed to die too? Than how come the other part of the Kyuubi did not die with Minato?

    I genuinely stopped caring at some point. Keeping up with all the stuff that goes on in this manga is a pain in the ass.

    Oh God, and the Sharingan...
    At first it was only awakened by 3 individuals and it had 2 techs (Amaretsu and Tsukuyomi) + one ubber secret one (Susanoo)
    AND A WILD IZANAGI APPEARS
    THIS IS THE LAST ONE GUYS I SWEAR

    AHAH JK LULZ HEREīS KAMUI AND KOTOAMATSUKAMI

    Wait, did i say the more someone uses the Sharingan, the more their vision gets weaker? Forget that.
    Oh, and that Super secret thing that only 3 individuals managed to use? Kakashi and Danzo have it too.
    Yeah, and Obito.
    And Shisui for some reason.

    Alright, iīm gonna stop this.

  16. #9876

    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

    Quote Originally Posted by SpaceCowboy View Post
    My biggest problem with Naruto, besides the quality of the plot, is the way the plot develops week after week.
    ...
    yep, pretty much. Kishi is throwing out "reveal" after "reveal" each week to "spice up" this final showdown, including ad-libbing the final villain and motivations!

    I'm pretty sure that if you told someone reading Naruto during Zabuza or the Chunnin Exams that the final villain would be some ancient rabbit lady whose kin reincarnated in Naruto and Sasuke and who can get distracted by the former turning into naked men, they'd laugh at you for like an hour.





  17. #9877
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    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

    Quote Originally Posted by MetaMario View Post
    I'm pretty sure that if you told someone reading Naruto during Zabuza or the Chunnin Exams that the final villain would be some ancient rabbit lady whose kin reincarnated in Naruto and Sasuke and who can get distracted by the former turning into naked men, they'd laugh at you for like an hour.
    If someone back then told me that, I would have thought that the setting would make sense in context and would be awesome and emotional and funny. :(
    Wash your hands.

  18. #9878

    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

    Quote Originally Posted by El-Matematico View Post
    If someone back then told me that, I would have thought that the setting would make sense in context and would be awesome and emotional and funny. :(
    *scratches head* Er...

    well either way, the contrast between Naruto before chapter 100 and now, before chapter 700, is a jarring one.





  19. #9879

    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

    Quote Originally Posted by MetaMario View Post
    *scratches head* Er...

    well either way, the contrast between Naruto before chapter 100 and now, before chapter 700, is a jarring one.
    No, I think El-Matematico is right. Like Robby's been saying, it makes sense that the sexy technique could be something used against the final boss who may or may not be someone ridiculous. It was Naruto's first technique that he himself conceived so it's a back to basics thing.

  20. #9880

    Default Re: Naruto and Bleach IV- Sexy time

    Quote Originally Posted by Purple Hermit View Post
    No, I think El-Matematico is right. Like Robby's been saying, it makes sense that the sexy technique could be something used against the final boss who may or may not be someone ridiculous. It was Naruto's first technique that he himself conceived so it's a back to basics thing.
    Weird, I never thought of it like that. Hmm...





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